Suggetions on Mesh Avatar Issues. Neck problem or Clothes Don't Fit

[BobCates]

I'm finally working on getting a mesh avatar but ran into a couple of issues that I would like suggestions on.

After trying a few bodies and heads and struggling with some of the HUDs, I've decided to get a Belleza Jake body and a Logo Chase head.  Mainly because these are the HUDs that are most intuitive to me.  However, I ran into a couple of issues. 

Problem 1: Just using the Belleza Jake shape and body then putting on the Logo Chase head creates that neck problem where there's the line that shows.  The HUD that came with the Belleza Jake body does have a neck sheath setting that I turned on, but the neck issue is still noticeable.

Problem 2:  Clothes no longer fit.  The Logo Chase head directions say to start out with their shape provided then modify shape later to get a proper body head fit.  So, I tried that.  Used their shape to start, then imported the shape of Belleza Jake, then used a separate skin and it looked good. No neck line issue.  But now, the clothes don't fit.  I"m assuming because now this really isn't the Belleza Jake body anymore but only the shape.

Suggestions?  I have have to live with the neck issue is I can't find a good solution.  For problem 2,  do certain mesh clothes only fit certain bodies? Or is there "generic" mesh clothes that would fit different bodies? 

Thanks.

 

 

[Emma Krokus]

Have you given the free Apricot Paws neck fix a try?

There's a BOM version in this too.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Apricot-Paws-SLUV-Neck-ExtenderFix-Freebie/14958878

Emma  

[Rowan Amore]

36 minutes ago, BobCates said:

I'm finally working on getting a mesh avatar but ran into a couple of issues that I would like suggestions on.

After trying a few bodies and heads and struggling with some of the HUDs, I've decided to get a Belleza Jake body and a Logo Chase head.  Mainly because these are the HUDs that are most intuitive to me.  However, I ran into a couple of issues. 

Problem 1: Just using the Belleza Jake shape and body then putting on the Logo Chase head creates that neck problem where there's the line that shows.  The HUD that came with the Belleza Jake body does have a neck sheath setting that I turned on, but the neck issue is still noticeable.

Problem 2:  Clothes no longer fit.  The Logo Chase head directions say to start out with their shape provided then modify shape later to get a proper body head fit.  So, I tried that.  Used their shape to start, then imported the shape of Belleza Jake, then used a separate skin and it looked good. No neck line issue.  But now, the clothes don't fit.  I"m assuming because now this really isn't the Belleza Jake body anymore but only the shape.

Suggestions?  I have have to live with the neck issue is I can't find a good solution.  For problem 2,  do certain mesh clothes only fit certain bodies? Or is there "generic" mesh clothes that would fit different bodies? 

Thanks.

 

 

The clothing should fit if it's made for the Jake body.  There is NO generic mesh that fits all bodies that I'm aware of.  Some clothing made for one body MIGHT come close to fitting another but generally, it doesn't.  Most of the mesh clothing you would have been wearing on your system avatar is probably marked L, XL and such.  That's not fit to any mesh body.

[Marianne Little]

It sounds like you haven't found the alpha cuts or know how to use them.

Very few male clothes fit without help from alphas to turn the body invisible.

Some clothes have a script in them to do this when you put them on, but it appears that you have not found such clothes yet.

Even if Belleza has a lot of support, the neck fit has always been problematic. And the bodies are not updated as soon as new things comes on the market.

You should take some pictures and post them here, we can perhaps come with some neck advice.

If you read the "Free Lelutka heads!" thread, you will find many images of the free heads. At the end, it is also posted a free gift skin for males that is very attractive.

It is lots of tutorials out there. Try to read some of Skell Dagger's tutorials. BoM (Bakes on mesh) is the future for invisible neck seams. The tutorial Activating Bakes on Mesh on your mesh head and body

show you how to turn on BoM on your body parts. It is also a part "Troubleshooting" at the end of the tutorial, covering the most known problems. And also, Bakes on Mesh ‘for Dummies’

http://www.virtualbloke.com/tutorials

[Lewis Luminos]

2 hours ago, BobCates said:

Problem 1: Just using the Belleza Jake shape and body then putting on the Logo Chase head creates that neck problem where there's the line that shows.  The HUD that came with the Belleza Jake body does have a neck sheath setting that I turned on, but the neck issue is still noticeable.

Problem 2:  Clothes no longer fit.  The Logo Chase head directions say to start out with their shape provided then modify shape later to get a proper body head fit.  So, I tried that.  Used their shape to start, then imported the shape of Belleza Jake, then used a separate skin and it looked good. No neck line issue.  But now, the clothes don't fit.  I"m assuming because now this really isn't the Belleza Jake body anymore but only the shape.

Neck fit - The LOGO head should fit the Jake body, but if you're using one of the default skins from either the head or the body, or both, they are not going to match. You need to get a skin that matches head and body, either an all-in-one BOM skin or separate head and body skins from the same store in the same tone. If you have done that, and it still doesn't match, check both the head and the body for shine/glossiness. If these are set differently on one or the other, then it's going to look different, especially in default region light or mid-day.

If you're going Bakes-on-Mesh, you will need to pick up the free relay from the Belleza store for Jake. They haven't added the functionality to the hud yet (and probably never will). Logo comes with BOM turned on by default, IIRC.

Clothing - mesh bodies are all pretty specific and if you wear the Jake body, you'll mostly need to wear clothes made for Jake. Sometimes standard sizes will work, such as outfits with long sleeves and long pants, you can just use the hud to alpha-out all the sections that show through. so for something like a suit, or jeans with a long-sleeved sweater, just about any size will do. It doesn't matter what shape you wear with a body; both the body and the fitmesh clothes made for it will adjust to fit any shape. However, standard -size clothes (those labelled "S, M, L" etc) are fixed size and do not adjust, so wear the size that's closest. I often fine-tune my shape when I'm wearing standard size clothing. I often have to make my shoulders a bit narrower and reduce torso muscle (but that's a Gianni thing, it's a bulkier body than Jake).

[BobCates]

Thanks for the various suggestions thus far.  So much to learn.  I will have to tinker around a little more later with the suggestions(can't at this moment....darn RL getting in the way with SL) like the Apricot neck fit and alpha cuts.  I know alpha cuts is part of my body's HUD.

 

 

[BobCates]

22 minutes ago, Lewis Luminos said:

that's a Gianni thing, it's a bulkier body than Jake

While we are on Gianni here's a total simple question that hopefully you can answer.  To get around that neck issue with my Jake body and Logo head, I thought about just using a Gianni (either of the two guys, bulky or not) body and head since the head is built for the body (no neck seam).  But using looking at the HUDs' beard settings.  I didn't see away to have no beard?  Is that true?  I was surprised to see no option to have no facial hair.

[Lewis Luminos]

6 hours ago, BobCates said:

While we are on Gianni here's a total simple question that hopefully you can answer.  To get around that neck issue with my Jake body and Logo head, I thought about just using a Gianni (either of the two guys, bulky or not) body and head since the head is built for the body (no neck seam).  But using looking at the HUDs' beard settings.  I didn't see away to have no beard?  Is that true?  I was surprised to see no option to have no facial hair.

Unfortunately I can't give specific help, I did not buy the Signature head as well, only the body. I use a Catwa head. 

However, facial hair on mesh heads generally occurs in one of two three ways.

1) It's "painted" on the skin itself. This, you will not be able to get rid of, but it's nothing to do with the head. Changing the skin is the way to fix that. Changing the head won't help in this case, unless you are also changing the skin.

2) It's an applier layer on the head (or a tattoo layer if you are using BOM). These can be removed, either by using the Hud (there will be an option to clear the applier layer, if present) or by detaching the system "tattoo".

3) Mesh beards, that are worn as an attachment, which is clearly not the case here.

My bet would be on #1 - that the Signature head comes by default with skins that happen to exclude a clean-shaven option, in which case all you would need to do is find a skin that looks the way you want it to, and use that instead of the default ones. 

[BobCates]

4 hours ago, Lewis Luminos said:

Unfortunately I can't give specific help, I did not buy the Signature head as well, only the body. I use a Catwa head. 

No prob.  I misunderstood and thought you got a Signature head as well.

As for my mesh avatar situation, since I'm still learning (though I did actually buy the Jake body and Logo head as thought I was ready to create), now I may go the BOM route instead.  Not 100% sure but would be nice to not have to concern myself with alphas and appliers.

So, I get a free BOM LeLUTKA head, the Jake BOM HUD and tried.   First attempt not good as looks like I have the system avatar skin.

But now I'm confused as to how and where to get a skin that works for my LeLUTA head and Jake Body.   Assuming I get BOM to work.    What am I looking for?  a BOM skin?  A skin that matches my head's name? An all in one type skin that matches my head's name and the Jake body?  Puzzling to me as I don't expect I'd got to a store inworld and run into a display showing skin for Jake Body and LeLUTA Alain head.

I've included a picture of my try (if can be called that still with system avatar skin).

Edited December 15, 2020 by BobCates

[Lewis Luminos]

OK yes, applying Bakes on Mesh does apply the system skin, so you need to get one of those. There are some in the Library (from the starter avatars in the Clothing section) which you can use to test it out, otherwise you'll need to buy one.

I can see that you've successfully converted the body to BOM, but you haven't done so with the head yet. The brown part is your underlying system head, the white part is the plain mesh head, without any texture on it at all yet. 

To do that, wear the Lelutka hud, click on the top item in the menu (looks like a face) and then click on where it says "BAKES ON MESH" at the top. This will apply your system texture (the brown part) onto the mesh (white part), while at the same time making the system part disappear.

I've circled in red the parts of the HUD that you need to look for.

 

[Marianne Little]

4 hours ago, BobCates said:

No prob.  I misunderstood and thought you got a Signature head as well.

As for my mesh avatar situation, since I'm still learning (though I did actually buy the Jake body and Logo head as thought I was ready to create), now I may go the BOM route instead.  Not 100% sure but would be nice to not have to concern myself with alphas and appliers.

So, I get a free BOM LeLUTKA head, the Jake BOM HUD and tried.   First attempt not good as looks like I have the system avatar skin.

But now I'm confused as to how and where to get a skin that works for my LeLUTA head and Jake Body.   Assuming I get BOM to work.    What am I looking for?  a BOM skin?  A skin that matches my head's name? An all in one type skin that matches my head's name and the Jake body?  Puzzling to me as I don't expect I'd got to a store inworld and run into a display showing skin for Jake Body and LeLUTA Alain head.

I've included a picture of my try (if can be called that still with system avatar skin).

Your head has had BoM turned off some way, so the head is the white parts, and the newbie skin the flesh colored parts. It looks like the body has a newbie skin and you have successfully turned on BoM. The newbie skin is a low quality and the nipples does not line up.

Head skins and body skins is sold separately. In a store like Stray dog, you pick a demo for the head you like who has the Lelutka Evo tag. Then you turn around and look to the left side of the entrance. You will see the body skins. Pick a demo for Belleza Jake.

To play with a free alternative, look at this post:

"It's a BoM skin in a single tone, with the head on a system skin and the body on tattoo layers."

Image 1, starter avatar Greg.

Wear Belleza Jake and the Lelutka head. You have already done that, and it looks like you have BoM on the body.

Wear from the "Alain" folder: Shape.LeLUTKA.Default.Alain, LeLUTKA.Head.Alain.2.5, LeLUTKA.HUD.2.5., LeLUTKA.Teeth.2.5(m), LeLUTKA.Eyes.2.5, Alpha.Mask (BOM Head/Body, APPLIER Eyes)

From the Clef de Peau gift skin: Wear the Clef de Peau.Jamie TXM. Then add Clef de Peau.Body Tight TXM [JAKE]. Then wear Jamie.Brows Shape (Alain 2.5)(brown "cap" symbol) that is made for Lelutka Evo Alain.

You should now look like image 2.

Go back to the Lelutka folder Alain. Add one of the LeLUTKA.Base.Brows.Alain.. Model is using 004. The Lelutka HUD is a small circle. Open the eye side (Eye symbol) and change eye color if you wish, Model has changed to dark brown. Add LeLUTKA.HD Beard.Alain.2.5 and LeLUTKA.HD Beard.HUD.2.5. Set the beard you want. Model is using dark brown. Unpack Lelutka hairbases. Model is wearing LeLUTKA.Hairbase.002.Brown (m).

You should now look like image 3.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2020 by Marianne Little
changed a typo and added a few words

[Marianne Little]

Lewis has already told you where to turn on BoM, so I don't have to do that.

Neck issues: It is because it is a Belleza body, and they are slow to update.

Using a lighter windlight setting (Nams skin and prim) helps a bit. Image 1 with Belleza body. It is still a difference.

Signature has a better neck fit. I wonder if this is as god as it get. SL is also depending on graphic card quality. I am on a laptop now. We can talk about using materials or not, but as I said... Belleza is slow with updates. I do not think tinting or other tricks can make their neck better.

 

 

 

[Marianne Little]

When you feel secure about using your head and body, you may want to change your look. You will find items that's tattoo beards instead of HD beards. You need to take off the LeLUTKA.HD Beard.Alain.2.5 and add the tattoo beard. You may buy eyes that has an eye symbol instead of a box (applier). To use these, find the page in the Lelutka Hud with the eyes and click on Bakes on Mesh. The model is wearing eyes that's not for sale anymore, they are grey/blue and named Ellis_Sleet.

The model decided to be a bit different than the darkhaired clones that walk around. 9 of 10 SL men go for the same color, dark brown or black. He unpacked the "Unpack.LeLUTKA.BOM.AddOns (m)" from the Alain head and added LeLUTKA.Freckles.001. He is also using a different, lighter hairbase and hair from Stealthic and eyebrows and beards from Clef de Peau.

It is possible to change even more with the shape sliders under appearance. Remember to work on a copy of the shape, so you can always go back if you feel you messed up too much.

 

[BobCates]

5 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

Head skins and body skins is sold separately. In a store like Stray dog, you pick a demo for the head you like who has the Lelutka Evo tag. Then you turn around and look to the left side of the entrance. You will see the body skins. Pick a demo for Belleza Jake.

I want to make sure I understand this correctly.  So, right now I have a Belleza Jake and a LeLUTKA Alain.

If I got to a store like Stray dog, I'd get the demo for Belleza Jake, but the do I look for 1) a demo head for LeLUTA Alain or 2) any head with the Lelutka Evo tag

If (1) and they don't carry an Alain, then I'd probably need another head to make things work or wait and hope they eventually get an Alain.  Correct?

Thanks to everyone in advance for the tips.   I appreciate.

 

[ClariceRose]

21 hours ago, BobCates said:

While we are on Gianni here's a total simple question that hopefully you can answer.  To get around that neck issue with my Jake body and Logo head, I thought about just using a Gianni (either of the two guys, bulky or not) body and head since the head is built for the body (no neck seam).  But using looking at the HUDs' beard settings.  I didn't see away to have no beard?  Is that true?  I was surprised to see no option to have no facial hair.

The Signature head is ugly, don't waste the money. 

[ClariceRose]

37 minutes ago, BobCates said:

I want to make sure I understand this correctly.  So, right now I have a Belleza Jake and a LeLUTKA Alain.

If I got to a store like Stray dog, I'd get the demo for Belleza Jake, but the do I look for 1) a demo head for LeLUTA Alain or 2) any head with the Lelutka Evo tag

If (1) and they don't carry an Alain, then I'd probably need another head to make things work or wait and hope they eventually get an Alain.  Correct?

Thanks to everyone in advance for the tips.   I appreciate.

 

Look for Lelutka Evo demos for the head. For the body, it's separate and it's near the entrance, you'd get a Belleza Jake demo.

If you need help, do a search for NCI Kuula in places. Teleport there and ask in local if someone is available to help you. It's a help center with volunteers. 

 

 

[BobCates]

7 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

Head skins and body skins is sold separately. In a store like Stray dog, you pick a demo for the head you like who has the Lelutka Evo tag. Then you turn around and look to the left side of the entrance. You will see the body skins. Pick a demo for Belleza Jake.

I can't find much at Stray dog.  All I see is a small stand (shown to the left of me, I"m in the red shorts) and there's about 6 head skin models to choose from.  I didn't see a clear Lelutka Evo tag but looking in the inventory there is Letlutka.   As for the body skins, I get lost in the store.  All I see are signs with faces and appliers and to the left of me are a couple of skin appliers.  Think I may need  someone to drag me around the store to find stuff or at least someone please show a picture of what I'm too look for. Otherwise, I'd be stuck in a maze.  I asked in open chat where is the skin demo and nobody replied.

On the bright side, I did get my BOM head to look okay with Lewis' suggestion.  I didn't click on the face icon early, only on the Bakes on Mesh label.

[Lewis Luminos]

2 hours ago, BobCates said:

I want to make sure I understand this correctly.  So, right now I have a Belleza Jake and a LeLUTKA Alain.

If I got to a store like Stray dog, I'd get the demo for Belleza Jake, but the do I look for 1) a demo head for LeLUTA Alain or 2) any head with the Lelutka Evo tag

If (1) and they don't carry an Alain, then I'd probably need another head to make things work or wait and hope they eventually get an Alain.  Correct?

Thanks to everyone in advance for the tips.   I appreciate.

 

It would be a head skin that you're looking for, not a head.  And yes, any skin made for any Lelutka EVO head will do, it doesn't need to be made for Alain specifically. Some skins made for other brands may work too, as long as they have Bakes on mesh layers, but ymmv if its not specifically an EVO skin. Even old classic (pre-mesh) skins will work - that skin I'm wearing in my pic above was made in about 2012 and the only real issue with it is that the eyebrows are too low.

The reason is that each head-maker maps the heads slightly differently so some details like the position of the nostrils, eyebrows, eye corners, ears and the edge of the lips will vary slightly from one head to another. But all heads from the same brand range will use the same map as each other, so they don't need to be so specific that only Alain (for example) will do.

[Marianne Little]

3 hours ago, BobCates said:

I want to make sure I understand this correctly.  So, right now I have a Belleza Jake and a LeLUTKA Alain.

If I got to a store like Stray dog, I'd get the demo for Belleza Jake, but the do I look for 1) a demo head for LeLUTA Alain or 2) any head with the Lelutka Evo tag

If (1) and they don't carry an Alain, then I'd probably need another head to make things work or wait and hope they eventually get an Alain.  Correct?

Thanks to everyone in advance for the tips.   I appreciate.

 

Yes, any skin for the head with the Lelutka Evo tag.

It should be many by the entrance, almost all his newest content is for Lelutka Evo.

 

[Chic Aeon]

Just wanted to add since I did a LOT of testing with skins this last week that having a head BOM skin say it is for Lelutka Evo really doesn't help.  For me and MANY MANY tries the skins "made" for Lelutka Evo didn't work any better at all. I ended up with a 7DS skin that was built for Genus and it was MUCH better than the skins (from various makers) that had the Lelutka Evo tag on them.

 

So once again we can all sing the chorus TRY THE DEMOS which of course the OP is doing. Clap. Clap.   Also important and mentioned often but not here ---- not all skin makers update their body skins at the same time as there head skins. So there can be some discrepancy  between neck and body JUST in the skin itself. You cat test out if a skin is "correct" by wearing it on your default non-mesh body (which of course you would be doing anyway with BOM).  So taking OFF the body and head and just seeing the skin will let you know if the skin itself is correct.  

 

AND (yes the whole body thing is very complex) sometimes the head and body just don't fit well together (I am guessing it has to do with the directions of the vertices of the mesh which don't match.  And for that there is no fix other than the creators fixing it.  There have been some very nice all in one (head with body) avatars (some for free but not sure there are any good ones available at the moment) at altamura.  Those have perfectly seamless skins at the neck. The downside of course is that there is very little made for altamura avatars. So clothes shopping is tedious. 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2020 by Chic Aeon
spelling

[BobCates]

13 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

From the Clef de Peau gift skin: Wear the Clef de Peau.Jamie TXM. Then add Clef de Peau.Body Tight TXM [JAKE]. Then wear Jamie.Brows Shape (Alain 2.5)(brown "cap" symbol) that is made for Lelutka Evo Alain

I'm trying to along with the instructions but  where to I TP to go get the Clef de Peau gift skin?

I tried to follow the Free LeLUTA Head thread but only see conversations, not an actually TP link or anything.

NOTE:  Oh, I joined the Clef group and got the TP location.  🙂

 

Edited December 15, 2020 by BobCates
Found the TP location.

[Chic Aeon]

Join Lelutka and you will find the landmark.  Only ten people when I took my alt today :D.

[BobCates]

17 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

"It's a BoM skin in a single tone, with the head on a system skin and the body on tattoo layers."

Image 1, starter avatar Greg.

Wear Belleza Jake and the Lelutka head. You have already done that, and it looks like you have BoM on the body.

Wear from the "Alain" folder: Shape.LeLUTKA.Default.Alain, LeLUTKA.Head.Alain.2.5, LeLUTKA.HUD.2.5., LeLUTKA.Teeth.2.5(m), LeLUTKA.Eyes.2.5, Alpha.Mask (BOM Head/Body, APPLIER Eyes)

From the Clef de Peau gift skin: Wear the Clef de Peau.Jamie TXM. Then add Clef de Peau.Body Tight TXM [JAKE]. Then wear Jamie.Brows Shape (Alain 2.5)(brown "cap" symbol) that is made for Lelutka Evo Alain.

You should now look like image 2.

Go back to the Lelutka folder Alain. Add one of the LeLUTKA.Base.Brows.Alain.. Model is using 004. The Lelutka HUD is a small circle. Open the eye side (Eye symbol) and change eye color if you wish, Model has changed to dark brown. Add LeLUTKA.HD Beard.Alain.2.5 and LeLUTKA.HD Beard.HUD.2.5. Set the beard you want. Model is using dark brown. Unpack Lelutka hairbases. Model is wearing LeLUTKA.Hairbase.002.Brown (m).

You should now look like image 3.

I went ahead and followed your instructions step by step  (yay!).    This is a great starting point for me.

I do like how with BOM I avoid having to use the alpha layers and skin appliers.

Thanks to everyone for all their tips and suggestions.  They were a big help! 

[BobCates]

Hi,

Just as a follow up, I decided to use what I learned here (thanks again!) and last night tried again with my original Jake body/Logo Head combo.

Ended up quite happy with the result.  The look is more of what my non-mesh avatar looked like, just better now 🙂.

The BOM automatically handled the head/body color match well.  Plus I even was able to get the neck seam less noticeable.

[Marianne Little]

Very good! The "splayed fingers" is another of the quirks the Belleza body has.

I do not know if you have an Animation override? An AO replaces the default stands and walks with other movements. The new AO's made to be used with mesh avatars is marked "Bento". They animate the fingers too. I have low budget suggestions, if you need them. But if money isn't an issue it is just to go to any AO store and demo them.

The splayed fingers issue can come back when you log out and in again. Reset the AO.

Edited December 17, 2020 by Marianne Little