Hey! Forum Lurkers and Silent Friends! Say Hello Here!

[Scylla Rhiadra]

5 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Well, go back over it. 

I take the point that you, I think, are trying to make (and in the process, insulting pretty much everyone who posts here), but I reject its premises because I don't buy into the applicability of this "article" to this forum, nor its rather crude and reductive portrait of online communities.

There is, as you yourself note, no evidence that LL does anything with the data to which it has access -- indeed, there's no proof they even collect it so far as I know.

And without that as motivation, the rest of this falls apart. These forums are not organized to maximize data harvesting, and there are therefore no "board hos" or "diva board hos" for the simple reason that those social positions and the hierarchy to which they belong would have no function here. It's worthwhile noting, in that context, that the one "reward" and/or metric that might possibly work towards producing the social organization described here -- "reputation points" -- has been rendered pointless in this forum because it's no longer visible. There is no hierarchy here: I have a lot of "reputation points" here, but you'd never know it unless you actually looked at my forum profile. And what would be the point of doing that?

By the same token, the implication that this thread, or any other, is some kind of "recruitment tool," or "audition," or social mechanism is absurd.

The article is irrelevant to this thread because it does not accurately describe this forum, nor in any way the point of "forum lurkers" saying hello here.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Scylla Rhiadra]

6 hours ago, Stephanie Lovely said:

I have often wondered  how many lurkers we do have on the forums here and what puts them off engaging. I have seen some pretty unwelcoming treatment of first time posters and I am pretty sure those people won't be coming back. It will be interesting to see if the new rules, and the focus of discussion on SL matters only, make people feel more comfortable to engage with the forums.

I think that there are many people who simply don't feel confident about speaking up.

I do worry with you, though, that the occasional spectacle of a new poster getting flamed (it doesn't happen all that often, but it's not rare either) may be a disincentive.

[Love Zhaoying]

3 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I take the point that you, I think, are trying to make (and in the process, insulting pretty much everyone who posts here), but I reject its premises because I don't buy into the applicability of this "article" to this forum, nor its rather crude and reductive portrait of online communities.

There is, as you yourself note, no evidence that LL does anything with the data to which it has access -- indeed, there's no proof they even collect it so far as I know.

And without that as motivation, the rest of this falls apart. These forums are not organized to maximize data harvesting, and there are therefore no "board hos" or "diva board hos" for the simple reason that those social positions and the hierarchy to which they belong would have no function here. It's worthwhile noting, in that context, that the one "reward" and/or metric that might possibly work towards producing the social organization described here -- "reputation points" -- has been rendered pointless in this forum because it's no longer visible. There is no hierarchy here: I have a lot of "reputation points" here, but you'd never know it unless you actually looked at my forum profile. And what would be the point of doing that?

By the same token, the implication that this thread, or any other, is some kind of "recruitment tool," or "audition," or social mechanism is absurd.

The article is irrelevant to this thread because it does not accurately describe this forum, nor in any way the point of "forum lurkers" saying hello here.

So, didn't like the article then?

* makes a tickmark on notepad *

[LoveXiaoying]

* Stops by and waves *

[Finite]

41 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

? The Democratic National Committee? Training wheels? Finite, are you bringing RL politics into the SL forums that are only supposed to be about SL? 

Honesty I thought the 6 year part would get me in trouble. Besides I thought it to be more self-deprecating humor than actual politics.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Finite

[Scylla Rhiadra]

1 minute ago, LoveXiaoying said:

* Stops by and waves *

Yay you!

/me waves happily back

🙂

 

[Love Zhaoying]

51 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

The article is irrelevant to this thread because it does not accurately describe this forum, nor in any way the point of "forum lurkers" saying hello here.

Here's the way I see it: someone wrote an article, and got it posted on the internet, so therefore it can be quoted at any time for any reason supporting any argument. That's how actual "debate" works, people can use anything at all they quote, to support their debate points. 

Your counterpoint is also a completely valid debate response. 

If this was a "real life" debate in college or some debate contest, it would be the "debate judge" who adds up the points from either side and says who "wins". The audience (me in this example) response is irrelevant. 

This is the debate method people learn in school, that they carry into their further careers, whatever that career may be.

My main point being, in the context of "debate", it doesn't matter whether someone's points are relevant or not. And since there's no "debate judge", there's no real "winner or loser".

Luckily, this is a forum and not a debate! So, I can scroll past and think, "oh look, a debate on the forum." And wave, and carry on.

Yes, the article was off-topic; debating the article is starting a debate IMHO. If you don't want a debate on your thread, perhaps don't engage in the debate, just an idea.

Thank you for creating this thread.

[Akane Nacht]

13 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

So, we know you're out there. Every once in a while, I'll run into one of you in-world, who'll say something like "I've seen you on the forums, and I just wanted to say hi!"

It's really lovely, actually, partly because it makes me realize that I'm in some sense connected to people I didn't know I was engaging with, and that the community here is really far larger than just the smallish group of people who post.

You're part of this forum too!

So, say hi! You don't need to write much, or even anything! Just wave if that's all you're comfortable with doing!

But we'd love to see you, and acknowledge you as part of our community! Because silent or not, you're one of us!

shhhh they are silent for a reason

[vahiti Yiwama]

Hello  ,

I don't speak english , so i am a silent forum lurker...

[Prokofy Neva]

3 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I take the point that you, I think, are trying to make (and in the process, insulting pretty much everyone who posts here), but I reject its premises because I don't buy into the applicability of this "article" to this forum, nor its rather crude and reductive portrait of online communities.

There is, as you yourself note, no evidence that LL does anything with the data to which it has access -- indeed, there's no proof they even collect it so far as I know.

And without that as motivation, the rest of this falls apart. These forums are not organized to maximize data harvesting, and there are therefore no "board hos" or "diva board hos" for the simple reason that those social positions and the hierarchy to which they belong would have no function here. It's worthwhile noting, in that context, that the one "reward" and/or metric that might possibly work towards producing the social organization described here -- "reputation points" -- has been rendered pointless in this forum because it's no longer visible. There is no hierarchy here: I have a lot of "reputation points" here, but you'd never know it unless you actually looked at my forum profile. And what would be the point of doing that?

By the same token, the implication that this thread, or any other, is some kind of "recruitment tool," or "audition," or social mechanism is absurd.

The article is irrelevant to this thread because it does not accurately describe this forum, nor in any way the point of "forum lurkers" saying hello here.

Well, if you read the comments of "Dyerbrook" on that exchange, you will see a critique of the socialist reductionism in this vision of corporate-run boards. I think everyone scrapes information from boards, and not only corporations, and some of it is used to hold others or the corporation itself to account.

You don't find it relevant because you wanted merely to to create a hostess thread to get people back on the forums. But why? I think it's a useful post to reflect on for lots of reasons, mainly because indeed the cast of characters  caricaturized are here, and indeed you are trying to get them to come back and stay. Again, the question is *why* when your own wish is to talk RL politics, is it not?

It is indeed relevant as Stefanie pointed out because people lurk and don't talk -- and not just for fear that some corporation will grab their data -- as I explained, LL doesn't do that to sell ads -- but because then there are all kinds of consequences -- and the consequences are now worse, and the waters more treacherous.

Above you see the famous scene with Glinda the Good Witch, urging the Munchins to "come out, come out, wherever you are." But in that story, the Wicked Witch of the East had been slain. Not so here.

[Prokofy Neva]

2 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Here's the way I see it: someone wrote an article, and got it posted on the internet, so therefore it can be quoted at any time for any reason supporting any argument. That's how actual "debate" works, people can use anything at all they quote, to support their debate points. 

Your counterpoint is also a completely valid debate response. 

If this was a "real life" debate in college or some debate contest, it would be the "debate judge" who adds up the points from either side and says who "wins". The audience (me in this example) response is irrelevant. 

This is the debate method people learn in school, that they carry into their further careers, whatever that career may be.

My main point being, in the context of "debate", it doesn't matter whether someone's points are relevant or not. And since there's no "debate judge", there's no real "winner or loser".

Luckily, this is a forum and not a debate! So, I can scroll past and think, "oh look, a debate on the forum." And wave, and carry on.

Yes, the article was off-topic; debating the article is starting a debate IMHO. If you don't want a debate on your thread, perhaps don't engage in the debate, just an idea.

Thank you for creating this thread.

The famous article, going back to the author's experience at the Well, is of course relevant because it goes to the heart of what boards or forums are *for*. And invites you to think beyond a facile assumption that they are just nice places to chat. And to contemplate why certain social dynamics always occur on them, and in whose interests those dynamics are. Even if the forums were utterly free, they would unlike draw more than 5-10% of the population. Because they are not kind, and they are a place for agendas to play out. 

At one point in its history, the Lindens completely got rid of "General". They thought that would fix the "mean girls" problem of the forums. If you go on the old forums archive, you see much wailing and gnashing of teeth. But then somehow, it migrated back, and here we all are.

PS and as I said back on that old Alphaville Herald page (as Dyerbrook), it's not like the notoriously punitive and awful Stratics board's corporation sold me more t-shirts or that I found more ads for EA.com games in my email. It's more about the whole society, and the effort the company made to use some players to gang up on others, as a governance method in general.  It's not merely the data scraping of ads, which is a crude take, although has its place. It's the data scrape of control in general.  Especially when the scrape *removes* as much as it blesses.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Prokofy Neva

[Prokofy Neva]

3 hours ago, Finite said:

Honesty I thought the 6 year part would get me in trouble. Besides I thought it to be more self-deprecating humor than actual politics.

I'm bewildered by this reference but it's ok, no need to explain. You can IM me inworld. 

[Seicher Rae]

6 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

and there are therefore no "board hos" or "diva board hos"

ETA the Taylor Swift for everything gif... although I do like the lip quivering from "Homelands"

Edited August 10, 2022 by Seicher Rae

[Seicher Rae]

"Hi Lurkers! We appreciate you, but would also encourage you to say hi!"

innocuous comments

screed screed screed wtf-screed

lurkers stay quiet... it is a mystery

[Hysteria Chastity]

* Delurks*   Hello  🥸    * back into Lurk mode *   

 

 

[Love Zhaoying]

1 hour ago, Seicher Rae said:

"Hi Lurkers! We appreciate you, but would also encourage you to say hi!"

innocuous comments

screed screed screed wtf-screed

lurkers stay quiet... it is a mystery

iknowrite? Like, why are they so shhhyyyy?

[Charalyne Blackwood]

Some of you see me in the photography type threads. A few have friended me. I'm largely quiet cos many of you are like A list celebs in my eyes and I'm a silly fangirl all shy and blushy like I'm asking for autographs at a red carpet event...wait...how did i get to a red carpet event..?

 

*runs off and hides behind a tree*

[Seicher Rae]

2 minutes ago, Charalyne Blackwood said:

Some of you see me in the photography type threads. A few have friended me. I'm largely quiet cos many of you are like A list celebs in my eyes and I'm a silly fangirl all shy and blushy like I'm asking for autographs at a red carpet event...wait...how did i get to a red carpet event..?

 

*runs off and hides behind a tree*

I didn't know how to respond to your post! With a laugh because... A-list celebs? Bwahahahaha. Have you met some of these people? They (not me) are all nuts.  Allegedly. 
But I also "get it" and felt the same for quite a while. And I often hide behind trees or in corners (introvert).

(yay! finally! the return of the Taylor Swift gifs for every occasion! Ah, nostalgia...)

 

[Love Zhaoying]

15 minutes ago, Seicher Rae said:

Have you met some of these people? They (not me) are all nuts.

Just like "A-List Celebs", that's why I think people are interested in them. 

[Luna Bliss]

3 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

At one point in its history, the Lindens completely got rid of "General". They thought that would fix the "mean girls" problem of the forums. If you go on the old forums archive, you see much wailing and gnashing of teeth. But then somehow, it migrated back, and here we all are.

But the cast of characters you referenced in an earlier post is always present in any group, and there is a social power structure, usually unseen unless paying close attention. That doesn't mean we should not have groups and that they are completely bad, or that they are all at the same extreme level of dysfunction as the groups in the article you presented.

In the article you posted the group portrayed is at the very end of the continuum of the dysfunctional group scale, and a narcissistic woman along with her minions (sometimes called 'flying monkeys') has taken complete control. Apparently before I was participating the forum reached that level of toxicity with the "mean girls" running wild. I have seen these forums become quite toxic, along with the group scapegoating and crucifying of individuals, a pile-on as the group attempted to boot the vilified individual out of the community. But I don't see these levels of toxicity now.
However if it would take hold again our present leader would be the Wicked Witch Of The North, not East or West as in your earlier analogy (cause she's from Canada).

Edited August 10, 2022 by Luna Bliss

[Scylla Rhiadra]

1 hour ago, Hysteria Chastity said:

* Delurks*   Hello  🥸    * back into Lurk mode *   

 

 

Hi Hysteria! Thank you for delurking and saying hi!!

🥳

[Scylla Rhiadra]

59 minutes ago, Charalyne Blackwood said:

Some of you see me in the photography type threads. A few have friended me. I'm largely quiet cos many of you are like A list celebs in my eyes and I'm a silly fangirl all shy and blushy like I'm asking for autographs at a red carpet event...wait...how did i get to a red carpet event..?

 

*runs off and hides behind a tree*

lol

No "A listers" Charalyne -- just some wearing slightly more worn and ratty orange jumpsuits than others!

Besides, at this point, you're well past the "novice" stage yourself!

[Luna Bliss]

14 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

16 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

Wut?  I'm not a "board ho".     

Oh! Then what explorers shout when they see their destination!

"Land ho!"

I am never on the land though -- I am in constant flight -- as I changed into my lil ghost avatar when I heard the cicadas singing in my garden and noticed the days growing shorter two weeks ago, signaling the coming autumn which hosts the Halloween spirit.

So come up with another joke, funnyman    

[kali Wylder]

I remember my very first post in the forums was attacked by an oldbie who thought I must be a sock puppet.  Not sure whose sock puppet I was supposed to be, but apparently whatever I said pushed a button.  I survived.  The one who attacked me is long gone.  These things happen.  The attacks today are not nearly as blatant as they were in 2009 but these things still happen.  I try not to push buttons if I can avoid it but I still speak my mind. 

[Seicher Rae]

9 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

lol

No "A listers" Charalyne -- just some wearing slightly more worn and ratty orange jumpsuits than others!

Besides, at this point, you're well past the "novice" stage yourself!

They are making these in orange now? I need an upgrade.
 

ETA: It also explains my inability to type a post without major errors.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Seicher Rae