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Everything posted by animats

  1. I was thinking vendors, too. I was expecting to find some abandoned store with a wall of dead vendors. But no.
  2. I've been looking around, and I can't find anything exciting on the lots that have build turned on for everyone. No signs of squatting or dumping. What may be causing the peak load is unwanted synchronization. If you write a task that uses shared resources, then waits for N seconds, and run a lot of copies of that, all the tasks will sync up and try to run at the same time. (This is a classic result from operating system theory.) So maybe somebody has a lot of objects with a script with a 10 second wait in it. I just spent an hour peering into everything in the sim, all the way up to 4096 meters. Found nothing that could explain the lag. There's a nice garden that has animated leaves falling and butterflies, but those seem to be looping animations, not active scripts. Saw various sky boxes, sex rooms, and abandoned builds, but nothing that looked like it did anything. I peered inside the three parcels that have ban lines, and there's nothing there to cause lag. I was looking for something like a store full of identical forgotten vending machines, all trying to phone home to some defunct web server. The statistics window shows huge amounts of "Pump IO" when the sim is lagging. But no. Are there any tools to help with this? Per-parcel statistics?
  3. With broken Vallone sim to test on, I've been logging and recording video of this. What happens is that, about once every 10 seconds, Vallone sim stops sending object update messages. You can turn on a feature in the viewer (at least in Firestorm) where little squares appear above an object as updates for it come in. During these stalls, those totally stop. Sims don't send object position updates if the object is moving with the same velocity (both linear and angular) and acceleration as previously sent. Viewers extrapolate from the last update when no updates are coming in. This works great when updates are coming in on time, and terribly when they're lost or sent late. Lack of an update causes velocity interpolation to extrapolate from the last frame, which, if the object is doing anything interesting like turning, extrapolates too far and is usually bogus. Velocity interpolation knows about "sim running slow", and the sim slowdown factor is applied to velocity interpolation. But that only works if the sim is consistently slow. The viewer finds out about intermittent lag too late, after the lag is over. The update message after the lag has a slowdown factor update. This class of lag is the cause of most bogus motion not near a sim boundary. I'm looking at this in detail because I've been working on that section of code in the Firestorm viewer, improving region crossings. There are viewer-side workarounds which could make things look a bit better. If no packets are coming in from a sim for any object, assuming the sim is running slow or there's packet loss is a good guess. I'm reluctant to put that in, though without coordination with the LL sim side. It's guessing in the absence of information, after all. All the viewer can do is turn a sim stall into a visible stall. It can't fix the lag.
  4. Sometimes lag may just be a bug. Vallone, which usually has zero or one avatars in it, has a huge lag every 10 seconds or so during which the frame rate drops to zero. I have a lag meter on the corner. It's just Vallone; Kama Center, the next sim over, has an identical lag meter, and theirs doesn't show this. With one avatar on the sim, the lag is much worse. (It's not just me; I've had others come over for test purposes.) Walking around, your avatar stalls totally during those periods. Vehicles are even worse. I put in a support ticket (#204301), and the sim has been restarted twice, with no effect. Izzy Linden looked for the problem, but couldn't find it. Somewhere on Vallone, or possibly on the machine hosting it and other sims, something is using heavy simulator resources. Ot hasn't been found yet. Most of the sim is for rent or sale; there's not much going on there. Anyone seeing this elsewhere? It's really obvious if you have a lag meter column - it stays green most of the time, then drops all the way to zero, going red at ground level, then comes back up.
  5. Well, sort of. #1 isn't bad, except why does the lighthouse of Pharos of Alexandria, one of the wonders of the ancient world, have a California precast concrete freeway bridge leading to it? #2 has sharp shadows on a dull day. #3 is "see, we can distort models along a spline curve!". If you want it to look real, more subtlety is needed.
  6. Sansar seems to be about at the level of "Heaven" (2009).
  7. This is SL, not Sansar. It's a new build just opened at Serena Seacrest, from the people behind Lost Eden. The main edge Sansar has is professional artists.
  8. Very nice. This is the best I can get out of Firestorm. The other viewer must be in "max level of detail no matter what distance" mode.
  9. Once you have adequate technology, the business model matters a lot. There has to be enough incentive for people to build in the world, keep the servers going, and market enough to get users. SL is there, barely. With no marketing and no business model, nobody is there. OpenSim/Hypergrid, which is an open source SL clone, shows this. Peak avatars today, 115 for the whole grid. The technology is fine. The business model is a near failure. I admire the people behind it for keeping it going, but nobody is using it. It may be possible to market Sansar into a success, although it's not compelling enough to do it by itself. (I have the horrible feeling that the future of Sansar is to acquired by Disney, with Experiences for not just Star Wars and Ready Player One, but every princess in the Disney pantheon plus the Marvel Overexpanded Universe. With lots of in-world stuff to purchase.)
  10. Ah. The problem here is that you're setting what SL calls "omega", which is the angular acceleration vector. If that value is very small, it will be treated as zero by the physics engine, to reduce load on the simulator. If you want really slow rotation, like 1 RPM or less, you'll probably have to compute and set angular position directly. Try using llSetLocalRot on your planetarium objects, and update the positions from a timer. See http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetLocalRot
  11. Good point. That look is nice in still photos, OK for looking around, not good for driving or flying, terrible for building. It's not really appropriate to most situations. New Babbage is set that way for Victorian steampunk ambiance. Few other places are. Because it does get old fast. Can anyone find a video of Sansar of a nice, clear day? Everything I find looks dark and foggy. Here's a futuristic city nightclub scene in Sansar, from someone who liked the original Blade Runner look: Watch what happens when the furry avatar with a plastic tail gets hit by a car. It works exactly like being hit by a tram in New Babbage - you get pushed, not knocked aside. If you like that look, there's a better place in SL - Hangars Liquides. That's at Hangars Liquides (139/176/2184). Mostly abandoned. If you go there, take one of the cabs and get the tour. The feeling I'm getting about Sansar technically is that it works like SL with more server capacity, bigger prim allowances, and higher viewer specs. But beyond that, it's not a big advance.
  12. It's a spiky problem, as you said. No lag, then huge lag for a second or so, then no lag again. I put up a "lag meter" column on my lot. It drops to yellow and red briefly every 10 seconds or so. If I cross the street from Vallone to Kama Center, with zero avatars now in Vallone, that stops. But the neighbor across the street has an identical lag meter (mine is a copy of his) and it doesn't drop to yellow or red when I'm on that sim. I don't have an exotic avatar or any unusual outfits. I've tried going back to a standard-issue newbie avatar from White Tiger, and the lag still happens. If you want to see this, go to Vallone (249, 7, 36). Try crossing the streets while watching the lag meter at the corner.
  13. Sansar does do lighting better than SL. SL is slightly off in some ways. That avatar above is not floating above the ground. That's a problem in SL's shadow rendering. Here's a worse case. That brick wall goes all the way down to the ground slab, and even some distance into it. There's no gap, despite what the lighting shows. The avatar and the car appear to be hovering. But they're not. Here's the view from ground level. That's a rendering bug. Again, it's not inherent in SL that you can't have Sansar-quality rendering. Rendering is all viewer-side. The sim tells you "There's a prim here, with this texture, and lights there, with these parameters." The viewer does the rest. Good project for Firestorm people to juice up rendering to modern standards.
  14. Could that be some kind of attack? That's a common form of web attack, asking the user to install some fake "plugin".
  15. In what way can they "crash sim"? If the sim process actually crashes, LL will have a record of that.
  16. OK, let's beat that look in SL. As a start, I did some lighting tests in an empty warehouse in New Babbage. You can get the basic look. Now we just need a good build.
  17. There really is excessive load on some servers even when nothing is happening in an individual sim. Here I am on a nice morning in Vallone, in Kama City. I'm the only avatar in Vallone. Yet lag is awful. Can't drive a vehicle properly. Viewer lag meter reports both the sim running slow and network lag. The network lag is all at SL's end. I'm running a ping to the sim server in the background, and it's consistently reporting 40-50ms ping times with no packet loss. Traffic on the network link is very low (it's a 30Mb/s link loaded to 0.088Mb/s). (Remember, 1 Byte/s = 8 bits/s).Viewer side, CPU load is low (4-core client machine). It's been like this for days. Okay, how many sims did they load onto this poor server? Some days, I suspect that all of Kama City is running on one 1U rackmount server.
  18. Yes. The wiki page which is supposed to document Object messages is blank. No wonder they can't make it work right. Viewers and sims have to be working from the same spec for SL to work properly.
  19. If you turn on viewer logging in Firestorm and watch the error messages go by, there's a surprising number of HTTP 404 Not Found errors, 503 Forbidden errors, and gateway errors. Each of those indicates some asset the sim told the viewer to fetch, but fetching it failed. In-world, each of those errors means a texture that didn't appear, or a prim that had to fall back to a lower level of detail, or an object that didn't appear at all. Those ought to be rare events, but they're not.
  20. Summing up: The viewer-side fix to get rid of grossly bogus movement at region crossings is working in Firestorm, in use by a few users, and on track to go into a future beta and then a release. The road problem at sim crossings is well-understood - roads need a prim on each side attached to the other side, to provide support for the first few meters after a sim crossing. Some roads have this, some don't. I'm working on a "pothole detector van" to detect and log places that need a fix. An automated repair van should be possible, but a Linden with road-building privileges would have to drive it. If you have a good road and the viewer-side fix, sim crossings are pretty good. I've posted videos of zipping around on a motorcycle without slowing down for sim crossings. Fun. There are still the "partial unsit" bugs. Some of those situations can be recovered by clever scripting. But not all. Those are real bugs in the code. The worst case is a 4-way sim crossing, but those bugs can show up at any sim crossing. Thanks, everyone.
  21. the VR fad SL lacks a casual gaming model SL lacks ad-based monetization So far, the big "experiences" in Sansar seem to be a Star Wars ad and a Ready Player One ad. What would make SL attractive to people who only had time to spend half an hour a day there? That's LL's big problem.
  22. Lespanto Church, a real-world church modeled in SL. A project of the Roman Catholic Church, this is their official presence in Second Life. It's an example of how good a job you can do in SL, within SL prim and texture budget limits. All the detail is there. Take a close look at the pictures, the stained glass windows, the books open on the altar. Ultra rendering settings, full-resolution PNG snapshot. The main lack here is shadows. Only some objects in SL can cast or receive shadows. Most users don't have shadows turned on, but they do work if you have the graphics power.
  23. Luna, is this the "appealing surreal look" you wanted? That's the New Babbage docks in winter, with New Babbage's standard lighting and rendering options at max. New Babbage, unlike most of Second Life, has people who care about and work on the aesthetic. They have a building code and building inspection, to keep the quality up, and an annual Oiling Festival during which problems are fixed. Sansar's few experiences are mostly the creations of pro designers. That's why they look good. It's not the technology.
  24. Artistic choices and rendering power. Here's a picture of the SL Waterhead Welcome Area with common rendering settings. Same scene, but with highest rendering settings in SL, plus a change to the scene lighting to early twilight. Frame rate on my machine is about 20fps at these settings. SL's night is rather bright, but doesn't have to be. Here's New Babbage at night, lit only by the few street lights and the tram's headlamp. Here's Dark Alley, the roleplay area, rendered as, well, a dark alley. If you want to make SL look like Sansar, the tools are there.
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