A Secularist Wishes You a Merry Christmas

[LaskyaClaren]

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." (John 3.16-17)

I am in no very recognizable way a Christian. My own upbringing was pointedly secular: I was never taken to church, and really only got to know the Bible as a young adult. But, like most children in the West, I was brought up to love Christmas. It meant family, and celebration, and food, and, of course, presents. It is still wrapped, for me, in a sort of hazy, happy aura of joy and community. And although I don't have children myself, I glow a little with vicarious, remembered pleasure when I watch the young experience the holiday as I did. Christmas, to this non-Christian, will always be special.

But, to adapt the words of Paul, that was when I was a child, spake as a child, and understood as a child. The irony is that, as secular adult, the other meanings of Christmas have actually become more important to me.

No, I don't personally believe in the virgin birth or the incarnation, or in the salvation supposedly bought by what to me represents a bloody and pointless martyrdom.

But what I do believe in -- what I cling to -- is a belief in the spirit of Love embodied in a holiday that marks the birth of a child, a gift freely given out of Love to all humankind. I want very much to believe in a God that "so loved the world," but even if I cannot accept the existence of a personal god, I can embrace and hug to myself the beautiful and generous idea that this story represents.

So, in that spirit, the spirit of a Love that unites and liberates without condemnation or discrimination, this secular humanist would like to wish you all, in the hope that you will accept it in the spirit with which it is intended, a very happy and loving Christmas.

May this peace and goodwill be with all of us for all the days of our lives.

[KarenMichelle Lane]

Merry Christmas Laskya

[LaskyaClaren]

Thank you! And to you and yours. :-)

[Madelaine McMasters]

I'm in approximately the same boat Laskya, though absent any desire to believe in an overarching presence or grand plan. I'm content to think that our survival depends on us, and that we can do it if all (most?) of us pull together.

I hope that those who recognize the oars in their lives pick them up, row and experience the fellowship of collaboration and the satisfaction of a job well done. And I hope that those who don't won't be too alarmed by the wood swinging over their heads and will not constantly ask "are we there yet?"

I hope everyone has a safe and happy holiday season.

[LaskyaClaren]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

I'm in approximately the same boat Laskya, though absent any desire to believe in an overarching presence or grand plan. I'm content to think that our survival depends on us, and that we can do it if all (most?) of us pull together.

I hope that those who recognize the oars in their lives pick them up, row and experience the fellowship of collaboration and the satisfaction of a job well done. And I hope that those who don't won't be too alarmed by the wood swinging over their heads and will not constantly ask "are we there yet?"

I hope everyone has a safe and happy holiday season.

---

Very nicely put, Maddy. 

I'm not so much into wanting to see evidence of a guiding plan or personal god, as I am in wanting to believe in the kind of all-powerful love that is embodied in this particular story about this particular "God."

And I agree absolutely in the importance of pulling together; that's why "community" is such an important part of Christmas for me.

So, if you have an extra oar to spare . . . :-)

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

I'm in approximately the same boat Laskya, though absent any desire to believe in an overarching presence or grand plan. I'm content to think that our survival depends on us, and that we can do it if all (most?) of us pull together.

I hope that those who recognize the oars in their lives pick them up, row and experience the fellowship of collaboration and the satisfaction of a job well done. And I hope that those who don't won't be too alarmed by the wood swinging over their heads and will not constantly ask "are we there yet?"

I hope everyone has a safe and happy holiday season.

---

Very nicely put, Maddy. 

I'm not so much into wanting to see evidence of a guiding plan or personal god, as I am in wanting to believe in the kind of all-powerful love that is embodied in this particular story about this particular "God."

And I agree absolutely in the importance of pulling together; that's why "community" is such an important part of Christmas for me.

So, if you have an extra oar to spare . . . :-)

---

Take mine, I'm not using it.

;-).

[sirhc DeSantis]

A Secularist - One who waves the banner of the split between 'religiion' and 'state' yet feels secure enough to pik n mix from other faiths/sects/practices and blend in schmaltz faux camaraderie and a tinge of consumerism. Plus time off work because, you know, 'the holidays'. Amusing.

Almost as much as the Humanist - who embraces 'Science (sorry 'rationalism, empiricism') except 'Not those bits which contradict stuff I like'.

I wish you Joyeux Noël and peace on Earth too - and if you find some - please share.

 

[LaskyaClaren]

---

sirhc DeSantis wrote:

A Secularist - One who waves the banner of the split between 'religiion' and 'state' yet feels secure enough to pik n mix from other faiths/sects/practices and blend in schmaltz faux camaraderie and a tinge of consumerism. Plus time off work because, you know, 'the holidays'. Amusing.

Almost as much as the Humanist - who embraces 'Science (sorry 'rationalism, empiricism') except 'Not those bits which contradict stuff I like'.

I wish you Joyeux Noël and peace on Earth too - and if you find some - please share.

 

---

Well, I hope you'll forgive me from observing that you seem to be speaking largely from an American perspective.

I'm a Canadian, and "secularist" means something rather different in an Anglo-Canadian context. We aren't, for instance, really hung up on the issue of the separation of church and state -- at least, not to the degree that your constitution makes you. Remember that our titular head of state -- the Queen -- is also the head of the Church of Engliand. I'm far from disagreeing that the term is problematic sometimes, but I mean it really just in the sense of "without faith in a particular religion."

As for picking-and-choosing from the religions that I have otherwise rejected, I stand, in my OP, self-convicted. But I don't have a problem with cherry-picking the best and most worthwhile parts out of other belief systems. To refuse to do so, even where I see value, would be to act in as unthinkingly doctrinaire a manner as I sometimes criticize the religious for adopting.

And, um . . . can I also remind you that Christmas isn't actually marking the birth of Christ, but is rather piggy-backed on the Roman Saturnalia? Am I allowed time off for that?

As for Humanism . . . well, the term, and the way in which I use it, predates the scientific revolution by at least a century and a half. Humanism, as proposed by Renaissance thinkers such as Erasmus, mostly proposes relocating the locus of value and meaning with and in humanity and the human. Science is very much a late-comer to that movement.

I haven't found peace on Earth yet. Probably never will. 

Not going to stop me looking and hoping for it, though.

[Dillon Levenque]

A Merry Christmas to you as well, Laskya. I enjoy this time of year just because of the positive energy it brings; I don't think my absence of religious belief means I can't appreciate the importance some things have to believers. My spirituality is pretty vague but I believe it's there. I have a belief (based upon the most cursory examination of the evidence) that humanity as a whole is more good than evil, and in fact the percentage in favor of the good might even be increasing, generations at a time.

Now if Snugs can just crack the whip a little and get Maddy's oar back in the water, I'll sit back and play the ukelele.

Merry Christmas!

Karen, that's a lovely card. :-)

[LlazarusLlong]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

 I'm content to think that our survival depends on us, and that we can do it if all (most?) of us pull together.

---

If you (and Laskya) take off your rose tinted spectacles for a second you might notice that there isn't a snowball's chance in hell - if such a thing exists in a secular worldview - of this.

The human race is 100% either selfish or non compos mentis, by nature's design. Civilisation has generated a degree of recognition of deferred gratification among the more intelligent who present their hidden self-centredness as a charitable attitude, although it would have been difficult to identify this characteristic in the bars of the western world last weekend, or even in recent weeks among the parents competing to video their little darlings singing better than all the rest (or at least louder) in their school nativity events.

I wish you the Christmas you would wish yourselves, but don't drag me into the fake "love to all men" thing.

[LaskyaClaren]

---

Dillon Levenque wrote:

A Merry Christmas to you as well, Laskya. I enjoy this time of year just because of the positive energy it brings; I don't think my absence of religious belief means I can't appreciate the importance some things have to believers. My spirituality is pretty vague but I believe it's there. I have a belief (based upon the most cursory examination of the evidence) that humanity as a whole is more good than evil, and in fact the percentage in favor of the good might even be increasing, generations at a time.

Now if Snugs can just crack the whip a little and get Maddy's oar back in the water, I'll sit back and play the ukelele.

Merry Christmas!

Karen, that's a lovely card. :-)

---

Thank you, Dillon!

Here's to those who insist upon the value of glasses with at least a bit of rosy tinting to them! Far better to have hope, surely, than to succumb to self-fulfilling misanthropic tunnel-vision!

 

Never really understood the ukelele. I look forward to being educated about its charms. :-)

[LaskyaClaren]

---

LlazarusLlong wrote:

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

 I'm content to think that our survival depends on us, and that we can do it if all (most?) of us pull together.

---

If you (and Laskya) take off your rose tinted spectacles for a second you might notice that there isn't a snowball's chance in hell - if such a thing exists in a secular worldview - of this.

The human race is 100% either selfish or non compos mentis, by nature's design. Civilisation has generated a degree of recognition of deferred gratification among the more intelligent who present their hidden self-centredness as a charitable attitude, although it would have been difficult to identify this characteristic in the bars of the western world last weekend, or even in recent weeks among the parents competing to video their little darlings singing better than all the rest (or at least louder) in their school nativity events.

I wish you the Christmas you would wish yourselves, but don't drag me into the fake "love to all men" thing.

---

Sorry, old man! You don't get an exemption from our goodwill wishes without a note of permission from a registered Metaphysician.

Enjoy the holiday in whatever way most accords with your own views.

And don't forget: they have pills now to help you with that dyspepsia.

 

[Celestiall Nightfire]

Bah humbug!  

I don't cotton to that mythos stuff. 

Do like fiction though.  So, have read that convoluted text known as the bible.   I don't self-identify with terms like "secular" or "humanism", as I think it's soft-peddling.  I'm an atheist.  Period. 

Cheers, for family, food, and goodwill towards our fellow man!

We don't need mythology to tell us to be kind to one another.  The kindness is reward enough.  Thanks to our psychological payoff, which is the reason we're kind to one another.  *We* get something out of it!      Pretty good evolutionary trait, eh?  ; )

 

[Perrie Juran]

Wishing everyone here all the best for the Holidays also.

[Celestiall Nightfire]

---

sirhc DeSantis wrote:

.... who embraces 'Science (sorry 'rationalism, empiricism') except 'Not those bits which contradict stuff I like'

---

Your comment above doesn't make sense.    Do you not understand what science is?

[Ted McGregor]

I wish thís upon you and everyone else, not for religion's, but for tradition's sake :

 

[Ted McGregor]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

I hope that those who recognize the oars in their lives pick them up, row and experience the fellowship of collaboration and the satisfaction of a job well done. And I hope that those who don't won't be too alarmed by the wood swinging over their heads and will not constantly ask "are we there yet?"

 

---

/me sits in the boat, grumpily resting his chin on his fist.

*grmblh* I knew I should've gone kayaking. :robotindifferent:

[Hippie Bowman]

The happiest of holidays to all of you!

 

Peace!

[Dillon Levenque]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

---

Never really understood the ukelele. I look forward to being educated about its charms. :-)

---

 

Like everything, it has to do with style. You gotta have style.

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Dillon Levenque wrote:

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

---

Never really understood the ukelele. I look forward to being educated about its charms. :-)

---

 

Like everything, it has to do with style. You gotta have style.

---

It's hard to beat that clip for style, Dil. That really is the essense of Uke.

But the Uke has other charms...

 

[Josephine Carissa]

Best wishes to you and yours.

 

Kind regards,

josephine

[Dresden Ceriano]

My love of Christmas has nothing to do with God or Jesus or any of that nonsense.  It's really all about the music, which inspires not only fond memories, but rather pleasant, less horribly cynical thoughts...

Not only that, but Christmas provides me with the perfectly legitimate excuse to dress my baby up in left-over garland (much to his displeasure), subject him to an impromptu photo shoot (against his will) and upload the best resulting image to the world wide web (without letting him know)...

Merry Christmas!!!!!

....Dres

[LlazarusLlong]

I'm with the dog on this one.

My favourite Christmas Song

Gotta love those brass riffs!

(Actually, except for the danger of being accused of endorsing date-rape I might have said this one was my favourite.)

[Pamela Galli]

Merry Christmas from an old fashioned Christian!

[LlazarusLlong]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

 

 Far better to have hope, surely, than to succumb to self-fulfilling misanthropic tunnel-vision!

 

---

It's not just me; I have on my side the top man in an official religion who says: "Christmas spirit is not a fairytale" or "some fantasy kind of happy ever after" and "that is not the world in which we live".