I think it's funny. I've accused other people of being creepy (particularly in SL)....

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Luna Bliss said:

Well I'm going to continue on helping others learn how to sing mantras or meditate, and right-click eject -- someone else can save them. LOL

Arielle, are you having fun yet?

 

The OP's question is:

Quote

What is the point of this post? I dunno. I just wanted to reflect on my "hypocrisy" of calling people "creeps" i guess. Or maybe illustrate how Second Life (and other virtual worlds) made me realize the errors of my ways and beliefs. Or something else.  

Do you feel you have responded to it yet?

[PersyBennett]

the men saying "hi" to a woman is creepy, but the man playing a woman isnt?  heh

[Marigold Devin]

3 hours ago, Gopi Passiflora said:

...but now that I think about it, I've also been creepy in the past (particularly in real life).

If you know me in the forum, sometimes I complain about receiving a lot of IMs from strangers when I'm playing as a woman avatar. I've called the men who IMed me "creeps" even for something as basic as a "hi" and "hru".  But I think I've done a similar thing in real life. Back when I was in college I cold-called these women on the phone I didn't really know, just to get to know them. Needless to say, they either didn't answer or were peeved at the call. I also complimented a woman in a job fair about her beauty, and that didn't go well either. I probably did other creepy stuff that I can't remember or realize at the time.

But now I think I know better than to do those things. I particularly realized the error of my ways when going online and exploring places like Second Life - y'know, experiencing life as a woman avatar and all that. But even more recently I just realized I was one of those SL people I called "creeps", too. Lonely, single, loveless, or whatever.

What is the point of this post? I dunno. I just wanted to reflect on my "hypocrisy" of calling people "creeps" i guess. Or maybe illustrate how Second Life (and other virtual worlds) made me realize the errors of my ways and beliefs. Or something else.  

 

 

I see nothing at all wrong in complimenting someone on how nice their hair looks or dress. It's something I've always done, but certainly I've found younger people find this quite a strange thing to do, and small children don't seem to react at all, so I guess I have become a creepy person too, because the world has changed, and what was acceptable when I was a small girl, is no longer acceptable. 

A couple of years ago, when we had thick snow, kids were playing on sledges on the small slopes of the field at the back of my brother's house. I thought I was giving encouragement as I walked past a group of kids taking it in turns to use their sledge, but actually got called "creep" and "weirdo" by two of the boys! Again, when I was a child and we used a sledge, it wasn't unusual for the neighbours to come out and watch us race or to even bring us out hot drinks and gloves and scarves, such was the sense of community back then.

[Luna Bliss]

1 minute ago, PersyBennett said:

the men saying "hi" to a woman is creepy, but the man playing a woman isnt?  heh

A man playing a woman is sometimes creepy, sometimes not.  No black & white to this -- we'd have to consider context.

[Luna Bliss]

5 minutes ago, Marigold Devin said:

I see nothing at all wrong in complimenting someone on how nice their hair looks or dress.

What if you were, say, standing in a customer service line....many people waiting to get their issue solved...and a man you didn't know walked up to you in the line and said "you look so pretty" ?   Clearly, we have to include context for this issue -- it can't be absolutely wrong or right in all cases.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Luna Bliss

[Arielle Popstar]

6 minutes ago, Marigold Devin said:

I see nothing at all wrong in complimenting someone on how nice their hair looks or dress. It's something I've always done, but certainly I've found younger people find this quite a strange thing to do, and small children don't seem to react at all, so I guess I have become a creepy person too, because the world has changed, and what was acceptable when I was a small girl, is no longer acceptable. 

That is the reaction of a child brought up with a lack of love and nurturing to the point they cannot take a compliment without denying its truth in some manner. And yes, it makes them uncomfortable and queasy when receiving a compliment. Been there, lived that. Took some work to overcome but it is an example of an inappropriate emotional response. Everyone should now stop genuinely complimenting  another because some of us might be uncomfortable with it? That is what some are trying to say here.

[Arielle Popstar]

10 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

What if you were, say, standing in a customer service line....many people waiting to get their issue solved...and a man you didn't know walked up to you in the line and said "you look so pretty" ?   Clearly, we have to include context for this issue -- it can't be absolutely wrong or right in all cases.

Smile, thank them and move on.

[Marigold Devin]

3 hours ago, Phil Deakins said:

It's sad that compliments can be taken badly. I'd guess that most aren't.

But you reminded me of of something that I was reminiscing about with a friend a few days ago. We were entertainers in a holdiay camp (Butlins for the Brits) and we were having lunch with some staff, including my girlfriend, when a lovely girl went by carrying her lunch. I told my girlfriend that she is lovely, so my girlfriend suggested that I tell her. She called her over and I told her that she is lovely. From that day on, the lovely girl became my girlfriend

What an absolutely lovely story.

Best time of my life was working at Butlins. After the times of knobbly knees, but still with Glamorous Grans and Captain Blood, none of which would be PC now. 

[Luna Bliss]

20 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

31 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

What if you were, say, standing in a customer service line....many people waiting to get their issue solved...and a man you didn't know walked up to you in the line and said "you look so pretty" ?   Clearly, we have to include context for this issue -- it can't be absolutely wrong or right in all cases.

Smile, thank them and move on.

Actually, a version of this did happen to me. Only the guy poked me in the arm and said "you, me, let's go!!!!".  It freaked me out...I didn't know if he had a gun, was mentally ill, or on drugs, and so could possibly be dangerous and might try to drag me out of the line.  His eyes were a little glassy so I'm thinking it was drugs.

People do not walk up to an individual person, a complete stranger standing in a long line and tell them they're pretty or poke them and give instructions to follow them. This is odd behavior, even for my podunk city-town.  it's wayyy over-friendly.

Anyway, aside from that, if people act in ways that ignore the typical boundaries one would expect (this could vary according to country and the location within a country), then it demonstrates they're not so aware of boundaries.  Now the person might just be socially inept, but it could also be that since they don't understand appropriate boundaries between self and others, or boundaries specific to their location, that they would not understand that they pushed in on yours.  That means danger -- they will take what is not theirs because in their eyes there is no 'you' .

I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake.

It could be, Arielle, that only a woman would understand this.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Luna Bliss

[Rowan Amore]

16 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Smile, thank them and move on.

Apparently, everyone has a hidden agenda and any compliment should be dissected to find the underlying meaning behind it.  I compliment both men and women in SL.  I have absolutely NO agenda whatsoever.  I don't want to be friends or hook up or steal their look.  It's sad that a kind word is now suspect.  

[UnilWay SpiritWeaver]

Context is key, and also the contents of the statement.

Random single word IMs are just weird - not creepy but more "what do I do with this, give me something to work with."

"Hi" vs "Hi, I see you're into [name of some SL hobby], I've been curious about that."
- In the second one, you've handed me a topic to engage with you over, something you probably used my profile to find out I'm into.

Other times...

Some words can be a compliment to my avatar, others can be pickup lines, and when and where I get these matters. If I'm in some explicit venue vs if I'm sitting in my linden home or at a philosophy club or something - it all matters.

 

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Luna Bliss said:

Actually, a version of this did happen to me. Only the guy poked me in the arm and said "you, me, let's go!!!!".  It freaked me out...I didn't know if he had a gun, was mentally ill, or on drugs, and so could possibly be dangerous and might try to drag me out of the line.  His eyes were a little glassy so I'm thinking it was drugs.

I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake.

And the best and safest way to handle such a situation is to smile, make a light hearted joke and mention your So is waiting for you. It takes the potential tension out of the situation while at the same time letting them know someone else is close by. It works in both RL and SL. Freaking out only causes aggravation and potentially escalates the situation.

Quote

 

Anyway, aside from that, if people act in ways that ignore the typical boundaries one would expect (this could vary according to country and the location within a country), then it demonstrates they're not so aware of boundaries.  Now the person might just be socially inept, but it could also be that since they don't understand boundaries they would not understand that they pushed in on yours.  That means danger -- they will take what is not theirs because in their eyes there is no 'you' .

 

That leaves you as the enlightened one to defuse a situation with the proper response, not an emotional reaction.

Quote

I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake.

Sure focus on the moment but that doesn't have to mean one needs to judge everyone around them. "Oh, there is a low life, creep, loser, misogynist" even before you really know what makes them tick.

Quote

It could be, Arielle, that only a woman would understand this.

Men and women are really not very different at their core. But I guess you don't understand that since you think we are

[Luna Bliss]

4 hours ago, Gopi Passiflora said:

If you know me in the forum, sometimes I complain about receiving a lot of IMs from strangers when I'm playing as a woman avatar. I've called the men who IMed me "creeps" even for something as basic as a "hi" and "hru".  But I think I've done a similar thing in real life. Back when I was in college I cold-called these women on the phone I didn't really know, just to get to know them. Needless to say, they either didn't answer or were peeved at the call. I also complimented a woman in a job fair about her beauty, and that didn't go well either. I probably did other creepy stuff that I can't remember or realize at the time.

But now I think I know better than to do those things. I particularly realized the error of my ways when going online and exploring places like Second Life - y'know, experiencing life as a woman avatar and all that

It's great you could have the experience of being a woman in SL, and that you're so willing to change your ways upon finding certain things frequently bother some women...not all men would be willing to do that!

5 gold stars!  

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, UnilWay SpiritWeaver said:

Context is key, and also the contents of the statement.

just have to requote u for emphasis.

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

18 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Actually, a version of this did happen to me. Only the guy poked me in the arm and said "you, me, let's go!!!!".  It freaked me out...I didn't know if he had a gun, was mentally ill, or on drugs, and so could possibly be dangerous and might try to drag me out of the line.  His eyes were a little glassy so I'm thinking it was drugs.

I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake.

And the best and safest way to handle such a situation is to smile, make a light hearted joke and mention your So is waiting for you. It takes the potential tension out of the situation while at the same time letting them know someone else is close by. It works in both RL and SL. Freaking out only causes aggravation and potentially escalates the situation.

A strange man who looks high in a public place, poking me in the arm and ordering me to go with him, possibly with a gun (who knows) will frighten me, always.  It's bizarre that you would expect otherwise.

[Luna Bliss]

6 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Quote

I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake.

Sure focus on the moment but that doesn't have to mean one needs to judge everyone around them. "Oh, there is a low life, creep, loser, misogynist" even before you really know what makes them tick.

What part of "stay alert" don't you understand? 

[Arielle Popstar]

15 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Apparently, everyone has a hidden agenda and any compliment should be dissected to find the underlying meaning behind it.  I compliment both men and women in SL.  I have absolutely NO agenda whatsoever.  I don't want to be friends or hook up or steal their look.  It's sad that a kind word is now suspect.  

And I was taught that multiple times growing up and yes, in certain cases it is right but I was taught to suspect all compliments. And from that I learned to distrust those who did even when it was well intentioned. I also learned to never compliment another out of the fear that they might feel as queasy about it as I used to.

SL has been a place where I have learned to be complimentary to others without expecting anything in return. As a result I have started to receive more compliments inworld from people who are not expecting anything else either. It is quite nice actually.

[Arielle Popstar]

5 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

What part of "stay alert" don't you understand? 

The part where it comes across as "hypervigilance". Not a healthy state.

[Luna Bliss]

1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said:

8 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

What part of "stay alert" don't you understand? 

The part where it comes across as "hypervigilance". Not a healthy state.

I did not say I was hypervigilant though.....I said I was alert/aware...this is what I said I was in public:

"I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake".

Of course there's no need to maintain such awareness in SL as there aren't men who weight 60 pounds more with upper body strength that can do damage, nor are there guns that can harm us.

I do stay aware, in SL, of signs that indicate someone has inappropriate boundaries though -- they will be more likely to push in on mine then and cause havoc at a group or disturb my peaceful meditation on the beach.

[Luna Bliss]

27 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Quote

It could be, Arielle, that only a woman would understand this.

Men and women are really not very different at their core. But I guess you don't understand that since you think we are

I think men and women, on average, are very different at their core, in both 1st and 2nd life. Men are more aggressive on average. Note I am saying "on average" and this does not apply to every man and woman (believe me, i have known some aggressive women). But this "on average" difference is why we see in the statistics that more men murder their women partners at a rate of 10 to 1.  This means that for every man murdered by a spouse there are 10 women murdered by their spouse.  And there are no safe houses/shelters for men as they are not needed -- only women need this to protect themselves and their children from aggressive spouses.

This aggressiveness plays out in 2nd life where men are more aggressive on average, and think they must be in control (thinking of a recent example where this guy thought he would take over my Heart Menders group one week).

 

[Arwyn Quandry]

One thing I've found success with when I play a male avatar is being specific in my compliments. 

"Wow you're so pretty" - Generally not taken well, often ignored, not a good entrance into a longer conversation. 

"Wow it's so cool how you matched the pattern on your heels to your headband, your look reminds me of (character in media)" - Specific, doesn't smack of lust, may lead into talk about the character or shopping. 

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, Arwyn Quandry said:

One thing I've found success with when I play a male avatar is being specific in my compliments. 

"Wow you're so pretty" - Generally not taken well, often ignored, not a good entrance into a longer conversation. 

"Wow it's so cool how you matched the pattern on your heels to your headband, your look reminds me of (character in media)" - Specific, doesn't smack of lust, may lead into talk about the character or shopping. 

Yes, that...more tailored compliments not taken to be 'lust' so easily.

Where I'm at, too, matters.  I'm remembering compliments about my looks at parties now that didn't phase me, whereas the same compliment as I'm sitting on a beach meditating or out shopping would come across far differently.

[Arielle Popstar]

15 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I did not say I was hypervigilant though.....I said I was alert/aware...this is what I said I was in public:

"I always pay attention in public, keep aware if anything doesn't feel quite right. I'm not paranoid, I feel fine, I feel happy -- I'm just more aware or alert in certain places.  If a situation feels "off', if people are not acting in a typical manner, this should be paid attention to for safety's sake".

Of course there's no need to maintain such awareness in SL as there aren't men who weight 60 pounds more with upper body strength that can do damage, nor are there guns that can harm us.

I do stay aware, in SL, of signs that indicate someone has inappropriate boundaries though -- they will be more likely to push in on mine then and cause havoc at a group or disturb my peaceful meditation on the beach.

No you didn't say it but it was implied when you mentioned earlier about how you keep a tight reign on who enters your personal space when you have the power. It is when people do have that power that their true selves come out. I would have thought you'd talk a potential pest into submission rather then resorting to the eject button. 

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

No you didn't say it but it was implied when you mentioned earlier about how you keep a tight reign on who enters your personal space when you have the power. It is when people do have that power that their true selves come out. I would have thought you'd talk a potential pest into submission rather then resorting to the eject button. 

You can't be serious.

[Cinnamon Mistwood]

5 hours ago, Gopi Passiflora said:

...but now that I think about it, I've also been creepy in the past (particularly in real life).

If you know me in the forum, sometimes I complain about receiving a lot of IMs from strangers when I'm playing as a woman avatar. I've called the men who IMed me "creeps" even for something as basic as a "hi" and "hru".  But I think I've done a similar thing in real life. Back when I was in college I cold-called these women on the phone I didn't really know, just to get to know them. Needless to say, they either didn't answer or were peeved at the call. I also complimented a woman in a job fair about her beauty, and that didn't go well either. I probably did other creepy stuff that I can't remember or realize at the time.

But now I think I know better than to do those things. I particularly realized the error of my ways when going online and exploring places like Second Life - y'know, experiencing life as a woman avatar and all that. But even more recently I just realized I was one of those SL people I called "creeps", too. Lonely, single, loveless, or whatever.

What is the point of this post? I dunno. I just wanted to reflect on my "hypocrisy" of calling people "creeps" i guess. Or maybe illustrate how Second Life (and other virtual worlds) made me realize the errors of my ways and beliefs. Or something else.  

 

 

I don't find anything you've described as creepy.  Enjoy your SL and do what you can to minimize your perceived negative effects on those around you.  You simply can't control how other people react or feel.

Personal Disclaimer: This is coming from someone who has been accused of have no sense of self preservation.  Ever.  Even in clearly dangeous situations. I will talk to anyone in SL or RL. It's not that I never get "creeped out" by people, it's just very rare. This acceptance of other's differences has served me well all through my life.

Just yesterday I was IM'd inworld and asked how I felt about... um... familial relations.  Would I like to play his mother who 'wants' her son?  Well, no.  I don't, but I wished him well on his journey to find his fantasy.  Creepy? No. Honest? Yes.  A polite refusal and he was on his way.  I did not feel insulted in any way.  I never once thought, "How dare!"

Gopi, enjoy your SL in any way that suits your own journey. It's not creepy to me.