Rufferta

I set up a group "River Run Realty and Restoration" to own real estate so that I could have a little more land for the tier rate that I could afford. I've been buying small parcels, fixing them up, then re-selling them. Not making a profit (actually, just losing money more slowly) but getting building practice. I found a donut-shaped block of multiple small parcels in Labro, near 224.238, that I have been buying, one by one, and joining together. When I buy them I set them to the group, allow deed to group, and "owner makes contribution with deed". When I join the parcels; however, they lose the "allow deed to group" and "owner makes contribution with deed" tags. When I try to join the undeeded parcels with the "deeded to group" parcels I get the message "Cannot join property because it belongs to two different owners." I haven't been able to change the tags to make them match. One piece made of joined patches is 1280 and the other is 1344. (Some of original parcels were as small as 16 meters. Don't know why they were cut so small before being abandoned.) I tried selling the smaller parcel to myself to see if I could change the tags that way, but I get the message that if I buy the land I will have to pay the next higher tier - the difference is more than the land is worth! The "sell to group" option is greyed out. (I actually now have 860m less than I did last week at same tier rate). Submitted this as a bug report, but Alex Linden says this is not a bug, ask for help here. I hope someone will be able to suggest a solution. If not, I have two very peculiarly-shaped plots of land for sale. Rufferta (the perennial newb) Added 10-24-12 Made sure I was wearing group tag. I was able to subdivide a small piece of "deeded to group" land, but it lost the tag when I did so. I notice a discrepancy in the land account tab/group account tab/and info on the land itself as to ownership. I'm wondering if I misunderstood what one of the Lindens wrote in the Knowledge Base "Group-owned land is held collectively by a group, not by any one group member. For the group to own land, its members must submit land contributions, donations that members make from their own personal land tier allowance. The group can own a total amount of land whose area equals 110% or less of the sum of all group contributions. " and that perhaps I can only contribute part of my total land holdings to the group? I'm pretty small potatoes as far as land barons go - with only 16,880 square meters perhaps I am a "land baronita"? Meanwhile, I will just muddle along. 10-24-12 Thank you, Chaos Mohr, for your help. I was finally able to resolve the problem by splitting the parcels and re-selling them to the group. The sticking point seemed to be whether or not the box "owner makes contribution with deed" was checked. The system saw these as belonging to a separate owner and would not let me join parcels with this checked to the parcels that did not have this box checked and it would not let me change them until I had split the land and re-sold it to the group. Once I bought the land I was able to change the boxes to match, and rejoin all the piddly parcels. Whew!

Ry0ta Exonar wrote: Do you have a permanent place or are you a wanderer? - I have a permanent place. Did you get a home as soon as you started or did you wait? - I got a home almost as soon as I signed in. Skybox or ground? Own or rent? Mainland or island? Roommates? - I rent a small parcel in Caledon Stormhold. I also have other small parcels on the Mainland I am using to practice building. What is your prim allotment to the parts of your home? - With the Julia Hathor house, landscaping,, three cats, furniture and art collection I am using 333 of a prim allowance of 468 on the 1024 parcel. Don't know the percentages. What do you do in your house? - Play with the cats, move the furniture and art around, change clothes, sit and meditate while looking at the water. Do you recommend homeowning? - Yes. Does it make you stay in SL? - Not necessarily, but I think if I were to down-tier I would save at least a small 512 parcel with a low-prim house just so I would have a home. Perhaps women are more "home" oriented than men?

Dear PitbullTheDog: The answer is "It depends" - It depends on the supply of similar parcels; and It depends on the demand for this type of parcel. I think the old saw is "You can charge what the market will bear.." If you look at land sales, for example, you can see that prices vary tremendously. There is plenty of land available at the "Abandoned land" price and lower, yet people will continue to pay more than that if they want a particular parcel. I would suggest offering a few parcels of land for rent and seeing what happens. Good luck!

Parcel has been sold. If I have any new parcels available, I will post them here.

Tamara Artis wrote: ...... If you preserve the right not to care of your avatar's look and walk around like a noob then pls continue be careless when someone comments on that look. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- But, I take umbrage. Sometimes I feel like a noob, sometimes I don't. Sometimes I go out all prim-d, but other times when I am going to an event where the organizer has asked everyone to "please remove excess scripts, prims, etc...." I will slip on one of the standard avatars or a "low lag" outfit I put together based on the numbers given by the "Show draw weight for avatars" in the Performance tools in the Advanced menu. While I have heard many arguments that "high draw weight" is only a problem to the person carrying the weight, I feel it is only polite to try to comply when asked. Performance tools says the draw weight for this outfit is 1000; however, if I have time I add a non-noob walk. Please do not judge an avatar by its cover. Sincerely, Rufferta Resident The Eternal Noob

I sort of enjoy watching the vehicles go by. I've never riden one, though, but I have riden other vehicles (trains, pods, horse carts, etc....) in all parts of Second Life. Perhaps the scripting could be enhanced so that they are rezzed only when needed, and so they can follow the road more smoothly? (Saw one go by on its nose the other day). Added at 7:14pm Linden time: Just took a long ride in one of the convertibles. While the ride wasn't terribly smooth, we never ran off the road or over anyone's property that I could see. Went through several sims and it seemed to me that there are still a lot of structures being maintained by the side of the road, in spite of what some people are posting. I enjoyed the ride, and I for one would vote to keep the vehicles around. Thanks!

Knowl Paine wrote: I'm guilty, it was me. I don't want a wrecked angle, I wanted a square. The last person to touch the land (a linden), thought it would be a good idea to revert 22,000 sqm on a hill side, rendering most of the surrounding land unusable. The only way to make any sort of flat area, is to purchase the surrounding land, edit terrain, and then abandon it. When editing terrain, it is sometimes necessary to subdivide some land sections, because of the way the land shears differently at each adjacent property line. No sane person will buy that 22,000 sqm, I have no idea what the Linden plan is, somebody (LL) needs to chop that into useable peices, and bit the bullet on the fragmented plots. I know what some of you are thinking; SL has plenty of insane people. I agree, but do they also have cash? Land preservation and reunification, is a noble, but misguided effort. Monies, time and effort, would be better rewarded in a private region, with an enforceable covenant, providing surety in investment. Knowl Paine, the land that was dissected was flat; however, your explanation of why you split up land in order to do better terraforming makes perfect sense, and I will try to remember it next time I'm trying to bulldoze property on a slope. As for ..."SL has plenty of insane people. I agree, but do they also have cash?" I have to answer that 'yes' based on some of the builds I've seen. (Though some might think my builds the work of someone 'differently normal'.) As for "Monies, time and effort, would be better rewarded in a private region, with an enforceable covenant, providing surety in investment." I partly disagree. I rent a small parcel in Caledon, but it is far too civilized there for me to mess around and experiment. While I try to respect my neighbors on Mainland, I don't feel so bad about leaving the cement mixer out overnight.... Thank you all for showing me that there may be many reasons for subdividing land into odd bits.

Property has been sold. IM me if you want a free copy of the temple. (Either the one originally shown or the revised one with straight columns.)

And don't forget back in the good old days a 512 plot,even one sub par location cost you 17000L. Not too long ago I saw a woman trying to sell her 512 for almost 200k. Now that was really greedy because she knew the resident yacht club had an eye on that parcel to finally have the whole sim. So one could say it's like blackmailing. End of story was she finally had to abandon the land and it went onthe market for 512L

The first 'miracle' was very simple - seeing virtual swans swimming in virtual water. Later when I went to the place in SL that sells the swans, I was again excited by seeing all the different creatures roaming around. I was also amused and gratified by the way the seller has a drop box where you can place your swans to be updated (it works!). There are so many things I love about second life. These days, when I sometimes feel that I'm running around a giant hamster wheel in RL, I come here to get a bit of peace and to work at building my own landscape (with swans), and to explore a little more. There are so many wonderful creative, talented and generous people in SL. Thank you for reminding me.

VonGklugelstein Alter wrote: I just saw that a merchant who is selling similar product as me has been getting like 20 reviews a day on a few items. After some research it turns out the merchant is paying for these reviews and therefore also paying people to buy their product in effect increasing the relevancy of their product. What is the story? Has The marketplace become this sleazy that anything goes? While I do use the Marketplace, I prefer stores (like yours) that maintain a physical presence in Second Life and that have a good track record. The Marketplace offers speed and convenience, but is not policed very well. One example: I picked up a grandfather clock at a freebie center, and I happened to be visiting the Marketplace a little while later and found at least nine places offering that same clock (same texture, same number of prims) for from 5L to 50L before I stopped looking. I don't think there are ways to do reviews of items purchased inworld, but if there were, I'm sure someone would be trying to game the system. Perhaps it wouldn't hurt to put a small note on your Marketplace items asking purchasers to make reviews?

Almadi Masala wrote: As owner of almost half a mainland sim, I agree completely that landowners should have full control over who can enter their land. I'm just pointing out that it is very aggravating for a visitor to be suddenly yelled at and ejected by a security orb without even having been told that certain areas are off limits. If you are inviting people to visit your sim and are hoping that they will enjoy themselves there, you might want to take that into account. Putting up a nice border may cost some prims, but if your goal is to provide your visitors with a positive experience, maybe it's worth it. I agree with you. Inviting someone to visit the sim without warning them that areas are off-limits does not create a good atmosphere. Have you tried IM'ing the sim owner? I know some sims don't allow ban lines or security orbs at all. On the mainland I have been noticing what seems to be a correlation between abandoned land and ban lines. Visiting what might otherwise be desirable plots of abandoned land I often find ban lines immediately adjacent. Don't know what came first, though....the ban lines or the abandoned property. In one case I recently re-visited a sim where a property owner with a trigger-happy orb once ejected me in micro-seconds when I grazed the side of her ban lines. She's still there, but another large parcel on one side of her has recently been abandoned, leaving her almost surrounded by empty land. Do you think ban lines and security orbs lower the value of surrounding property and causing neighbors to leave, or are they being put up because the adjacent abandoned property may be the target of griefers or squatters?

Jeanne said: yeah .. i do expect ppl to act rationally .. for the most part .. i think that irrational behavior stems from oppression .. oppressed ppl behave irrationally outuv resentment or as a way of getting back @ the oppressor .. in a community that isnt oppressive i dont expect much irrationality .. some perhaps .. due to mental or emotional illness .. but not nearly as much as is seen as is the difference between the group making decisions by consensus or by majority vote & an autocrat doing so is that the group exercises compassion towards all .. dissenters included .. the autocrat or autocratic corporation has no compassion .. only profit matters not people .. when the group behaves compassionately dissenters & their opinions are accomodated as much as they possibly can be .. compromise may be reached that all can agree on & if not .. @ least the dissenters got the chance to have their opinions heard & taken into consideration .. LL currently neither listens to SL residents or takes anything into consideration besides maximizing profits .. corporatism is so pathological that any attempt to make decisions according to resident consensus is an improvement Jeanne ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jeanne, we have to remember that SL would not survive without financial contributions - either through land sales, tier, premium memberships, or income from the Marketplace. If I remember my SL history, it started out to be free for all, but due to "the tragedy of the commons" the Lab started charging a "prim tax" on users based on how many prims a person created. It costs a lot to run servers and pay staff. These costs eventually led to the land/tier system and the marketplace as a means of revenue. I am glad to pay for SL use, because I appreciate all the wonderful things and people that are here. My alt pays nothing, though, and that is fine, too. I am one of those weird people who doesn't mind paying taxes, if it means that my poorer neighbors will get help without my having to personally go over and play "lady of the manor" by giving them a chicken once in a while. I have gotten good support from Linden Labs in the past for different issues, but I can imagine that they get a bit tired hearing all the complaints about minor stuff. True, there are a lot of things that could be better, but then, we the residents can do our parts, too: befriend a newbie, make beautiful things, pay our way if we can afford it. I am less hopeful about SL ever being run by a consensus of residents. Humans are not rational, more "Man is a rationalizing creature." (Robert A. Heinlein). I can imagine it getting all political. Consider all the different groups in SL, each with its own agenda, for example, those who want "sex clubs" vs. those who want "pure meditation temples". There are some group-run areas in SL, but they are not for everyone. Sincerely, Rufferta Resident

I tend to be pretty much a hermit, but if I was looking for friends I would try to find out where like-minded people hang out. I would also try out different avatars to see which ones get a friendly response from those people. I find that I get different reactions from people depending on whether I am being an animal, an African-American girl, an Imelda Marcos, a dwarf, a "hot chick", or an avi that resembles the RL me. When approached by other avatars I am averse to getting in conversation with anyone who has "lust" or similar items in their name, or who is wearing a lot of laggy items (bling and wings) in a public place. I hope you find your place.

Hugsy Penguin wrote: If you're going to tier down by keeping some land and getting rid of the rest, you'd want to sell what you're getting rid of. If you end up having to abandon it instead, I suppose there's various way you could go about that. You could abandon it as all one piece. You could split it into as-useful-as-you-can-get parcels and abandon each. You could split it into as-least-useful-as-you-can-get parcels and abandon each. Or, you could split it all up in 16s and abandon each. What you're describing seems like a blend of the least-useful option and the all-16s option. This is curious because the least-useful option seems like it could work to keep people away but the all-16s option seems to invite people to buy the micro parcels (perhaps just one and then something ugly gets put there). I could see someone cutting everything up into 16s before abandoning thinking they're being the “nice guy”. The thought is this: with everything cut into 16s, the next buyer can buy exactly which bits of the abandoned land that they want right now. They won't have to ask LL to recut the land (and possibly be denied). This is assuming the buyer(s) will want to use the land in a community conscience way so it's probably a bad idea. I'm not sure what the purpose of the sub-divider was, although I have to admire the intricacy of the way he or she split the property. It is almost as if they were trying to split it into bits that could not be merged into useful portions unless you bought the whole thing. If I'm doing my math correctly the land could have been split into nine 512 parcels, or six 512 parcels surrounded by a small border of abandoned land. I am inclined to believe that the person who occupies the center of the abandoned land is the person who did the subdivide because 1. He or she acquired the central parcel a long time before the outer land was split, and 2. His or her build exactly fits the irregular 512 in the portion. I'm still stumbling around in Second Life, but I realize from some of the previous posts that this kind of thing is a minor problem compared to others and I should worry about more serious things. We are living in interesting times.

Richie Kanto wrote: Yes... and let's add there should be a law against putting trash on a parcel next to someone's nice build (and don't tell me about one man's trash is another's treasure... we've all seen how people ruin land value just so someone will buy them off the parcel). There should be a law against LL creating more and more land, which just ruins the value of land already existing and sitting empty on the grid. There should be a law against LL taking weeks or even months to respond to tickets asking that objects overhanging your land are removed when the other land owner refuses to even respond to nice requests to do so (or is no longer around in SL). There should be a law against grieving SIMs just to make them lag and crash... then endlessly being able to change to different alts when finally after days have passed of having "fun" at everyone's expense you finally get your account suspended. There should be a law that says LL should follow their own rules, and not decide all of a sudden to make up a rule that allows them to sell to someone else a Linden road (protected land) that used to go to your property until they sold it to a private individual so he could shut it down and have it end on his/her parcel. And these are just minor annoyances... how about a law against LL destroying the marketplace with misguided and counter productive "fixes", or a law against charging for "tier" at a rate many times that of other grids, or a law against charging different people different prices, then keeping it a secret from everyone and denying you have a preferential "atlas program" in existence at all? and sure... there might actually be laws or TOS rules against some of this... guess there should be a law that says laws should be enforced and not arbitrary. Good luck with that one. I agree. I live in the hope that things will be better in the future.

SinfulPrince wrote: ... For me, had I done what you're describing, it would have been to create SPACE between parcel "a" and parcel "b". For my opinion, I feel like LL should have orchestrated it that way themselves. Just my .02 I agree that having a bit of space between you and your neighbors makes a nicer environment. I think that is why a lot of people prefer land bordered by 'protected' maintenance land, roads, or water. The first piece of property I bought was a 1024 rectangle that was protected on three sides. I always regret that I traded it to a realtor, because she promptly split it into two skinny 512 parcels - I'm assuming to maximize profits. I think that is why I am so sensitive to 'micro-splits'. ("This cake serves 24 people, but you have to cut it with a lazer.") What is a good distance between properties? Road width? River width? What other ways are there to avoid feeling claustrophobic on a small plot of land? I know people build skyboxes, or put 'landscape murals' around their property, but I guess I'm old-fashioned - I like to build on the ground with a view of what is actually around me, for better or worse. I'm thinking that when I get all the 16-meter bits together, I can sell it as a small racetrack.... "Restore the Mainland. Buy my property."

Are some property owners subdividing the land around them into unusable parcels and then abandoning them to reduce tier but discourage new neighbors? Perhaps I have a suspicious mind, but I visited several sims today where there were some older occupied properties surrounded by a lot of smaller parcels that all seemed to have been abandoned on the same day. Not to give anyone ideas. If this is deliberate it is uncouth. This is sorta like the guy who takes the middle of two parking spaces for one car, or the person who sprawls across two seats on a crowded bus. For example, one of these properties was a 512 parcel surrounded by a larger parcel that had been split into 55 smaller pieces that were each on their own pretty much worthless. Surrounding the occupied 512 were four 192's and a 1024 that seemed to have been split into four pieces* separated by the 192's. Surrounding those was a ring of 52 16-meter parcels, and that in turn was surrounded by a 960 "donut"-shaped parcel. I was feeling particularly curmudgeonly today, so I bought as many of the 16-meter parcels as I could afford, rejoined them, and planted mushrooms. When I am rich or have more tier I hope to buy all of the 55 pieces, re-join them, and then subdivide them into usable parcels, for what it is worth. I realize that part of the problem could be that tier is too high, and the way it is calibrated it is tempting to chop off a small piece of land to avoid going into a higher tier bracket. If you look at the abandoned land for sale you will see that a certain amount of it is little bits and pieces that you can't do much with. I don't know if changing the tier system at this late date would help much. *I really can't figure out how someone did that, but when I clicked "about land" the 1024 showed as four separate parcels.

Thank you. I will look for the Mental Mentors. Don't know if I can be a lot of help, but I can try.

I was lucky enough to find the Virtual Abilities Welcome Center right off, and I also went through the learner's path at Caledon Oxbridge. Many absolute strangers have offered valuable help and advice. The Forum has been invaluable. The Caledon Quest taught me about maneuvering my camera, and I've taken many classes at different locations (The people who offer their time as instructors should be sainted), but I'm still learning. I would like to help other new people, but it is awkward to know how to go about it. If anyone has a good plan I would be glad to get involved.

I love exploring and seeing what people have created: from one prim, to an avatar, to a continent. After five months I am still amazed every time I am here. I also feel a great sadness, sometimes, when I have tried to track down the maker of something I saw while I was travelling, and find that the artist has seemingly left Second Life for good. I have followed slurls that landed me in vacant lots; or gotten the message "that location is no longer there". In a way, though, that makes me have a greater appreciation for what still IS here. You could say that Second Life is like a garden of flowers that bloom and fades. Let us tend our gardens. Or you could say that "Second Life is the Gateway to the Metaverse". But I am not ready to begin packing. I'm waiting until they get "those other places" both as perfect as Second Life, and cheaper.

Just wanted to comment: I don't think we should assume that because something is "as big as a house" that it is going to be causing a sandbox to lag. I've been working on a house for a 512 parcel and I've taken it to a sandbox so that I have room to move around. Even when I tried adding a fourth floor it was less than 40 prims and five scripts. I often see people working on much larger houses. I don't see taking your house with you and rezzing it for a while on a sandbox as a capitol offense....In fact, I think it shows a certain ingenuity.

I don't usually do reviews on any worlds unless an item/experience has been very positive or very negative. I do wish it was easier to add comments to Marketplace items like "Thank you for the great service!" or "This $50 item is a freebie at Yadni's.".... Like many of you, I tend to shop inworld before going to the Marketplace, but I will order things through the Marketplace from merchants I know and trust.

Banlines set up at the very edge of waterway and roadways, which give you a micro-second warning and then eject and freeze you. I ran into one of those the other day when I was gong down a river, and when I complained, the owner called me "uncivilized." (She was correct that I DO have a lot to learn, but I still don't understand, since she had quite a large parcel, why she couldn't have moved her banlines in a few feet). If I had run into that banline during my first days in SL I might well not have come back. As it is, I can understand why some estate owners do not allow them. Just venting. For now I don't have banlines up anywhere. Yes, the occasional newb drops in, but most of them are polite and I try to be courteous, because I know how confusing it is here at first*. If they are not polite, then I can just add them to the ban list, which is very short. Just venting. *still confused, but I'm making mistakes at a much higher level now. Ever had one of those moments when you attach a shutter to a window, and when you try it the house revolves?.........