Breedable animals SL drop bug -kittycats-

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

 Hello, I recently got into the breedable craze, kittycats to be exact and I want to know if anyone has any idea what this is happening that the functionality of the kittycats and reason I was drawn to them in the first place is a product of a SL bug or what is going on? The Kittycats teams all state that it is a LL bug but I cant find any information on it aside from their website and they said that it effects all breedables but not all breedables are effected because not all breedables are interactive as kittycats.

 Kittycats CRS told me that LL wont address it until after the first of the year but I have my doubts now over it all. The thing is you have to buy milk to gain happiness now instead of just cuddling the cats. I also can not attach them and go on walkabouts.. which is a main reason I liked kittycats so much.  When I said in the group that I liked to walk about and hold and cuddle the cats. I was told "There is no reason to cuddle the cats."  And treated as if I was sking the devil to take everyones souls.. Also, if I kept attaching the cats they might not want to return my cats anymore..(that was from a non CSR) but, um.. this is the REASON I started with this specific breedable animals in the first place, the interactivity.  I actually got kinda upset about this last comment to be honest.

 

 When you wear or cuddle the animals you are supposed to "drop" not detach, but since November I believe people have been loosing their attached pets and they do not show in inventory at all even on worn and the dop feature is greyed out.  I was told this effects no copy items, but I have no problem with other no copy objects.

 

 So in a nutshell can anyone help me locate any text that can assure me that LL is in fact aware and will fix this issue. I believe it is something to do with asset server issues.

Thank you for any help supplied.

 

 

[Tini Jewell]

I too have wondered about the 'after the first of the year' comments for a fix.  I do know a JIRA issue was created by another person with the drop issue.  I don't have the Issue # but it was recently created.  I haven't commented or added to the JIRA as I personally have not experienced the problem and was told it's not happening regularly to everyone, that it's random.  The other thing is that I have seen the same problem being addressed through other breedable groups, it's not just kittycats experiencing this issue.

So, all I recommend is that you do a search for the JIRA, add your comments to it and keep fingers crossed.  I have no idea how, why or when this problem began nor am I aware of any official comments as to when it will be fixed.  Would be nice to see something official.

In spite of the problem, Happy New Year!

[Theresa Tennyson]

The problem was first noticed by the developers of "Dwarfins" toward the end of December and they attended a SL Server user group with some of the Linden Lab developers to  bring the issue up - I happened to attend the same meeting. They discussed the issue and worked out a test plan with the LIndens but the Lab doesn't make changes to the server software over the holiday period because they'd be short-staffed if any major problems came up.

Here's more from the Dwarfins home page:

http://dwarfins.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/missing-dwarfins/

[Czari Zenovka]

I don't know if the "SL bug" would affect other types of pets besides breedables, but I have a VKC (Virtual Kennel Club) cat that I can pick up, hold, then "Drop" to detach it (meaning it stays in world, but I'm not holding him anymore) and I haven't had any issues with that at all. 

Don't blame you at all for being upset; I've seen the KittycatS but never owned any; I do have BioBreedable dogs, but they cannot be picked up so, yes, interactivity for me would be a big plus.

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

I did wanted to add, Kittycats does supply  a work around. I forgot to add that and its pretty important. (about cuddling to gain happiness) and milk purchases. You can "pet" the animal and its happiness will increase. You just can not use spome interaction menus without potentilly loosing cat (in this case) and having to file a ticket for a CRS to return cat.

 

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

TY, reading now

[Tari Landar]

Actually that "problem" has existed since before the days of Sion chickens(aka, before 2007). It's not exclusive to breedables, not by a long shot. Any item that is no copy *can* be, well, eaten(lack of better term here, this is what we've always used to describe it) when you drop instead of detach from inventory.

Now, some breedables creators say you need to ALWAYS drop, because detaching can potentially lose your animal. In some cases it's because you literally pick them up from the ground. However you'll note when you do that, they show in your inventory as well. If/when they don't, it's likely poor communication on the part of the asset server. Sometimes a relog will fix that problem. They should *always* show in inventory as worn, when you attach them(no matter how you choose to do that). Still you'll find other creators who say you need to detach, because dropping can potentially lose your animal.

If you want anecdotal evidence, you'll find lots of it, on BOTH ends of that idea. If you want actual proof, you won't find any. It's all anecdotal. I have lost items using both methods. I have witnessed people losing items both methods. I have watched LL close and ignore JIRAs related to the subject for years(since 2008, when I actually started looking for the JIRAs). I have watched them *not* fix this bug, for just as long. I don't honestly believe ll thinks it's a bug, more like a feature that works some of the time, but not all of the time, like a lot of things.

There is no guarantee that either method is safer than the other. Any creator who tells you that, is likely basing it entirely off anecdotal evidence given to them from their customers, or possibly their own anecdotal experience. Personally, I have lost more objects simply dropping them. I have lost a lot less by detaching from inventory(and then re-rezzing that item from inventory).

Whether or not it works is hit or miss. Just because you have no problem with other no copy items, doesn't mean everyone else has the same experience. Like I said, I have lost quite a few items using the drop method(not all breedables), and retained a lot using the detach method. But even my experience is only anecdotal, at best. There is NO hardened rule that states one works better than the other, or even mostly better than the other. Don't believe anyone who tells you otherwise. There's no actual evidence to support that. Some people have had the exact opposite of my experience and dropping works best for them. It doesn't mean either method is better, though. Not by a long shot.

LL has said numerous times they would "look into" this. Whether they actually have, or even will, isn't something any resident can tell you. You just have to sit, wait and hope they do fix it eventually, like the rest of us. Until then, I say choose whatever method works best for YOU. Yes I know what the creators say, but they aren't always right any more than their customers are. That's not a knock on them. I know they know their product and they believe they're giving the best advice they possibly can, given the circumstances, but that doesn't mean it's always going to work. ANY creator who says they won't replace your product if it's lost(when it simply requires them checking their database for ownership and returning that item) isn't someone I would support. That's the main reason I don't support certain breedable creators anymore, that atrtitude. It's not a hardship on them to return your item. It, in fact, benefits them greatly to do so. You'll continue to buy their products, continue to give them good word of mouth, you get the picture. If, however, they decide it was "your fault" and they won't return it, well, then they've lost a customer and will likely have an awful lot of bad pr and bad word of mouth to deal with. Some of them don't care. The ones worth a lick, do care, and they won't refuse to return your breedable regardless of why the item is now lost. Stick with those folks, because they not only care about their bottom line(hey, it's a business, they should care) but also their customer base. They're also the ones most likely watching that bug a lot closer, so they can better help folks when it happens. Some creators, and especially their staff, are simply using the same lines over and over as if they're scripted, when a customer runs into that(or any) problem. Which is not only not helpful, it's going to drive people away from their product. I'm not even sure they actually believe it's helpful, sometimes. It's just what they're told to say to customers, so they do.

TLDR; Bottom line, everyone's in the same boat on this matter. Regardless of which method of "removing an item from our av" we chose, we're all still in that same boat. So until LL fixes it(assuming they ever do) neither method is going to always work, and neither method is better than the other.

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

Was not a kittycats customer service rep that said they will get tired of returning was just a group member. KC has been fairly good about it, its just they are not understanding that some of us really enjoy intereacting with teh pets more than trying to make money breeding that exclusive animal that everyone wants...

 

 I appreciate the insight.

[Shamu077]

"Was not a kittycats customer service rep that said they will get tired of returning was just a group member. KC has been fairly good about it, its just they are not understanding that some of us really enjoy intereacting with teh pets more than trying to make money breeding that exclusive animal that everyone wants..."   Tarina,   KC fully understands that you enjoy enteracting with your kitties - why would you think otherwise?  It is not their fault that the SL asset servers are have gone south, creating 100 times more inventory errors than before November of this year.  And never listen to someone's opinion in a group, that does not represent the company.  Anyone can post there, and they are often wrong, usually newbies who somehow think they know it all.  Here is the official Notice from KittyCats, fyi: **IMPORTANT** Drop Bug Information Hi all. About a month ago it seems there was a new bug introduced in SL. In regards to KittyCatS, this bug appears to be affecting the ability to Drop your cats after interacting with them via the menu, as well as possibly affecting cats that vanish randomly without reason while rezzed on land in SL. Other breedables have been affected by this bug as well. Linden Labs appears to be aware of this bug, however they cannot address it until after the holidays.   Unfortunately this bug has caused many problems for our customers that like to Interact with their cats for fun and breeding purposes. To help minimize the loss of cats caused by this bug, we recommend that customers disable the cat's ability to walk and run, and not use the Cuddle/Hold/Lay/Walk interactions with their cats until further notice.   We realize that the walking animation and interactions are a large part of the appeal of KittyCatS for many, and we truly apologize for the inconvenience that this latest bug has caused in regards to your ability to enjoy your cats. Please be assured that we are working hard to try and find a solution to this problem, and that we will be in contact with Linden Labs to determine what has caused this issue and how it can be fixed.   We know that many of you use the Interactions to help with your breeding programs and that this bug has also interfered with your ability to breed normally. If you MUST Cuddle/Hold your cats to give them the Happiness/Love buff and you are having trouble Dropping your cats because the Drop option is greyed out, please try the following workaround:   1. Pick up the cat you want to cuddle and take it into your inventory.   2. Right click on the cat in your inventory and select "Attach To" and select one of the following:   - For Teacups and Toys, attach to the Left or Right Shoulders   - For Petite, Normal, and Bigger de Big cats age 7+, attach to the Chest or Right Forearm   (If your viewer supports multiple attachments to the same spot then your cats should all attach together)   3. When you are done cuddling, DETACH the cat. DO NOT DROP. This is very important!!! If you attach the cat from inventory like a regular prim object, then you MUST Detach it. Only use Drop if you cuddled/held the cat via its Interaction menu.   This should be a viable workaround for the Dropping issue. Your cats may look a little funny attached to your avatar this way and you may get animation script errors, however the cats will still get the Happiness/Love buff, and you should not lose them when detaching.   If you do end up losing your cats due to Dropping/Detaching, please go to our support website at http://kittycats.biz/support and file a ticket. If you are not registered on our website, you can do so by clicking the "Online Help" button on your cats' menu, or by using the web terminal in our main store lobby, located to the immediate right as you enter. Please be sure to include your cat's ID# (you can find this on your pedigree page at http://kittycats.biz/pedigree/.)   We apologize again for the inconvenience. Thank you for your patience and support.   Your KittyCatS Team

[Tari Landar]

The creators are simply passing on whatever message they feel best suits their customers to help deal with the problem. Well, most of them. I still stand by the fact that some don't honestly care, lol. But, some do, and they'll do their best to deal with it. Sorry I didn't mean to imply I thought you were saying the kittycats staff had said that about not replacing the lost cats. I know you had said someone else told you that. I kind of went off on a tangent on that bit, but it does apply to some creators. There are some who will *not* replace a missing breedable if it gets lost during a drop. There are also some staff members of those types of companies who will basically give you a "well you shouldn't have done that" answer, should something go awry. Part of my point in that area was that neither of the solutions you'll get from companies is ideal. Neither works more, or less, than the other, for ANY product. It really is a crap shoot. As long as creators are willing to replace those assets, should they get sucked into the abyss of nothingness, it should be ok.

It wasn't even a breedable that first brought this bug to light in 2007, it was other no-copy objects. It just didn't become the problem everyone was saying it was back then, until more breedables started having the problem. For the longest time a group of people were having issues with some weapons, and that caused a few different JIRAs at the time. Then breedables came to the grid-and being what they are, more people are into them, so more will run into the problem. They even had a linden in-world(back when they came in-world a bit more) to actually show them the issue. I really wish ll hadn't shut down the stupid JIRAs like they did. I could show you all of the ones that have been created over the years, and the comments made. Not to mention all the ones that were closed shortly after being opened, with no comments or voting even allowed on them. I could also show you where ll has been saying since 2008, specifically, that they're "looking into it". Don't put much faith into them fixing this problem, until they actually do fix it. I honestly believe they'll say whatever they can to appease the crowds, so to speak. I have absolutely zero faith they intend to fix this issue. As up until now, they've done nothing.

None of the creators are going to be able to get ll to do anything, no matter how many public forums, meetings and general chats they have with them. Creators have been doing that for years. No matter what kind of influence they think they've had, or they tell their customers they've had. Ll has shown no real interest in fixing it, but they've been really good at saying enough to get people to shut up about it for a while, lol.

[Sassy Romano]

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Tini Jewell wrote:

So, all I recommend is that you do a search for the JIRA, add your comments to it and keep fingers crossed. 

 

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Nice idea but flawed because JIRA's are now private and have been for some time, can't search anymore, can't see anyone else's JIRA entry.

[Perrie Juran]

Stating it simply some how the data gets lost when being transferred from one server to another.

It happens to both Copy and No Copy items.  The problem is when you move a No Copy item to another server and something goes wrong you can find your self SOL.

Agreed that it would be great for LL to fix the problem.  Data shouldn't get lost like that.

[Tini Jewell]

not sure where you're looking but the 'Bug Tracker' is still searchable (I believe that is what is referred to as the JIRA)

 

ETA:  my bad, thank you Sassy for link to info about the changes when they (LL) switched to Bug Tracker, I had missed that post.  Evidently, issues are no longer searchable as they were previously.  So we'll never know if/when this 'may' be fixed nor can we add to any issue posted by someone else to show the extent that the community is being affected or any potential insights from the many intelligent sources of info (self excluded!) :matte-motes-silly:

[KarenMichelle Lane]

IMHO - Drop is a horrible command! Way too many things can go wrong even without any bugs in server code. Dropping an avatar attached anything anywhere that is not your home is invite for disaster.

Not only from the threat of griefing objects carried into non-rez areas but with all the security permissions checks that need to be added to the very act of "Dropping" from a object already rezzed on an avatar.

This is one of those options I'd love to see go away.

[Kelli May]

Building on what has been said about dropping: the main problem I've had is not dropping, but wearing (attaching) a dropped item from in-world, rather than from inventory. I remember a lot of complaints of no-copy items being lost this way, especially dance HUDs, collars and AOs. The advice that was always gien was to never attach a rezzed item, but to 'take' it and then attach from inventory.

I'm not discounting any losses pet owners have suffered from dropping, just adding this bit of (old) advice for anyone not aware of it.

[Pussycat Catnap]

While asset server issues happen and can eat no-copy items (its happened to me once that I am sure - with an item that was meant to show profiles of recent visitors, and maybe one or two more with stuff I cared too little about to know)...

This has to be something new if there's an outbreak of it going on. I was into Meeroos for most of 2011 or 2012 or somewhen and I don't recall ever seeing this mentioned as occuring to anyone other than less than a handful of odd notes - the sort CSRs could fix with ease. Nothing so overwhelming that they had to limit support and tell people to stop picking them up.

Picking up and dropping your Meeroo was a major part of the theme for them.

If its now occuring a lot - I'd look to that breedable if isolated to one brand, or to a new bug if more widespread.

Undisclosed suprise new bugs are certainly common enough in SL.

 

[KarenMichelle Lane]

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Pussycat Catnap wrote:

... 

Undisclosed surprise new bugs

are certainly common enough in SL.

 

---

Huh? Isn't this an oxymoron?  Bugs by their nature are not only undisclosed and frenquently a suprise but also unknown until they are 1) Identified, 2) verified repeatable and 3) Finally placed into a Software bug Tracking system with a status other than New.

"Bugs are certainly common enough in SL." says it all.

 

[Tari Landar]

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Pussycat Catnap wrote:

While asset server issues happen and can eat no-copy items (its happened to me once that I am sure - with an item that was meant to show profiles of recent visitors, and maybe one or two more with stuff I cared too little about to know)...

This has to be something new if there's an outbreak of it going on. I was into Meeroos for most of 2011 or 2012 or somewhen and I don't recall ever seeing this mentioned as occuring to anyone other than less than a handful of odd notes - the sort CSRs could fix with ease. Nothing so overwhelming that they had to limit support and tell people to stop picking them up.

Picking up and dropping your Meeroo was a major part of the theme for them.

If its now occuring a lot - I'd look to that breedable if isolated to one brand, or to a new bug if more widespread.

Undisclosed suprise new bugs are certainly common enough in SL.

 

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It is most definitely not a new issue. There may be more people experiencing it now, but it's not new by a long shot. The fact that more are experiencing it now is more likely due to more people involved with the products this bug typically seems to attack. Unfortunately, I can't show you the proof because the dimwits at ll decided to disallow the viewing, commenting and voting on JIRAs. There are/were quite a few about it. One in particular had regular(seemingly) communication from the lab at one point. That one was started in 2008, but didn't get much commentary until 2009-and shortly after it went to dead silence again. There were others before it, and plenty after too.

It was an issue with meeroos as well. But the staff never came forward and told people to stop picking them up. Their advice was , typically, for people to "drop not detach". They were actually the first breedable that suggested this method. All others before(and most after) had/have always said "detach, don't drop". The others said that, because of this bug specifically. It was quite known at one time. We had many, many discussions about it back when breedables were just barely hitting the grid(sion, petable, ozimals-mostly). It wasn't a bug that most ever saw, until that point. When the objects affected are used by more people, you're bound to run into more instances.

It's not a huge widespread issue that has any sort of constant. It's still as random as it's always been. You're likely to find at least as many people affected as those not. That's part of why it's such a frustrating bug. There's absolutely no rhyme or reason to it.

I found part of what I was looking for earlier, lol. You can see this has been an issue for a long time now

http://forums-archive.secondlife.com/327/4e/269738/1.html

If you look in that thread it discusses two different issues, the very last post goes to a blog that describes the drop-and-lose issue quite well. The first "fix" this blog article discusses addresses a different lost asset issue. It's about items being detached and disappearing from inventory altogether. That bug was, supposedly, fixed, in 2010. But the other problem, the losing of no copy items when worn from the ground and then dropped issue, was never resolved. I can't post that link here without people RICing the hell out of the thread. But, you can read it there in that thread.

[Shamu077]

Tari,

" It's about items being detached and disappearing from inventory altogether. That bug was, supposedly, fixed, in 2010. But the other problem, the losing of no copy items when worn from the ground and then dropped issue, was never resolved."

The bug today is when an attached item NEVER appears in inventory when it is attached.  If the item does not show in inventory  then Drop is greyed out - since there is nothing to rezz back to land from inventory.  

Of course if you try to Detach the kittycat, it will vanish most of the time - that has always been the case.  There are specific warnings never to use Detach for the kittycats.    If you log out while the item is still attached, it will be gone when you log in.  Either way, if Attaching using one of the menu driven commands does not show in inventory, you will lose the breedable.  You must use Drop for the kittycat to rezz back to land.  You must also be wearing the land tag for the land or Drop can lose it - but that is another issue entirely, NOT related to this present SL bug.

This is ths same problem that all objects are now having when trying to return them to inventory - an error message appears saying the asset server did not respond in time, and the rezzed item remains rezzed.  In this case, you just keep trying to Take the object back to inventory.  This asset server problem has severely increased in the last month.  With breedables that use a menu to attach to avatars, the result is no breedable in inventory, and hence Drop is greyed out.

This has nothing to do with increased popularity of breedables meaning more reports.  I have been using the Drop command for 2 years every day, sometimes 100 times/day.  I have never lost a kittycat up to about mid November, because Drop was greyed out  AND the cat was NOT in inventory.  Now, if I try to attach, the cat will not move to inventory about 1 in 5 times.  It still attaches, but does not exist according to SL, since it is not in inventory and attached.

In other words, from no problems using drop many times/day for 2 years, to a problem every 5 cats.  That is a huge change - and why Kittycats is now saying do not use any command that will attach to your avatar until SL fixes this new problem.

And, people that don't rezz and take objects by the hundreds every day as part of their business may not notice the problem - that doesnt mean it does not exist or is some old infrequesnt bug, as some have suggested.

Shamu

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Czari Zenovka]

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Shamu077 wrote:

 

This has nothing to do with increased popularity of breedables meaning more reports.  I have been using the Drop command for 2 years every day, sometimes 100 times/day.  I have never lost a kittycat up to about mid November, because Drop was greyed out  AND the cat was NOT in inventory.  Now, if I try to attach, the cat will not move to inventory about 1 in 5 times.  It still attaches, but does not exist according to SL, since it is not in inventory and attached.

In other words, from no problems using drop many times/day for 2 years, to a problem every 5 cats.  That is a huge change - and why Kittycats is now saying do not use any command that will attach to your avatar until SL fixes this new problem.

 

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I'd have to agree that this is some new variation of the old bug, if not a new one altogether that (based on this thread) appears to be happening primarily to the KittyCatS breedables, unless it is happening to other breedables and has not yet made its way onto the forums.  As I mentioned earlier, my BioBreeds dogs cannot be carried so I can't test it with one of them, but the Virtual Kennel Club (VKC) came out with a dog that could be held in 2007 (Bichon) and has since added many more small breeds that can be held in addition to the cats and rabbits added in the last couple of years.  These are the instructions on picking up/holding/dropping or detaching the smaller pets taken from the VKC website (I just chose the rabbit as an example; the text is the same on all the pets that can be held):

Say: mimz here

This command tells the rabbit to jump into the arms of her owner. When an owner gives this command to the rabbit, the avatar bends down just in time to catch the rabbit as it leaps into the arms of its owner. The owner can then walk around, and even TP, while holding the rabbit. Only the owner may give this command and the owner must grant permission for the command to work.

Permission: Before the "here" command will work, the owner of the rabbit must give permission to allow the rabbit to animate his avatar. To do this, use the following command:

Say: Mimzy attach

A menu will appear seeking permission to animate the avatar. Click "yes" to grant permission. The rabbit will remember this permission until it is revoked by the owner or until the rabbit has been to the VKC Clinic, so this usually is a one-time command. Once the rabbit has permission to animate the avatar, the owner only needs to use the command "here" to get the rabbit in his arms.

Stop Carrying Rabbit: To stop carrying the rabbit, the owner should right-click on the rabbit and select drop from the menu. The rabbit will jump down to the ground. If you prefer, you may right-click on the rabbit and select detach from menu. In this case, the rabbit will appear in your inventory.

(Bolding mine)

VKC gives both the drop or detach options.  I have used the drop option (including within the last week) quite often without a problem.  If this was a big issue (speaking just for the VKC brand here), it would have been in chat and/or a notice put out by VKC, which is why I'm leaning towards KittyCatS having this issue atm for some reason.  Now just why one type of SL pet is experiencing this and not others is a mystery, but I do agree it is something different than the drop bug of old...or maybe it morphed and became more targeted...definitely a mystery.

[Shamu077]

According to KittyCatS, it is affecting other breedables.  But Kittycats is now the most popular of the breedables, and the cats have the most attachment interactions of any breedable.  Besides the Cuddle/Hold/Lay/Walk interactions, you can ride (like a horse) the MegaPuss, fly around on a broom with the Halloween cats, and go sledding with the Holiday cats.

So its no surprise they are now getting most of the problems.   This is from the KC announcement in their forum, from the KC owners:

**IMPORTANT** Drop Bug Information
Hi all. About a month ago it seems there was a new bug introduced in SL. In regards to KittyCatS, this bug appears to be affecting the ability to Drop your cats after interacting with them via the menu, as well as possibly affecting cats that vanish randomly without reason while rezzed on land in SL. Other breedables have been affected by this bug as well. Linden Labs appears to be aware of this bug, however they cannot address it until after the holidays.

Unfortunately this bug has caused many problems for our customers that like to Interact with their cats for fun and breeding purposes. To help minimize the loss of cats caused by this bug, we recommend that customers disable the cat's ability to walk and run, and not use the Cuddle/Hold/Lay/Walk interactions with their cats until further notice.

We realize that the walking animation and interactions are a large part of the appeal of KittyCatS for many, and we truly apologize for the inconvenience that this latest bug has caused in regards to your ability to enjoy your cats. Please be assured that we are working hard to try and find a solution to this problem, and that we will be in contact with Linden Labs to determine what has caused this issue and how it can be fixed.

 

[Kitten Longmeadow]

Gosh, lots to reply to in this thread! I'll do my best to respond to the concerns and questions that have been brought up as they directly relate to KittyCatS, and if anyone else has further questions please feel free to message me in world.

Our post regarding this bug is here: http://kittycats.biz/blog/2013/12/26/important-drop-bug-information/. Thank you to those that re-posted it also.

"The Kittycats teams all state that it is a LL bug but I cant find any information on it aside from their website and they said that it effects all breedables but not all breedables are effected because not all breedables are interactive as kittycats."

Our post that I linked above stats that "other breedables are affected". We knew that Dwarfins customers were experiencing some issues, and Meeroos may have been experiencing some issues as well as shown here: http://www.worldofmeeroos.com/?q=node/13384. The Dwarfins post is linked in our blog post above, as well as here: http://dwarfins.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/missing-dwarfins/. Thank you to those that re-posted this also.

 

Before I address some of the direct concerns I want to give a little background on this issue as it concerned KittyCatS.

One of the most popular features of KittyCatS is the ability to Interact with the cats via their menu. These Interaction functions allow a customer to Cuddle, Hold, Lay with, Walk, and Play with their cats. Using the radial menu, they can also Pet their cats and Megapuss owners can Ride their cats. You can read more about KittyCatS Interactions here: http://kittycats.biz/help/category.php?id=6

When KittyCatS launched, initially customers would stop Interacting with their cats by Detaching the cats. However some customers would find that their cats would detach into inventory as a "parentless" object outside of the Inventory and Library folders and thus disappear. This is apparently an old SL issue that affects no-copy objects that attach to your avatar via a menu. After testing extensively, the suggested alternative was for customers to right click the physical cat and Drop it instead. This has worked well since our launch in 2011, and while some customers did still experience issues from time to time, the vast majority have been able to use Drop as a viable workaround.

About a month ago however, we began to notice an increase in tickets from customers that would lose their cats due to the Drop option being greyed out and having to Detach instead. Initially we thought it may have been to due to an influx of new customers since the end of summer (more customers = more tickets.) However over the recent holidays, the number of tickets regarding this issue suddenly exploded, and after researching the problem and finding it was a known issue that a) was affecting other breedables and b) was being looked into by LL, we made the decision to suggest to customers that they not Interact with their cats unless necessary for breeding. For those customers that did need to Interact with their cats for breeding purposes (ie. to give them the happiness/love gain buff) we suggested a workaround where they could Attach their cats directly to the correct attachment points, and then detach when done, much like one would detach a hair or clothing prim.

So that is where we are now. Knowing that the holidays are a busy time for everyone, we trusted that the issue was being looked into and that this was just a case of needing to be patient and allow LL to handle things. Once it seems like the bug is no longer affecting Interactions with KittyCatS, we'll give our customers an "all-clear" so they can get back to cuddling, holding, laying, and walking with their cats.

 

Now to address some of the specific concerns just so that there's an official word on them from us

"The thing is you have to buy milk to gain happiness now instead of just cuddling the cats."

Vita-Milk is an optional product. It provides a buff to Happiness and Love gain. It's not required for your KittyCatS. It's what we call a convenience product. For all of our convenience products, there is a free workaround. In the case of KittyCatS, the free workaround is to use the cat's Interaction menu to lay with, cuddle, or hold the cat. This causes the cat to attach to and animate your avatar via its menu. Customers could also right-click on their cats to bring up a radial menu and "Pet" their cat. Doing any of these activities for 30min would provide the same buff that the Vita-Milk product provides. I want to make it clear that at no time have we told customers affected by this issue that they HAD to purchase Vita-Milk as a solution. As was pointed out, we've instead offered a workaround detailed on our blog post linked above.

"Also, if I kept attaching the cats they might not want to return my cats anymore..(that was from a non CSR)"

I think they key here is that you were told this by someone that is not an official representative of KittyCatS, therefore it's not something that you should take as an indicator of policy. If you do need an official reassurance however, then as the Head CSR for KittyCatS, I can state that if you send us a ticket with the lost cat's ID#, and it's shown to be owned by you and not in the Menagerie, we will assist in retrieving it.

"its just they are not understanding that some of us really enjoy intereacting with teh pets more than trying to make money breeding that exclusive animal that everyone wants..."

On the contrary, we understand this very well! As we said in our blog post: "We realize that the walking animation and interactions are a large part of the appeal of KittyCatS for many, and we truly apologize for the inconvenience that this latest bug has caused in regards to your ability to enjoy your cats." So don't worry! We want you to enjoy your KittyCatS and once we know that this bug won't be an issue, we'll be sure to let our customers know.

 

Thanks for the opportunity to clarify a few things regarding our product! If anyone has any concerns specific to KittyCatS, please don't hestate to contact me in world so I can assist you.

 

Kitten Longmeadow

KittyCatS, Head CSR

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

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Kitten Longmeadow wrote:

 

 

Kitten Longmeadow

KittyCatS, Head CSR

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I am looking for a jira about the bug I would like to watch it. You wrote a lot there and I am going through it all now, maybe I missed it.

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"Also, if I kept attaching the cats they might not want to return my cats anymore..(that was from a non CSR)"

I think they key here is that you were told this by someone that is not an official representative of KittyCatS, therefore it's not something that you should take as an indicator of policy. If you do need an official reassurance however, then as the Head CSR for KittyCatS, I can state that if you send us a ticket with the lost cat's ID#, and it's shown to be owned by you and not in the Menagerie, we will assist in retrieving it. **Only uploaded images may be used in postings**://secondlife.i.lithium.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif" border="0" alt=":smileyhappy:" title="Smiley Happy" /> - 100% understood

 

I hope everyone got that message, To any CRS this has put a lot of work on your tables too.

I see a lot of cats lost. Mine included and I am really bummed I cant walk with the darn cats. Because they were low scripted and traveld well. 

 

I seriously hope Linden Labs and the developers get it fixed.  

 

I am a die hard "breeders are idiots" fan but these got me hooked. So understand I wuv these kitties. And right about now its the only thing motivating me to spend time on SL.

 

Kitten, you are always helpful and I respect that a whole lot.

 

 It is asset server bug, correct or would it be somethign else.

 

 

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

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Sassy Romano wrote:

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Tini Jewell wrote:

So, all I recommend is that you do a search for the JIRA, add your comments to it and keep fingers crossed. 

 

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Nice idea but flawed because JIRA's are now private and have been for some time, can't search anymore, can't see anyone else's JIRA entry.

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AHHH Ty

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

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Shamu077 wrote:

Tari,

" It's about items being detached and disappearing from inventory altogether. That bug was, supposedly, fixed, in 2010. But the other problem, the losing of no copy items when worn from the ground and then dropped issue, was never resolved."

The bug today is when an attached item NEVER appears in inventory when it is attached.  If the item does not show in inventory  then Drop is greyed out - since there is nothing to rezz back to land from inventory.  

Of course if you try to Detach the kittycat, it will vanish most of the time - that has always been the case.  There are specific warnings never to use Detach for the kittycats.    If you log out while the item is still attached, it will be gone when you log in.  Either way, if Attaching using one of the menu driven commands does not show in inventory, you will lose the breedable.  You must use Drop for the kittycat to rezz back to land.  You must also be wearing the land tag for the land or Drop can lose it - but that is another issue entirely, NOT related to this present SL bug.

This is ths same problem that all objects are now having when trying to return them to inventory - an error message appears saying the asset server did not respond in time, and the rezzed item remains rezzed.  In this case, you just keep trying to Take the object back to inventory.  This asset server problem has severely increased in the last month.  With breedables that use a menu to attach to avatars, the result is no breedable in inventory, and hence Drop is greyed out.

This has nothing to do with increased popularity of breedables meaning more reports.  I have been using the Drop command for 2 years every day, sometimes 100 times/day.  I have never lost a kittycat up to about mid November, because Drop was greyed out  AND the cat was NOT in inventory.  Now, if I try to attach, the cat will not move to inventory about 1 in 5 times.  It still attaches, but does not exist according to SL, since it is not in inventory and attached.

In other words, from no problems using drop many times/day for 2 years, to a problem every 5 cats.  That is a huge change - and why Kittycats is now saying do not use any command that will attach to your avatar until SL fixes this new problem.

And, people that don't rezz and take objects by the hundreds every day as part of their business may not notice the problem - that doesnt mean it does not exist or is some old infrequesnt bug, as some have suggested.

Shamu

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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 This is happening  ALOT to me in my sim and other places.