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I understand what the op is saying. When I first started SL back in 2010, people seemed to be a little more open and friendly. When someone randomly im'd you, it was pretty harmless and most likely you'd have a decent conversation and either you made a new friend or just had a nice chat. Sure there were "sexi timez" people that would hit on you, but they were seemingly a minority. Now...it's a different story. You can still have those things, but it seems less frequent.

 

I remember when I first started a group of people, just saw me and probably took pity on me, but they gave me folders full of shapes, skins and hair. I don't think people do things like that as often. And I wasn't on newbie island either, I tp'd away and didn't know how to get back. I think I ended up in a crappy mall sim somewhere. I still enjoy SL, but I do feel like that little piece of community feeling it had, just isn't there.

 

The mic thing. Most of the time I have mine turned off now and it's mainly due to trolls. I remember being somewhere and a girl was just screaming into her mic, I turned it off, then I found myself getting more and more annoyed at people's mic control andI'll turn it on if someone wants to talk and every once in a while I'll say I don't have one, if a creepy guy im's me.

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(Sorry in advance if my post is a bit long, I am a bit overtalkative.)

SL is a bit depressing of a place. I have been here nearly two years. My main thing is RP, I absolutely am passionate about stories and feel the visual aspect of SL adds to the experience as a whole. I guess seeing Hot Tub Time Machine made me interested. You can get arrested here and serve sentences? It sounded like you could do anything, be anything.

RP is nothing new to me, at least self-indulged RPs. I often would load up a RPG game and roleplay there, doing things such as finding shelter or collecting food. I have done this for years prior to coming to SL. Needless to say,  doing the same thing but with other people thrilled me. In my head I was doing RPs, but the problem was I knew what was occuring. I wanted unpredictability.

Getting interested enough to join, I spent months just setting up my avatar to be the way I wanted. I absolutely love the customization options here. I also love the idea of being in a giant world where anything can happen.

Eventually I left the dressing room (yes, I spent months in a dressing room trying on clothes) and decided to explore. Originally all I saw was clubs and safe zones, areas with a lot of people. But I wasn't here for a 3d version of Facebook. I found out about RPs and started trying to interact in them. But the problem was many were medieval and my avatar was modern based. I wanted something with some adapatbility that I could join.

I guess that is how I started joining adult RP servers, the urban based servers were pretty much the little I could adapt to. Well, at least try. Every sim I would go to I would end up reading the rules, which there were many, and find such little tidbits such as "my avatar height is too small". I guess it is my fault for not adapting to them, but once again I wanted something I could be welcome in. Plus the sims that didn't have that just had guys that would IM me and want to take me to some other sim. Or, you know, nobody would be on the sim besides 1 afk person.

After months of searching, I found a home for a bit. I decided what I needed was quests, some singleplayer motivation. which I could use as a jumping off point and interact with NPCs. Instead I found a place I was welcome at. It was an adult sim, so most of the interactions were sexual, but I didn't mind as it meant I was actually doing some RP finally. But my character had a strong will, she wouldn't just let herself remain trapped, so she seeked to escape. They helped me RP my escape and so I had to seek somewhere else.

Trying to find out where I could go, I tried Gorean. The problem was that it was uncommon to find people on the sim, I would often have to wait hours on the weekends just to get one interaction. Eventually they RPed a way to get back to Earth and I hoped to find more sociability.

It was around this time I tried chatting with people on SL and take a break from the RP for a bit. Sadly everything ended on a bit of a big disagreement and I ended up alone in SL once again.

Since then I have pretty much been searching again but the same problems as before exist. Except now they are even worse because my chracter never got clothing when escaping the last area. I have pretty much trapped myself in adult RP sims that accept nudity, which is a smaller number than you might think.

I got a mesh body around this time, but couldn't find any mesh clothing to fit me. I also can't stand alphas, feeling I want the outfit to perfectly contour to my body and look like I am wearing it instead of it being too small for me. This pretty much meant I was limited in the clothing choices I could wear, especially as I don't want to use real life money in my SL as I don't feel comfortable making an investment in a digital world. How this affected me is that it became really hard to wear clothing, especially anything with decency. Combine that with the fact that I would need to have an RP of getting clothing means that I have been stuck on Adult sims for a bit of time. I could go back to system or accept alphas as a downside of mesh, but both feel like unhappy compromises.

Being stuck on sims filled with people who just go there to use people and forget about them, it has been pretty lonely. I found a home, got banned from it. Found my way to somewhere else, found my escape, moved on.

I guess what eventually happened is I ran out of places to run to and have no way to really leave the area I am at. I have trouble creating a new character since I invested so much time in this one, but at the same time feel stuck until and if something happens. Sometimes that something happens quickly, sometimes not, but oftentimes lately I barely see anyone to even talk to. Even if I do, the people tend to not care about RP and just want to IM me something awkward. I try to be accepting of others RP, I am a newbie myself with any sort of para RP and thus am not the best at it, but it seems like I run into so many people that don't even want to try on RP sims.

My newest place is a small world I am stuck on. People have come and gone here, but I am stuck in a location that makes it impossbile to interact with them. Usually when I say people I mean one other person, a good deal of the time involves sitting here and looking at my people tracker to see that nobody is around. It has taken me an hour to write all this up, nobody has appeared in this sim in this time. I guess that is why this post struck home with me, I have felt very lonely here and have at numerous points in my SL career. Hopefully it picks up again, that is why I still log on, but I do feel very alone in the meantime.

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I don't know why but January is traditionally the month of complaint on the internet, been that way for as long as I've had a modem.

It's coming to an end now though so how about trying to see it from a different angle and ask ourselves: what can we do about it?

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This is an interesting observation and I'm trying to figure out why it resonates.

I think as an oldbie (12 year), my friendship list from the early days is now 90% decimated -- people literally died in real life, left SL for other worlds or Facebook, or they just drop out for RL or technical reasons. So I literally have less friends because they died out, but I make new ones, it just takes a little effort. I personally not have the need to get deep socializing from SL that others do but I think it is doable if you follow your own interests and find likeminded.

I think Chin Rey really nails it -- I have customers who write and simply say "My computer can't play SL anymore, bye" or "I can't get logged on, I can't see things, everything is laggy" and they quit. So that really cuts down on participation.

More often it's "I'm out of cash" or "I am busy in RL" or "I broke up with my boyfriend".

When new people come in, they say they've seen a news article, their friend told them about it, their wife played for years, finally they are starting, etc. 

So there are those dynamics but I think a bigger problem is what you say, trying to make friends, find a group, fit in somewhere. I notice from my customers that they form FIERCELY TIGHT GROUPS. They want security up the wazoo to keep everyone out, block, boot, ban. And mind you, this isn't a couple with cybersex. This could be a group of pals who play Greedy or sit and breed their animals or make gardens or just chit chat with a media on a prim playing. They are out in the front yard, but they don't want ANYONE to come over for a barbecue. I don't allow bans anywhere on the ground in my rentals, and that might be why people actually meet and become friends and even marry in my rentals, imagine.

But by and large, there is what I call "the archipelago of egos". Very tight groups, very impervious to outsiders, very fearful of being griefed or hated, very worried that whoever might curiously come to look at their rose bushes might also try to steal something. And there are real reasons for this.

It's kind of a frontier atmosphere, but without the barn-raising or chuch meetings or pot-lucks that might have helped cement people better because there isn't a virtual equivalent. That is, sure, there are even places of worship in SL but that's not the may activity. And not even clubs are. That is, they are and they aren't. Clubs are laggy and people either find smaller clubs with their posse (where it's hard to land without getting a stare or even an eject) or they do other things. Like they go to the breedable stores, markets, etc. They go shopping. They hit yard sales. They go to the fancy pretty sims for pictures. That sort of thing.

The single most frequent activity in my SL Public Land Preserve every day is riding a horse or riding a camel. The single greatest number of freebies taken are boats and a shiny box of treasures.

So if you go do breedables and ridables, you may find people, just a thought. I'm telling you my slice of life, it may not apply. If you look on the events list, you might find live music that works for you. Live music crowds are friendly than DJ club crowds in my view -- also, my subjective take.

I've written many times over the years about how to try to fix this atomization, this isolation. I'm tired of doing that to be honest. 

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Prokofy Neva wrote:

So there are those dynamics but I think a bigger problem is what you say, trying to make friends, find a group, fit in somewhere. I notice from my customers that they form FIERCELY TIGHT GROUPS. They want security up the wazoo to keep everyone out, block, boot, ban. And mind you, this isn't a couple with cybersex. This could be a group of pals who play Greedy or sit and breed their animals or make gardens or just chit chat with a media on a prim playing. They are out in the front yard, but they don't want ANYONE to come over for a barbecue. I don't allow bans anywhere on the ground in my rentals, and that might be why people actually meet and become friends and even marry in my rentals, imagine.

I thank you Prokofy and wish more of Second Life took this approach. I tend to like to explore when waiting for something to happen in my RP, so I often start sim hopping and checking out places. What I often find is I am at someone's house and am unwelcome there. I try to explore the mainland, I keep hitting ban lines to the point I expect most parcels to have them. I go sim hopping by the map, you can bet I expect to be sent back to some Safe Hub or be warned I will be evicted in 30 seconds.

I understand people want privacy with cybersex or with a couple talking together, but many of the sims I get kicked off of will only have one or oftentimes zero people there. I just like to explore, if it allows for building I always delete anything I rez, and I go so far to close doors that were closed and put things exactly the way I found them. Yet so much of Second Life seems to consist of private land. When I go to a sim it should be a surprise that they want privacy, not the expectation that it will be a private place I potentially need to leave quickly. When I show up in a place without banlines, I have pretty much conditioned myself to expect that land to turn out to be private and for the owner to show up and ban me off their property. That isn't a positive image and not a very welcoming one, but it is what I have found from my travels. I am thankful to hear it verified that I am welcome on some properties.

Perhaps this is what makes people leave. They come for a world where everyone can interact, but run into banlines and estates any time they try to get outside of safe hubs that are overrun with spammers. It is an effective quarantine and one way to prevent against people you don't want messing up your house, but it also gives the vibe to newcomers or even those who have been around a bit of being generally unwelcome. My question in SL is not often where I can go, the world is massive, but more where I can go and actually be welcomed. Between ban lines, cryptic rules on RP sims that leave room for unsurities, and automatic bannings I wouldn't be surprised if many without some social gathering find SL a very unwelcoming place.

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kungaroo2010 wrote:. My question in SL is not often where I can go, the world is massive, but more where I can go and actually be welcomed. Between ban lines, cryptic rules on RP sims that leave room for unsurities, and automatic bannings I wouldn't be surprised if many without some social gathering find SL a very unwelcoming place.

when I first came to SL, and created an account, after choosing a 'starter avatar' and downloading and installing the viewr, I stopped, and thought...

 

Default sims in sims 2 look like crap, you want a nice looking sim you go custom...

So I clicked the link for the SL Marketplace, and did some freebie shopping, a new skin that was obviously nicer then the default one in the starter avi, some clothing, some hair...

 

Then I logged in for the first time, made my way through the welcome island obstacle course, arrived in world, turned off the dam,n awful voice spam feature, and went looking for a place to open my boxes and wear my new look.

 

THEN I went looking, via the destination guide for places I might enjoy, second place I tried, I landed, and was immediately hailed by some old sl inhabitant as "another bloody alt"

During the subsequent conversation I was informed that...

 

Not looking like crap on your first day proves you are an alt and thus obviously some kind of socially undesirable sl criminal.

Looking like crap on your first day proves you are a disposable griefer account and thus obviously some kind of socially undesirable sl criminal.

Nolt being payment registered and premium on your first day proves you are freeloading trash and thus some kind of socially undesirable sl criminal.

Not having a "proper last name" proves that, since SL-IQ = SL-Age measured in weeks, you are a zero SL-IQ noob and thus some kind of socially undesirable sl criminal.

Having the last name Resident proves you are socially undesirable and an sl criminal...

 

The Ancient, in her retina melting 2005 avatar, then told me that the above being taken into account she thought I should just log out of SL and never come back because "people like you have ruined SL".

I told the fossilised perma-noob asshat that I thought she could...

"go fornicate your self to death, anally, without lubricant, using a chainsaw, sideways..."

Obiously, being English, and not having that PG-Murican fear of short anglo saxon words, the original version was slightly shorter...

 

SL *is* frequently unwelcoming, look at all the "hi i am new and lonely" posts elsewhere on the forum.

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I think that with less residents logged in at any time and with the game being highly occupied by older users and new users interested in adult entertainment, it leaves us somewhat cynical. I tend to keep to myself and my small group of friends, simply because I don't want to participate in adult activities or the club scenes.

SL certainly isn't what it used to be in terms of population either so the pool of people to choose to associate with is less than say 6-7 years ago. Theres definitely been a decline in the number of people logged on at any certain time. Currently (looking right now) there are only 42,000 people logged in. This is including bots as well.  

It may be worth a shot going to clubs or places that pique your interest. I have found quiet a few friends at RP sims, shopping events, and club events that I really enjoy the music. 

Also, if you ever want to chat, feel free to message me!

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Another thing I noticed is SL has become secondary to socialization or a springboard for socialization. What I mean by that is, people just kind of stopped doing things inworld like they used to. First came voice, which I didn't mind, but people started spending more time calling you to talk about the same things they would talk about through text, then that escalated to skype. Woe unto you if you didn't have a cam or your mic was broken (before wireless used to ruin cords by running over them)Then came those facebook like features and eventually having a facebook SL page became a thing and to some people having a SL facebook makes you more "real". Lastly, the rise of video games. A lot of people log on to meet up with other people to play video games on Steam (it actually took me a minute to think of that because I'm not a gamer). They'll log on and idle on SL while playing another video game elsewhere.

 

So long story short a lot of people use SL to be social else where. The inception like idea of that is weird and sort of leaves some of us behind. But SL's shortcomings are taken up elsewhere and seem to take up a lot of people's time, more than SL itself does. Mainly its social media and video games though.

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Tis a sad state indeed. Here is an example of why people have stopped being so open to chatting with you in SL. Picture this: you've been joking around with a female who has joked back with you constantly & no flirting. This has been going on for weeks. Her b/f gets jealous, so he tells you stop chatting with her "give it a rest." You call him what he is acting like, but her b/f is also a "special" buddy (empowered to ban ppl) of a sim owner of a sim you frequently visit...well not any more you've been banned via the kiddish jealous b/f. Yet another example, you've began a conversation with a female who tells she is an "escort", so you inform her you are not interested in a polite manner, but she reports you to the sim owner for being "rude"...you are banned anyway! These are just two unfair examples of why SL residents are not more open to conversing. Until LL policies change you'll continue to see a dwindling SL population.

"I Love Simplicity"

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

{snipped to remove standard self pity whine]

Until LL policies change you'll continue to see a dwindling SL population.

What kind of 'policy changes' were you pointlessly hoping for?

 

A rule from LL stating it's a ToS violation for parcel owners and their appointed representatives to eject/ban whiny guys who keep trying to poach their women ?

Perhaps a rule stating that whiny freeloaders walking into brothels hoping for a 'freebie' can't be ejected for wasting the working girls time?

 

If you walked into a coffeeshop in FirstLife, and sat there for hours, without buying anything, repeatedly saying in a loud voice "Boy that coffee sure smells good... Yummmmmmmmmm..." that there wopuld eventually come a time where the Manager would ask you to get the hell out.

 

It's not policies that need changing it's the current whiny internet entitlement culture, where people think they have a constitutional right to be universally liked, universally respected, universally praised, and to earn more money 'playing a game for fun' than in their minimum wage day job.

 

"Wahhhhh! I don't have any friends, can't get laid for free, and my Mad Mainland land invenstment left me pennyless! Call the FBI and have them make LL change SecondLife so it's more acceptable to me!"

 

Welcome to WoW... World of Whinux

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I am going to stick "to the topic" lets ask THOUSANDS who left SL never to return. It is like a cafe that recently opens it is crowded, BUT over a period time you have approx. 1/10 of the customers left. There is something wrong with your food & or SERVICE. There is one LL/SL rule I like to changed immediately related to this Forum...off topic name calling = banned for life from this Forum via your IP address. Your remarks are off topic & shall be reported to the moderator.AND LL

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

I am going to stick "to the topic" lets ask THOUSANDS who left SL never to return. It is like a cafe that recently opens it is crowded, BUT over a period time you have approx. 1/10 of the customers left. There is something wrong with your food & or SERVICE.
There is one LL/SL rule I like to changed immediately related to this Forum...off topic name calling = banned for life from this Forum via your IP address. Your remarks are off topic & shall be reported to the moderator.AND LL

That's not off topic, it's plain... the annecdote about you being banned by somebody's boyfriend, from a parcel, because they felt you were harrassing their girlfriend, is one you have posted before, coupled with a demand that LL should change policy, to prevent you being banned by peoples boyfriends, 

 

Then a second annecdote regarding you being banned from a parcel for trying to get companiopnship from an 'escort' without paying, presumably in an escort club since she was able to have you banned by the parcel owner.

 

The fact that you got ejected and banned from 2 parcels for your behavior, is not the issue, what is, is that you came to this thread and whined about it, and demanded special treatment, new rules from LL to ensure that people you annoy cannot eject you from the land they control. LL are almost certaionly NOT going to comply with your self centered request.

 

As for your cafe analogy, sorry but you seem to have missed some options, people leave becausze... there's a new coffee shop around the corner thats more fashionable, or because they lost their jobs in a global economic downturn and cant afford designer coffee any more, or simply because they got sick of that damned whiny guy in the corner who never buys any damn coffee but keeps hinting that he'd enjoy a free cup, but only if he gets 'special service'.

 

And yes, you do seem to think you have a constitutional right to expect that everyone respects, likes, and admires you, witness your arguments with other self styled 'pc hardware gurus' on other threads, often comprising excessive numbers of reply and counter reply, derailing the threads topic

 

If we're talking about IP address bans for being off topic, I suspect that repeated complaints that people object to the way you approach women, is definately ban-worthy.

 

Oh, in case you havn't heard theres an MMORPG where your kind of self centerted 'why dont they change the rules just for me' attitude is common, it's initials are WoW, hence what we English speakers call a "pun" or play on words, blending Whine (what you were doing) with Linux (your presumed pc operating system of choice) and splicing it into the name of said MMORPG...

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FYI those "episodes" were not experienced by me. Have you ever read the THOUSANDS of online complaints by former SL residents??? I have. This is not my SL id I use in SL, so I find it amusing you think you know soo much about me. My neighbor-SL resident was NOT in an "escort" sim. Apparently this "escort" was buddies with the either sim owner or empowered buddy of the sim owner. ALL it takes to get banned..read about online..i have! As many hits as I get in this Forum apparently I am helping several people & I am not here to stroke my ego. I am here because I want to help others. That's it. I am no pc Guru:

Former EggXpert review team member (have to be chosen)

WalMart Spark review program (have to be chosen)

I have had pc component manufacturer's send me components for review (have to be chosen)

As an older gentleman I have been online reviewing for over 15 years & my real id is _______

I am old enough to see what you are attemtping to do & its counter productive to this Forum. Here is a thought go answer some questions since this is a SL Forum Miss "member." Who knows one day you might be a "moderator" here IF put forth the effort; instead of attempting to get me to "get myself banned"..not happening  :)

"I Love Simplicity"

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

Here is a thought go answer some questions since this is a SL Forum Miss "member." Who knows one day you might be a "moderator" here IF put forth the effort; 

 

The mods are Linden employees. All the other "rankings"? Something done by the software, totally meaningless -- as I write this I have no idea what my title is.

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Thank you I like this Forum. Here is a point some are missing. I am not being paid to share tech tips here & I am not here to stroke my ego. Every person I help here can log into SL hopefully to help support it. IF I step on toes here, it is because I have "tested" what works in SL & I see inaccurate posts that cause residents to spend more money than he/she needs, or answers posted I know will not work!. I care. Over the years I have had great times in SL...this is my way of giving back.

"I Love Simplicity"

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

FYI those "episodes" were not experienced by me. Have you ever read the THOUSANDS of online complaints by former SL residents??? 

Oh, I've seen thousands of complaints, on forums, and inworld, both in SL, and on other online MMO/Communities, going back decades. People bitching because there are people in the place who are newer than them, and getting equal treatment... Outrageous. People complainingthat some aspect of the world had changed and they were nolonger special flowers... Outrageous. People promising to leave the world because they were not getting theur constitutional; right to be superior... Outrageous.

 

A common source of such thinking is PvP (player versus Player) in MMO's, games that are not pvp centered have thousands of posts by tiny noisy minorities claiming that if only the Devs would allow them to 'spawn-camp[-noob-gank' then popularity of the game would soar and the company would see more profits.  Said toxix pvp people then whine like bitches when the majority reply on the forum that such actions would actually drive people away.

 


LinuxGod4u wrote:

Apparently this [insert list of people here] was buddies with the either sim owner or empowered buddy of the sim owner. ALL it takes to get banned..

Yup... annoy friends of a parcel or sim owner who isn't your friend and they ban you, that's how it works, welcome to LIFE, Try this in First life, wait till your boss is with their spouse at the company xmas party, walk over, tell your boss their spouse is ugly and stupid... See how long you keep your job...

 


LinuxGod4u wrote:

I am not here to stroke my ego.That's it. I am no pc Guru:

Former EggXpert review team member (have to be chosen)

WalMart Spark review program (have to be chosen)

I have had pc component manufacturer's send me components for review (have to be chosen)

But then you stroke your ego attempting to prove you are a pc guru with a list of 'have to be chosen'  pc guru positions.

 


LinuxGod4u wrote:

Here is a thought go answer some questions since this is a SL Forum Miss "member." Who knows one day you might be a "moderator" here IF put forth the effort; instead of attempting to get me to "get myself banned"..not happening  
:)

"I Love Simplicity"

I have answered some questions... You probably didn't notice since those threads offered no opportunity to while about getting banned by peoles friends,  You attempt to insult me (unsuccessfully) by refering to a title auto granted by the system, one which you are likely to recieve shortly your self. And then you assume I want to be a 'moderator'...

 

I have been amoderator on a number of forums and chatrooms over the last 20 odd years, it's a bloody horrible job, one has to slap down friends who'se opinions you agree with and defend idiots spouting trash, because... Rules.

 

At one time i was a moderator in an Athiest chatroom and forum, every damn day, I'd have to banhammer self rightious internet entitlement whiners who KNEW that is was their contstitutional right, to enter our quiet peaceful world and insult us to our faces, call us morons and damn us to hellfire, and who felt it was utterly intollerable that when they did we just kicked them out, because THEY were special flowers, and they had a right to make us listen to and respect their foamy madness.

 

And I don't have to attempt to get you do do a damn thing. What you do is your business, not mine. I really don't give a rats backside how many sims you get yourself banned from for failing to understand that your attitude inworld (which probably mirrors your attitude here) is why these things happen to you...

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You took it wrong, I was paying you a compliment! You could be a moderator. I do not care about my Forum status I am here to help people that is it.. I was not insulting you by calling you Miss "member" I was acknowledging your gender/Forum status. I am not here to insult people, name call etc. I am here to share what I know works *in SL. In addition, I have learnt things from reading posts in this Forum too! You are entitled to your opinions..we are all. You have the right to dislike me. LOL @ Constitutional rights complainers. I hope you have a great day.

"I Love Simplicity"

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

You took it wrong, I was paying you a compliment! 

Yeah right, of course you were...

 

No... Wait...


LinuxGod4u wrote:

There is one LL/SL rule I like to changed immediately related to this Forum...off topic name calling = banned for life from this Forum via your IP address. Your remarks are off topic & shall be reported to the moderator.AND LL

Yes, I can see EXACTLY how keen you are to compliment me... :matte-motes-evil-invert:

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LinuxGod4u wrote:

You took it wrong, I was paying you a compliment! You could be a moderator. I do not care about my Forum status [...]

I'm enjoying this spat. I'd love to get into it but I've nothing to argue about in this topic, which is very much unlike me. I can usually find something to argue against for the sake of arguing :(

I'm only posting because I want to clarify something. There is no forum 'status' or rank here. Those 'titles' do not confer anything on anyone, so we are all the same - merely forum users. I mention it because you appear to think that they go up and up as far as moderator. They don't.

Incidentally, whatever your reason for writing Miss form "member" was, it did come across as quite the opposite of a compliment. I understood it as comparing your 'title' to hers in a negative way.

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