Aethelwine

Being subject to opinion is not insurmountable, after all the test for whether something should or shouldn't be changed is ultimately the bottom line... whether the change increases revenue or reduces it. There are mainland policies that amount to a covenant https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Mainland_policies A fairly limited one, but it does exist.

Indeed, but there have been a number of problems raised on the thread and there are more about the way mainland works. Perhaps to say it is broken goes too far.... but there are a number of perversities to the way mainland works that are limiting. Discussing potential solutions the pluses and the minuses worthwhile. If that includes changing the covenant then, balancing reactions is obviously important. It is however possible the Terms of Service are explicit that the mainland covenant can change if Linden Lab wants it to, it even mentions the possibility of rezoning land, that in itself is not the barrier. The barrier is the scale of reaction does the positive outweigh the negatives? The answer to that will depend on the change being implemented.... in some cases reaction will be over all negative... but perhaps there are changes that will be over all positive too.

A proposition that doesn't appear to have a solution, doesn't seem to be a very good one.

Well my point above this addresses the point I was making to you perhaps more clearly. In my original post the one immediately before the one of yours that you reply to, I say I don't agree with everything Animats said. One of the things I don't agree with would be restricting screens to 4m height. I use screens to a limited extent myself.. I have some alpha bamboo screens I use on a couple of parcels, one to break up the concrete bunker next to me that extends up 30 or 40m right up to boundary line of my parcel. In another case I use them around the edges of a dance area to hide in a relatively tasteful way my surroundings. Which include full bright prim modernist structure full of glass and bdsm pictures and not on Zindra.... but behind closed door... just clearly visible in expansive glass covered front of the building. I probably could report it, I don't think the owner has been online in 10 years anyway but my palm tree screen sufficient. I like to think people will get that by building in keeping with their neighbours their land and enjoyment of their parcel will be improved, but I am not in favour of Governance taking on a fashion police role.

Well I know Prok complains about GTFO hubs, and I am sure they are not alone in doing that. Their proliferation also indicates how a lot of people like them so much they want their own too. You said there would be some obvious metric if there was a desire for a more restrictive covenant on mainland. You haven't expressed what metric you are expecting to see. The first metric I can think of would be proliferation of GTFO indicating people that want to not just travel but also play their trading game whilst doing it. Another metric might be the survey done admittedly some time ago about security settings on mainland... where if I recall correctly the number of parcels with orbs or banlines was under 5%. It certainly seems low and probably lower now... But what metric are you thinking of if not these? You said it should be obvious... but it isn't obvious if you don't explain what test you are applying and expecting to see.

It has nothing to do with controlling what people can build. If I had any interest in controlling what people build then I would have said so.

Where as i would say they do. I can't quote figures but they would seem likely to increase land values too by providing community facilities even if just coffee, seating and rezzing.

Whilst places like the East River Community have gone the land owners replacing them have so far subscribed to a similar ethos. There don't seem to be many regions now without GT FO hubs on them built in the last few years. You are not looking in the right places if you are not seeing thriving and healthy investments in mainland for Community building purposes.

Like with the difference in land values? That clearly show the value of land with high quality access to transport routes. What other feedback mechanism are you thinking of?

Mainland also exists for people that want to live in a community not bound by restrictions they find elsewhere. Bellisseria is great but you can't sell from there, you are restricted by what buildings you put out or having no buildings at all. Mainland is not solely a product for people that don't want a covenant. People enjoy Mainland for the creativity, the freedom to explore, connectivity and sense of community unavailable elsewhere. There are alternative options, like private estates connected to mainland for boats, but they too have restrictions often strange ones that are not to everyone's tastes - Seychelles for example has a bizarre rule on not allowing autoreturn. The availability of those options don't address the issue anyway. In my experience the forum has a very different view on this topic to the view common on mainland that people feel restricted by the lack of a covenant, like Bellisseria. Although they don't want all that covenant because they want to see businesses, they want to have tip jars, they enjoy the diversity of builds and creativity. The value of land around roads and waterways is very dependent on what neighbours have done. Derendering isn't an option when the problem is oppressive security elsewhere along the protected route. It is why land has less value the further along a river way you are and away from open water. Consider the different value between land adjacent to the Sea of fables and land up near the Linden Village, or along the North edge of Corsica compared to that along the South next to the open water. Another problem are resources you can buy the perfect spot only for a busy community hub to arrive in the opposite corner that regularly attracts 30 to 40 avatars so you can't always rely on being able to bring a friend home. A neighbour can knock LS100,000 value off your land by what they put on it. Mainland might not be totally broke, but it does have problems that often make buying land an expensive gamble. I don't fully agree with Animats on the specifics but in general I think there is much more desire for additional rules or better interpretation of existing rules and enforcement of them than people on the forum tend to give credit too.

I don't have need for a "boat keeper", because it is rare I feel any need to leave my boat behind whilst I go exploring. In the past I have used Radegast viewer for my alt, you don't really get any more lightweight than that, but there is no real need to go that light at least not on my current PC it happily runs two instances of firestorm without issue.

I haven't used the Linden viewer in a long time. All I can say for sure is it didn't. To keep your boat rezzed whilst you go exploring you can sit an alt account on it as a "boat keeper". There might be other tricks but that is the one I know of.

As well as NE corners many of the islands have rezz areas. Showing parcel boundaries is a great tool for finding them. On a TPV r-click the minimap to find the option under "show" on firestorm.

I am glad it is not just me that had this pop up. It hasn't generated much comment on the forum. I wonder if it is a trial or some sort of test at the moment?

I just had a Feedback pop up whilst browsing the forums. It asked me to rate whether I wanted quarterly premiums to come back on a scale of 5 to 1 with 5 being a must.. I didn't know they had gone, but always gone annual anyway so answered 3 which I took to be indifferent. Next Question was something to do with Starter premium membership... Which had me stumped, not heard of that before so I did a search to see if it brought anything up... and no nothing atleast not with expression in quote marks... But now the pop up thing has gone anyway. So forum feedback on this feature is questions could be clearer, as I don't really know what they are asking... and secondly could be more patient to give opportunity to actually answer them. Was I hallucinating? it is about my bed time.

Tall ships good too..

Maybe in some cases, but certainly not always and unlikely to be in examples that have happened. I do find the rule odd. Gratuities are almost by definition non-commercial because they are tax free. Whereas the alternative of paying for a Dj to run without tips is. But that might be cultural perception. It is what it is though, but is a barrier to bringing mainland events to Bellisseria.

For flying there is always the Pirate chicken airship... And the good old Terra Stingray.... flies nicely.... and works as a submersible too

Well the Mudskipper ATV works well on roads and rivers... I love to take it around the trads and houseboats areas can easily swap between land and water, inclines are no problem. On water I love the rivers around the Trads area and often start at Campwich because it is a short walk from a trailer I have. Ideal for a bandit 170 for motoring... Or a Bandit If for sailing....

I am curious to know more about what was there. A quick Google search has brought up this reference. https://lindenlab.wordpress.com/2006/05/16/volunteers-working-together/ It would be interesting to know more about it.

Another suggestion for things to do is to go exploring motorcycle club regions. On most you will find a board advertising a hundred or so regions set up with multilevel roads and places on them to explore.

There are many more cruises than just the LCC Sunday 1pm cruise. You can find most of them and boat races (regattas) advertised in the Secondlife Sailing Association (SLSA) group. I have a slow internet connection, so I get used to managing lag. If you try to keep out the crowds, keep your draw distance within limits of your bandwidth and graphics driver (I usually run with 160m draw distance), keep scripts you are wearing low then you should find them more enjoyable. I love sailing cruises so much I am involved in running 4 separate groups cruises each week.

You got it ! Your turn now.

I have got my old Isetta out and crossing a river going in to the tunnel through the tunnel: and out the other side: But where am I ?

It is of course, Kingpost