Ever get a 1-star "did not receive product" rating? WHY?

[Nelson Jenkins]

I've been selling on the Marketplace since it was the original SL Marketplace, and even then I got reviews such as the following:

1/5 Stars
did not receive my product plz delveir kthx
-misinformed idiot 

We need to figure out a way to either flag these reviews (since often users forget to delete them after getting a redelivery) or prevent them from being posted in the first place with a proactive warning of some kind, i.e. "If you didn't receive your product, contact the creator before posting a review." Many, many people believe that reviews get automatically emailed to vendors and often don't even IM them for a redelivery, relying solely on the review being seen at some point in the future.

I am glad to redeliver products to my customers, but rating 1/5 stars because of a fault on the Marketplace's behalf (which I am not addressing, just the rating problem here) is unfair and not productive. Not only does it kill a product rating - especially if it's the only review, because people are too lazy to review purchases unless there is a problem - but whatever customers actually look past the 1-star rating find a review that tells them nothing about the product itself. To put this in perspective, rating 1 star for misdelivery is much like giving a game 0/10 on Metacritic because the Steam purchase failed. It makes no sense, it isn't helpful, and it won't fix your problem.

tl;dr we need to fix "1/5 stars, did not receive, plz redeliver" reviews.

[Zanara Zenovka]

Easy way would be to not enable a review until after the product is delivered.

The magic box already pings back to SLM to confirm that it's done the llGiveInventory() (ie sent stuff) so there's no reason the "enable review" code couldn't be run after that.

Any failures after the llGiveInventory() are the recipient's problem anyway - eg, offline and IMs capped, magic box/merchant on ignore, busy mode, etc.

However these reviews do serve one purpose - they let buyers know which merchants are not involved in their business, since such reviews are easily removed by the commerce staff if you put in a ticket. (Being notified of reviews by email is a bit essential here...).

[Monti Messmer]

Because i do not care for reviews, the above example isn´t the only one why, i never check my own. Only have 150 products on the marketplace i could but how would someone with 5.000 + check all pages and reviews ? Maybe the text for a review should be like for a JIRA, first you have to pick a "topic" from a list.

Oh yes and send emails for reviews, maybe at least a notice someone did; make it optional too

Monti

[Catwise Yoshikawa]

Guess every merchant had this problem, and more than once, sadly. They don't give info about being online when they are buying, (as they did in Xtreet), to avoid error deliveries (guess they can't, cause now sometimes delivery delays more than 4 hours), so how do you expect to give info about this? I just give up waiting for them to fix this problem.
You can flag that review and LL will remove it ;-)

[Margo Gadsby]

I am not even a seller/creator but that is so wrong. There should be a disclaimer pop up when writing review saying to FIRST contact the seller with any issues, then again most don't read anything.  More often than not it is a newbie, so maybe put an age-in-world minimum for leaving reviews/ratings.

I feel for creators/sellers, they are the people who create amazing objects, builds, and clothing for all of us to use.  Without creators SL would just be a text based chat room.

Rating and reviewing items bought is so helpful to sellers and future buyers; I wish more people would leave reviews for all purchases.  I have been in SL nearly 6 years and I have bought and do buy a lot on marketplace and in world.  I try to rate them all, but it is hard to keep up sometimes.  At least make an effort to help creators learn from buyers and continue to make great items for us all to use.

[Josh Susanto]

>Easy way would be to not enable a review until after the product is delivered.

But that would interfere with secret Linden alts intentionally obstructing deliveries by their competitors and then using it as an excuse to leave a bad reviews.

[Princess Verwood]

I loath seeing those ratings for myself or any other merchant when I am shopping on the Mkpl. Its almost like people don't really give a flying f**k what it means to the merchant because clearly its the merchant holding on to their items (not).

I would really like to see customers to have to go a bit more just to give 1-2 or 3 star ratings. Maybe questionnaire, or ...something...i.e

1. Have you received the item?

2. Have you contacted the seller?

3. Is the reason for your low review because of something the seller misrepresented? etc..etc.

Something that will trigger the right combination in order for people to have the opportunity to make a 1-2, or 3 star ratings visible.

I guess what I mean is not to make it as easy to give a low rating. I've seen more low ratings on items about the dumbest things that they could of took the same amount of time that it took to create the review just to contact the seller.

[Nelson Jenkins]

"Easy way would be to not enable a review until after the product is delivered."

IIRC this already happens, but llGiveInventory fails and the box doesn't realize it, so it happily shoots back to the Marketplace saying everything is fine and dandy. The potential llTransferInventory function might help, but I doubt LL is keen on updating the boxes when direct delivery is in the works - presumably, at least.

It's a bit tedious to file a ticket on these reviews, and there is no category to flag them. Every time a potential buyer sees that 1 star, it could be a lost sale.

[Nelson Jenkins]

"I've seen more low ratings on items about the dumbest things that they could of took the same amount of time that it took to create the review just to contact the seller."

Cars seem to be notorious for this because there are two distinct classifications of carowners - aficionados and leadfoots. Aficionados like cars because of the detail and give 1-star reviews to cars that simply aren't worth the money, while leadfoots don't care and just want it to go fast; sadly, I've seen a lot of cars get 1-star reviews solely because they wouldn't go fast enough (60-70 MPH on a car from the 1940s is too slow?) I suppose a lot of people tend to forget that SL has unlimited resources and more money does not necessarily mean faster engine.

Back on topic, a questionnaire seems like it would be a good idea, maybe it would filter out some of those reviews, but I'm inclined to believe that there would still be some tools that zip through it just so they can leave a bad review and vent their frustrations.

[Princess Verwood]

---

Nelson Jenkins wrote:

Back on topic, a questionnaire seems like it would be a good idea, maybe it would filter out some of those reviews, but I'm inclined to believe that there would still be some tools that zip through it just so they can leave a bad review and vent their frustrations.

---

So true. And I had thought of that when I was typing it. But I mean there must be something or some way like that, that will be efficient for lower reviews. A long questionnaire with 20 questions? Maybe that would defer people from leaving bad reviews if they had to answer questions for 4-5 minutes, or maybe a more interactive questionnaire where they had to type in a response of at least so many words to justify their low rating. Anything would be better then how it is now I'm sure.

[Chelsea Malibu]

This is the primary reason I have been campaigning to end the rating system.  It serves now valuable service and allows for many areas of deception.

Old products that by comparison to many new products that are better, have high ratings as the system pushed users to rate them where today they don't.

It's easy to game the system with friends and alts.

Reviewers can do what they want with complete impunity.  They should be required to post their name and there should also be a tracking system to show what users rate and how.  If a user is notorious for bad ratings, then it only seems fair that we know a person who consistently rates 1 or 2 stars.

[Zanara Zenovka]

---

Josh Susanto wrote:

>Easy way would be to not enable a review until after the product is delivered.

But that would interfere with secret Linden alts intentionally obstructing deliveries by their competitors and then using it as an excuse to leave a bad reviews.

---

Thank you Josh...I knew you wouldn't let me down

[Zanara Zenovka]

---

Nelson Jenkins wrote:

"Easy way would be to not enable a review until after the product is delivered."

IIRC this already happens, but llGiveInventory fails and the box doesn't realize it, so it happily shoots back to the Marketplace saying everything is fine and dandy.

---

No - reviews are enabled before that. The problem here is being able to review something when your purchase status is "undelivered".

I tested this with https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Test-object/2914647?page=1 by purchasing then deleting the item from magic box before it could be sent.

The status page shows 

"1 item has not yet been delivered

This item is queued for delivery. Merchants cannot redeliver the item at this time, and have not been paid."

but the "review item" link above that is enabled already and i was able to leave a review.

(Note: Actual failure of llGiveInventory() does happen (and more frequently in the last year or so, for some reason), but very rarely (I know because i make and use products that use it a lot). It's very low down on the list of reasons for delivery failure.)

[Nelson Jenkins]

I was mainly talking about llGiveInventory failing, not the box itself. That is a problem as well, yes, but easy to fix - llGiveInventory failure is probably not as easy and virtually undetectable until llTransferInventory shows up, so we would need a way to filter out those bad reviews or an easier way to delete them than sit around waiting for a ticket response.

(fwiw, I have not gotten a response to a support ticket or even abuse report in at least the past 2 years)

[sunshine Juneberry]

I've been fortunate and never recieved a bad rating yet.

As a shopper however, i been fooled more than once by rigged ratings and have learned the hard way to take them all with a grain of salt.

I bought an AO once had over 30 ratings almost every rating 5 stars, it turned out to be the biggest piece of junk i ever wasted L$ on. Looking at the reviewers it turns out 75% had no profile pics, groups,  or much going on apparently, The other 25% were all in the same group, had a lot of the same interests, how wonderful for them.

Lesson learned, I dont pay attention to 1 star ratings for failed delivery and I'm leary of products with nothing but glowing praise from people who can take time to fill in a review, but not take time to fill in their profile.

[Isoldel]

As a merchant and frequent shopper, I find it discouraging to see others rate an item poorly soley on the fact that they did not recieve it and blame the merchant. Granted, if the magicbox was suddenly derezzed and could not deliver an item then it's obviously the merchant's fault but that is not the case most of the time. I totally agree that under more "personal rules", if you did not recieve the item then you cannot realistically rate the item. You are rating the item, not the service. (Though when you do come in contact with the seller then you can realistically rate the customer service.) ... Get what I mean?

Unfortunately people do not read the "fine print" in a lot of shops stating that buyers should message the seller if there is a failed delivery due to SL hiccups and wholeheartedly believe that it is the seller's fault.

[Anna1 String]

Concerning 1-star-reviews..

I personally cannot complain, LL has removed all 1-star reviews I have had so far (a lot .. a hell lot .. )

Most were because of non-deliveries, which I flagged as spam - some were just due to user errors or impossible customers afterall, which I have flagged as flaming/hate speech.

The really bitchy ones are the 2 star reviews, they don't get deleted that easy, grr..I swear, people that leave them are well aware of that... well so are some more now lol.

My personal wish would be to get rid of the whole review system, since there are too many new and/or stupid customers arounds, yes I've said it!

Maybe there would be more time to concentrate on real abuse reports when it comes to copybotting or other real heavy stuff.

[Nelson Jenkins]

"My personal wish would be to get rid of the whole review system, since there are too many new and/or stupid customers arounds, yes I've said it!"

I don't think the review system does more harm than good. I know I tend to get comfy buying a product that at least has a 3-4 star rating instead of one with no rating at all. It at least means someone bought it and used it. Now that sales ranks don't exist (for what I can tell), it's impossible to tell if something has actually sold before, or if it's just a piece of junk.

[Zanara Zenovka]

I actually like the review system too - as both a merchant and shopper.

As a shopper I like reading what people have to say, it's easy enough to read between the lines and see which are genuine and who just reviews their own on alts, which also lets me know who not to do business with.

As a merchant they're definitely useful, and it's always nice to see that people have been impressed enough to take the time to write something. I have got useful criticism from them on occasions too, and keep a record of these to consider when updating products.

I've haven't yet had a failed delivery one (a lot of my customers are merchants and understand, but i also leave a lot of notes about how to contact me, etc, or maybe i've just been lucky so far). I have had a couple of low reviews, which turned out to be people having trouble getting things to work, and by contacting them and going through the instructions we sorted it out. And the ones that were utterly unreasonable or obviously from competitors I was able to get removed quickly by submitting a ticket.

I just think it needs

(a) email notifications  - seriously guys, it's been well over a year since the SLM was out of beta

(b) reviews to be enabled after delivery.

[Josh Susanto]

c) an easy way for customers to see all reviews by another customer.

If I see a negative review (as a customer), it might be helpful to know that all reviews by that other customer are negative.

[Pamela Galli]

I suppose disabling reviews before delivery would be some really difficult coding task?  And that's why it's not done that way?  It can't be that they don't have time to do it, because think of all the time they spend deleting bogus reviews now.

The other day someone gave a house a one star review because, she freely admitted, she had not read the ALL CAPS warning that no furniture was included (tho she did refer to it as "fine print"). But that was a disappointment, not getting an entire house full of furniture, so she felt it deserved a one star review. Never mind that the fact that she failed to read the listing provides other prospective buyers with any useful info.  LL got rid of the review.