What do customers think about selling the same cloth in different textures as different products in the SL marketplace?

[Jaylinbridges]

3 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Here's an example.  It's a full perm template dress.  Texturing HUD included.  This isn't something new that designers are doing.  Price...199L

Yeah good example of what I was talking about.  So what is wrong with a full perm template dress?  Was the price too cheap to impress your friends?

I can also show you a well known old designer that never includes HUDS - each dress/gown is separate, and too expensive.  $499L for nearly everything.  The same basic template has been used for 10 years.  Change the texture, change the model and hair style, give her a new dress name, and ask $499L.  Of course nothing is ever mod there.  So women will pay for a new texture as if it's a new design?  I don't consider most textures to be that difficult.  But the fashion world is nuts anyway.

 

[Kathlen Onyx]

3 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Here's an example.  It's a full perm template dress.  Texturing HUD included.  This isn't something new that designers are doing.  Price...199L

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Bens-Boutique-Korina-DressAnimal-Print-Hud-Control/21965418

I am way confused. I thought full perm meant copy, modify and transfer? This dress is only copy. It also has the same type HUD that a fatpack would have.  Why is this designer selling outfits with 50 solid colors and 50 patterns for $199 when other designers are selling each color at $249 or $1299 for the fatpack?  The process of getting the texture on to the mesh item has got to be the same. So did this designer just buy the template and only do the textures and not the mesh? 

[Stephanie Misfit]

11 minutes ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

I am way confused. I thought full perm meant copy, modify and transfer? This dress is only copy. It also has the same type HUD that a fatpack would have.  Why is this designer selling outfits with 50 solid colors and 50 patterns for $199 when other designers are selling each color at $249 or $1299 for the fatpack?  The process of getting the texture on to the mesh item has got to be the same. So did this designer just buy the template and only do the textures and not the mesh? 

Yes, it is made from a full perm template that they have purchased from someone else. There is a huge market for these templates, and those sellers selling HUD packs of 30 or so textures for 99 or 199L are almost always using full perm templates, not making their own mesh.

[Kathlen Onyx]

38 minutes ago, Jaylinbridges said:

Yeah good example of what I was talking about.  So what is wrong with a full perm template dress?  Was the price too cheap to impress your friends?

 

You sound bitter or angry or both and I'm not sure why.

I don't design or create clothing so all I'm trying to do is understand.

If you bothered to read my other post in this thread you would know that I don't spend money just to spend it.  I mistakenly assumed you were talking about system clothes or appliers which I find to be not realistic at all, like they are painted on. Just my personal preference.

I actually bought a dress from the link Rowan gave and I happen to love the fact that it is in four pieces and you can change each color. I very, very rarely will buy a fatpack from well known designers. They haven't designed anything that different than their other things lately and it all looks alike to me.  I might pick it up on a FLF or Saturday sale if I really like the item.

 

[Jaylinbridges]

1 hour ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

I am way confused. I thought full perm meant copy, modify and transfer? This dress is only copy. It also has the same type HUD that a fatpack would have.  Why is this designer selling outfits with 50 solid colors and 50 patterns for $199 when other designers are selling each color at $249 or $1299 for the fatpack?  The process of getting the texture on to the mesh item has got to be the same

I don't think Rowan really meant full perm for the product.  Copy, no mod, no transfer with a texture HUD is the new standard.  As to why the price is only $199L, it could be the designer would rather have her products affordable, which will increase sales.  Volume sales vs overpriced no mod and one texture outfit for 3 times the amount.  Who will sell more outfits?  There is trivial more work to make a new texture or worse, a color - I have always called that a scam to charge as if it's a new outfit.

Here's another example - my partner bought this dress last week.  They call those HUDs fatpacks in the package, but they are NOT like the fatpacks where every color is a separate object, and you must buy a fatpack box with all the colors, for some outrageous price.  That is the old greedy way of selling, and it is clogging up the MP with separate ads for every texture and color, beside overcharging for the fatpack box.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/LC-Cynthia-Dress-FATPACK-Original-Mesh-NEW-2021/22723132

Note it says Original Mesh Design. That store has been around for a long time. $299L for the 20 colors/textures included.  Their HUD is switchable between Top or Skirt, so you can mix and match the textures for hundreds of combinations.  The price is about typical for just one dress.  Why pay $2500 L for a fatpack box, when you can get the SAME thing for $299L?

This is what the HUD included in the Cynthia Dress looks like onscreen. has a Top and Skirt switch:

 

She also bought the matching socks for $199L. So for $498 she gets a complete outfit with unlimited color/texture combinations.  The downside is trying to decide which color/texture to wear.  Between the dress and socks and HUDs there are over a million combinations.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/LC-Cynthia-Socks-FATPACK-Original-Mesh-NEW-2021/22743314

Edited October 11, 2021 by Jaylinbridges

[Jaylinbridges]

30 minutes ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

You sound bitter or angry or both and I'm not sure why.

I don't design or create clothing so all I'm trying to do is understand

I was not talking to you.  I clearly quoted Rowan.  I was talking to Rowan.  Read my latest post please.

The designers that claim it's worth it to pay for every texture/color are trying to claim they are somehow better than the rest.  They will lose money if they switch to fatpack huds, and charge a reasonable price.  It's like you can buy 100 Bayer aspirin for $5 USD, or buy 100 USP aspirin for $1 from the dollar store or walmart. The pills are the same, probably made in the same Chinese or Indian plant.  Yet Bayer keeps selling their overpriced USP aspirin to consumers. Brand name foolishness.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Jaylinbridges

[Stephanie Misfit]

21 minutes ago, Jaylinbridges said:

I don't think really Rowan meant full perm.  Copy, no mod, no transfer with a texture HUD is the new standard.  As to why the price is only $199L, it could be the designer would rather have her products affordable, which will increase sales.  Volume sales vs overpriced no mod and one texture outfit for 3 times the amount.  Who will sell more outfits?  There is trivial more work to make a new texture or worse, a color - I have always called that a scam to charge as if it's a new outfit.

Here's another example - my partner bought this dress last week.  They call those HUDs fatpacks in the package, but they are NOT like the fatpacks where every color is a separate object, and you must buy a fatpack box with all the colors, for some outrageous price.  That is the old greedy way of selling, and it is clogging up the MP with separate ads for every texture and color, beside overcharging for the fatpack box.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/LC-Cynthia-Dress-FATPACK-Original-Mesh-NEW-2021/22723132

Note it says Original Mesh Design. That store has been around for a long time. $299L for the 20 colors/textures included.  Their HUD is switchable between Top or Skirt, so you can mix and match the textures for hundreds of combinations.  The price is about typical for just one dress.  Why pay $2500 L for a fatpack box, when you can get the SAME thing for $299L?

That store probably isn't the best example for determining what is a fair price for clothes though. It has a few original mesh items but most of what they sell is created from full perm templates. The store owner's overall investment of time in creating their designs is much lower than someone who creates original mesh for every single release. It doesn't mean that designers who do create their own mesh and textures for all their items are over pricing their items, they just aren't undervaluing them. Original designers who charge per item or colour are not greedy, they are merely trying to recover the cost of their hard work. Template resellers do not set the standard for pricing.

[Mollymews]

15 minutes ago, Jaylinbridges said:

The designers that claim it's worth it to pay for every texture/color are trying to claim they are somehow better than the rest

some times they are, better than the rest

better in the fact that the textures are highly detailed and perfectly sized for the faces of the garment. And when they are then I am happy to pay 250 to 500 for each item

once upon a time in the days before mesh we used to get these high quality highly detailed layer textures and we paid for them seperately, a fatpack consisted of a folder full of layers

then mesh came, and the arrival of the HUD, and a lot of the texture quality went out the window in the rush to stuff as many colors and one size fits all patterns into the product as possible - quantity over quality

but luckily there are still some texture makers who do quality detailing for each face. Like I my fav layer tights. 300L. One color. My fav bodysuit layer. One color. 300L. And my fav mesh makers. One quality detailed texture on the mesh. 300L each please.  Thats just for the top. The bottom and the shoes are 300L each more please. And I buy them because detailing

i also have factory produced clothing as well.  A zillion tints of the same one size fits all texture in a HUD. Some them are nice, but nothing special

 

[Rowan Amore]

4 hours ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

I am way confused. I thought full perm meant copy, modify and transfer? This dress is only copy. It also has the same type HUD that a fatpack would have.  Why is this designer selling outfits with 50 solid colors and 50 patterns for $199 when other designers are selling each color at $249 or $1299 for the fatpack?  The process of getting the texture on to the mesh item has got to be the same. So did this designer just buy the template and only do the textures and not the mesh? 

@Stephanie Misfitexplained it perfectly.  There's nothing wrong with purchasing templates.  I own quite a few of outfits from various merchants who use them.  

I think of them more like items you'd purchase at Wal-Mart.  Mass marketed.

 

 

 

[Rowan Amore]

4 hours ago, Jaylinbridges said:

 

Here's another example - my partner bought this dress last week.  They call those HUDs fatpacks in the package, but they are NOT like the fatpacks where every color is a separate object, and you must buy a fatpack box with all the colors, for some outrageous price.  That is the old greedy way of selling, and it is clogging up the MP with separate ads for every texture and color, beside overcharging for the fatpack box.

 

Most designers who offer fat packs of their product do not package each color separately.  I mentioned that as something I hate.  Most stores package  the item in various sizes and a HUD that changes the texture.  Whether it's a dress, shoes, jewelry, hair.  Almost every store at any major event sells like this and have for years.  

No, I didn't mean they were selling the items full.perm.  The store buys a full perm template and retextures with a HUD as you've shown above.  They sell cheaper because most people won't pay for something they know isn't original which I highly doubt that one shown is.  

 

 

 

[Finite]

I always question certain pricing methods. Especially at events where it's easy to comparison shop. I'll look at a fatpack of say 25 color options and a sign that says "50% off". Then when I see the price it's 3k. And I think so they are saying this is a 6k valued outfit? And I'll look at another vendor selling a similar quality outfit for 850-1200 or others for even lesser and I am sure you can guess where my money went.

I'm not a sales expert by any means but as a customer I feel the arrow should be pointing me toward buying the fatpack. Like I want to buy the fatpack. I often feel like the fatpack prices points me toward buying a single color.

When I see an outfit, I might only like 3 colors. Regardless of the amount of color options in the fatpack if it's not the price of 3+ maybe 2 extra colors then I'm likely going to pass. I can't think if of single outfit I have that I've worn 25-50 times let alone 25-50 color variations of. So 50% off isn't much of a deal at all to me. I don't think it would be for anyone.

One particular instance I recall is when I saw an outfit I liked. I liked it a lot in fact. It was from a vendor I am I very familiar with from other events but the price was just a bit of a reach. There was also a nice hat that matched the outfit that was sold separate in which they wanted what I felt was also a high price for a hat fatpack. I remember thinking if they included the hat as a bonus with the outfit fatpack I probably would have felt more compelled to reach for the price they wanted. Instead, I walked away altogether. I just feel there should be something that entices me to buy the fatpack. 50% off of 25-50 colors most of which I will never use is not going to cut it.

And from events I regularly attend I notice a lot of the newer vendors to said events tend to charge higher prices than the regulars do and I question this also. I assume the regulars who have "been there done that" have figured out lower prices yield more sales and hence a higher total dollar amount than a high price does. And the newer vendors just haven't quite figured this out yet. Of course this is just an assumption. I obviously do not have any spreadsheets or data to back this up.

At an event I attended recently I first went to my favorites (like the people who are the reason I'm at the event to begin with) first then went around and basically insta-bought all the things I felt were reasonably priced. The higher priced items that I was interested in I placed in my mental shopping cart. I had already determined how much I wanted to spend at this event before attending and have already bought the lindens. After I bought all the insta-buys I went around to reconsider the rest of the items I wanted with what I had remaining. I have a screenshot of a folder I made of the things I bought in order but I am a tad embarrassed at how much I spent at said event xD.

As for the MP. I feel prices should be higher in the MP and even in store than what is listed when the item is released at an event. Sales in MP end up being higher over time but are also much slower than the initial boost in sales you get from an event (assuming it's a popular event that people actually attend). If someone spent say 2hours on a product then they should look to make 60-120 USD overall upon releasing it at an event depending on hour much they value their labor (most places I've worked for charge on average $60 per hour for labor or time). Anything they make over time extra to that on the MP or in store should be considered a bonus.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Finite