Ciaran Laval

Nowhere have I claimed everyone is using v3 or Mesh enabled viewers, you're going off on a tangent there, i said the 2% was an absurdly low estimate.

Medhue Simoni wrote: Ultimately, my message is that any1 can learn to make mesh. I did, you can. I'm still learning. It's endless. The longer you wait, the longer it will take. At it's core tho, making a mesh is not much different than making that same object in SL with prims. It is really that easy, just 1 step up. Well, maybe a few steps, lol. Quite a few steps indeed, I'm playing with making basic prim shapes such as walls, the advantage I see is that I can link 10 prims and they have a land impact of five, half the impact native prims would have for exactly the same look. The downside at the moment is texturing inworld, I've learnt after a tip off on another forum how to upload a mesh that will have faces the same as a native prim that can be textured inworld individually, I haven't figured out how to scale them so that the textures when applied use the same metrics though, although I'm sure the answer will be found eventually. Providing end users with UV Maps is good if you're selling them as a building tool but not good for consumers who just want to click and change the texture inworld. However you're right about use cases and why more is better.

This issue has came up a few times, there have even been cases where an item is a category that makes perfect sense but there's another category that Linden Lab consider more suitable, the person who has had their item delisted is confused as not only is the category suitable, they find other similar items in the category they have been delisted from. Dakota sometimes posts the correct category here, it should be an easier process to find out why you're in the wrong category, those who are abusing the system know why they've been delisted, those who think they've been abiding by the rules, don't know. One thing to look out for is listing your item in a top level category, use the sub-categories.

Toysoldier Thor wrote: Im just using an arbitrary estimate but you tell me what you think or any facts you have on how many LL V3 viewers have been installed on the main grid. Most users are now entrenched Phoenix loyalist and are waiting for Firestorm to come out of beta with mesh. As such, you tell me the actual adoption to date of V3. I am in SL every night and I sure as heck am not seeing an avatars walking around with V3 over their heads. Its hard enough to see any more than about 30 40% of V2 users. I have no idea how many people are using mesh enabled viewers but 2% is absurdly low when we're talking about the official Linden Lab viewer. However you Antimeshies might like to think it's 2% Toysoldier Thor wrote: Regardless... the vast majority of SL Population does not and will not for then next couple months have a MESH capable viewer.... as much as all you Mesh Evangelists would wish otherwise. I suspect that anyone that is massively promoting and pumping and blogging about how Mesh is here and its awesome and everyone has it.... they are only doing it to try to help LL speed up the adoption rate. Sorry - but it will not be mainstream until 2012. Here you're just getting silly, people promoting, pumping and blogging about mesh are inevitably going to have to point out the issues with mesh viewers and that some people won't see mesh rendering properly, mesh will live or die because it becomes attractive to users, not because someone is blogging, promoting and pumping it.

Josh Susanto wrote: Lindens don't like sculpts just like they won't like mesh when they find the Next Big Thing. But users want what they want. So far no one is producing mesh versions of my products and they probably should not because of the implicit ideal size of the item and the comparative PE cost at such a size. PE is dead, Land Impact is the new measure and it is on the beta gird now, it will be on the main grid soon enough. Yes you're right, users want what they want. Josh Susanto wrote: Competing mesh products will give people more options, but not consistently better options, and the shift to viability for mesh viewing for most users stands to be a sufficiently gradual process that I can expand into mesh as the demand for similar products in mesh becomes more apparent. I'm pretty sure that people don't buy my products because they are sculpt versus some other kind of prim. I'm pretty sure that they buy them because they are the item they want. With a lot of what I produce, a mesh version just isn't going to be what people want if they get a chance to compare the two options, and if they want the stuff now, there's no reason for them to stop wanting it later just because it's not mesh. The same with sculpts and prims, horses for courses, when sculpts were released there were a lot that simply weren't a better option, this isn't new. There are still a lot of sculpts that aren't a better option, it's all about options. Josh Susanto wrote: In the meantime, the reason for people to get enthusiastic about working with mesh is because it's intellectually and artistically rewarding; not because it's a guaranteed good investment. Mesh makes the previously impossible possible, and I support research into its application on that basis. But I'm not thrilled about the continued slinging of snake oil now that everyone should be able to examine the matter personally and decide what they must almost inevitably decide; not everything should be mesh. Just because people are investing time in Mesh, it doesn't mean they think everything should be mesh, I've made the point that there's no need to change everything mesh elsewhere on these forums.

hibit Spad wrote: Try creating your own physics shape. Its the same principle as making your own LOD. Lots of people complaining about not being able to walk into a room/house/whatever. The auto generater is not the greatest thing in the world for LOD or physics so you might just be better off planning to make your own no matter what the project is. Not sure what you mean, the physics shape is based on my Blender file, I'm not using auto generate but if I make a cube and delete the front face, i can only walk inside if I turn it into a prim under features, whilst it's a convex hull I can't walk inside it.

Where are you getting this 2% figure from? There are a lot more than 2% of people using Mesh enabled viewers. Linden Lab do not seem to like sculpts, you need to read very very carefully what is being said.

Interesting, I wanted double sided textures, so in Blender I duplicated my objects and then flipped the direction of the faces on the duplicated version, this way I get textures inside and out. Sounds like you're onto the cause of the issue.

Ian Undercroft wrote: Making due and proper allowance for those who don't have English as their first language, you're kidding yourself if you're suggesting that a person's grammar and spelling doesn't, as a general rule, also say a lot about their intelliegence. My history teacher at school could not spell, his teaching of history was inspiring.

I used the same LOD for all four settings, the new one on the beta grid lets you use the "one above" in the menus, physics shape I loaded from file using the same file I uploaded. I'll have a play on the beta grid over the weekend and look at the developer menu info, thanks for that tip.

How many times have you abandoned? There used to be a daily limit, I think it was five a day before it wouldn't let you get another Linden home in any given day.

Phone the card provider and ask them, they should have a log of your attempted purchase.

I was playing around on the beta grid last night and uploaded a couple of basic meshes, basically cubes but one has the front cut out so you can walk inside it. So all was well when I uploaded them, did the physics stuff, bounced off all sides of the mesh as I'd expect as they are walls, with the exception of the one side that has the front missing, I couldn't walk inside whilst it was set as convex hull, so I changed it to prim. All seemed well, I could walk inside, the problem was that I could walk out of one side of it too, one side had became phantom, it was the same with the full cube when I changed it from convex hull to prim, I could walk in and out of two sides of it but the other two sides acted as I expected, I couldn't walk through those walls. Any ideas?

Madeliefste Oh wrote: Still mesh can be interesting for lower primcount, not in all cases but in some. The 'hidden advantage' with mesh is linking. When you have one mesh rock it will always have a minimum primcount of 1. But when you link 10 low poly mesh rocks that all have a primcount of 1, the total prim count of these ten meshes becomes 6. When you link 20 mesh rocks the primcount becomes 11. So as single object mesh can never win on prim count compared to sculpts of prims, but as soon as you start to link meshes you surely can save on prim count. Yes, I was messing around on the beta grid yesterday and had three mesh objects that had a land impact of 6 (land impact is the new prim equivalency), when I joined them together it was land impact 4. For those who want to try out the new system on the beta grid, download the mesh project viewer and login to the beta grid, you may need to take the Mesh quiz again to upload mesh to the beta grid, I did anyway. http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Alternate_Viewers

Void Singer wrote: it is just a faq... Behave!

Even Demon DJ's experience some lag, a lot of stuff needs to get cached when you first arrive, it gets better as you go along or you could try a TPV like firestorm, that supports new features such as Mesh.

People will learn how to optimise mesh, especially with buildings, you'll see those counts come right down as people get their heads around it. Sculpts could be in trouble depending upon how the new land impact settings are rolled out. Prims aren't going away and nor should they, they've been enhanced with the new larger prims.

Darrius Gothly wrote: Ahhh yes. Thank you for jogging my memory. Yes, word stemming caused a massive fuuuu ... ummm .. problem with Classifieds. But that should have been addressed by changing how Classifieds were indexed and searched. The solution of shortening the available space was one of those "left-handed" soltuions that may have sorta kinda worked, but didn't really fix the problem. (And let me add ... I am left-handed, so I'm perfectly allowed to use that term. Please refrain from email bombing me about being anti-lefty. TYVM) Indeed, I'd rather they worked it like the marketplace whereby you had a keywords part and then a non indexed for search purposes description where people could be more creative with their adverts.

Darrius Gothly wrote: Word stemming, in and of itself, was not the cause of reduced Classified Ad space. Whatever reason was given (and I frankly don't remember the exact official cause), word stemming is simply the act of recognizing words with identical "stems" as the same word. Thus "prefab" and "prefabs" look the same to the keyword indexer and search retrieval processes. Where it gets complicated is when you have words with identical stems but radically different meanings. Sea did do a lot of unstemming but she also pointed out at a user group meeting that stemming had led to classifieds holding the top spots for loads of different searches and you could end up with three words per word due to how it was implemented, it wasn't just stemming in terms of the root word, they made different words mean the same thing, which meant people weren't getting found when they tried to use different words, so for example houses and prefabs might have been considered the same thing, this buried plenty of classifieds.

Darrius Gothly wrote: This is a side-effect of switching from a mature search system (like the GSA) to a D-I-Y Search Engine (like Lucene). The GSA included word-stemming in its keyword indexing algorithms. You make this sound as if GSA was efficient, it wasn't, and you make it sound as if keyword stemming worked well, it didn't, indeed we ended up with the amount of characters we could use in classifieds being reduced because of keyword stemming.

You may still have land tier donated to your group under land contributions. If the land was only sold today, you should receive the money tomorrow.

Madeliefste Oh wrote: I have experimented a lot with satelite stores in the past for my fashion brand. I have had shops near clubs, in clubs, in places with a fixed landing point and where avis have to walk along the stores before they reach the club, in places that had several spread landingpoints, in place where you could set a landingpoint in your own shop. I have paid rent prices from 1 linden per prim to 20 linden per prim per week. I have been in places that where themed and not themed. There was a search update quite a few months ago that ruined the idea of having lots of landing points and different parcels, I watched this happen, it was a very abrupt decline in business and the only way to start making some recovery was to merge the parcels, which made them less useful as they now had to have more generic descriptions and also made them less competitive, but the old style of being able to be found on a smallish parcel was pretty dramatically damaged with that update.

There's more to a satellite store than sales, it's a big advert too, tracking whether that advertising is working is part of deciding whether it's worthwhile or not.

Premium sandboxes are a great idea and it's good to see them introduced, I'm not so sure about the gifts but it's good promotion for the creator involved. I'd like to see more options with regard to premium membership, some people don't want the free land tier, so maybe offer an option to take a higher stipend or no stipend and a higher free land tier allowance for those who want it, though the latter has a cost implication for LL. Allowing people to donate their free tier to private estates would be a good idea too, but again there's a cost implication, however certainly for roleplaying sims or community sims, that could well encourage more people to go premium,

Storyof Oh wrote: I must of blinked and missed the email inviting furniture makers to apply to offer products.. . A bit more openess in the process would be nice, that's for sure. There will be more gifts according to the blog, so it would be nice if creators knew how to get onboard.