Tamara Artis Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Dilbert Dilweg wrote: Knowl Paine wrote: Thank You Dilbert. Cost effectiveness is in my consideration of your contribution to the Group. The data is a part of history. I'd like to help in storing as much as is reasonably possible. Even if I'm not the holder. :smileyhappy: Not a problem at all. The cost is nothing. The domain would be a bit cheaper like 12-14 bucks. But I am personally paying for the privacy to not display my real life contact info to the public lol What a mess that could be lol ( don't want Luc calling my home phone at 3 AM just to be funny) LOL . The cost is minimal, and no issue at all . Sever is already payed for ( 3 years ). from other services... Its all good I am really please on how things are going. Every one has some wonderful ideas and how everyone is working together is fantastic. Yes and a growing experience. All and all I am sure this outcome is going to be fantastic and bigger than me imagined /me adds a 'Like' button to like this post;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knowl Paine Posted April 19, 2012 Author Share Posted April 19, 2012 Excellent news :matte-motes-grin: I like it to Tamara :smileywink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Starsider Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Dilbert Dilweg wrote: Knowl Paine wrote: Thank You Dilbert. Cost effectiveness is in my consideration of your contribution to the Group. The data is a part of history. I'd like to help in storing as much as is reasonably possible. Even if I'm not the holder. :smileyhappy: Not a problem at all. The cost is nothing. The domain would be a bit cheaper like 12-14 bucks. But I am personally paying for the privacy to not display my real life contact info to the public LOL What a mess that could be LOL ( don't want Luc calling my home phone at 3 AM just to be funny) LOL . The cost is minimal, and no issue at all . Sever is already paid for ( 3 years ). from other services... Its all good I am really pleased on how things are going. Every one has some wonderful ideas and how everyone is working together is fantastic. Yes and a growing experience. All and all I am sure this outcome is going to be fantastic and bigger than me imagined I'd bring beer and everything... ETA: I agree with the last sentence anyway. - Luc - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilbert Dilweg Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Hahaha right on! Bring it! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy Paperdoll Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 "... -2 - On the issue of proportions of avatars displayed on the wall, Is a final decision that the photos must be mandatory full body? Is it not possible a resident send a photo of her/his eye, face, hand, american shot (3/4 shot), feet...? If this is possible, that images do not fit into the debate on the proportions." ----------------------------------------------------- Irene, that's actually a very good and valid point. I think everyone is assuming the users wanting to be included will take the time and/or make the effort to provide a picture that fits our idea of what the finished (I hesitate to use that word since finished is so final........I can see a possibility that this thing can be open ended with no real "finished" end to it) image or picture is going to be. Some people have pictures of their avatars that they really like and shows how they want others to see them.....those may not fit our precieved ideas of what we should be putting into the end product. I do see some issues with continuity of the project using the Dres/Tamara model. But no worse than non-human pictures we will also be working with. Not all avatars are human in SL. Being too rigid about what we want can (and probably would) be counter productive. Editing an image that already been edited might also present problems with quality. Which actually makes a collage or photomosiac a little more attractive.......even if those are not preferred choice. I still say it can be done but I don't think the results are going to be exactly how we invision it. Flexibility is the key. On the desenting voice........it ain't no problem for me. You should have been at the meetings. I sort felt like red headed step child at times with my objections to some of the ideas. Speaking your mind needs to be encouraged and discussed to get the best results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy Paperdoll Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Reply to Irene Muni - view message 04-19-201202:18 AM "I will address your second issue, Knowl will correct me if I am wrong. What we are trying to make, is a large photo that gives the impression of many avatars standing all together. In that sense, full body shots are ideal, however, we realize that we will get photos that do not fit perfectly into this large 'group' shot. For those images that cannot be included into the main project, there is a secondary project that aims to use each and every photo that is submitted. While we would love to have photos of complete avatars, no one is going to say eyeballs and feet cannot be sent in. **Only uploaded images may be used in postings**://secondlife.i.lithium.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif" border="0" alt=":smileytongue:" title="Smiley Tongue" /> However, I would encourage participants to send in photos of their avatar, as opposed to just pieces of it. American shot, is that term common usage? Interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_shot" ------------------------------------------------------------------ I'm sure you know my concerns about a "secondary" (or parallel project) since I've voiced my opinions about that a few times. I won't go there again here. But I just had a thought about how we can use the images we receive that are awkward or not really suitable for what we all (myself included) see as the objective. A collage or photomosaic (the two ideas I'm least in favor of) could be used as the background to place the cut-outs on. Doing that presents a whole new set of issues, I know.......things like making sure no one's avatar image gets covered by the full avatar's cut out and the background texture would be constantly changing as the project grows. Geeze, this idea can get really really complicated. Just tossing ideas as I think of them right now because I tend to have too many to remember for meetings and stuff. I need to take notes.........LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Tamara Artis wrote: Ok I'm going to remove your photo Irene. About all those notecards I was reading now... I prefer Charolottes example for those residents that are going to send us their snapshots. She makes it simple, attractive and easy to follow. She uses enter key (which helps better visibility, I opened up one notecard and got kinda scared of oll that text inside lol). Simple, attractive, and easy to follow? Why thank you, Tamara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Dilbert Dilweg wrote: Tamara Artis wrote: About all those notecards I was reading now... I prefer Charolottes example for those residents that are going to send us their snapshots. She makes it simple, attractive and easy to follow. She uses enter key (which helps better visibility, I opened up one notecard and got kinda scared of oll that text inside lol). Yes but I am not too keen on the idea of having 3 places to submit photos. Flicker (bad idea).. submit to Groups? not a good idea i think.. You would have to have somone sit there all day looking for a submission and giving everyone the ability to send notices is not wise I agree that submitting to group inworld is not a good idea, in fact, I mentioned that 10 lindens could be saved by not having the photo inworld. The two options I suggested in the rough draft of my notice are email and flickr. The reason I suggested two places to submit is because everyone does not have a flickr, but those that do could use it, and email, as an example of a way we could collect photos. Other places to submit will be fine, but I think free is the way to go. Other than email and Flickr, what other options for submitting photos would you suggest, I know there are others, those are just the two I personally use most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Irene Muni wrote: I have not problem with my photo as part of the project, my problem is with my photo in the logo. It's not the same the project and the logo. You probably understand me better if you had some 20 PMs and IMs telling you crap every time you appear on these forums with a new range or each time you reach a certain number of messages I can work in the Spanish side of this project without my image on the logo Haters gonna hate. I think the project image, logo, being a mini me of the final product is a good idea, however, I must admit I was a bit taken aback at the look of it. Use your dragon image like you did at the oscars! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Knowl Paine wrote: I'm ok with both writing styles. Charolotte has the lead on that. As long as it's spelled checked, and roughly translates without saying anything horribly offensive in a non-english language. (maybe I should handle the translate check) You mean spellchecked. http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/spellchecked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Luc Starsider wrote: Sure. Just making sure... I agree on her writing style. ...and I also wish she would write all text... - Luc - Thank you, Luc, and everyone else who likes my writing style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Peggy Paperdoll wrote: I'm sure you know my concerns about a "secondary" (or parallel project) since I've voiced my opinions about that a few times. I won't go there again here. But I just had a thought about how we can use the images we receive that are awkward or not really suitable for what we all (myself included) see as the objective. A collage or photomosaic (the two ideas I'm least in favor of) could be used as the background to place the cut-outs on. Doing that presents a whole new set of issues, I know.......things like making sure no one's avatar image gets covered by the full avatar's cut out and the background texture would be constantly changing as the project grows. Geeze, this idea can get really really complicated. Just tossing ideas as I think of them right now because I tend to have too many to remember for meetings and stuff. I need to take notes.........LOL The idea on the surface seems phenomenal, but I do think it would be a nightmare to implement, the one project over the other. As to having two projects, for the sake of simplicity and focus, there is only one project, and that is the giant group photo. However, since not all photos will be able to be used for that photo, all photos received will be put to use in the secondary project, the photomosaic. In that sense, the Avatar Photo Project is an attempt to get as many avatar photos into one group shot. Images that cannot be used to that end will be moved into the photomosaic, where any and all photos will be, by design, useable, within rating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dresden Ceriano Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Let's talk about simplicity: We all agree that making it as simple and easy as possible for people to take and submit photos is a priority. It seems as though, for some of us, that means giving people various options of how to do that... as if not doing so will somehow make it more difficult for people to participate. This is something with which I do not agree. I believe we have to set forth very specific, well written, easy to understand and easy to follow directions. I believe that too many options will only lead to confusion and will make things more difficult for both the submitters and the editors. I also believe that we must make it clear that photos not submitted under our guidelines could possibly be excluded from the project. I'm not saying that we can't make an effort to include photos that are not perfect, but the firmer we are in our directions, the less people will be sending in any old photo. ___________________________________ As for the way in which we collect the photos, I believe, for simplicity's sake, there should be only two collection methods: 1. Direct upload to Dilbert's server through a web page. (If Dilbert can set up a safe way to do that without requiring people to sign up for anything.) 2. Email to a main project account either through people's personal email or through the viewer. (It's my understanding that Dilbert can set us up with an unlimited storage space email account through his server... so that shouldn't be an issue.) We simply cannot collect photos inworld, for reasons Peggy has already stated in one of her group notices. Any other way and we'll end up having to transfer photos from one place to another, probably more than once, which could become a huge ordeal... not to mention the options cause confusion thing. ___________________________________ In a perfect world, I'd rather we be undertaking only one project. By doing two, not only must we provide directions for both projects' submission requirements, but we would then have to separate each and every photo into the appropriate project's storage area... which, I guarantee you, will be a logistical nightmare. Not only that, and more importantly, I'm afraid that asking people to submit photos for both projects would end up in having them choose between the two... thus stealing focus from one for the other, which would work both ways. I say this with the understanding that the requirements for photos submitted to each project are quite different and the photos could not be considered interchangeable... correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the only logical conclusion to which I can come. ___________________________________ I'm sure there was more I wanted to say, but I can't think of anything else right now and this post is long enough as it is. ...Dres Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dresden Ceriano Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Charolotte Caxton wrote: Peggy Paperdoll wrote: I'm sure you know my concerns about a "secondary" (or parallel project) since I've voiced my opinions about that a few times. I won't go there again here. But I just had a thought about how we can use the images we receive that are awkward or not really suitable for what we all (myself included) see as the objective. A collage or photomosaic (the two ideas I'm least in favor of) could be used as the background to place the cut-outs on. Doing that presents a whole new set of issues, I know.......things like making sure no one's avatar image gets covered by the full avatar's cut out and the background texture would be constantly changing as the project grows. Geeze, this idea can get really really complicated. Just tossing ideas as I think of them right now because I tend to have too many to remember for meetings and stuff. I need to take notes.........LOL The idea on the surface seems phenomenal, but I do think it would be a nightmare to implement, the one project over the other. As to having two projects, for the sake of simplicity and focus, there is only one project, and that is the giant group photo. However, since not all photos will be able to be used for that photo, all photos received will be put to use in the secondary project, the photomosaic. In that sense, the Avatar Photo Project is an attempt to get as many avatar photos into one group shot. Images that cannot be used to that end will be moved into the photomosaic, where any and all photos will be, by design, useable, within rating. I was under the impression that we wanted photos with backgrounds for the photomosaic... my how things change. ...Dres ETA: @Peggy: I actually really like that idea, but I'm concerned that the background would end up being too busy on which to adequately display the main avatar photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irene Muni Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Dresden Ceriano wrote: ... ... ... As for the way in which we collect the photos, I believe, for simplicity's sake, there should be only two collection methods: 1. Direct upload to Dilbert's server through a web page. (If Dilbert can set up a safe way to do that without requiring people to sign up for anything.) 2. Email to a main project account either through people's personal email or through the viewer. (It's my understanding that Dilbert can set us up with an unlimited storage space email account through his server... so that shouldn't be an issue.) We simply cannot collect photos inworld, for reasons Peggy has already stated in one of her group notices. Any other way and we'll end up having to transfer photos from one place to another, probably more than once, which could become a huge ordeal... not to mention the options cause confusion thing. ___________________________________ In a perfect world, I'd rather we be undertaking only one project. By doing two, not only must we provide directions for both projects' submission requirements, but we would then have to separate each and every photo into the appropriate project's storage area... which, I guarantee you, will be a logistical nightmare. Not only that, and more importantly, I'm afraid that asking people to submit photos for both projects would end up in having them choose between the two... thus stealing focus from one for the other, which would work both ways. I say this with the understanding that the requirements for photos submitted to each project are quite different and the photos could not be considered interchangeable... correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the only logical conclusion to which I can come. ... ... ... ... Totally agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Dresden Ceriano wrote: I was under the impression that we wanted photos with backgrounds for the photomosaic... my how things change. ...Dres ETA: @Peggy: I actually really like that idea, but I'm concerned that the background would end up being too busy on which to adequately display the main avatar photos. I agree with there should only be one project. In that sense I believe there is. The project is to get as many avatar photos into one group shot as possible. Now, on the other hand, we will have photos that may not make it into that project for various reasons. The suggestion to use them in the mosaic was made. For that, it wont matter if there is a background or not. My how things change, well, yes, this is a project, not an assignment, there will be many changes, I was not aware of any final decisions being set forth as of yet except for the decision to go with your idea, which I thought you would have liked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Starsider Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 About the photo mosaic... Are we going for one where smaller images form a bigger picture, where people are going to be able to click (or something) to see a bigger, more detailed version of the small picture they clicked on? If so, do we have a solution ready for this? - Luc - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Luc Starsider wrote: About the photo mosaic... Are we going for one where smaller images form a bigger picture, where people are going to be able to click (or something) to see a bigger, more detailed version of the small picture they clicked on? If so, do we have a solution ready for this? - Luc - Good question, and another reason I vote for only one project. I believe we should focus all our concerns and energies on the main project, the project. That being said, we do not want to simply discard the images that for whatever reason we cannot use, thus the idea to use them for a secondary project. So, yes, ideally we would love to have a large photomosaic comprised of many smaller pictures that someone could zoom in on to see the individual images. No, we do not have a solution for this and will not be actively pursuing one until our main objective is complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamara Artis Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 This is what happens when you have many people with their own ideas, without the one "boss" person to simply say what can and what can't be done, but rather wanting to get everyone happy. This is also a perfect example of whats going to happen if we give residents choice. This is our project and its perfectly understandable to set some rules. We're still on that way, just need to decide about them. I do hope we will have some kind of a voting or whatever, about all our ideas, and after we decide about something, there will be no more discussion about it. We're all logging in to SL, but its not the same world we see there, what each residents sees, depends of their pc specifications. I'm saying this because I see myself wanting to put together 5 submitted snapshots, each taken at different resolution, different camera position, different light and who knows what else. Take one windlight and change from high to mid/low graphic preferences, and you'll get 2 different shots. Few days ago I had a missunderstanding about one clients photo. It was a photo of their wedding rings. The bride was not happy with his ring, it looked too bright on my photo, and it was black on her screen. She wanted it black. But I couln't know that she has all lights (basic shaders, local lighs...) turned off. She thought I changed his ring, which was custom made, but I only took a snapshot of what I saw on my screen. In some way this situation is going to repeat in our project too, we'll have many residents saying their photo doesnt look like the others who are placed next to it or like it looks on their screen. Actually we already had an example, Irene did sent me her snapshot but then changed her mind and wanted to go out. It was probably my mistake, cause I called it logo, and its not a logo in some general meaning, but I did explain I'll make it to look like an example of our future project. Which is about people, not some signs. Now imagine xy residents that want to go out cause their idea was kinda different, but the final product is allready done, rezzed on some land... I said it at the beginning, if you give people freedom you get back chaos. But I also said I'm fine with whatever the rest of the group agrees. For now the group is only expressing different ideas. Only thing we need to agree on, is that every collector takes same snapshots. The rest is up to the submitters and how much will they follow our instructions. Speaking about instructions, yesterday I got 2 snapshots for our logo. Sent inworld, no copy no mod permissions. So for now we can count that on 12 people we get one chaotic lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charolotte Caxton Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Tamara Artis wrote: So for now we can count that on 12 people we get one chaotic lol Hahaha, let me guess, their name was Judas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamara Artis Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 hahahahahahaha I love how sometimes words and people sort themselves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Starsider Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Thank you Charo. I was wondering if I had missed some info about this. Even if this will the secondary project, thus with less focus and of lower priority than the primary one, we need to decide if this is going to be the second project before we start editing. If we change our minds down the road, we might end up having to do a lot of editing of pictures twice. Perhaps we need to come up with the technical solution sooner rather than later... - Luc - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dresden Ceriano Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Well since Knowl saddled me with the responsibility of making the final decisions on submissions and editing, when the time comes I will... until then, I need everyone's feedback to help me decide on the best practices for everyone concerned. I understand that what one person sees in SL is not what another does, that's why I tried to set forth some basic requirements in the last group notice I sent. That along with my photo booth, I believe, will give us a bit of the type of consistency we're looking for. I've tried it out with different graphics levels and it seemed to remain consistent enough through each. I'd like to have a few people try those settings with my photo booth and give me some feedback on how well they think it will work... then we can go from there. This is a process... eventually, everything will be set in place. Tamara Artis wrote: Speaking about instructions, yesterday I got 2 snapshots for our logo. Sent inworld, no copy no mod permissions. So for now we can count that on 12 people we get one chaotic lol This is another example of why we can't collect pics inworld. Btw, about my photo booth... adding another measurement prim is not a problem at all and, in fact, makes perfect sense, as it gives people an even better idea of where to stand (between the two). ...Dres Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dresden Ceriano Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Charolotte Caxton wrote: My how things change, well, yes, this is a project, not an assignment, there will be many changes, I was not aware of any final decisions being set forth as of yet except for the decision to go with your idea, which I thought you would have liked. It was actually Tamara's idea, I just took it and ran with it. ...Dres Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy Paperdoll Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 "... As to having two projects, for the sake of simplicity and focus, there is only one project, and that is the giant group photo. However, since not all photos will be able to be used for that photo, all photos received will be put to use in the secondary project, the photomosaic. ..." -------------------------------------------------------- I understand exactly what you are saying Charollote. But I have a little bit of a problem with that "secondary" photomosaic display. We have already decided our primary project display preference (actually the goal of the project) is the avatars cut from the background of the image submitted and placed on another uniform background so that the resulting image would appear that all the avatars were at the same place in a group posing for the camera. That's the idea we are going to promote to the residents and request their participation. Now with the secondary display method being discussed (and, in my understanding, decided on) as a catch all for all the images that don't lend themselves to our vision of the end product. In some (if not many) cases anyone submitting an image is expecting to be included in the primary display but if their picture won't work (according to our standards) it's going over to the secondary display. I just don't see that as a good idea. It's going to hurt some feelings or disappoint someone........I don't think we want to go there (at least I don't). One project and only one. We can attempt to make it as easy as possible for the people without familarity with graphics, SL photo taking and submitting the highest quality image that can be reasonably submitted. Offering help or assistance when we can for those who request it. Keep it as simple as we can, keeping the standards as high as we can with the understanding that there's only so much quality in textures possible in SL (that's just a fact of SL life with the platform and OpenGL limitations about powers of 2). But we have to be flexible with what the residents can or do submit and respect their expectations for their contribution (the images we are requesting). That's my problem with the whole two projects or, as you say, one project with two options (at least that's what I hear). We are trying to do too much at one time. And I believe that is very likely to reduce residents desires to contribute their images for our project(s). We can try but I'm not hopeful that it will work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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