So what changed in the Terms of Service?

[Love Zhaoying]

4 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

32 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

That's your impression ... and also no different from saying "she's asking for it".

The who IS running the child part of the couple engaging in AP?  It takes 2.  

Maybe the Adult Avatar is "asking for it"?  How bizarre!

Luckily, the topic is not about AP.  Right? Unless that's what Coffee wants to talk about. I'm no prude!

 

[Theresa Tennyson]

11 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Not me! I'm just saying, "ignore public nudity" on Moderate land. Basically, get over it - it's allowed in the TOS (unless it changes, we are misinterpreting it, etc.).

ETA: When I suggested "restrict child avatars to G land", it was as an alternative argument to giving up "rights" on Moderate land. 🙂

 

Once again, let's say what the policy actually says...

Is simple nudity without sex Adult?

Depending on context, nudity may not require an Adult rating. For example all of the following could be rated Moderate:

• A nude beach without sexual activity.
• Skin vendors showing a nude skin to display the product.
• Nude art that is not sexual.
• Strip clubs that do not use adult words in search or host sex furniture.

Depending on the context, exposed genitalia may not be considered Adult. For example:

• Hanging out at a nude beach would be fine.
• Walking around pants-less on the mainland could be inappropriate.

Non-sexualized depictions of nudity are Moderate NOT Adult.

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

Now here's where people say, "They didn't say it WAS ALWAYS inappropriate."

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Maybe the Adult Avatar is "asking for it"?  How bizarre!

Luckily, the topic is not about AP.  Right? Unless that's what Coffee wants to talk about. I'm no prude!

 

Why bizarre? Some of us never ask for it and don't have to because Adults come to the younger avatars. You really have to try it to understand and relate.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

10 minutes ago, JUSTUS Palianta said:

If LL is reading this and considering any of it why haven't they updated the FAQ Monday work day is over now.

Tommy Linden posted earlier this morning that they'd be updating the FAQ in a few days and will provide more guidance as to the modesty layers.

Where that post is...I dunno. A million pages back by now.

[Jaylinbridges]

2 minutes ago, Silverdown Seetan said:

So under this logic my current avatar I can add a tail and ears to my tweeneedo child body , call my self a cub and be exempt from the new rules?  I feel that would make me more likely to be targeted by a person with a weird mind seeing alot of adults use tails and ears. 

That could be a good test case.  But the rules are clear I think, they don't include definitions of a neko adult or cub. What age does a cub become an adult?  And this applies to teenagers too- which is the actual problem here.

[brodiac90]

5 minutes ago, Chery Amore said:

Beats the Twilight Zone I guess. Let's just call it Split..

But seriously if you do try it, get yourself a camera hud to change your camera to head height. If you think adults look tall now wait until you see them from a kid's perspective. 

Edited May 6 by brodiac90

[Coffee Pancake]

7 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

The who IS running the child part of the couple engaging in AP?  It takes 2.  

Approaching this with a presumption of wrong doing or guilt isn't helpful and only serves to silence those with child avatars reading this thread.

[Love Zhaoying]

2 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

Once again, let's say what the policy actually says...

Is simple nudity without sex Adult?

Depending on context, nudity may not require an Adult rating. For example all of the following could be rated Moderate:

• A nude beach without sexual activity.
• Skin vendors showing a nude skin to display the product.
• Nude art that is not sexual.
• Strip clubs that do not use adult words in search or host sex furniture.

Depending on the context, exposed genitalia may not be considered Adult. For example:

• Hanging out at a nude beach would be fine.
• Walking around pants-less on the mainland could be inappropriate.

Non-sexualized depictions of nudity are Moderate NOT Adult.

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

Now here's where people say, "They didn't say it WAS ALWAYS inappropriate."

Yep! And I noticed the "red" line was also a stand-out previously.

So, how did we get to where now, we are discussing "Adult nudity NOT ok" on Moderate land?  Is it just because someone requested "no public nudity"?  (I notice that there is no "Public" mention above, so it could be "out of scope" / not covered in the specific rules.)

[Love Zhaoying]

4 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

7 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Maybe the Adult Avatar is "asking for it"?  How bizarre!

Luckily, the topic is not about AP.  Right? Unless that's what Coffee wants to talk about. I'm no prude!

 

Why bizarre? Some of us never ask for it and don't have to because Adults come to the younger avatars. You really have to try it to understand and relate.

Arielle, my usage of "how bizarre" was ironic (i.e., sarcasm). 

(This is why we can't have nice things, and why I used to always put 'is joke'.)

Edited May 6 by Love Zhaoying

[Chery Amore]

3 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Yep! And I noticed the "red" line was also a stand-out previously.

So, how did we get to where now, we are discussing "Adult nudity NOT ok" on Moderate land?  Is it just because someone requested "no public nudity"?  (I notice that there is no "Public" mention above, so it could be "out of scope" / not covered in the specific rules.)

Yes.  Some want a whole new TOS and restrictions for us dirty adults instead of clarification of what's already there. 

[Arielle Popstar]

15 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

The who IS running the child part of the couple engaging in AP?  It takes 2.  

You make up a lot of different outfits, try a younger look and go to a few clubs to see the reaction you get after immersing yourself in an actual younger role. May take a few times to understand but then at least you'll have a better idea and won't be leaving these confused reactions on my posts.

Really goes for the lot of you who think you know and really show you haven't a clue.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

Just to bring this forward a bit (I actually found it - page 165). 

Screenshot to avoid quoting unnecessarily.

[Rowan Amore]

4 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Approaching this with a presumption of wrong doing or guilt isn't helpful and only serves to silence those with child avatars reading this thread.

I'm not presuming guilt.  I'm saying there ARE bad actors on both sides.

Maybe LL should have restricted the adult avatars?  Might have put a dent in the adult activity that you've said keeps the doors open.  

Will any of this fix anything?  Probably not.

[Branduff Bisnovat]

6 minutes ago, Chery Amore said:

Yes.  Some want a whole new TOS and restrictions for us dirty adults instead of clarification of what's already there. 

I just want like an infographic or something. LL is so bad at communicating it's wild, everything is buried behind outdated wiki pages on a good day.

[Arielle Popstar]

24 minutes ago, Silverdown Seetan said:

So under this logic my current avatar I can add a tail and ears to my tweeneedo child body , call my self a cub and be exempt from the new rules?  I feel that would make me more likely to be targeted by a person with a weird mind seeing alot of adults use tails and ears. 

I wonder if can have a bulge at the back of my slacks to show I stuffed my tail down there!

[Rowan Amore]

8 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

You make up a lot of different outfits, try a younger look and go to a few clubs to see the reaction you get after immersing yourself in an actual younger role. May take a few times to understand but then at least you'll have a better idea and won't be leaving these confused reactions on my posts.

Really goes for the lot of you who think you know and really show you haven't a clue.

So, you're saying all the child avatars at Giggles and Family safe are innocent?  Those are the ones I'm talking about.  The ones run by creepy adults.  Not child avatars in general.

Don't presume to know what I know.  You might be surprised.

ETA...I showed pictures.   AI already thinks my avatar looks 14.

Edited May 6 by Rowan Amore

[AnthonyJoanne]

4 hours ago, Leslie Trihey said:

I'm sorry but if you think well over 40's dominate SL you need to get out more. The data is sketchy, sure I'll admit that. But all similar data sites back this. My demographic PIONEERED this technology. You merely adopted it.

I'll bite.

What demographic do you fall in?

How do you justify your claim that your demographic pioneered the technology if you aren't a Baby Boomer?

(You may already have answered this question ... I'm five pages behind, but if I wait until I get to the end I'll forget to ask)

[Love Zhaoying]

7 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

23 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Approaching this with a presumption of wrong doing or guilt isn't helpful and only serves to silence those with child avatars reading this thread.

I'm not presuming guilt.  I'm saying there ARE bad actors on both sides.

Maybe LL should have restricted the adult avatars?  Might have put a dent in the adult activity that you've said keeps the doors open.  

Will any of this fix anything?  Probably not.

Isn't a presumption of "possible wrong-doing" exactly why these changes are needed?  Or, are the changes needed just because of "laws"?

[Love Zhaoying]

4 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

ETA...I showed pictures.   AI already thinks my avatar looks 14.

It's your youthful visage!

[Theresa Tennyson]

14 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Yep! And I noticed the "red" line was also a stand-out previously.

So, how did we get to where now, we are discussing "Adult nudity NOT ok" on Moderate land?  Is it just because someone requested "no public nudity"?  (I notice that there is no "Public" mention above, so it could be "out of scope" / not covered in the specific rules.)

It came into play when adult nudity on moderate land started to affect others - namely, child avatars.

Child avatars are now not supposed to be where nudity occurs, is encouraged or expected. Perhaps it would be fair to say that adult nudity should not be allowed where child avatars are encouraged or expected. Nekkid at a nude beach? Of course. Your house? Fine. The Unknown Theme Park in Rivula and Moneta, both Moderate? Why should it be your "right" there?

[brodiac90]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

Isn't a presumption of "possible wrong-doing" exactly why these changes are needed?  Or, are the changes needed just because of "laws"?

Let's get real here, there were kid avis who were bad actors in all this. As I've said before, people who play with genuine kid avatars hate those type of kid avatars more than anyone else. I gurantee that. 

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

The age of consent around the world varies from 11 to 21, but the most common ages range from 14-16, according to the World Population Review. In some countries, such as Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Libya, Iran, Pakistan, and Qatar, there is no age of consent but people must be married.

 

 So, I wonder if a teen (I was active at 16) at age 16 would be in violation of Linden Law.  Or is it a country (state) by Country (state) basis? However, my state is 18 yo...  so under age 18 where I am can get you in jail!

 In Nigeria for example, age 11. (I was shocked)

So, what ages (child) are we talking about? I might have missed that part.

[Love Zhaoying]

8 minutes ago, Branduff Bisnovat said:

I just want like an infographic or something.

Exactly what do you want to see shown in an infographic?

Like, a flowchart of "Is avatar an Adult? <Yes/No>", "Is avatar naked? <Yes/No>"?

[Rowan Amore]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Isn't a presumption of "possible wrong-doing" exactly why these changes are needed?  Or, are the changes needed just because of "laws"?

IMO, they were put in place to help prevent wrong doing.  It won't be effective.  

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

It came into play when adult nudity on moderate land started to affect others - namely, child avatars.

But..hasn't that part of the equation always been the case? Nothing "changed" in that aspect, unless I am misunderstanding.

Poor, innocent child avatars don't want to see nasty, dirty, adult avatars naked.  I get it.  Weird, but I get it.