Tipping DJs in Bellisseria

[diamond Marchant]

Second Life might be described as "a sandbox game with dancing". For twenty years, a fundamental aspect of our second life has been enjoying the performances of DJs and musicians. We show our appreciation for their efforts with praise and tips, which are optional, not required.

For the past four years, DJs have been been treated differently in Bellisseria compared to mainland, which actually diminishes Bellisseria. I suggest that they should be treated the SAME in both places (including residential regions).

The covenant says "Activities and items that could be construed by Linden Lab as commercial and for profit are not permitted in the residential homes and houseboats in Bellisseria."

In The New Linden Homes Update Post , @Patch Linden clarifies by writing "if it feels commercial, then you probably shouldn’t be doing it...What you may not do is put up signage on the parcel that advertises it, your store, brand, redirect people away from the home for purchases, etc.  You can not sell items off your parcel."

When a resident tips a DJ, it's a SOCIAL convention, not commercial. It is giving back. It is appreciating. It is supporting their work.

The essence of commercialism is REQUIRED payment. Tipping is optional. This is a fundamental difference.

Concerning governance, @Abnor Mole has posted "We don't want residents turning their residential homes into commercial clubs with tipjars or donations kiosks". I find it arbitrary and speculative to deny tipjars because they might trigger commercial sprawl. This is a GOVERNANCE issue. Any build that violates covenant (e.g. out-of-theme, overuse of resources) should be remedied by governance action.

In summary, I suggest that the Bellisseria covenant be amended to contain language similar to this.

Residents may tip DJs and musical performers either directly or via objects (e.g. tip jars) as long as such payments are optional, that is, not required.

[Gemma Cleanslate]

I feel that Diamond is right that tipping djs on Bellisseria should be considered . They do expend money for their music and stream and time. Since they are premium members most likely I do not think they are taking advantage of their homes to make money.   If I am wrong I think that attendees at their home events would  catch on fast and just stop going there. I believe it is a SOCIAL convention also. Anything people tip will not be much of a gain to call it commercial. 

I hope some language can be developed that will satisfy all. 

[Nika Talaj]

Everyone is free to simply give money to Belli performers and hosts directly.    People should. 

Belli's non-commercial aspect is a big plus to me - not to see tip jars, not to see their hovertext, not to see the more chatty ones attempting to coerce payment by blaring out the latest contribution in local chat.  

If people are allowed to put tip jars out at their homes, more homes will become clubs.  Tip jars will stay out during the many hours of the week that home owners are not DJing.  Advertising signage that also collect "tips" will follow.  Calendars to let passersby know when DJ HipTwitch spins here. 

If LL allows this form of commercialism, why not charity donation kiosks?   Not the ones that sell things, just the kind that collect donations, very much like tips, right? Harmless!  But, frankly, it is a relief to me to have this ONE estate in SL that isn't plastered with RFL kiosks.

I'd really like LL to hold the non-commercial line on this question.

[Love Zhaoying]

7 minutes ago, Nika Talaj said:

Everyone is free to simply give money to Belli performers and hosts directly.    People should. 

I like this. Tip Jars don't really serve a purpose (if the performer is present), except to "give the 'house' a cut".

[diamond Marchant]

40 minutes ago, Nika Talaj said:

it is a relief to me to have this ONE estate in SL that isn't plastered with RFL kiosks.

It does not follow that tip jars will lead to RFL kiosks. The American Cancer Society is a 501(c)(3) non-profit corporation with a highly paid executive suite.  Feels commercial to me.

40 minutes ago, Nika Talaj said:

more homes will become clubs

Speculative and if that is a problem, governance can provide a remedy.

32 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Tip Jars don't really serve a purpose (if the performer is present), except to "give the 'house' a cut".

I disagree. A tip jar suggests that the house is not paying for the entertainment. In all my years of hosting parties, I have never skimmed a DJ.

The situation I am promoting is allowing a resident to have occasional parties with a DJ. I am not promoting clubs. The covenant language can make it clear that "party builds"  including tip jar should be temporary... not permanent as would be the case for a club.

Edited April 20, 2023 by diamond Marchant

[Aethelwine]

1 hour ago, Nika Talaj said:

Everyone is free to simply give money to Belli performers and hosts directly.    People should. 

Belli's non-commercial aspect is a big plus to me - not to see tip jars, not to see their hovertext, not to see the more chatty ones attempting to coerce payment by blaring out the latest contribution in local chat.  

If people are allowed to put tip jars out at their homes, more homes will become clubs.  Tip jars will stay out during the many hours of the week that home owners are not DJing.  Advertising signage that also collect "tips" will follow.  Calendars to let passersby know when DJ HipTwitch spins here. 

If LL allows this form of commercialism, why not charity donation kiosks?   Not the ones that sell things, just the kind that collect donations, very much like tips, right? Harmless!  But, frankly, it is a relief to me to have this ONE estate in SL that isn't plastered with RFL kiosks.

I'd really like LL to hold the non-commercial line on this question.

Until you mentioned it it had never occurred to me that RFL tip booths would be covered by rules on Commercial activity.

In the UK the economy is divided in to sectors. The first sector being commercial, the second sector public and the third sector charities and not for profits.

[Persephone Emerald]

Personally, I'd like to allow tip jars for charity donations too. I love that some Premium members use their Linden Homes for art galleries, coffee shops, etc. I don't see the harm in allowing 1 tip jar with no floating text and no local chat.

[Love Zhaoying]

"Tipping DJ's"..

..is like "cow tipping"? Sneak up on your DJ and push them over when they are asleep!

Recalling a sign that says, "TIPPING IS NOT A CITY IN CHINA"..

 

[diamond Marchant]

1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Tip Jars don't really serve a purpose (if the performer is present), except to "give the 'house' a cut".

Two more thing to consider about tip jars.... (sorry)

1. In residential regions (and prior to March 30, 2023, everywhere... including the Fairgrounds), giving money to a DJ  by any means is a likely covenant violation, as the covenant says only "Activities and items that could be construed by Linden Lab as commercial and for profit" and makes no mention of DJs or how they are paid.

2. In the past, the Second Life Birthday event, organized by Linden Lab, has been  "non-commercial" yet allowed DJs and other performers on Performance Stages to rez tip jars, establishing a precedent for tip jars in "non-commercial" areas and confirming this practice as a NORM.

Edited April 20, 2023 by diamond Marchant

[Nika Talaj]

17 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said:

1. In residential regions (and prior to March 30, 2023, everywhere... including the Fairgrounds), giving money to a DJ  by any means is a likely covenant violation

Now, THERE'S an entertaining absurdity!   LL is usually loathe to impose unenforceable restrictions, but hey, there's always a first time.  I suppose we should also look forward to a ban on marketplace transactions while in Bellisseria?

[diamond Marchant]

3 minutes ago, Nika Talaj said:

Now, THERE'S an entertaining absurdity!

Totally agree. It is absurd but the covenant says what it says. (I have no worries about marketplace as those transactions are not considered to be in world.)

[Abnor Mole]

As estate managers we have seen multiple instances of people attempting to turn their residential homes into clubs with tipjars, dance pads, and particle poofers; as well as fielded complaints about said clubs next to them. Allowing tipjars or donations in residential homes would not do anything but open the floodgates to an increased proliferation of this. 

We're giving them the opportunity to do so in community regions so they do not do it instead in their residential parcels.

I don't see this conversation going anywhere positive but trying to stir a pot.

[Love Zhaoying]

3 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said:

Totally agree. It is absurd but the covenant says what it says. (I have no worries about marketplace as those transactions are not considered to be in world.)

But what if the DJ isn't even on your parcel / in Belli? You're just paying them somewhere else for whatever happens to be playing on their stream, which your parcel happens to be set to. What then, huh? Huh?