Is voice now expected as default for SL?

[Love Zhaoying]

I don't even have sound enabled on my PC. Last time I tried, nuthin'! (Optical cable to A/B selector to sound bar..) But I know it works! I guess for a mic, I'd have to try a headset. More things to try and make work!

[EliseAnne85]

16 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

More things to try and make work!

They are difficult to keep clean, too.  The fabric covering of mine disintegrated after I cleaned them a couple of months ago, so I need new ones but I'm in no rush.  I rarely use it because as others have said too much background noise and the group I do hang with is very clever with word play and it's rofl.   But, I do use headphones for music.  

I was a land owner for awhile and my decision was to allow voice.  I had DJ's to do the voice that speaks to the people, and I watched the local chat when I could.  The reason I allowed voice was to give people a choice plus I set up games where I figured people are so concentrated on the game, they'd probably prefer voice.  So, I think having both available is the best option but each land owner has to make that decision themselves.  However, if anyone was hassling people to go on voice in local chat or in IM, they would have been booted off my lawn.  

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

38 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I've never seen a thread with people "whining" it ruins their RP.  

assuming one is not the sex of their avatar if they don't voice,  People have boxed in minds.

But, those calling people liars or whatever who don't voice do need to stop doing that. 

I've been in sl forums for 20 years, there's been lots of those threads. 

The rest is straw man arguments. I did not once call anyone a liar and actually brought up several legitimate reasons aside from morally corrupt catfishing, that someone might not want to reveal their voice. 

I get the feeling this is a touchy subject here but don't hate the player hate the game son. 

 

[Love Zhaoying]

10 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

The fabric covering of mine disintegrated

Same..

10 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

after I cleaned them

..You're supposed to clean them?!

I ended up getting a second headset because mine wouldn't pair with Bluetooth. (This model is both BT and wireless.) Anyway, discovered the other day the new one wouldn't pair either. Google finally found a YT video on how-to..

..is teh dum!

[EliseAnne85]

5 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

I did not once call anyone a liar

I said "those people" not Y-O-U.  It was a person earlier in the thread who has since edited their post to something like "edited due to sensitive dah-lings" or some such nonsense.  That poster flat out said all female avi's that don't voice are men.  

[EliseAnne85]

1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

You're supposed to clean them?!

Yeah!  They have like 120,000 plus bacteria on them.  

I often wonder if people who use VR headsets have ever cleaned their headset even once.  Gross.  

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

3 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I said "those people" not Y-O-U.  It was a person earlier in the thread who has since edited their post to something like "edited due to sensitive dah-lings" or some such nonsense.  That poster flat out said all female avi's that don't voice are men.  

You quoted me so I assumed it was directed at something i said.

[ildiko Evergarden]

I haven't voice chat in SL in a long time. I mostly get on discord and voice chat and that's with very close friends only. No one is "expected" to voice chat in SL nor are they expect to reveal their personal lives to second life residents. What you do on here is your choice. And you have the right to say no. And if people persist after you told them a hard no, just mute them.

Edited March 5, 2023 by ildiko Evergarden

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

8 hours ago, HeathcliffMontague said:

Just a bit curious though. What does voice bring to your SL that a non-SL voice would not? We seem to be speaking (as it were) totally past each other here.

Simply put, conversations on voice tend to flow a little faster/more naturally and it's easier to multi-task while text communication is more useful when attempting to provide detailed instructions or relay precise information.

To be clear, I'm not advocating for the use of either.  I have some friends who prefer voice and some who refuse to use it at all and I have no qualms about choosing to conform to their preferences.  I do however take exception to anyone trying to impose their personal preferences on other people.

As has been pointed out this topic has already been discussed in various threads on these forums many times over, unfortunately they usually devolve into the same sweeping generalisations and pigeonholing with little consideration for the individuality of SLs residents which is a shame since a conversation addressing the lack of accessibility in SL and how things could be improved for those who are excluded from using either method of communication due to a disability would be a lot more productive and far less contentious.

Still, with the recent (and seemingly exponential) advances in the development of artificial intelligence perhaps it won't be long before there are reliable speech-to-text/text-to-speech apps which will remove the barriers that are in place for those who are currently excluded through no choice of their own.

[EliseAnne85]

16 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

reliable speech-to-text/text-to-speech 

Reliable?  Probably not.  We will lose the human nuances and voice-to-text will remain sub par to actual human text interactions forever.  

For example Tinies and Dinkies are small animal characters and the region was going down and someone shouted "Flee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  And then the next person shouted, "Flea!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  

It was brilliant and happened in the moment.  The human aspect will be lost forever other than if one said type out flea instead of flee.  

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

Just now, EliseAnne85 said:

Reliable?  Probably not.  We will lose the human nuances and voice-to-text will remain sub par to actual human text forever.  

For example Tinies and Dinkies are small animal characters and the region was going down and someone shouted "Flee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  And then the next person shouted, "Flea!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  

It was brilliant and happened in the moment.  The human aspect will be lost forever other than if one said type out flea instead of flee.  

Regardless of how reliable AI assisted systems may be or how much nuance may be lost during translation, I suspect those with a disability which prevents them from sharing in joyful little moments like the one you described would welcome a chance to be included.

I keep emphasising words like choosing and choice but I shall make it as plain as I possibly can in case anyone isn't clear on my intention.

For most, this entire topic boils down to personal choice and I strongly believe that, rather than yet another discussion about which form of communication is best, it would be far more beneficial if those who do have a choice were discussing how best to help those who don't!

[Love Zhaoying]

1 hour ago, EliseAnne85 said:

Yeah!  They have like 120,000 plus bacteria on them.  

I often wonder if people who use VR headsets have ever cleaned their headset even once.  Gross.  

They're all my own bacteria!

[EliseAnne85]

22 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

rather than yet another discussion about which form of communication is best, it would be far more beneficial if those who do have a choice were discussing how best to help those who don't!

A lot of nuance will be lost with AI as opposed to human-to-human texting.   

However, my feeling is it should be a choice but read the room also.  Tinies, Dinkies and the humans or other typeS of avi's that may hang out are notoriously funny with word play and it's part of the community itself every day/night.  If one wanted to join in that but had a disability...what is the disability?  First, perhaps the person doesn't know how to type?  They could learn to type.  I did.  I did not learn in a class nor a school.  I taught myself with a book called "Teach Yourself to Type".  As far as other hindrances, it could be English is not their first language plus others.  We have to adapt some too to what suits us best whatever it may be.  

My answer to is voice expected by default was it depends on the group or the people one hangs out with.  It varies across SL.

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Ayashe Ninetails]

9 hours ago, HeathcliffMontague said:

Just a bit curious though. What does voice bring to your SL that a non-SL voice would not? We seem to be speaking (as it were) totally past each other here.

Not a single thing for me. I can't think of a good reason why I'd want to place or receive private one-on-one voice calls with strangers in Second Life, and open/region voice chat is a hot, noisy mess for all kinds of reasons (as you already know). Being someone who plays online games a whole lot, I think it's just a natural instinct for me to turn off voice chat the instant I'm able to. I've heard enough immature toxicity screamed over open mics for one lifetime. If a close friend threatened me with removing all access to chocolate for the rest of my life if I don't hop on voice, it's happening on Discord, where the sound quality is a lot better.

Side note - I'm a bit surprised you found Tarkov to be that annoying, though. I don't play, but I do watch streams on occasion, and it's been fine. I must've been lucky not to hear whatever you were hearing. Other game lobbies, on the other hand - burn those with fire. Twice.

[EliseAnne85]

28 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

They're all my own bacteria!

That doesn't prevent you from bacterial infections.  Bacteria colonize for one thing, plus you lay the headsets down constantly onto what...?  I'm looking at a page now that says clean your headset daily.   I clean my electronica but it's not always easy.  Both of ours, mine and yours, the outer fabric disintegrated upon cleaning I said and you said.  Probably because they were ready to go in the trash.  

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Love Zhaoying]

Voice brought my SL family a little closer, back in the day. The "reality" of who we are, expressed in voice, made it all a little more "real". That being said, I don't want to do voice with just anyone.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Love Zhaoying

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

29 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

what is the disability?

Aside from the obvious reading disabilities such as dyslexia there are those who have difficulty reading due to a visual impairment of some kind, then there are amputees and those who suffer from chronic arthritis, muscular dystrophy and other conditions that can make typing difficult.  I'm sure there are a myriad of other conditions which, while not severe enough to completely rule out using either method of communication, contribute to each individuals personal choice as to which they prefer.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Fluffy Sharkfin

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I said "those people" not Y-O-U.  It was a person earlier in the thread who has since edited their post to something like "edited due to sensitive dah-lings" or some such nonsense.  That poster flat out said all female avi's that don't voice are men.  

That poster is in for a very rude surprise if they ever manage to get me on voice. 😈

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, ildiko Evergarden said:

No one is "expected" to voice chat in SL nor are they expect to reveal their personal lives to second life residents. What you do on here is your choice. And you have the right to say no. And if people persist after you told them a hard no, just mute them.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Silent Mistwalker

[EliseAnne85]

10 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

Aside from the obvious reading disabilities such as dyslexia and dysgraphia there are those who have difficulty reading due to a visual impairment of some kind, then there are amputees and those who suffer from chronic arthritis, muscular dystrophy and other conditions that can make typing difficult.  I'm sure there are a myriad of other conditions which, while not severe enough to completely rule out using either method of communication, contribute to each individuals personal choice as to which they prefer.

I am both dyslexic and have a slight arthritis though it's worse in other areas besides my fingers.  Dyslexia, in no way, keeps me from being able to read in small doses.  It's in large doses where I find my difficulty with my dyslexia, but I do have dyslexia and that is probably why I have to edit almost every single post I have here.   I thank those for being patient with me on that.  But, I will read it and then hit post and still have to edit almost every single time.  

But, like I said, we have to adapt because there is no perfect anything.  There are Dinkies and Tinies on voice, however, probably for some of the reasons you listed above.  Those who are voice only are welcomed.  I don't know of any Tiny/Dinkie sim where voice is disallowed as Tiny/Dinkies are not strict role play.  I was simply saying word play is a large part of that community and it's happening in text which is something I'd miss were it to go away because of AI inability to really mimic human to human texting.

Edited March 5, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Solar Legion]

2 hours ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I said "those people" not Y-O-U.  It was a person earlier in the thread who has since edited their post to something like "edited due to sensitive dah-lings" or some such nonsense.  That poster flat out said all female avi's that don't voice are men.  

That is normal for certain users here and is an attitude that one sadly can find out i the wild.

It's a lovely marker for those to avoid.

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

3 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

Dyslexia, in no way, keeps me from being able to read in small doses.

Dyslexia is an umbrella term and there are several subcategories each of which can have a different impact on an individuals ability to comprehend written communication.

7 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I was simply saying word play is a large part of that community and it's happening in text which is something I'd miss were it to go away.

I'm a huge fan of the written word and am often overly verbose when communicating via text but at no point in time has anyone in this thread suggested that text based communication should be removed in favour of voice.  Everyone should be free to choose which they prefer and there should be more emphasis on providing additional support and resources for those unfortunate enough to not have a choice at all.

[EliseAnne85]

19 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

no point in time has anyone in this thread suggested that text based communication should be removed in favour of voice.

That's not what I meant.  I meant were text based communication to go away *when and if* AI voice-to-text replaces it.  But, if actual text were ever replaced by AI completely, I'd think that would be far into the future and is a *who knows*.  But, for many things on the internet in general, I already use voice activation and would love voice-to-text.  But, voice-to-text will lose the nuances of what a human can actually do is all I was saying.

[Love Zhaoying]

3 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

I meant were text based communication to go away *when and if* AI voice-to-text replaces it.  But, if actual text were ever replaced by AI completely, I'd think that would be far into the future and is a *who knows*. 

Give nuance that people add to their voices, I predict that any text-to-speech will be disappointing for at least the near future. For context and comparison: when a hearing-impaired person uses ASL with the Relay system (in the US), the Relay ASL interpreter attempts to convey the appropriate emotion in their own voice. This can be annoying, disconcerting, and laughable- and that's with a human.

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

3 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

That's not what I meant.  I meant were text based communication to go away *when and if* AI voice-to-text replaces it.  But, if actual text were ever replaced by AI completely, I'd think that would be far into the future and is a *who knows*.  But, for many things on the internet in general, I already use voice activation and would love voice-to-text.  But, voice-to-text will lose the nuances of what a human can actually do is all I was saying.

Understood.  The point I was making in reply is that, for those with a disability that prevents them from using either, the potential loss of nuance would most likely be preferable to being excluded from the conversation entirely.