BilliJo Aldrin Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 18 hours ago, Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia said: Oh, for god's sake... nobody wants to talk about how much you hate flexi prims. We talked about it in 2007. It's over. Stop beating a dead horse! LOL Whats wrong with flexi prims? *tossles her hair and feels it blow in the breeze* 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feorie Frimon Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 20 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said: A corollary question which gets asked often is, "if you are so unhappy, why are you on Second Life still?" This is such a passive aggressive question that is only asked when they can’t justify their position on the original topic. Resident: Um - this seems shady. Can we fix it? Them: No. Resident: Why not? It’s not against the rules. Can you explain to me how this works so I can go back to making money for SL? Them: No. And if you don’t like it, when why are you here? It makes no sense to me. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, Feorie Frimon said: This is such a passive aggressive question that is only asked when they can’t justify their position on the original topic. Resident: Um - this seems shady. Can we fix it? Them: No. Resident: Why not? It’s not against the rules. Can you explain to me how this works so I can go back to making money for SL? Them: No. And if you don’t like it, when why are you here? It makes no sense to me. You miss the point: I was referring to people who ONLY complain, have nothing good to say, only trash LL, etc. Not just people who complain once about one thing, or have a single area of Peeve. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elleevelyn Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 23 hours ago, Sid Nagy said: We need more breathing beating room for serious Second Life discussions here. fify 😹 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feorie Frimon Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Just now, Love Zhaoying said: You miss the point: I was referring to people who ONLY complain, have nothing good to say, only trash LL, etc. Not just people who complain once about one thing, or have a single area of Peeve. No, I see the point, I just don’t agree with it. 🤷🏻♀️ 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirhc DeSantis Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Fascinating. Hence a Modest Proposal Given that the General Section of the Forum Does Not Reflect the Population of Second Life a) posting to the General Section should be limited to those logged in World. b) Once established the Company should Henceforth provide a Sim or Region dedicated to the Usual Denizens as said General Section c) Profit (cue Gnomes) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elleevelyn Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 being more serious in terms of culture wars the forum moderators do let it run when culture is impacted by ToS changes. The recent ToS re child avatars being the latest. It ran for pages and pages and days and days and got quite heated at times 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodhiSeven Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 being positive is good. i wonder if being empty or quiet is even better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristiano Midnight Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 On 6/14/2024 at 9:26 AM, Sid Nagy said: The question in the thread title basically says it all. We don't seem to even get the possibility to discuss serious Second Life problems or problems that affect merchants or the marketplace. Isn't that why the forums are here in the first place? It has pretty much become a waist of time to be member of the forums as they are handled now. Again. Some threads can go on for ever. Others .... ToS, Rules, fine but where is the consistency? We need more breathing room for serious Second Life discussions here. Inconsistent moderation and the threat of what you say here affecting your SL account were among the reasons I started a third party forum 21 years ago. Not much has changed it seems. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 hour ago, Feorie Frimon said: No, I see the point, I just don’t agree with it. 🤷🏻♀️ Ok, cool. Your illustration seemed otherwise. It's all good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 8 minutes ago, Cristiano Midnight said: Inconsistent moderation and the threat of what you say here affecting your SL account were among the reasons I started a third party forum 21 years ago. Not much has changed it seems. I haven't gotten an actual "retained/saved" warning (the kind you could see in your profile), or a temporary ban, in 5 years. Prior to that I had 3. From my point of view, moderation has relaxed a LOT. This from me - who post a lot more than others. (Yes, mods do cleanup threads, send messages, etc.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arielle Popstar Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 13 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: I haven't gotten an actual "retained/saved" warning (the kind you could see in your profile), or a temporary ban, in 5 years. Prior to that I had 3. From my point of view, moderation has relaxed a LOT. This from me - who post a lot more than others. (Yes, mods do cleanup threads, send messages, etc.) But you rarely take a stand one way or another so that doesn't seem surprising. It is those of us who take a position that are most often challenged, sometimes aggressively so. That then results in a response in kind leading to moderator action. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Amore Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 33 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: I haven't gotten an actual "retained/saved" warning (the kind you could see in your profile), or a temporary ban, in 5 years. Prior to that I had 3. From my point of view, moderation has relaxed a LOT. This from me - who post a lot more than others. (Yes, mods do cleanup threads, send messages, etc.) I agree. I've had 3 official warnings since I've been posting. More recently, they just seem to send you a message, without an official warning attached, to tell you they removed a post and to behave. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnerCity Elf Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 On 6/14/2024 at 4:05 PM, discussionbot said: It's just a glorified echo chamber. Good luck with that. That's pretty much true for all forums, Reddits, etc., that I've ever seen and that lasted for a while, to be fair, if it's not moderation, it's the hive mind, or even a few "influencer individuals" who set the tone and cause an echo. That it's most forums, doesn't make it better, though, of course. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnerCity Elf Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 23 hours ago, Roxy Couturier said: Forums not under the control of the corporation they talk about are the place to have more robust conversations That's true. On the other hand, I've seen forum discussions that actually inspired changes in their corporations, while the corporations are more bound to ignore or even being unaware of conversations elsewhere. Perhaps having robust discussions elsewhere, and bringing what consent there is from those to the corporate forums might be an approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristiano Midnight Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said: I haven't gotten an actual "retained/saved" warning (the kind you could see in your profile), or a temporary ban, in 5 years. Prior to that I had 3. From my point of view, moderation has relaxed a LOT. This from me - who post a lot more than others. (Yes, mods do cleanup threads, send messages, etc.) That is good then, for awhile it was pretty extreme. Granted, I don't participate much here anyway. Still, when you have a company's forum, there will always be limits to what they allow to be discussed that is critical of said company. It goes with the territory and is not unique to LL, but it is still problematic. There have been some topics they have allowed leeway on because quite frankly they had to (bloggate/child av policy), but others they are quick to shut down. Whatever the case, it is par for the course. Edited June 15 by Cristiano Midnight 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliJo Aldrin Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 hours ago, Cristiano Midnight said: Inconsistent moderation and the threat of what you say here affecting your SL account were among the reasons I started a third party forum 21 years ago. Not much has changed it seems. I signed up a couple of weeks ago, but haven't posted yet 😁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codex Alpha Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 hours ago, Cristiano Midnight said: Inconsistent moderation and the threat of what you say here affecting your SL account were among the reasons I started a third party forum 21 years ago. That idea only works if one signs up under that forum without their SL name, as anything you say can and will be monitored by the original staff and users, and used against you. Some dedicated fans will follow people they allegedly 'hate', just to keep updated on what they say, etc. Strange behaviour but it happens. Some have reported even having their words screenshotted and pasted from private Discord rooms into others, and into staff hands. We're in a new era where the rules of civility and privacy no longer exist. Everything you type and say can and will be used against you, in context or not, so a chilling effect definitely has happened. It isn't carefree go lucky 2010 in SL or related platforms anymore. 2 hours ago, Arielle Popstar said: But you rarely take a stand one way or another so that doesn't seem surprising. It is those of us who take a position that are most often challenged, sometimes aggressively so. That then results in a response in kind leading to moderator action. Yep, always those who play it safe never have a problem. The smartest ones are the ones who remain silent. How strange that over time, they can be the most popular on a platform - because they never said a word, and therefore people see them as harmless. Add a cute adorable avatar and it's a recipe for popularity. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristiano Midnight Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, Codex Alpha said: That idea only works if one signs up under that forum without their SL name, as anything you say can and will be monitored by the original staff and users, and used against you. Some dedicated fans will follow people they allegedly 'hate', just to keep updated on what they say, etc. Strange behaviour but it happens. Some have reported even having their words screenshotted and pasted from private Discord rooms into others, and into staff hands. We're in a new era where the rules of civility and privacy no longer exist. Everything you type and say can and will be used against you, in context or not, so a chilling effect definitely has happened. It isn't carefree go lucky 2010 in SL or related platforms anymore. Yep, always those who play it safe never have a problem. The smartest ones are the ones who remain silent. How strange that over time, they can be the most popular on a platform - because they never said a word, and therefore people see them as harmless. Add a cute adorable avatar and it's a recipe for popularity. The TOS does not apply outside of SL and these forums. It does not extend to any third party sites, including Discord, Reddit or other forums. If they are disciplined for something outside of what was said in SL or here, then LL is violating their own user agreement. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codex Alpha Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Cristiano Midnight said: The TOS does not apply outside of SL and these forums. It does not extend to any third party sites, including Discord, Reddit or other forums. If they are disciplined for something outside of what was said in SL or here, then LL is violating their own user agreement. LL's Sansar TOS included such actions, as well as the modern Roblox TOS (for interest sake), that anyone can be disciplined even outside the regular areas for words or actions or (alleged) harassment of users related to the platform. For the response you quoted specifically, that may be true, but not practiced. Keep in mind there is a lot of crossover of staff and users (in the LL and "San Francisco crowd") - so these things happen, and have been PROVEN to happen. Just a warning, or reminder. We can extend these to things posted on Reddit, Twitter, wherever. Even on third party sites, do not use your main account name - there will be consequences. Many play for keeps these days, Cristiano. Edited June 15 by Codex Alpha 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristiano Midnight Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Codex Alpha said: LL's Sansar TOS included such actions, as well as the modern Roblox TOS (for interest sake), that anyone can be disciplined even outside the regular areas for words or actions or (alleged) harassment of users related to the platform. For the response you quoted specifically, that may be true, but not practiced. Keep in mind there is a lot of crossover of staff and users - so these things happen, and have been PROVEN to happen. Just a warning, or reminder. We can extend these to things posted on Reddit, Twitter, wherever. Even on third party sites, do not use your main account name - there will be consequences. Many play for keeps these days, Cristiano. I have been through more than you can imagine from running the largest SL third party forum. I am not worried in the slightest by comparison. There are times I have limited discussion of a topic only for the protection of my site from legal issues (I had a similar policy to /r/secondlife in regards to the recent ***** issue discussion), but otherwise have never restricted what can be discussed. Edited June 15 by Cristiano Midnight 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codex Alpha Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Cristiano Midnight said: I have been through more than you can imagine from running the largest SL third party forum. I am not worried in the slightest by comparison. Just for a heads up, I was using 'You' in a general sense. I never get used to use "one this", "one that", as even if it is non personal and correct, always sounds corny as hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristiano Midnight Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Just now, Codex Alpha said: Just for a heads up, I was using 'You' in a general sense. I never get used to use "one this", "one that", as even if it is non personal and correct, always sounds corny as hell. I knew what you meant. One does sound more formal certainly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Mistwood Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 5 minutes ago, Codex Alpha said: 2 hours ago, Arielle Popstar said: But you rarely take a stand one way or another so that doesn't seem surprising. It is those of us who take a position that are most often challenged, sometimes aggressively so. That then results in a response in kind leading to moderator action. Yep, always those who play it safe never have a problem. The smartest ones are the ones who remain silent. How strange that over time, they can be the most popular on a platform - because they never said a word, and therefore people see them as harmless. Add a cute adorable avatar and it's a recipe for popularity. I take a stand on issues that are important to me. I think most people do. I do, however, play it safe with my words and try to keep to the topic and ideas instead of the people who posted them. Occasionally a I'll look at a post and think "Nope, not touching that." I fail at that sometimes, but I try. There will always be flamers and instigators that enter threads with the sole intention of riling people up and derailing threads like its some sort of sport to see if they can get a post locked. There are some that post incredibly obvious personal attacks over and over again and nothing happens. There are some who bring RL issues and politics into every thread over and over and nothing happens. There are some who derail threads over and over and nothing happens. It's the same few people over and over. Has me wondering who they know in the inside that lets those posts stand over and over. I like the forum and get a lot of news here about rule changes, updates, new features, issues with viewers, and even some entertainment, but it is difficult to just have a chat about some things. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliJo Aldrin Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 11 minutes ago, Cristiano Midnight said: The TOS does not apply outside of SL and these forums. It does not extend to any third party sites, including Discord, Reddit or other forums. If they are disciplined for something outside of what was said in SL or here, then LL is violating their own user agreement. I signed up with your forum using my SL name, and picture. You are right, anything you do outside of SL will not affect your SL, as one of my fans found out a few weeks ago. I really should unblock him in case he wants to rant at me some more, he is always good for a blog post 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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