Do people really care?

[Madelaine McMasters]

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Darrius Gothly wrote:

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

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Freya Mokusei wrote:

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

If so... that would stop the copybotters, wouldn't it?

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Tried, failed. Predictable as anything. Look back to 2011 or so.

All it did was make it harder to detect rogue viewers. LL can't win this arms race by trying to close the gates.

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I don't remember them ever locking SL to a few specific viewers... Ever.

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There is a bit of information sent to the SL Login Service at the very start of the login process that identifies the type of Viewer being used. This is how Linden Lab determines the popularity of specific Viewers. It was used in the past to warn people using Viewers that were dropped from the TPV.

But the problem with using this bit of info to block Copybot Viewers is that those Viewers simply identify as some authorized and legitimate Viewer instead. This makes it totally useless to use the declared Viewer Type to log and block Copybot Viewers.

If LL were to try and use some sort of "fingerprint" in the communication between Viewer and Server, it's important to realize that the entirety of the "conversation" between the Viewer and SL Servers is controlled by code provided by LL themselves. Yes, TPV Developers can have different types of conversations than the basic LL Viewer does, but the way they "talk" and the construction of what they say must follow the same rules for every Viewer in existence. This prevents the LL Servers from detecting a rogue or pirate Viewer.

In order to do what Copybot Viewers do, that does not require anything special in the type of conversation had. Copybot Viewers can get every bit of information and detail they need to Copybot in-world objects simply by being within draw distance. Any details that might not necessarily be communicated are so irrelevant that they can be replaced by stock values or made-up info anyway.

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You don't need a copybot viewer to rip textures (and to a lesser extent, geometry). You can do that with a standard LL viewer using an OpenGL model ripper. The only way LL could prevent copybotting would be to render SL in the server and stream the video to our computers.

[Perrie Juran]

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Rya Nitely wrote:

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Darrius Gothly wrote:

So maybe that's your answer Rya: People DO care, but feel largely incapable of suggesting, requiring, demanding or even threatening in order to get the problem fixed.

When trying to dance in tandem with a partner that neither listens nor talks, it becomes virtually impossible to do anything other than step on each other's toes.

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Let us settle with some people care, but 'do not have a strong opinion perhaps'.

The evidence is this -

Many people in SL are happy to use these items - both creators and customers - so either these people don't care or they don't know the items are stolen, or maybe they just don't want to know.

These stolen mesh items are very popular, and becoming more so everyday. You might not be aware of it because you don't go around inworld, you don't participate in hunts and expos, you don't explore popular sims ( I am assuming). I find it hard to believe that people are not aware of ripped mesh, especially merchants who should be more careful, and also the owners of popular locations in SL.

@ Chic, I think you would be more exposed to it because I have been involved in some expos and hunts where you were a blogger, and some of the ripped mesh items on display were owned by major sponsors.

But, as I said in my first post I'm not so concerned about it anymore. I just find it amusing now, especially when the item shows the name of a merchant from these forums where the subject has been discussed - so some people say they care but go ahead and use ripped mesh in their creations anyway. 

My original post was sparked by what I saw - the prominence of ripped mesh in Halloween displays. Games tend towards the gory, so it’s not surprising. Of course people are going to buy and display these items because they look so horridly impressive. My partner and I played ‘name the game’ when we went around looking at the Halloween displays. It amused us for an entire evening.

 

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I think you are expecting to much from Residents here.

Speaking for myself, I do care.

But when I log in I don't do it to play policeman.  I'm logging in to enjoy doing the things I enjoy doing.

You have no right to ask me to do any more than what the ToS and CS requires.

You see, I have no way of knowing if content is ripped.  I can only at best suspect it.  As a consumer I can choose to take the risk and buy it knowing I might lose it if a take down is filed.  That's a choice I have. 

But asking me to try and figure out if the content is ripped is asking too much.  Am I supposed to live my SL in suspicion of everything I see?

Likewise, I don't play any computer Games.  I don't do WOW or Skyrim or any others.  There is no way I'd recognise if something was ripped from them.

Sure there are things I would be very suspicious about.  It's not that I have no awareness. If I got passed a folder full of full perm hairs I know there is a likelyhood they are ripped and I'd be very hesitant to use them.  But I am by no means a hair expert, or a skin expert, or a clothing expert that I can tell you which creators work it is.  If I do recognise the work I'll send a note to the creator to ask. 

Again, it's not that I don't care.  I do.  I support creators rights.  But when I signed up for SL I didn't see anything in the agreement that required me to police the grid.  It is certainly not what I or the vast majority who log in are here for.

 

[Mikki Miles]

here's a first little step I will take:

- I will withdraw my goods from hunts as soon as I find out there are ripped items available on that hunt, and I will let the hunt organizer know

- I will withdraw my items from any inworld market or mall where I find ripped stuff, and I will let the market owner know

[Pamela Galli]

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Perrie Juran wrote:

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Rya Nitely wrote:

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Darrius Gothly wrote:

So maybe that's your answer Rya: People DO care, but feel largely incapable of suggesting, requiring, demanding or even threatening in order to get the problem fixed.

When trying to dance in tandem with a partner that neither listens nor talks, it becomes virtually impossible to do anything other than step on each other's toes.

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Let us settle with some people care, but 'do not have a strong opinion perhaps'.

The evidence is this -

Many people in SL are happy to use these items - both creators and customers - so either these people don't care or they don't know the items are stolen, or maybe they just don't want to know.

These stolen mesh items are very popular, and becoming more so everyday. You might not be aware of it because you don't go around inworld, you don't participate in hunts and expos, you don't explore popular sims ( I am assuming). I find it hard to believe that people are not aware of ripped mesh, especially merchants who should be more careful, and also the owners of popular locations in SL.

@ Chic, I think you would be more exposed to it because I have been involved in some expos and hunts where you were a blogger, and some of the ripped mesh items on display were owned by major sponsors.

But, as I said in my first post I'm not so concerned about it anymore. I just find it amusing now, especially when the item shows the name of a merchant from these forums where the subject has been discussed - so some people say they care but go ahead and use ripped mesh in their creations anyway. 

My original post was sparked by what I saw - the prominence of ripped mesh in Halloween displays. Games tend towards the gory, so it’s not surprising. Of course people are going to buy and display these items because they look so horridly impressive. My partner and I played ‘name the game’ when we went around looking at the Halloween displays. It amused us for an entire evening.

 

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I think you are expecting to much from Residents here.

Speaking for myself, I do care.

But when I log in I don't do it to play policeman.  I'm logging in to enjoy doing the things I enjoy doing.

You have no right to ask me to do any more than what the ToS and CS requires.

You see, I have

no way

of knowing if content is ripped.  I can only at best

suspect

it.  As a consumer I can choose to take the risk and buy it knowing I might lose it if a take down is filed.  That's a choice I have. 

But asking me to try and figure out if the content is ripped is asking too much.  Am I supposed to live my SL in suspicion of everything I see?

Likewise, I don't play any computer Games.  I don't do WOW or Skyrim or any others.  There is no way I'd recognise if something was ripped from them.

Sure there are things I would be very suspicious about.  It's not that I have no awareness. If I got passed a folder full of full perm hairs I know there is a likelyhood they are ripped and I'd be very hesitant to use them.  But I am by no means a hair expert, or a skin expert, or a clothing expert that I can tell you which creators work it is.  If I do recognise the work I'll send a note to the creator to ask. 

Again, it's not that I don't care.  I do.  I support creators rights.  But when I signed up for SL I didn't see anything in the agreement that required me to police the grid.  It is certainly not what I or the vast majority who log in are here for.

 

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I agree, the average consumer has no way of knowing and no obligation to investigate.  However, those who blog products and organize events, IMO, do have SOME obligation, since they are recommending products.  

 

For example, I dont read blogs often but when I do, I notice that "creators" -- actually uploaders -- who have been widely and incontrovertedly outed as having taken things from Turbosquid and other sites and illegally resold them, continue to be blogged and featured in events. That makes a statement. That statement is: Who cares? 

[Perrie Juran]

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Pamela Galli wrote:

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I agree, the average consumer has no way of knowing and no obligation to investigate.  However, those who blog products and organize events, IMO, do have SOME obligation, since they are recommending products.  

 

For example, I dont read blogs often but when I do, I notice that "creators" -- actually uploaders -- who have been widely and incontrovertedly outed as having taken things from Turbosquid and other sites and illegally resold them, continue to be blogged and featured in events. That makes a statement. That statement is: Who cares? 

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On the one hand I am not sure that the Blogger's and Event organizers should be or are obligated to investigate every thing they blog about or who is included in the events.

But I will agree that they should not be promoting content thiefs after they have been given solid evidence that the content was stolen.

Once they are given the evidence they should remove the promotion, etc, etc.  I would take them to task if they failed to do that.

 

[Rya Nitely]

I posted about this because it was providing information that is worthy of discussion. Most people might not be aware of the extent of content theft.

I'm not playing police when I go out there. I'm not going to tell people to take down their gift on the first day of a hunt and have them scrambling for an alternative. I'm not going to destroy the weeks of time and expense put into setting up these Halloween displays on the day before Halloween. I'm not going to IM merchants to tell them that I saw an obvious piece of ripped mesh in one of their Halloween creations - AND that I posted a picture of that very same ripped statue on a previous thread right here in the merchant forums (this merchant participated in the thread).

I'm not going to do any of this because, as I said - I don't care enough about it to take up that fight.

 

I simply posted it here because it is an interesting topic and just as worthy of discussion as the ToS.

[Darrius Gothly]

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Freya Mokusei wrote:

Thanks for the elucidation, Darrius. You've a way with words and a patience that I can't match here.

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You're very welcome Freya .. and thank you for the compliments. It might not be patience though .. it could just be a thick-headed inability to recognize when it's time to give up. (A bad habit I've had for years.) *grin*

[Madeliefste Oh]

I do care. Because it is unfair competition to creators who put their time and skills in making original content for SL. In the time it takes me to create a mesh, a uv map and a texture, an infringer can upload 100 textured mesh models, make productpics and list the stuff on marketplace.
And since the 'production' of rippers goes much faster, they also take away the visibility of original creators, because it will become harder and harder for customers to find them in the pile of ripped content.

I do not recognize items from games, because I hardly played games. But I do use marketplace and come along shops from meshmakers. And I see more and more shops coming where you do not see "the personal touch of the creator". Where you for example see a lot of difference in quality in different ranges of products, or where some objects have really lousy textures, while others are perfectly textured. It just does not look as if it comes from the same hand.

I must add that it is highly frustrating to care. Because we are in a system that does not care at all. We have nothing to expect from Linden Lab (unless they are forced by law to act different, they will do what they have always done, only react to correctly filed dmca's).
And we have very little to expect from the majority of residents. When it is beautiful and cheap it will sell, to people who are not aware of possible infringement and even some of people who are aware might be tempted...

I feel powerless to change the bigger system, I cannot spend my energy on that level. My strategy is to care for what is in my power to care for. I care for my customers, I care for the reputation of our brand. We feel responsible for the legality of our content, since our customers are often merchants themselves. We don't want to put them in risk to loose items from their inventory or from their shop when one day the IP right holder comes along with a dmca. And that is not going to happen in our house, we play it fair. We have our pride.

[Drake1 Nightfire]

Technically speaking, LL is profiting from stolen content every time one of these ripped items is sold on the MP. Wouldn't that make them an accessory? I know if I was the owner of marvel for instance, I would be suing LL for every penny they received from the sales of copyrighted items that I owned.

[Darrius Gothly]

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

Technically speaking, LL is profiting from stolen content every time one of these ripped items is sold on the MP. Wouldn't that make them an accessory? I know if I was the owner of marvel for instance, I would be suing LL for every penny they received from the sales of copyrighted items that I owned.

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This is where the ToS covers their backside. Terms and conditions in the current ToS (as well as similar language in the prior version ToS and Marketplace Guidelines) state that the Merchant is the sole party responsible for the legality of the uploaded content. Linden Lab is not responsible to verify that each upload is owned and rightfully controlled by the person uploading it. So unless and until they are rightfully notified that the item is being illegally distributed, they have no legal exposure.

However, once they are rightfully notified then they have a responsibility to remove it el pronto. The Catch-22 is .. only the rightful owner can "rightfully notify" them.

[Drongle McMahon]

"This is where the ToS covers their backside."

It will be interesting to see how well that holds up when they start selling the plethora skyrim content to other games developers on Desura!

[Darrius Gothly]

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Drongle McMahon wrote:

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Darrius Gothly wrote:

This is where the ToS covers their backside.

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It will be interesting to see how well that holds up when they start selling the plethora skyrim content to other games developers on Desura!

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Oh, I strongly suspect that LL will take the time and do the investigation to make sure they aren't posting ripped content. After all, posting it for sale under their name is an "Active Event" .. meaning something they did themselves. Letting ripped content sit on the Marketplace or seeing it sold in-world are "Passive Events" for LL .. meaning they didn't do anything to cause the problem.

With Passive Events, it really falls to the complaining party to prove LL knew the content was stolen in order to successfuly sue them. What with "Plausible Deniability" that becomes a very tall hurdle to overcome. 

[Rya Nitely]

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Madeliefste Oh wrote:

I do care. Because it is unfair competition to creators who put their time and skills in making original content for SL. In the time it takes me to create a mesh, a uv map and a texture, an infringer can upload 100 textured mesh models, make productpics and list the stuff on marketplace.

And since the 'production' of rippers goes much faster, they also take away the visibility of original creators, because it will become harder and harder for customers to find them in the pile of ripped content.

 

I do not recognize items from games, because I hardly played games. But I do use marketplace and come along shops from meshmakers. And I see more and more shops coming where you do not see "the personal touch of the creator". Where you for example see a lot of difference in quality in different ranges of products, or where some objects have really lousy textures, while others are perfectly textured. It just does not look as if it comes from the same hand.

 

I must add that it is highly frustrating to care. Because we are in a system that does not care at all. We have nothing to expect from Linden Lab (unless they are forced by law to act different, they will do what they have always done, only react to correctly filed dmca's).

And we have very little to expect from the majority of residents. When it is beautiful and cheap it will sell, to people who are not aware of possible infringement and even some of people who are aware might be tempted...

 

I feel powerless to change the bigger system, I cannot spend my energy on that level. My strategy is to care for what is in my power to care for. I care for my customers, I care for the reputation of our brand. We feel responsible for the legality of our content, since our customers are often merchants themselves. We don't want to put them in risk to loose items from their inventory or from their shop when one day the IP right holder comes along with a dmca. And that is not going to happen in our house, we play it fair. We have our pride.

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Good post.

It is frustrating to care, because there isn't much we can do about it.

I post to raise awareness. It needs to be raised. I'm hoping that raising the subject has some small impact. If nothing was ever said then people may start to find the situation acceptable and normal.

 It doesn't help when some people diminish the validity of my post with comments like  'who are you to say this and that...'  and 'how would people know if they're not gamers?'. This actually causes more damage because it would encourage offenders to use these justifications and excuses.

For the record, I'm not a gamer. My partner is, and I have played a few games with him. I recognise items from games only because I did some very intensive research into stolen content. I took the time to do this because I cared. 

Why do I care and why do I bother? Because I believe the influx of stolen content will have a huge damaging effect on business in SL. It's going to devalue content and bring down prices, until creating original content in SL will no longer be worth the effort. And what impact will this devaluing of content have on the SL economy as a whole? I'm not an Economist but it would certainly be a negative flow on effect.

[Pamela Galli]

Years ago when the freebie/hunt business was just starting I connected the dots and made the observation in the Xtreet forum that this trend was going to hurt merchants -- and was trashed for it in a huge thread: NO WAY could the freebie flood be anything but positive, and how dare I suggest otherwise. To compete with free stuff, just make better stuff. 

A couple years ago when I heard mesh was coming I connected the dots and predicted a flood of ripped content -- and not just from games -- and the effect this would have on people making and selling mesh of their own. Again, I was told this could never happen -- and if it did, just make better stuff. 

So let me say right now, that the trend now is going to be towards uploading mesh rather than making it. Yes, some of us will continue to make it because we like to, but in SL playing by the rules will not be rewarded, and that is not going to change (unless LL wants to be really proactive with accounts).

 

[Dresden Ceriano]

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Perrie Juran wrote:

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Pamela Galli wrote:

I agree, the average consumer has no way of knowing and no obligation to investigate.  However, those who blog products and organize events, IMO, do have SOME obligation, since they are recommending products.  

 

For example, I dont read blogs often but when I do, I notice that "creators" -- actually uploaders -- who have been widely and incontrovertedly outed as having taken things from Turbosquid and other sites and illegally resold them, continue to be blogged and featured in events. That makes a statement. That statement is: Who cares? 

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On the one hand I am not sure that the Blogger's and Event organizers should be or are obligated to investigate every thing they blog about or who is included in the events.

But I will agree that they should not be promoting content thiefs after they have been given solid evidence that the content was stolen.

Once they are given the evidence they should remove the promotion, etc, etc.  I would take them to task if they failed to do that.

 

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I understand what both you and Pam are saying, but I fail to understand what level of evidence these bloggers are expected to have in order to discontinue blogging a designer.  Most of the calling out of creators for ripped content on the blogosphere amounts to little more than speculation and is backed by no real evidence.  Who's word are they to give more wait... Joe Schmo from the interenet saying, "Hey, such and such is selling ripped content, " or a well established creator saying, "Hey, no I'm not"?

I'm not saying that such things shouldn't be taken into consideration, but where do you draw the line?  What type of evidence should be considered "solid"?  Surely, a DMCA take down would be a huge indication, but even those can be nothing more than false claims and would need to be arbitrated in a court of law to hold any significant meaning.

This is certainly a complicated issue which will probably require a complicated solution.  But I see little to no value in throwing stones at perhaps, ignorant, but nonetheless, innocent people.

...Dres

[Dresden Ceriano]

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Rya Nitely wrote:

I posted about this because it was providing information that is worthy of discussion. Most people might not be aware of the extent of content theft.

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Perhaps it's quite worthy of discussion, but your OP read like nothing more than an attack on people, who may or may not know any better, and you throwing your hands up in disgust... how productive is that?

...Dres

[Pamela Galli]

Yes you make a good point, there is no way to absolutely prove something is ripped.

 

But there is often enough evidence of it to constitute reasonable doubt.  This page has been discussed grid-wide:  http://www.pinterest.com/OMDGSL/interesting-things/  There may be some bloggers that just missed the memo. Bloggers are certainly free to disavow any responsibily whatsoever -- but if I publicly recommended products to people I would, as I say, believe I had SOME responsibility to do some due diligance. 

 

ETA For those who do care, here are some indicators (not proof but indicators) to look for:  http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2013/02/tips-for-avoiding-stolen-content.html 

[Dresden Ceriano]

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Pamela Galli wrote:

...in SL playing by the rules will not be rewarded, and that is not going to change (unless LL wants to be really proactive with accounts).

 

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This is something with which I completely agree.  Not only is LL not doing anything about it, but, those of us who do follow the rules are stifled by their new ToS.  For example, we can no longer even use textures which we bought inworld, with a limited user agreement, without violating the terms to which we had to agree... meanwhile, rippers continue uploading stuff as usual and blatantly getting away with it.

...Dres

[Rya Nitely]

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Dresden Ceriano wrote:

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Rya Nitely wrote:

I posted about this because it was providing information that is worthy of discussion. Most people might not be aware of the extent of content theft.

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Perhaps it's quite worthy of discussion, but your OP read like nothing more than an attack on people, who may or may not know any better, and you throwing your hands up in disgust... how productive is that?

...Dres

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Dres, if you actually read my posts in this thread ( and not just the first one) you will see that this 'attack on people' was aimed at a specific merchant (I made that clear in two posts now, and this is the third). The person was actively involved in a discussion on stolen content. This person asked for advice on how to avoid it and read the list of things to look out for, saw a picture of a stolen mesh statue which was used in that thread as an example of what to look out for, and now this merchant has that very same statue in his/her creation. Now, do you see where I was coming from? I really didn't want to spell it out in this much detail because I don't want my finger pointing to become too direct.

[Darrius Gothly]

Really spoils the joke when you have to explain the punchline, huh?

[Dresden Ceriano]

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Rya Nitely wrote:

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Dresden Ceriano wrote:

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Rya Nitely wrote:

I posted about this because it was providing information that is worthy of discussion. Most people might not be aware of the extent of content theft.

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Perhaps it's quite worthy of discussion, but your OP read like nothing more than an attack on people, who may or may not know any better, and you throwing your hands up in disgust... how productive is that?

...Dres

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Dres, if you actually read my posts in this thread ( and not just the first one) you will see that this 'attack on people' was aimed at a specific merchant (I made that clear in two posts now, and this is the third). The person was actively involved in a discussion on stolen content. This person asked for advice on how to avoid it and read the list of things to look out for, saw a picture of a stolen mesh statue which was used in that thread as an example of what to look out for, and now this merchant has that very same statue in his/her creation. Now, do you see where I was coming from? I really didn't want to spell it out in this much detail because I don't want my finger pointing to become too direct.

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Oh, I get it now... you were attempting to personally attack someone here in the forum, but not actually name them in order to avoid breaking the CG; then trying to play it off as some sort of public service announcement.  Yeah... that's real productive.

By all means... carry on.

...Dres *won't bother paying any further attention*

[Rya Nitely]

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Dresden Ceriano wrote:

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Oh, I get it now... you were attempting to personally attack someone here in the forum, but not actually name them in order to avoid breaking the CG; then trying to play it off as some sort of public service announcement.  Yeah... that's real productive.

By all means... carry on.

...Dres *won't bother paying any further attention*

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That's very unfair when I was intentionally being vague in my original post, Let's go back and see how this developed:

My original post: ' Some of the creator names I have seen should and do know better. People can hide behind the 'Oh, I didn't know' ripped Halloween mask all they like but, NO... you're not that dumb.'

My second post:  ' I just find it amusing now, especially when the item shows the name of a merchant from these forums where the subject has been discussed - so some people say they care but go ahead and use ripped mesh in their creations anyway. '

An individual would have to be very paranoid to see this as a personal attack.

Your response: Who are you to say what any creator should or does know? .......How can you suggest that they don't care about ripped content, when in reality, they probably have no inclination that the content they're using might have been ripped?  It's simply not their, nor any other users' responsibility to be that knowledgeable about things on other platforms.'

 

And so I tried to make myself clearer for your benefit by saying: '....I saw an obvious piece of ripped mesh in one of their Halloween creations - AND that I posted a picture of that very same ripped statue on a previous thread right here in the merchant forums (this merchant participated in the thread).'

You: 'Perhaps it's quite worthy of discussion, but your OP read like nothing more than an attack on people, who may or may not know any better, and you throwing your hands up in disgust... how productive is that?'

Me: 'Dres, if you actually read my posts in this thread ( and not just the first one) you will see that this 'attack on people' was aimed at a specific merchant (I made that clear in two posts now, and this is the third). The person was actively involved in a discussion on stolen content. This person asked for advice on how to avoid it and read the list of things to look out for, saw a picture of a stolen mesh statue which was used in that thread as an example of what to look out for, and now this merchant has that very same statue in his/her creation. Now, do you see where I was coming from? I really didn't want to spell it out in this much detail because I don't want my finger pointing to become too direct.'

 

You: 'Oh, I get it now... you were attempting to personally attack someone here in the forum, but not actually name them in order to avoid breaking the CG; then trying to play it off as some sort of public service announcement.  Yeah... that's real productive.'

I don't believe that I have personally attacked anyone, but really Dres, because of your accusations you dragged more information out of me than I was ever going to reveal. You forced me to defend myself.

 

I really don't know what makes you so sensitive about the whole subject. You're coming very close to trolling.

And I don't understand how my first post was attacking anyone - was I attacking people who don't know they're using stolen content? If they don't know they're using stolen content then they wouldn't see it as an attack.

[Rya Nitely]

For a minute, I'm just going to pretend that I didn't create that first post and see how I would react to reading it.

I do create all my own mesh, but for a minute I'm going to pretend that I bought a full perm mesh item and added it to one of my boats.

Now I read the first post, and I start wondering about that full perm item. I hope it isn't stolen content, but if it is I would like to know. Would I see this first post as an attack on me? NO.

Then if the thread went on to talk about a stolen mesh item attached to a boat, and that the merchant uses and reads the forums - this would start me wondering and I'd become a bit concerned - but I still wouldn't see it as an attack on me.

If I thought perhaps the OP was talking about me, I would send an IM or PM to that person and ask. And If my bought mesh was in fact the source of discussion I'd be grateful for the information and I'd delete it. This is how an innocent person would react. They wouldn't feel attacked and insulted.

Why don't I IM this person about it then? Because there is a very real possibility that people who are using stolen content are aware of it, and I'm not going to play police.

But to end off I will say this. It's my opinion only. Most people don't care about stolen content coming into SL. It's like torrents - downloading shows, ebooks, applications etc. If things are easily accessable people will take it.

I'm not accusing anyone. I just gave examples of what I've observed to support my theory that most people don't care.

[Dartagan Shepherd]

You can only make a point if you're willing to dodge semantics, obfuscation, the reversal, the passive-aggressive, and the inevitable righteous indignation.

It helps to have had a manipulative ex in your background.

However, I'm calling out LL for starting the ball rolling when they first demo'ed mesh a couple years before they implemented it with a model of the Hulk and then later allowed obvious rips in the mesh beta. These were their shining "do as I say, not as I do" moments. It doesn't work well with parenting either.

Then, to not only "not" put more sensible blockades to thieves, but to become even more vested in the goods financially and then ToS away all liability.

I do agree that apathy is the biggest problem, though.

[Pamela Galli]

This is just a guess but I think 80% do care.  They do not want to buy from merchants with stolen merchandise, but, hey, if the stuff is being blogged, doesn't that mean it has an Official Stamp of Approval?  

In any case I would say that most of the ripped mesh stores that spring up are full perm, selling to merchants, because the uploaders do not want to have to script or texture or pay tier, etc.  As a merchant, I make it my business to know the signs of stuff that is ripped, though of course I can't know for sure about many. But I do check the SLU thread every week or so and I can look at the evidence there and make up my mind. 

If I was buying retail I would investigate stores the way I always did to determine if things looked copybotted.  Did this amazing ability to create professional quality mesh (with the merchant as creator in inspect) spring up overnight?  Did they go from creating nothing to creating whole stores of things? Most do care but I doubt they are going to do much research to find out, it is just too much effort. 

 

I know most of us who got into this job did it because we loved creating -- selling was an afterthought.  In my case and that of many others, I was also desperate for work I could do from home (two disabled relatives) and SL was a godsend, a miracle. I am grieved now with the effective WalMartization of SL, that actual creators of the kinds of things many of us sell -- rezzed objects -- will be marginalized. As Madelfieste said, we cannot compete with a machine that uploads dozens of meshes in the time it takes us to make one.

But life is not fair, and sometimes the cheats/thieves win. This is just one of them.