Firestorm & Mac Monterey OS - Some Things You Ought To Know

[TaraSimone Sixpence]

I am just putting this out there, to save anyone the headache I went through yesterday. If the Mods want to move this to a different forum, go right ahead.

I am giving you all the steps so I don't get remarks like - well, you forgot this or that.

History:

This is only for Mac people. Please, no Windows-Mac arguments. This, I think, only applies to Monterey and forward, because Gatekeeper has become aggressive at keeping unwanted apps off Macs.

I suddenly experienced (and still am btw) a huge drop in my FPS on my Mac. I went through all the usual procedures:

1. Reboot Router
2. Reboot Machine
3. Close all open programs 
4. Making sure my AV which is Bitdefender and always served me faithfully, did not suddenly go bonkers.
5. Checking all the Network and Graphic levels in FS
6. Making sure my Mac was clean and up to par. The one I use for SL is not my M1 - but a MacPro late 2019 with 1TB of disk, 16 g. Memory...it is the top model of the range.

Nothing worked or help solve the problem.

Then what do you next? You call your ISP and figure out what is going on. My ISP is excellent, and I was wondering if they were playing around with the infrastructure in my area, as they are getting ready for Optic Fibers. After exhaustive time on the phone going through every scenario they could think of and I could think of, they are going to replace my Mesh Router. I tend to doubt that will help but am willing to give it a chance.

The next step I did, and this one is where I hope will save you a lot of heartache if you try to install FS on Monterey. I decided to reinstall FS - it was a possibility that something got corrupted.To uninstall, I always make sure it is a complete uninstall of any program. For this I use a very well know Mac App called, "Clean My Mac" and go to the Uninstaller. 

That is when my 2-hour nightmare started.

1. Apple has something called "Gatekeeper." This is a known product for Developers and tech people, but the basic public is sometimes not aware of it. 
2. Gatekeeper had become more and more aggressive with each OS release. In short, what it does is prevent you from downloading anything that is not from the App Store. 
3. Until now, it never had problems with FS. Now it decided to play dirty.
4. If you wish to download other products, you go to System Preferences ---> Security & Privacy, unlock and check the second box on the bottom, which says: "App Store and Identified Devleopers"
5. In most cases this will work fine.
6. Note: There is an option hidden there. This is critical to install Firestorm.
7. When you download the Viewer from FS it all works fine.
8. Then you extract it to applications. NP.
9. Try to run it, and your Mac will come back with a message - "There is something damaged or corrupted in the file." And two options Cancel or Trash.
10. Try to run that same dmg again to get FS up, you will immediately get that message.
11. I tried this over 5 times Download-Extract to Application - Run and each time i got that message.
12. There is a trick most Mac developers know. When the app is already in the applications folder, you do not double click on it to run. You Control-Mouse Click which opens a menu. Then on that menu you click Open. This almost always works. As it bypasses Gatekeeper most of the time.
13. Turns out Apple really does not like the FS Viewer DMG. I mean, they really do not like it on Monterey.
14. So, i was left very perplexed.FS has been running on the Mac - the newest version. But suddenly with a reinstall on Monterey it would not past Gatekeeper, and Gatekeeper demanded I trash it because it was potentially corrupted.
15. This took a search starting the Firestorm app and going into the Apple Gatekeeper.

The Solution:

You will need terminal knowledge here. Sorry about this folks but only way to do this, until FS figures out a way to appease Apple. Good luck with that! Also there is a lot of misinformation about this command on the Net, so be careful you type it in exactly how it is written below.

1. Open your Apple Terminal. If you are not familiar with this go to your Applications button on the dock, click it and in the search bar just type in Terminal, and then click on the Terminal app.
2. Your Terminal will open up and wait for your input.
3. Type in as follows: 

   sudo spctl --master-disable

4. Exactly like that. What that command does is tell Apple to disable the entire Gateway system.
5. Make sure you type it in exactly as above, because as I have said, previous versions of the Mac OS had a different syntax to type in. Then hit Enter.
6. When you type that command in the Terminal will ask you for Password for the Mac. If you do not have that password - then you could not be on your screen in the first place.
7. If you type in your PW correctly, Hit Enter and the command line should return without any errors or any messages.
8. To verify this worked, go back to System Preferences ---> Security & Privacy and on the bottom a third option should appear "ANY Program." Use this with great caution, especially if you do not know Macs well.
9. Check "any program"!
10. Now make sure you trashed all your previous FS attempts at install. 
11. Download a fresh DMG from FS, put it in Applications folder. 
12. Control-Click to open.
13. You should now get the message "Unknown developer. Are you sure you want to Open the App?" With options. Just click OPEN.
14. Voila! FS will run
15. Clean up - if. you want to keep your Mac protected now go back to the terminal and type in:

16. sudo spctl --master-enable

17. Will ask you for PW again.
18. With this the "Any program" disappears and Gatekeeper is back up and running.

END

P.S. I hope FS makes nice with Apple for the next release.

[Gavin Hird]

46 minutes ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

I am just putting this out there, to save anyone the headache I went through yesterday. If the Mods want to move this to a different forum, go right ahead.

I am giving you all the steps so I don't get remarks like - well, you forgot this or that.

History:

This is only for Mac people. Please, no Windows-Mac arguments. This, I think, only applies to Monterey and forward, because Gatekeeper has become aggressive at keeping unwanted apps off Macs.

I suddenly experienced (and still am btw) a huge drop in my FPS on my Mac. I went through all the usual procedures:

1. Reboot Router
2. Reboot Machine
3. Close all open programs 
4. Making sure my AV which is Bitdefender and always served me faithfully, did not suddenly go bonkers.
5. Checking all the Network and Graphic levels in FS
6. Making sure my Mac was clean and up to par. The one I use for SL is not my M1 - but a MacPro late 2019 with 1TB of disk, 16 g. Memory...it is the top model of the range.

Nothing worked or help solve the problem.

Then what do you next? You call your ISP and figure out what is going on. My ISP is excellent, and I was wondering if they were playing around with the infrastructure in my area, as they are getting ready for Optic Fibers. After exhaustive time on the phone going through every scenario they could think of and I could think of, they are going to replace my Mesh Router. I tend to doubt that will help but am willing to give it a chance.

The next step I did, and this one is where I hope will save you a lot of heartache if you try to install FS on Monterey. I decided to reinstall FS - it was a possibility that something got corrupted.To uninstall, I always make sure it is a complete uninstall of any program. For this I use a very well know Mac App called, "Clean My Mac" and go to the Uninstaller. 

That is when my 2-hour nightmare started.

1. Apple has something called "Gatekeeper." This is a known product for Developers and tech people, but the basic public is sometimes not aware of it. 
2. Gatekeeper had become more and more aggressive with each OS release. In short, what it does is prevent you from downloading anything that is not from the App Store. 
3. Until now, it never had problems with FS. Now it decided to play dirty.
4. If you wish to download other products, you go to System Preferences ---> Security & Privacy, unlock and check the second box on the bottom, which says: "App Store and Identified Devleopers"
5. In most cases this will work fine.
6. Note: There is an option hidden there. This is critical to install Firestorm.
7. When you download the Viewer from FS it all works fine.
8. Then you extract it to applications. NP.
9. Try to run it, and your Mac will come back with a message - "There is something damaged or corrupted in the file." And two options Cancel or Trash.
10. Try to run that same dmg again to get FS up, you will immediately get that message.
11. I tried this over 5 times Download-Extract to Application - Run and each time i got that message.
12. There is a trick most Mac developers know. When the app is already in the applications folder, you do not double click on it to run. You Control-Mouse Click which opens a menu. Then on that menu you click Open. This almost always works. As it bypasses Gatekeeper most of the time.
13. Turns out Apple really does not like the FS Viewer DMG. I mean, they really do not like it on Monterey.
14. So, i was left very perplexed.FS has been running on the Mac - the newest version. But suddenly with a reinstall on Monterey it would not past Gatekeeper, and Gatekeeper demanded I trash it because it was potentially corrupted.
15. This took a search starting the Firestorm app and going into the Apple Gatekeeper.

The Solution:

You will need terminal knowledge here. Sorry about this folks but only way to do this, until FS figures out a way to appease Apple. Good luck with that! Also there is a lot of misinformation about this command on the Net, so be careful you type it in exactly how it is written below.

1. Open your Apple Terminal. If you are not familiar with this go to your Applications button on the dock, click it and in the search bar just type in Terminal, and then click on the Terminal app.
2. Your Terminal will open up and wait for your input.
3. Type in as follows: 

   sudo spctl --master-disable

4. Exactly like that. What that command does is tell Apple to disable the entire Gateway system.
5. Make sure you type it in exactly as above, because as I have said, previous versions of the Mac OS had a different syntax to type in. Then hit Enter.
6. When you type that command in the Terminal will ask you for Password for the Mac. If you do not have that password - then you could not be on your screen in the first place.
7. If you type in your PW correctly, Hit Enter and the command line should return without any errors or any messages.
8. To verify this worked, go back to System Preferences ---> Security & Privacy and on the bottom a third option should appear "ANY Program." Use this with great caution, especially if you do not know Macs well.
9. Check "any program"!
10. Now make sure you trashed all your previous FS attempts at install. 
11. Download a fresh DMG from FS, put it in Applications folder. 
12. Control-Click to open.
13. You should now get the message "Unknown developer. Are you sure you want to Open the App?" With options. Just click OPEN.
14. Voila! FS will run
15. Clean up - if. you want to keep your Mac protected now go back to the terminal and type in:

16. sudo spctl --master-enable

17. Will ask you for PW again.
18. With this the "Any program" disappears and Gatekeeper is back up and running.

END

P.S. I hope FS makes nice with Apple for the next release.

So you ask people to disable system security to install an app which has an issue that a) can be fixed easily by the developers and b) is fixed in the official SecondLife viewer?

The obvious recommendation is to recommend people use the official SecondLife viewer, that does not have this issue, till FS is fixed. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Gavin Hird

[TaraSimone Sixpence]

1 minute ago, Gavin Hird said:

So you ask people to disable system security to install an app which has issue that a) can be fixed easily and b) is fixed in some other viewers.

I am not asking for you to do anything. I was just giving out info. for those who  use FS on Montery OS and ran into the same problem. I could not care less what viewer you use.

[Gavin Hird]

 

12 minutes ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

I am not asking for you to do anything. I was just giving out info. for those who  use FS on Montery OS and ran into the same problem. I could not care less what viewer you use.

Obviously you do. If not, you would not make this "recommendation".

Also, what if there actually IS an issue that Apple flags? Both the two last versions of Monterey has fixed a bunch of zero day exploits, and what if some of those exist in the libraries in this viewer? – Do you want to take responsibility for fooling users into installing a compromised app?

As an macOS app developer, long term Mac user and former Apple employee, I have never experienced that the gatekeeper flat out refuse to run an app unless there is a real issue with it. – Sure you are asked to jump through annoying hoops to coerce gatekeeper to run some of them if they are not signed or notarized, but flat out disabling it is irresponsible at another level. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Gavin Hird

[Wulfie Reanimator]

1 hour ago, Gavin Hird said:

The obvious recommendation is to recommend people use the official SecondLife viewer, that does not have this issue, till FS is fixed.

"I want to use program X. How do I get it working?"

"Don't use program X, try Y instead."

Thanks!

[Gavin Hird]

1 minute ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

"I want to use program X. How do I get it working?"

"Don't use program X, try Y instead."

Thanks!

Use Y instead till the developer gets its act together and fix X.

(the fix is easy, but cost them $99/year)

[Love Zhaoying]

2 hours ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

Exactly like that. What that command does is tell Apple to disable the entire Gateway system.

Can we have the IP address of your Mac?

[Aiyumei]

I have a better solution! Switch to PC and use the Mac as mouse pad or cutting board, or whatever. 

[Silent Mistwalker]

5 hours ago, Gavin Hird said:

So you ask people to disable system security to install an app which has an issue that a) can be fixed easily by the developers and b) is fixed in the official SecondLife viewer?

The obvious recommendation is to recommend people use the official SecondLife viewer, that does not have this issue, till FS is fixed. 

Has everyone forgotten that we were all told to do exactly that on so many programs for decades on Windows!? Don't turn security off, whitelist FS. And all because of one little slvoice.exe file.

 

[Lindal Kidd]

Thank you, @TaraSimone Sixpence. I am sure a lot of Mac users are going to be very grateful to you.

Please also let the Firestorm team know about this by filing a JIRA report on their site. I'm pretty sure they want their viewer to play nice with Macs.  You might also consider posting your instructions on one or more Mac forums. I'm sure there are other applications for which people would like to disable Gatekeeper temporarily.

@Gavin Hird, I think you're way off base. Problems with over-protective security "features" are all too common these days, and it's important to know how to trick them into letting you do what you want to do, instead of keeping you swathed in cotton batting. Besides, she also showed how to re-enable the security.

[Gavin Hird]

1 hour ago, Lindal Kidd said:

Besides, she also showed how to re-enable the security.

She did, but not every viewer out there masquerading as the viewer in question is benign. Informing people how to bypass the system security mechanisms is also a vector to install malware.

The issue is easy to fix for the development team of that viewer. They are all too aware of it for quite some time.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Gavin Hird

[TaraSimone Sixpence]

@Lindal KiddAhh a voice of sanity in the wilderness. And I let Miro know in the FS group on line. Gave him the link. Up to FS to deal with it now. And to @Silent Mistwalkerpeople have incredibly short memories.

To repeat what it says in the first post. This is only information I wanted to share with the Mac Firestorm community, to help someone else avoid the two hours of frustration I had. I honestly do not care if you are on the LL viewer or some other, nor what OS you use. It is none of my business nor is it of any importance to me. This was an information post about a problem and how to fix it. Next time, I may just keep the solution and problem to myself to avoid the rude answers.

[Gavin Hird]

2 minutes ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

@Lindal KiddAhh a voice of sanity in the wilderness. And I let Miro know in the FS group on line. Gave him the link. Up to FS to deal with it now. And to @Silent Mistwalkerpeople have incredibly short memories.

To repeat what it says in the first post. This is only information I wanted to share with the Mac Firestorm community, to help someone else avoid the two hours of frustration I had. I honestly do not care if you are on the LL viewer or some other, nor what OS you use. It is none of my business nor is it of any importance to me. This was an information post about a problem and how to fix it. Next time, I may just keep the solution and problem to myself to avoid the rude answers.

It was a post about how to break system security when it informs the user there is a problem. 

Social engineering to get people to respond in certain ways is the most common vector to installation of malware on macOS.

[Myntz Mysterious]

Thats interesting. I dont believe that I have run into any issues with Firestorm on my Mac with Monterey. Granted it doesn't run as fast as my desktop. But I didnt have any issues when it came to installing or running it.

But this is noted for future reference! 👍

[Silent Mistwalker]

38 minutes ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

@Lindal KiddAhh a voice of sanity in the wilderness. And I let Miro know in the FS group on line. Gave him the link. Up to FS to deal with it now. And to @Silent Mistwalkerpeople have incredibly short memories.

To repeat what it says in the first post. This is only information I wanted to share with the Mac Firestorm community, to help someone else avoid the two hours of frustration I had. I honestly do not care if you are on the LL viewer or some other, nor what OS you use. It is none of my business nor is it of any importance to me. This was an information post about a problem and how to fix it. Next time, I may just keep the solution and problem to myself to avoid the rude answers.

Or just let Miro or even Whirly know so they can pass it on to the devs and get the info up on the FS wiki so everyone has access to it. 😉

[TaraSimone Sixpence]

@Silent Mistwalker@Lindal Kidd@Myntz Mysterious

Informed Miro immediately. And just filed in the Jira as @Lindal Kiddsuggested. 

@Myntz MysteriousNeither did I when FS first released the newest version. I think it comes from the uninstall and trying to install again. Gatekeeper just will not let it pass. On top of that, I think FS should actually register the APP if they have not yet done so. If for whatever reasons they cannot do so, or Apple is finicky about it, then I can almost guarantee the next OS release will have a more aggressive Gatekeeper, as that is how Apple has been going. In short, the DMG of FS should be registered with Apple, and if it already is then I am completely at a loss to explain why Gatekeeper insisted it was a corrupted or dangerous file and would not let it pass.

Edited May 20, 2022 by TaraSimone Sixpence

[Adamburp Adamczyk]

.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Adamburp Adamczyk
edited joke out

[Lyssa Greymoon]

10 hours ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

Try to run it, and your Mac will come back with a message - "There is something damaged or corrupted in the file." And two options Cancel or Trash."

That's not new to Monterey. I've seen it before but it's been a long time and I can't remember exactly what caused it and I don't think it was with an SL viewer. I want to say it had something to do with the Mac's clock being way off, but like I said, I don't remember.

I get the usual won't open because it can't be scanned unidentified developer message with the current FS viewer, and right-click open bypasses Gatekeeper and lets it run. Same in Monterey 12.4, 12.5 beta and Mojave 10.14.6.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Lyssa Greymoon

[TaraSimone Sixpence]

@Lyssa GreymoonExactly what I did the first time. The second time though was as I posted. Once that Cancel or Trash comes up, the DMG you are using is marked by the Mac. It will never install. I have never had this problem before with any program, and I work in high tech. I have never had to bypass Gatekeeper totally. There is a first time for everything.

[Gavin Hird]

1 hour ago, TaraSimone Sixpence said:

@Silent Mistwalker@Lindal Kidd@Myntz Mysterious

Informed Miro immediately. And just filed in the Jira as @Lindal Kiddsuggested. 

@Myntz MysteriousNeither did I when FS first released the newest version. I think it comes from the uninstall and trying to install again. Gatekeeper just will not let it pass. On top of that, I think FS should actually register the APP if they have not yet done so. If for whatever reasons they cannot do so, or Apple is finicky about it, then I can almost guarantee the next OS release will have a more aggressive Gatekeeper, as that is how Apple has been going. In short, the DMG of FS should be registered with Apple, and if it already is then I am completely at a loss to explain why Gatekeeper insisted it was a corrupted or dangerous file and would not let it pass.

They need to pay $99 (yearly) for an Apple Developer membership, generate the signing certificates need for Xcode and at a minimum sign the viewer, secondary get it notarized. 

LL does it for their viewer so they can copy that procedure and code, and they also has access to my repository and are free to copy my signing procedure which is slightly different from LL's simply because there are small diffs in what libraries are in use.

The effort needed is less than 10 hours. 

Given the large number of SL users on their viewer, they would make very many macOS users happy by getting this sorted. 

[Lindal Kidd]

8 hours ago, Gavin Hird said:

It was a post about how to break system security when it informs the user there is a problem. 

Social engineering to get people to respond in certain ways is the most common vector to installation of malware on macOS.

Depends on your mindset. If you believe a security feature is never wrong and one should always heed its pronouncements, then you're right. But security features, like all other software, are tools, and tools need to be used with understanding...and sometimes turned the heck off.

I will assume you meant that last statement as a generic one, and not aimed specifically at the OP. My response would be...So? I thought, based on that iconic Mac "Big Brother" commercial, that Macintosh was all about individuals thinking and choosing for themselves. That's great, me too! But with that freedom comes responsibility. Know the risks, make your choice.

[Gavin Hird]

5 hours ago, Lindal Kidd said:

Depends on your mindset. If you believe a security feature is never wrong and one should always heed its pronouncements, then you're right. But security features, like all other software, are tools, and tools need to be used with understanding...and sometimes turned the heck off.

I will assume you meant that last statement as a generic one, and not aimed specifically at the OP. My response would be...So? I thought, based on that iconic Mac "Big Brother" commercial, that Macintosh was all about individuals thinking and choosing for themselves. That's great, me too! But with that freedom comes responsibility. Know the risks, make your choice.

I don't think the issue here is a question whether  a security feature is wrong or not.

To me the issue is a developer of an app with a large number of users not providing a fix, for which there has been a straightforward solution for at least 2 years, putting their users in a position where they might have to bypass system security to use their app. – That is what you generally expect from a developer of malware. 

Regrettably there is an attitude amongst developers (perhaps even LL themselves) that macOS users are not worth having, and is a real bother to support. Many even ask them to switch platform or go elsewhere (that includes core developers of the viewer in question). 

 

In general macOS offers total freedom to do with and install what you want on your system as opposed to iOS and iPadOS which is too locked down for my taste. Admittedly Apple has made it a bit harder for both users and developers to install "anything", but they have publicly stated only a few weeks ago they have no intention of locking down macOS.

[Anastasia Horngold]

Hi, folks.

Firestorm does not recommend disabling security features.

Mac users have always needed to tell Gatekeeper to allow Firestorm to open (only on first launch after installation). The steps are documented on https://wiki.firestormviewer.org/fs_mac, and for recent Mac operating systems they consist of about 6 clicks, taking about 5 seconds. To our knowledge, there have not been any Mac users who were unsuccessful with these simple steps--if they were done correctly. Any Mac user having trouble should ask in one of our support groups or file a Jira ticket with us. 

Thanks,

Anastasia Horngold
Firestorm Support Team

[Laurent Bechir]

If I understand well, the problem is to launch Firestorm after a new installation ? On my side, I right click/select Open in the finder. The first time, I get a message telling me to trash the app, since it comes from an unidentified developer. The second time, I get the same option, but I also get the option to open the app with a warning regarding the risk of opening an app from an unidentified developer. After that, everything runs fine.

[Anicha Heartsong]

As a long-time Mac user, and one who regularly installs apps from outside of the official app store, I'm quite used to using the "control + click" command to tell Gatekeeper that I do want to install FS and other apps. No problem there. I've never had the initial problems experienced by TaraSimone, with the corrupted file. It sounds to me like there really was a corrupted file - perhaps because of issues with the download. Maybe the interwebs were having a funny five minutes.

It should not be necessary for the vast majority of mac users to disable Gatekeeper entirely, even if only on a temporary basis.

I can confirm what Anastasia Horngold says above - it's been necessary to follow these steps for quite a number of years, and with a whole range of apps as well. I'm no developer, so can't speak from experience, but I believe there's more to going through the Apple approval process than simply paying money. It can also, I believe, be a right royal pain the backside, and take quite a bit of time.