Prokofy Neva

- It's not about "setting NVdia correctly". It's about a bug in their driver that has a hot fix, as Whirly explained in the other thread. - Um, I *AM* logged into the world, derp. This happens when I access a person's profile FROM INWORLD. Everybody who actually logs into SL more than once in a blue moon is totally aware of this annoyance. It's typical that someone on the forums would deny its existence. - The message is wrong. That's because I'm the owner of the land AND I have the right group on for that land, yet the dumb message says "The owner of this land does not allow..." because of THE NATURE OF MESH which should evoke a different message. - I don't care at all what Firestorm does. I'm pointing out an annoyance for my tenants that Firestorm and/or LL should do something about. - We're not talking about "a second or two". We're talking about five minutes after ONCE trying to log out the other way and waiting...waiting...waiting...and finally having to force-close the other way -- and also not by one click and waiting...waiting.... - The norms want to buy content AND have their groups and land work. It's not only about rental agents. It's also about club owners and others who need groups. Again, the people who actually log in and use groups, which would not be sandboxing forums-dwellers, get this and complain about it all the time.

1. Grey squares are back. Two even five minutes is not uncommon now to wait for the scene to load upon log-on or teleporting to another sim, especially one with lots of avatars already on it. 2. Huge delay on profiles opening -- you can't pay someone quickly, leading to rage sometimes on their part when they are waiting for a refund. The screen takes FOREVER to turn over, giving you one of those "wheels" and sometimes you crash before it finishes. 3. Lock-ups and crashes with this Nvidia graphics card thing. Why doesn't LL tell you about this? 4. You can't search names in groups. Pasting in someone's full name, even if you know they're in the group, produces "0" results. So you have to go slow -- type just one or two letters. That may not work. So you sort by alphabet and look through the list -- slowly. 5. Often, when you try to access someone's profile, you have to log into SL again to see it *while in the viewer*. That is really damn weird because...you're already logged in. 6. The mesh error is misleading -- it's not about "owner of the group doesn't allow" but mesh bouncing off mesh. Can't the Lindens just change this message? 7. SLURLs clicked on while logged in lead to check for latest version and open up a window -- sometimes lagging or crashing you. 8. When people try to change groups on Firestorm, even if upgraded to another role, they can't, because it is greyed out, forcing them to relog. Oh, you say, that's not the fault of LL, because on the regular viewer, that doesn't happen. But then I will come back to you wish this: why does LL allow on its servers viewers that can't perform standard operations like this? What isn't working/not accessed? Prove to me this is entirely Firestorm's fault, and I'll remove it from the list. 9. Groups don't load -- period. Yes, if you have 1,000 or more members, and/or 500,000 meters of land in a land group, you will have trouble getting the group to load, update, reflect changes, etc. Then...why doesn't LL just say "Look, this is the outer limit of group capacity, don't go over it." But they never do. I solve this problem by making more land groups, but it gets confusing. And I find that even groups with only 250 people and 100,000 meters won't load. 10. You can't log out of SL -- it just won't "let go". When it stops working, and offers you the chance to still view IMs, it just won't exit normally. You have to use the X out on the whole screen -- and that won't work, requiring reclicking a dozen times. I could add more, but let's stick to the top 10. If LL cared more about inworld businesses, which rely on all these features managing groups more than most people, they might eliminate some of this. But their main focus is content creation, and the bugs they fix tend to be related to those or exotic techie things that norms don't care about. Groups are really overdue for a fix-up. People could always use MORE groups. But before adding MORE capacity to have MORE groups, let's fix groups. Let's make it possible to put land and people in groups and search on their name, not have them lag out, have them be able to change roles if on Firestorm, etc.

@Whirly UPDATE - yes, it stopped working eventually, perhaps after 10 log-ins. It gave me the error message and wouldn't work. Now I'm trying to hotfix, and SL is loading again, but I'm mindful this may end in tears, too.

@CoffeeDujour it doesn't matter. You do realize, being a scientist, that either way, it could in theory deliver everything eventually?

@Qie No there aren't any scripts as I mentioned. I've scrolled through the whole thing -- no scripts. But this gives me an idea -- I'll take the block to an empty sandbox and try there, as this is a busy and crowded sim where I am, with the fishing game and my office. You've also had another brilliant idea -- which is to PUT a dispensing script in it where it will keep giving me at least one thing at a time randomly.

Thanks. I may try that when SL stops working again.

Well, here's some fun facts. Here's the graphics card and driver I just installed; keep in mind that the driver just before that one crashed SL too. GeForce Experience GeForce GTX 970 Version 3.13.1.30 Driver 397.31 Here's what LL says are minimum requirements and optimal versions: Minimum NVIDIA GeForce 6600 or better Maximum NVIDIA Graphics cards 9000 Series: 9600, 9800 200 Series: 275 GTX, 295 GTX Won't Run NVIDIA cards that report as a RIVA TNT or TNT2 NVIDIA cards that report as Quadro So in talking to the NVidia customer service, I found out that my card, number 970, is actually NEWER than the series 9600 that LL recommends. That doesn't seem to make sense -- why is something with less zeroes newer? But in the world of tech, they may have a fear of going up over 10000 to five digits or something, so they start the enumeration again. And hence, a nearly-unheard-of thing, me having a graphics card NEWER than their recommended optimal -- which usually I find I never get to before my computer itself dies. Usually I'm just in under the wire. Why? Because like legion of normal people, I buy my computers at Best Buy. I don't build it from New Egg and don't even buy parts in Koreatown and get a geek to build it. I just buy what is reasonably priced off the shelf from Best Buy because they have Geek Squad, which I know is sub-par, but it is cheap with the warranty. DataVision and Compu-Something uptown are far from my house, and I have got bad computers at those stores -- they all are guilty of taking returned broken computers and refurbishing them, which you sometimes discover. Best Buy more or less works. HOWEVER the problem is that the available Best Buys never have the specs that SL needs. Ever. You have to spend another $200 to get a graphics card to play SL, it's that picky. Then, because whatever Best Buy you got can't really take that graphics card, you have to buy a better fan to cool it. As it is, a year after purchase, even with cleaning with air cans, my computer often sounds like it is in a windstorm playing SL because really, the fan is probably wearing down or it is just "straining" to play SL even with this card. But come to find out, this card is "too new" for SL. The CS guy said it will play, but may have errors and crashes. I haven't tried the hot fix yet. BTW, over my THIRTEEN YEARS getting my PhD in computer engineering AKA playing/troubleshooting SL haha -- I have had ATI Radeon. I've had others. They all have problems. I have never had an optimal SL experience, ever. I wish Linden Lab sold computers already pre-set-up with what ACTUALLY WORKS TO PLAY THEIR GAME.

Yes, but all of these things were in DIFFERENT folders. So it would take dragging them mistakenly dozens or more times. It's not even the case that these were "all" in that one mega folder with sub-folders that I once had, which is now my LOST INVENTORY. They were in different folders, some from the makers. Yes, I realize folders disappear after dragging, or at least others claim this. But the items were in different master folders. So it makes no sense that they were all dragged mistakenly so many times. And again -- there is no script, not ctr usage -- but no opening up of edit either. In order to "mistakenly drag," you still have to consciously open up a prim, if it has no "receive objects" script, and in edit mode, drag something to it. I'd have no reason to open up a big block that was the floor of an office. The only reason I noticed it later was because I was fiddling with its numbers in edit mode. Then I happened to look at the contents, and said "WOW". Furthermore, I will remind you the conditions of the other mishap: 1) a gatcha item removed from its box and put inworld once. 2) that item -- a desk -- was returned to inventory. 3) It was then re-rezzed in world, and I noticed then it had items inside of it. 4) I couldn't possibly have put those items in that desk. Any item rezzed on or near that desk, or dragged from inventory "mistakenly" while doing that room on that sim, was NOT what wa inside that desk. 5) Instead, what was inside that desk was a set of vacuum cleaners, all from the maker's folder, which were rezzed months ago on another sim, in another house, and not re-rezzed again or accessed again, such as to be "mistakenly" dragged. So again, if you don't open up a prim to "edit" and don't drag in deliberately or even "mistakenly," you have to remain curious as to how prims get inside another object. And the hypothesis is that they get there by jumbling on a server.

So I *just installed the other day* an update to my GeForce driver because SL was crashing with kernel messages and whatnot. I was just logged in not even hours ago and logged off. Now when logging in, I get this scary "you need to update your driver!" message and SL will not load unless I do this. I've never had that kind of message from LL before about their software, in 13 years. Usually if a driver or a graphic card wasn't quite up to muster, it still loaded, maybe you saw things badly, maybe you had to put all your draw distance down, maybe you crashed, but it loaded. So now I see an even newer driver from GeForce, so I'll try this, an endless process for various reasons but my hunch is that I'm going to have to roll all these back to the status quo ante because the issue is not needing a new driver, but some wonky wonky thing with SL. Stay tuned.

Yes, I realize that SL continues to have what is known as the "proscenium arch". But I still feel as if I am "there" on a sim. If at an ordinary theater "in the round" that is on a stage out into the audience, such as I went to recently to see a production of "The Way of the World," I can feel as if I am "there" in that story with the actors, say, being startled if one of them pounds something, feeling sad if one of them is hurt, etc. then so much the more so in Second Life, even allowing for its technical proscenium arch. A dragon suddenly landing an event will make me startle, and a bird's song will make me feel as if it is "real".

It's too bad they don't have the teen grid, because that's where teens should be kept, not allowed even into G on adult SL. My bifocals work just fine. It's about seeing letters and not focusing on the icon, that's all, when you have a whole list of things by the same creator.

No. That's not true. Because there was nothing in this block at all. There is no way to "drag and drop" things from inventory into a prim unless you have a script in that prim that enables it. I don't. You'd have to consciously open up the contents in "edit" mode and then drag. I didn't. I don't use ctr drag. I drag by um, dragging -- from inventory, into a prim in "edit mode". There is no way that I could have done this once, let alone hundreds of times. Why? Because nothing was in the prim. Then hundreds of things all of a sudden were. I discovered this while trying to change the numbers on the prim to fit with another prim on the deck. You don't "accidentally" drag hundreds of things, hundreds of times. @Qie -- yes, I get it that you have the lock on "recent". But that's not the case. It's not on recent. After reloading and retrying a dozen times, I finally got one non-copy item to move. Then it stopped working. It buffers and doesn't load, or if it does finally load, you can't drag out of the inventory into NOT recent but regular. That lets you know something is "up". @Klyta No, I don't hold ctr down. I realize that techies think this is "normal" and "habitual" but the rest of us never use it. Ever. When I lost the 15,000 inventory items, as I copiously already described, it wasn't that I "suddenly noticed" or "eventually noticed" they were missing. I got an error message first, telling me my trash was so overloaded, that I had better empty it. I had never, ever had a message like that. It was very odd -- I hadn't put anything in trash in the last while. I didn't drag any folders anywhere. All of a sudden, out of nowhere, I got this message. So I decided that there must be some "real" problem. And since I didn't think I had anything in trash that I couldn't delete, I obeyed this Linden Lab message coming from their software, odd as it was. Then I realized that an entire folder and its sub folder was missing, and I saw my inventory count. Even after relogging and clearing cache several times, it didn't come back. This all occurred on the sim of Alston where my office is. So naturally, when I see thousands of things in a big block on my deck even a year later -- yes, that's the other thing, a long passage of time -- I wonder -- could this be my lost inventory. It wasn't there before. It's on the same sim. And sure, in that span of time, the servers would have been cleared a milion times. Or would they? Did something about going into the cloud jumble up inventory and put it in another prim? I ask that question scientifically, looking for answers amid the inevitable insults and crazy you get here, because then I saw it HAPPENED AGAIN on another sim, with another prim, with copyable inventory that I definitely never put in that prim (vacuum cleaners on no copy put into a desk??? Why???) This is not about "not learning to use" a browser I've used for 15 years. It's about questioning software that doesn't work, and has bugs.

No. I didn't do this repeatedly over a long time. There was nothing in that block and that AFTER I lost 15,000 inventory items, I found it contained all that stuff. None of it can be deleted or copied. That's how you know it's a bug. The resistance of some people to admitting that software can have flaws in it is always astounding.

Yes, I know how to lock things. It's not that this "keeps happening". It's that it happened ONCE as a bug No, it doesn't have that script in it to take submissions. It isn't that I somehow put things in this block, or it somehow took things. It's that they got intermingled in their by an accident, AKA "a bug." As for "open and copy to inventory," gosh, why didn't I think of it? Except...I did. And it doesn't work. It gives an error message, "You are not allowed to copy". EVEN THOUGH these are MY items, in both copyable and single copy versions. That's how you know it's an unnatural occurrence, i.e. what is known as "a bug." I will file a ticket with the Lindens although I know it will "go nowhere."

Um, duh, I realize that, because I have been doing this since before you were born? Why? Some people may only have guns, "bits," some furry skins, and a few library items in their inventory so their cursor never slips. But if you have thousands of household objects for decoration, because if you are hunting for something by name, sometimes what happens, the creator has put a picture of that item in a texture with that same name. So you think you are grabbing THE ITEM and NOT THE PICTURE.

Yeah, I got that before you did because I'm older than you in SL. And I referenced that "phenomenon" in my answer, and even suggested staking up 10 prims layers with "totally clear" as the texture. Because the discussion was about THE TEXTURE ITSELF, not putting ANOTHER prim with "100% transparency". Sure, you can put 100% transparency, and gosh, I do that a hundred times a day and have done that even before YOU were born. But why put an extra prim out? That's the issue. And it still makes no sense. Because why put a prim over another prim even if clear or put to 100%? So that if you accidentally texture something, it then still stays clear? When you can just put the original texture right back on in one swoop?

NO. IT DOES, IN FACT DO THAT. I provided ample proof with multiple screen shots and cases in the thread about the "wish list". Ideology dies hard, I realize.

The inventory trash thing was real, the Lindens did some things, and people like you acknowledge this. But of course, along the way, those of us who suffered this, and tried to publicized it, got endlessly ridiculed, and for no reason. Callum is just exhibiting the usual hostility to me and making up ridiculous reasons for this -- as I noted, I don't even use "holding down control" so that's stupid. Putting a texture on a thing is not the same thing as *opening up a content of a prim in edit, and putting hundreds of objects in it, with no folders, which are in different folders*. You see the problem. The reason I mentioned the texture thing is that I am scientific about this. I say, hmm, if I am prone to error, perhaps I've done something. Let me look at this. Let me look at that. But then by the SAME scientific method I say, but this wasn't done, i.e. the prim wasn't even opened in edit mode; but these items are all in different folders, so to drag them all in would take enormous numbers of conscious, individual actions, not an accident. Furthermore, if those items were put in by a "normal" process, how come you can't get them OUT? You can see them, but can't drag them into inventory or delete them. That would suggest some kind of weird server glitch, corrupted files doing this. I appreciate your suggestion, but it makes no sense. Why put another prim over a prim? If the thing gets the wrong texture, you just go find its original texture and slap it down. The only advantage your idea might have is that if you didn't want to keep doing that, you could stack up a bunch of clear covers, then each time you made the mistake, just delete it, leaving the clear one below it to show the regular texture. But why? When it takes a second to put down that original texture again.

Um, no. Because I never, ever hold my control key down. So much for your theory. My keyboard is cleaned regularly. So much for your theory. The edit box opens over the prims -- this is a bug in LL's software.

Well, it's done all the time. You divide the sim into 16 parcels, and rent them out for US $25 each per month ($6756). Accept the dollars on PayPal so that people don't have the costs of buying Lindens. Your tier per parcel is US$18, so you make a profit IF you keep near to full occupancy. That's the hard part, you will find that very hard to do in a world with so many doing the same thing. I myself don't chop up the island like that but leave 4096 plus for a commons area that helps create landscaping. To break even, you'd have to charge 4983L per month per lot, i.e. $18. That's $1245 Lindens per week. And that's what a lot of people charge, or even less, so you won't be able to charge the $1689 that it seems you need to make a profit -- only if you do things like provide a house and security or provide some other thing like role-play. Providing beaches with waves or jet-skis won't make money as people don't want that, they want to be in their bunkers. I personally only charge $1200 and even give a 10% discount for 4 weeks, but then I have other land to rent out so that the cumulation of it can cover costs and leave some left over. If I don't do that, I can't keep the island full. You shouldn't fall into the trap of buying more and more islands "just to make a profit" and delude yourself into thinking "I'm plowing money back into the business." No, land costs are sunk costs, not "investments". You should try with one island, see how you do. You might divide it even in two, and find two customers that want half a sim, not a 4096 plot (the way most are done). My understanding is that you'd need 100 sims to really make a modest living from this business, but where are you going to get all those customers? I would never take the risk.

Group your land, then set the land to "group only". The group can consist of just you and your alt. You can also uncheck "avatars can see me," and then no one can see you at all, you're invisible. But if you want to prevent physical entry, you just check off the "group only" access. Or you make a list of avatars allowed on the parcel, and put only yourself in it. This is if you buy land. Some rentals agents will let you put "ban all" or "access only" to your group or list, so you can do that as well.

The idea that "five minutes of looking for land to buy" somehow proves that a) rentals keep the price high or b) even flippers keep it high is simply not based in fact. Use the search lists and you'll find plenty of good, cheap land. If you can't sell it, abandon it if it blights up next door, and buy a new one. Lots of people do just that.

Ridiculous, through and through. Many people are in rentals as a hobby, or simply to offset their own costs, and they are FREE to do so. You're making a completely unfounded statement, based on hatred and prejudice, and not fact, claiming that "rentals keep prices high". The price of land is a function of what the Lindens' SET THE START PRICE AT, and that goes up when they can get it. And land barons jack it up to keep its price high to flip it. One could argue that land flippers keep the price of land high. But that's a good thing, because when a person wants to sell their land, they then have a market -- instead of having to abandon it. The enormous amount of abandoned land is not only a function of high tier, but of a rock-bottom land market that began to bottom out a few years ago due to blight, micro-parcel ads and other factors. If anything, Mainland rentals prices go down and down -- just look at the ads on this very forum over time. A Mainland rental agent cannot charge over a certain amount of he will not have customers; further more, there is the hard stop of the price that anyone could pay in tier themselves plus a premium -- and many do. This idea that people can't be free to rent out Mainland is again, only based on hatred of capitalism -- of the small holders' type, while worshipping the oligarchs who in fact have far higher prices on private islands. Again -- fact-free claims, not based on actual examination of facts on the literal ground. Read Tyche Shepherd's reports on the Mainland. A large percentage of it is in end-users' hands, not rental agents, and many of the rentals, as I said, are to friends or a few people, even at a loss, just to cut costs. Fly around and see the facts instead of inventing "cures" that are merely meant to savage classes of people you hate.

There are some who viciously despise landlords, picture them all as rapacious slumlords greedily bilking their customers, and who refuse to realize most Mainland rentals lose money or break even, or have very little profit unless they are huge. So they are endlessly thinking of ways to punish them. Why not make their prices go up by having SL move to the cloud (although prices just went DOWN and should continue to GO DOWN for tier if server costs decrease for the Lindens which they should in the cloud. Mainland's very NATURE is "always on", so you couldn't do this to Mainland. And quite frankly, you couldn't do it to private islands used as rentals, either, because there might be even just one tenant on a sim. So what? Surely the cost of keeping them on is not so great such as PUNISH landlords -- the BULK of Linden LAb's profits! -- by jacking up prices to force them to pay more to be "always on". More to the point, the Lindens haven't indicated they have this plan.

I really think the Lindens should make a Mainland-wide rule in the TOS that you cannot place things in the sky below 500 meters. People are hugely inconsiderate and do this which really drives me mad. Why? It's not like it's harder to put it at 500 or higher instead of 100. Most often, they are in an enclosed dome, so it's not as if they are looking out this "panoramic view". I think LL has to make this a rule and police it, and it will stop eventually. They also have to make it a rule that if you do not log in and attend to your land for X amount of time -- 90 days? A year? -- that autoreturn will be put on at the very list, or your build will be removed at the most. The other big blight of the mainland is seeing junk pile up on no-show autoreturn 0 land.