Should 'Verified RL.....' Groups Actually Be Allowed ?

[Verena Vuckovic]

"just as goreans have certain things they want in their group or pg type groups want in their groups.."

"when they take it outside of their group and bring it to the public..then it's a grid problem.."

 

But it effectivey already IS outside the group. We're not talking about inclusive groups, like stamp collectors or something where the group definition is a particular inclusive group and says nothing about outsiders. The whole purpose of these groups is that they are deliberately making a statement about you if you are NOT a member.

Gorean groups don't have as their whole PURPOSE a statement about your RL status if you don't join !

[Venus Petrov]

I know someone who started such a group for 'voice-verified women' and asked me to join.  What for?  I do not need to belong to such a group.  My 'voice' is out there every Monday and Friday when I DJ.  Even so, there have been a very small number of times when someone has asked me if I were a dude (I have an alto voice).  I laugh. 

P.S. Qwal, if you would be so kind as to flick your tail so I can see if you are 'munk' or squirrel?  tyvm

[Verena Vuckovic]

"It is crazy to even think that such a group insists there is no choice in privacy. It is a vountary group made by voluntary people and you have a choice to join and reveal or not join, no pressure... lol Are you serious?

Why would you want to invade someone elses personal rights to assemble? lol"

 

It has nothing to do with right of assembly or free choice of privacy. That's the whole point.  The purpose of these groups is not to 'freely assemble' but to define another group.....non members....about whom aspersions such as 'dishonesty' ( see my list of group headers above ) can then be cast.  These aren't groups that are saying something about their members.....they are quite specifically set up to say something about anyone who won't join !

So I take it you'd be quite happy for me to set up a group whose entire premise was that you were dishonest, a fake, fraudulent, etc, if you did not join ? You woud not find anything even remotely disagreeable about such aspersion by lack of association ?

[Griffin Ceawlin]

Meh. The joke is on them. They'll find out later that the hawt babe that they've been bumping pixel uglies with is actually this guy's sister:

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

So I take it you'd be quite happy for me to set up a group whose entire

premise

was that

you

were dishonest, a fake, fraudulent, etc, if you did not join ? You woud not find anything even remotely disagreeable about such aspersion by

lack

of association ?

---

Well, I was at a funeral last night where the pastor looked out into the room and said he hoped that none of us had drifted away from God, as he was the only way to salvation. This was after he'd uttered some of the most curious things, including the "fact" that the deceased dying on Good Friday was proof positive of God's grand plan.

Was I bothered by being told I was gonna be excluded from heaven?

Nope.

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

Meh. The joke is on them. They'll find out later that the hawt babe that they've been bumping pixel uglies with is actually this guy's sister:

---

Griffin, if she wears the same style glasses, I'm interested!

[Qwalyphi Korpov]

The resident who provided the previous content, if any, has replaced it with this generic statement.

[Perrie Juran]

---

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

I'm reminded of a time when a friend told me some third party had told her that they'd heard me on voice at a certain location and the I was def a female.  Which was curious in that I'd almost never been on voice and never near that location.  Verfication drama.  Good times.

A chipmunk is better identified by the stripes on the head rather than on the tail end.

http://www.nps.gov/romo/naturescience/squirrel_chipmunk.htm

---

Well I can't think that I have ever heard a baritone chipmunk.  All the chipmunks I have ever heard squeaked (please forgive the human interpretation of your speaking) in a very high tone of voice.  I am sure that you chipmunks can tell the difference.

 

ETA to add, I would also like to debunk the myth that Martians talk out of their arse.  That is a condition that in the whole universe only humans seem to have the ability to do.

[Marianne McCann]

I am not a verified RL kid. :matte-motes-wink-tongue:

[Phil Deakins]

But are you verified as not being a verified RL kid. Without such verification, how can we believe you? You'd better find a suitable group and join it. Or create your own if no such group exists already.

[Senobia Xenga]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

The issue that I have is with inferences. Won't voice ? Won't 'verify' ? Oh....then you cannot possibly

really

be a woman. One is shoved into the 'fake' category

by default

 

 

---

Think about it. No, I mean really think about it.....should you really give a rat's arse what someone thinks of you in passing? Especially when that person is, more likely than not, 1,000s of miles - if not entire continents - away from you and the chance you will ever run across them in RL is between 0 and none?

 

Because if you seriously do, then you might want to re-think immersing yourself in any online situation at all, ever - in any form, forum or context.

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

"just as goreans have certain things they want in their group or pg type groups want in their groups.."

"when they take it outside of their group and bring it to the public..then it's a grid problem.."

 

But it effectivey already IS outside the group. We're not talking about

inclusive

groups, like stamp collectors or something where the group definition is a particular inclusive group and says nothing about outsiders. The whole purpose of these groups is that they are deliberately making a statement about you if you are NOT a member.

Gorean groups don't have as their whole PURPOSE a statement about your RL status if you don't join !

---

it must be something you feel they are saying to you..i don't feel anything from what you have quoted from their group..

they are not talking about my gender or yours..they are talking about the peoples that want to join..

i didn't read one thing in there where they are talking about the residents of second life..just typing up to those INQUIRING.......

it's some sex group and they just want to make sure that the people in the group are verified...they are not forcing them to do anything..

the gorean thing was an example of how groups have requirements..what they are has nothing to do with those not joining..pg groups or dancer groups or clubs or building groups viewer groups..any groups requiring someone to do a certain thing or abide by certain things is the same thing as what this group is ASKING from those that wish to join..they are not twisting anyones arm..

they are not singling anyone out..

they are not breaking the TOS keeping to thier group..

i don't see mass parties going out harrassing people on the grid about this sort of thing..i see individuals doing it..but that falls on the individual..group or no group if thye want to risk the AR..

until then ..sorry not seeing  it in anything you quoted from them..

when you find a TOS violation then  i'll agree ..but there isn't one here..so i'm fine with it hehehe

 

[Senobia Xenga]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

"Your privacy argument is redundant since people joining these groups are doing so voluntarily."

Well....no. The privacy argument is relevant because the entire

basis

of the existence of such groups is essentially an argument that people

have no right

  to such privacy ! Anyone who is so paranoid that they feel that people simply

must

reveal their true status is effectively saying that the right to privacy itself must be overriden.

 

And if you choose NOT to be a member of those groups - remind us again how their protocols affect you? Because until membership to such groups becomes mandatory, I'm just not seein' it.

 

[Senobia Xenga]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

You

seriously

think these groups don't want to force anyone to prove anything ?????

---

I don't see them trying to force it on anyone (namely you) so again, WHAT is your gripe?

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

I'm reminded of a time when a friend told me some third party had told her that they'd heard me on voice at a certain location and the I was def a female.  Which was curious in that I'd almost never been on voice and never near that location.  Verfication drama.  Good times.

A chipmunk is better identified by the stripes on the head rather than on the tail end.

http://www.nps.gov/romo/naturescience/squirrel_chipmunk.htm

---

i always thought it was by their amazing singing voices..because squirrels are like really bad at it..

and weasels..well just don't even go there!! they are terrible at it..

 

[Verena Vuckovic]

"I don't see them trying to force it on anyone "

 

Ah....well in that case you really need to look into the group 'Verified RL Blind As A Bat'

[Verena Vuckovic]

"they are not talking about my gender or yours..they are talking about the peoples that want to join.."

 

And why would anyone....er....'want' to join other than that they feel pressured to by the very insinuations that the group is set up to spread ?

 

"when you find a TOS violation then i'll agree ..but there isn't one here..so i'm fine with it hehehe"

It most certainly is a violation of TOS to spread or imply anything about a person's RL either by direct statement or by implication.  If one sets up a group whose entire implication is ' anyone who does NOT join this group is an XXX in RL'.......then you are by definition making a statement about the RL status of non members.

It's quite clear that the entire purpose of such groups is to circumvent TOS. The whole idea of such groups is that with a large enough membership a majority of people can be peer pressured into providing RL info. That is what these groups are all about.

 

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Verena Vuckovic wrote:

"they are not talking about my gender or yours..they are talking about the peoples that want to join.."

 

And why would anyone....er....'want' to join other than that they feel pressured to by the very insinuations that the group is set up to spread ?

 

"when you find a TOS violation then i'll agree ..but there isn't one here..so i'm fine with it hehehe"

It most certainly

is

a violation of TOS to spread or imply anything about a person's RL either by direct statement

or by implication

.  If one sets up a group whose entire implication is ' anyone who does NOT join this group is an XXX in RL'.......then you are

by definition

making a statement about the RL status of non members.

It's quite clear that the entire purpose of such groups is to circumvent TOS. The whole idea of such groups is that with a large enough membership a majority of people can be peer pressured into providing RL info. That is what these groups are all about.

 

---

i guess i just don't feel this peer pressure you do from these groups..

lets simplify this...

rather than trying to give your version of the rules..

just find the rule or rules they are breaking..quote the rule or rules in this thread..

i know the rules..show where these groups are not using an opt in or are breakign the rules with that quote of the rules..

until then.. there is nothing you or i could do about them..and chances are you won't convice  anyone they are breaking any rule until you can produce one that exists..

 

 

[Qwalyphi Korpov]

The resident who provided the previous content, if any, has replaced it with this generic statement.

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Perrie Juran wrote:

ETA to add, I would also like to debunk the myth that Martians talk out of their arse.  That is a condition that in the whole universe only humans seem to have the ability to do.

---

/me jots another note in her Things I know about Martians File...

"May have arses. Don't talk out of them."

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

---

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

I'm reminded of a time when a friend told me some third party had told her that they'd heard me on voice at a certain location and the I was def a female.  Which was curious in that I'd almost never been on voice and never near that location.  Verfication drama.  Good times.

A chipmunk is better identified by the stripes on the head rather than on the tail end.

http://www.nps.gov/romo/naturescience/squirrel_chipmunk.htm

---

i always thought it was by their amazing singing voices..because squirrels are like really bad at it..

and weasels..well just don't even go there!! they are terrible at it..

---

I'm afraid I have some news that may be upsetting for you.  Lately I'm hearing that Alvin and friends are in fact not RL chipmunks.   Most likely they are punked up gerbils with highlighted stripes.  Enough to pass for chipmunk on standard def TV.  Dats why they never made it into the HD era.  In a DNA test they're 98% chipmunk but then so is every other mammal.  Sorries if u is shocked and appalled.

---

Christmas will never be the same ever again....

[Anaiya Arnold]

Sure, I've met such people, but I'm not the least bit bothered that they don't want to interact with me.  If someone wants to push beyond my comfort zone, for access to what I think of as my RL, in a context like SL, I'd rather avoid them.  In my experience a disproportionate number of people who push for access to someone's RL in a "removed and discrete" online context, without taking every care for that person's comfort and privacy, are into drama or into being pushy in other ways.  I'd rather not deal with those people.

Anyone who thinks that if someone will not voice with them or otherwise give them access to their RL, they must be "not a real woman" is none-too-bright.  Do they think we all sit around every day just hoping to meet that special stalker?

[Ceera Murakami]

In a way, I love it that such groups exist. Anyone who insists others "must" be in that sort of group to be "acceptable" to them is tagging themselves as someone I don't want to waste my time socializing with. Saves me so much time in bothering to get to know them. Sort of like if the losers in a bar would be kind enough to hang a big "Loser" sign around their neck, so I can avoid bothering to talk with them.

Honestly, anyone that wants to RP with Ceera has to accept that Ceera, who is a three-tailed anthropomorphic vixen, is a fictional character from the word 'Go', and that she never has and never will offer to anyone a 'real life relationship'. All I want out of SL relationships is fictional fun between fictional characters. Anyone who sees their avatar as an extension of their real self, or who can't see their avatar as separate and distinct from themselves, or who gives a damn if the person typing the words for someone else's avatar is male, female, straight, gay or any other real life details, is on my "exclude" list for roleplaying in SL.

If someone said to Ceera "I won't interact with you unless you prove you're a real girl by doing Voice and a webcam with me", or by 'proving' real life info in any other way, such as sharing still photos, My response is quite simple:

"Okay. Then go away and find someone else. Beacuse you don't want me, and I don't want you. Thank you. Bye!"

[Anaiya Arnold]

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Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

---

---

I'm afraid I have some news that may be upsetting for you.  Lately I'm hearing that Alvin and friends are in fact not RL chipmunks.   Most likely they are punked up gerbils with highlighted stripes.  Enough to pass for chipmunk on standard def TV.  Dats why they never made it into the HD era.  In a DNA test they're 98% chipmunk but then so is every other mammal.  Sorries if u is shocked and appalled.

---

This is like Milli Vanilli all over again (except without the lycra bike shorts).

Why?! 

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

I am pretty...meh on this issue. I actually haven't seen any of this, but I am a bit hermity so...

Really, I am past the SL relationship thing for some time now, so I have no real reason to care who is what. I honestly don't see what it matters anyhow, unless people are planning on taking a releationship off-game.

Is anyone really exactly who they portray themselves to be online? I doubt it. There are a lot of my personality aspects that come through from RL to SL, but that doesn't mean that others don't like to be a totally different person, or 12, in game.

As long as these groups leave me the hell alone, I don't care what they do. If they are going out and harassing avi's, spreading rumours about avi's verified status, or what not...I would take issue. I have the right to not pay them attention as long as they aren't actively bothering me or hurting my interactions with others.