Women's expectations: Unrealistic

[Love Zhaoying]

Just now, Ayashe Ninetails said:

I do find it amusing that so few men joined in to agree with that, though. Perhaps it's not a position many on here hold.

Or, we bowed out of the thread awhile ago.

Question: If indeed most of the arguing has been amongst women, and if indeed they are arguing whether they have unreasonable expectations - to quote Shakespeare, "methinks the lady doth protest too much"?

In other words, they are arguing because someone hit a "sore spot"? "The truth hurts"?

Just asking!

[Paul Hexem]

6 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I don't want to appear too picky with unrealistic expectations, but I find your forum pic of a weird looking griefer kind of...creepy

I don't know what other people see in it, but my forum pic is clearly a happy smile indicative of a good sense of humor.

 

1 minute ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

Or, maybe they're just letting you take all the heat for saying that. 😏

Sometimes digging up the truth gets your hands dirty, what can I say.

[Love Zhaoying]

I'm getting a large number of notifications on this thread - not because I follow it or people are reacting to my posts - but because I follow so many of you who are posting on the thread!!

 

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

my forum pic is clearly a happy smile indicative of a good sense of humor.

that...is a griefer

[Casidy Silvercloud]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

In other words, they are arguing because someone hit a "sore spot"? "The truth hurts"?

Might be that the truth wasn't actually presented, at all.

Exactly which expectations are unrealistic? Why are they unrealistic? What expectations does OP, or any other man (woman too I suppose) actually bring to the table themselves? Are they really unrealistic or does OP, or other people, just not like that some women have some expectations they can't meet?

The OP is too vague, and we ran with it. I'm pretty sure everyone expected that. 

[Paul Hexem]

2 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

that...is a griefer

I dunno. He looks happy to me.

You don't think it's unrealistic to expect a happy smile to not be taken at face value?

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

6 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

that...is a griefer

I dunno. He looks happy to me.

You don't think it's unrealistic to expect a happy smile to not be taken at face value?

When I use Google to search for 'griefer face' that's the image that pops up.

[Ceka Cianci]

8 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I'm getting a large number of notifications on this thread - not because I follow it or people are reacting to my posts - but because I follow so many of you who are posting on the thread!!

 

We're all coming to you with our jars! \o/

[Love Zhaoying]

4 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

I dunno. He looks happy to me.

You don't think it's unrealistic to expect a happy smile to not be taken at face value?

Oh..! It's not supposed to be a creepy smile?

My bad!!

[Ayashe Ninetails]

9 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

In other words, they are arguing because someone hit a "sore spot"? "The truth hurts"?

I didn't see anyone actually arguing.

 

9 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

Sometimes digging up the truth gets your hands dirty, what can I say.

What truth, though? That SOME women have unrealistic expectations? Of course, that's a given. You could say that for humans in general - some people absolutely have unrealistic expectations.

That ALL women do, that's not been proven. You'll have to explain to every woman here and in SL why their own individual personal expectations are unrealistic if you really want to do that. 👀

[Paul Hexem]

5 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

I didn't see anyone actually arguing.

 

What truth, though? That SOME women have unrealistic expectations? Of course, that's a given. You could say that for humans in general - some people absolutely have unrealistic expectations.

That ALL women do, that's not been proven. You'll have to explain to every woman here and in SL why their own individual personal expectations are unrealistic if you really want to do that. 👀

Not once have I said "all".

[Love Zhaoying]

3 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

We're all coming to you with our jars! \o/

Two products I recommend:

https://www.amazon.com/Regent-Multi-Purpose-Gripper-Bottle-Opener/dp/B019R5TSYW

https://www.amazon.com/Adjustable-Multifunctional-Stainless-Gripper-Accessories/dp/B08L12PRDZ

All from: https://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Jar-Openers/zgbs/kitchen/17548243011

[Love Zhaoying]

7 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

19 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

In other words, they are arguing because someone hit a "sore spot"? "The truth hurts"?

I didn't see anyone actually arguing.

Sorry, I was just replying to someone else's post that they were supposebly argewin.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

8 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

What truth, though? That SOME women have unrealistic expectations? Of course, that's a given. You could say that for humans in general - some people absolutely have unrealistic expectations.

That ALL women do, that's not been proven. You'll have to explain to every woman here and in SL why their own individual personal expectations are unrealistic if you really want to do that. 👀

Except that the OP is not addressing the expectations of actual flesh-and-blood women. It's merely resurrecting (for a kazillionth time) certain socially-determined stereotypes about women and their relationships with men.

And this, of course, cuts both ways. Women who expect their men to be "manly" are similarly conforming to socially-conditioned ideas of what constitutes "masculinity" and being a "desirable man."

We'd all be a lot happier, I suspect, if we spent more time addressing our preconceptions born of conventional group-think.

Edited September 15, 2023 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Paul Hexem said:

Not once have I said "all".

I got "bit" by that same thing, someone went bugnutz about the post I made about a video where it was claimed "most" women want to find a man who makes more money than them.  I even used the word "most" in my post. 

Later, I googled other sources for the info and found it, but no sense in poking the bear.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

1 minute ago, Paul Hexem said:

Not once have I said "all".

You said "women." That tends to imply "all." Drop a "some" in front of that and you'd be entirely correct.

[Love Zhaoying]

Just now, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Except that the OP is not addressing the expectations of actual flesh-and-blood women. It's merely resurrecting (for a kazillionth time) certain socially-determined stereotypes about women and their relationships with men.

And this, of course, cuts both ways. Women who expect their men to be "manly" are similarly conforming to socially-conditioned ideas of what constitutes a "desirable man."

We'd all be a lot happier, I suspect, if we spent more time addressing our preconceptions born of conventional group-think.

Plus, the OP was about SL - and people's "overly strong reactions" are "as if" the OP was about RL!

I mean, c'mon already - it's just about SL - why such strong reactions? 

People just LOVE to argue!  It's a fact, I wrote..I mean read it on the internet!

[Arielle Popstar]

2 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Except that the OP is not addressing the expectations of actual flesh-and-blood women. It's merely resurrecting (for a kazillionth time) certain socially-determined stereotypes about women and their relationships with men.

And this, of course, cuts both ways. Women who expect their men to be "manly" are similarly conforming to socially-conditioned ideas of what constitutes a "desirable man."

We'd all be a lot happier, I suspect, if we spent more time addressing our preconceptions born of conventional group-think.

Or evolutionary conditioned ideas. So many other life forms on earth have instinctive mating habits, why the assumption that for homo sapiens it is socially conditioned? It doesn't seem logical in that respect.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

3 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Plus, the OP was about SL - and people's "overly strong reactions" are "as if" the OP was about RL!

I mean, c'mon already - it's just about SL - why such strong reactions?

Well, I suppose.

I generally reject the argument that one's emotional responses to interactions are less relevant or "real" if they happen here.

Yeah, I can't be hit or beaten up in SL. But I can be insulted, condescended to, complimented, etc. And it's real people doing that, just as it is in RL. I can't really see a reason why I should be less insulted or upset about being called a "b*tch" in SL than if it happens in RL?

[Ayashe Ninetails]

6 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Except that the OP is not addressing the expectations of actual flesh-and-blood women. It's merely resurrecting (for a kazillionth time) certain socially-determined stereotypes about women and their relationships with men.

And this, of course, cuts both ways. Women who expect their men to be "manly" are similarly conforming to socially-conditioned ideas of what constitutes a "desirable man."

We'd all be a lot happier, I suspect, if we spent more time addressing our preconceptions born of conventional group-think.

That's a good point, and it also tends to ignore things like cultural, regional, religious, and other differences I mentioned previously, which are extremely important when analyzing people in an international platform like SL. Positions like that often take a rather American focus, which I find a bit strange - perhaps since I lived abroad and traveled quite a bit. Women (and people in general) around the world are really quite different and it's so hard to fit us all into a tiny little box. Even if you narrow the position solely to women in the US, we're still extraordinarily varied.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Or evolutionary conditioned ideas. So many other life forms on earth have instinctive mating habits, why the assumption that for homo sapiens it is socially conditioned? It doesn't seem logical in that respect.

Because there is an endless array of things that we do that have zero to do with evolution, and a whole bunch of things that we now frown upon that would similarly be prompted by that mechanism. We have "values" and "ethics." We read poetry, listen to music, admire art, play video games.

And we don't abandon our ill or aged merely because they are, in evolutionary terms, a "burden" on our own survival.

How actually "important" is that men be strong, i.e., "manly" in our Western culture? How many men really need, in their day-to-day lives, to be more muscular than I am? (Other than the opening jars thing, of course!)

We aren't automatons merely being yanked around by hard-wired urges and responses, Arielle. We have free will, consciousness, make choices that have nothing to do with "evolution." We have developed our own logic that is very different from the simple evolutionary mechanisms imposed upon other species.

[Love Zhaoying]

10 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Well, I suppose.

I generally reject the argument that one's emotional responses to interactions are less relevant or "real" if they happen here.

Yeah, I can't be hit or beaten up in SL. But I can be insulted, condescended to, complimented, etc. And it's real people doing that, just as it is in RL. I can't really see a reason why I should be less insulted or upset about being called a "b*tch" in SL than if it happens in RL?

I didn't say the reactions aren't relevant or real. The point I intended to make is: the reactions AND response content are as if we are discussing RL relationships - whether topic drift, "can't help it", or subtle triggers were poked. But supposedly, we're just talking about SL.

[Casidy Silvercloud]

15 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I generally reject the argument that one's emotional responses to interactions are less relevant or "real" if they happen here.

Yeah, I can't be hit or beaten up in SL. But I can be insulted, condescended to, complimented, etc. And it's real people doing that, just as it is in RL. I can't really see a reason why I should be less insulted or upset about being called a "b*tch" in SL than if it happens in RL?

My earlier response about my personal expectations are applicable to both sl and rl (except in rl I do have the bits with which to mash, should I choose to do so, lmao). Just using your post as a jumping off point.

Feelings can be every bit as real even if their cause comes from an online source. That's not to say they all will be, or the same interactions/responses with others, causes I guess, will be the same for everyone. But online interactions with people, even objects, can very much have a real effect. There are people who try and do their best to separate rl with sl, even trying to separate potential feelings caused by sl interactions. I don't know how successful they are, some may do quite well. I do know how not successful I am at it though. 

You know how hard it is to get kids to understand this concept? Sometimes some adults are a lost cause on that one.

[Theresa Tennyson]

22 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Or evolutionary conditioned ideas. So many other life forms on earth have instinctive mating habits, why the assumption that for homo sapiens it is socially conditioned? It doesn't seem logical in that respect.

Some people think that it's logical that snakes don't have legs because God got mad at the one that tempted Eve.

[Luna Bliss]

25 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

31 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Except that the OP is not addressing the expectations of actual flesh-and-blood women. It's merely resurrecting (for a kazillionth time) certain socially-determined stereotypes about women and their relationships with men.

And this, of course, cuts both ways. Women who expect their men to be "manly" are similarly conforming to socially-conditioned ideas of what constitutes a "desirable man."

We'd all be a lot happier, I suspect, if we spent more time addressing our preconceptions born of conventional group-think.

Expand  

Or evolutionary conditioned ideas. So many other life forms on earth have instinctive mating habits, why the assumption that for homo sapiens it is socially conditioned? It doesn't seem logical in that respect.

I can believe this might not apply to some people.