This thread is ended

[HisaDrug]

 

 Thanks for the reply

[jwenting]

ever considered that you might be slightly toxic yourself in your hatred for those whose understanding of English isn't as bad as your own?

And yes, that's correct, your English is far from perfect. I had trouble understanding it and my understanding of English is near perfect.

Just as I wouldn't file an AR on you for your deficient writing skills, so I would suggest you don't do the same against your customers (and if you talk to your customers like you do in here, your translator will only further confuse them as it will generate garbage).

[iCade]

I am sorry, but I didn't understand what your point is, could you maybe state it in a more comprehensible manner?

[161488303349]

he said he has way to many foreigners buying his stuff. that he is a nice guy but enough is enough and can they please not buy anymore stuff from his shop. and other shop keepers need to be aware that all the foreigners who dont buy anything anymore in his shop will be buying from them

i think thats what he said

[Luc Starsider]

You're practically non-english speaking yourself as far as I can tell.

Customers, regardless of nationality and language, will come to your store. They will buy things and they will make requests. Perhaps some patience and a few lessons in customer service is in order?

[Echo Hermit]

I don't believe the problem of fiery customers making threats is very much to do with them being non-English speakers. 

Certainly, from the point of view of working in customer services roles for a large part of my real life, a great deal of patience is needed more than anything, especially if you are wanting to keep a good reputation for your business.  It can be difficult, and you need to find a way of being very firm, but fair. Use as few words as possible also.  Think carefully before you respond to a customer - often times I know you can feel the hair on the back of your neck stand up as a sign you are annoyed by a customer's attitude. 

A customer is usually just frustrated.  A product or service has not been quite what they were expecting, or they have not been able to understand instructions in a document or notecard.

Patience, my friend, is the key.

Edited to add:

You might want to edit your profile a little bit too.  Using words such as f*cking and F*ck (as in RL picture) will not make you look good in the eyes of customers.

Also, be aware, that if you are selling a product that might be attractive to someone less mature and worldly wise than the average person, you will need a lot more patience than someone who sells crimplene slacks to grey haired old people !

[Tiffy Vella]

Hisa...If I had bought something from you and had an issue, the first thing I'd do would be to open your profile for information about who you are, and how best to contact you. Your biography, which has nothing helpful in it at all, apart from the charming line "Im a good dog wit the sharpest teeth. Ill f***n break yer face tonight." This tells me that your social skills may be wanting a little polish, and I'd most likely be on my guard from the start, as my expectations of anything positive from you would be a bit low.

You are frustrated by customers who are less than polite. Well, I'd say that this is entirely in your power to fix, as those customers have probably come straight from that biography to your IM box, so you are getting what you just gave. You say to us that you are a nice friendly person, but your profile is rude and nasty.

A translator from English would have a hard time making sense of many of your sentence structures and spelling choices. Translators are very handy when you have non-English speaking customers, but they are imperfect, and need patience and correct use of language.

Now clean up that potty mouth, pull up your trousers, and keep flogging that cute hair you do. Or I'm calling your Mum.

[Paula001 Goldschein]

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HisaDrug wrote:

So I wanted to share the story with you guys whoever keep the shops n had those issues with some mean ppl.. well not mean but idk its complicated lol..... darn        

---

 

as you see.. this is not always the right place to swap stories ;p

 

am i the only one that gets what you want to say? *looks around*

he didn't come off in an anti-english-native-speaker way really ... he tried to tip toe around a touchy subject in a very polite way!

i think the thread is more about someone complaining about something the creator can't fix or about user errors.

and yeah, to swap stories, that happens to all merchants now and then i would imagine. to me like twice a year? if it happens very often to you then, i don't know..

i read that he tries to explain as much as he can in a friendly way until there, what more can he do?

..

i woudln't buy a product listed in chinese and then expect the merchant to help me through my problems in english.

 

[Kenbro Utu]

I got it right away.  The complaint is about customers who have problems utilizing what they bought because of lack of understanding or lack of ability to size and position, etc., and instead of asking for help they initate communication in an aggressive manner, threatening to AR, threatening to tell others not to buy, etc.  The OP goes on to say he tries to be patient and offer help, but the language barriers make that very difficult to do.  

[Perrie Juran]

 

[Tiffy Vella]

I think every merchant has had a few customers that can test patience. We've all been there once, I supect. You just have to take a deep breath and try to explain things as clearly as possible.

People are very polite and friendly when contacting me, even those I've had to use a translator for. I like my customers, and problems are usually very simple to fix, like MP delivery issues. But I had one once that was a loony, beyond all help, and who had me in tears, as she threatened to AR me for fraud, since she'd bought an item and then wanted a refund as other items had been on sale at the time. This sort is rare thank goodness.

How to cope-

Think about how you present things in your store, so that information is there. Do this to make it as easy as possible for your customers, and minimise future issues. Head problems off first.

Be polite (like what I said about profiles and presentation). Use your profile to welcome customers and be the first step towards helping them. Then once they land on your doorstep, they are in a better mood.

Know that there is a tiny minority of people who are just antisocial, like my friend above, and that you aren't responsible for their bad attitude.

Listen to customers, as they are teaching you how to make them happier. If you get lots of requests for removable scripts, thank them for telling you about it, and adapt your ways. Let them know what improvements you have made, and send them a fresh updated copy. The script issue isn't ridiculous at all, and if you are using old resizers, then updating to efficient removable ones is a brilliant improvement you can make to your product.

Perhaps make some notecards with FAQs about how to do do some basic things. Things that customers keep asking you, like perhaps how to adjust an attachment. English at the top, and other languages below to cover your customer base. Pass this out to your group, and make it available at the landing point to your store. Put it in your boxes. Some merchants even have notecards with links to Torley's tutorials, which cover lots of good basic SL skills.

 

I think part of our issue here is that LL do little to educate residents, and the onus falls onto merchants when somebody can't use a product because their SL skills are basic. If somebody can't adjust a necklace on their avatar because they've never had experience, they don't go to the blogs or wiki, they IM the person who made it. Merchants are the frontline for this sort of thing.

[Maelstrom Janus]

What about the customer who has trouble with a merchant - theres one in particular who gives especially poor service...now what's it called..

oh yes...Linden Research..

[Echo Hermit]

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Maelstrom Janus wrote:

What about the customer who has trouble with a merchant - theres one in particular who gives especially poor service...now what's it called..

oh yes...Linden Research..

---

It's funny you should say that, because I was just thinking about how much abuse Linden Lab get from some customers.  Not the majority, although it can feel like it on bad days I'm sure.

And look how infinitely patient LL are when their customers rant at them - they wisely say nothing at all.  Damned if they do, and damned if they don't.

 

[Maelstrom Janus]

Sorry but I think Lindens currently deserve everything they get............For lack of service in relation to the amount of money they get from me Lindens are almost unparalleled in terms of poor customer service. I think the only people who've come anywhere near are Hewlett Packard.

[iCade]

This is directed to the thread start.

 

Have you just once thought that you might make communication troubles worse for people because of your spelling and sentence structure? I am not a native english speaker, yet have learned and used it for many years, and while I am not perfect I do believe I am pretty good at it.

I could barely make sense of your post and had to read other people's summaries to understand what you were talking about. If I can barely understand you after a decade of english, then those foreigners who aren't as well versed in it stand no chance with your way or typing.

Make it easier for everyone involved and spell check, also make sure you respond to costumer inquiries in a comprehensible manner.

[Melita Magic]

The OP's message might have gotten lost a bit in the story about people speaking different languages. Even when people speak the same language, they can be on different wavelengths within that language. The real issue is communication, with the secondary issue of expectations rising to the level of demands, past demands into insults and threats.  There is never a good reason for things in a milieu such as Second Life to get to that point. I see it as endemic in most online communities; the pseudo-anonymity gives rise to a lack of humane treatment of others, and an impatience bordering on if not barging into the realm of instant gratification. People are not machines, but it is easy for some to forget that online. 

We are not NPCs, and we should all try to remember that when dealing with one another.

Especially with a free service, or a gift (the OP mentions being threatened over a group gift) this should never happen. But it does, I can tell  you it does.

[HisaDrug]

Thank you so much for yer suggestion. 

I think I really should starting the information kiosk for ppl becos for the obvious reasons. I'll defo look into that. 

[HisaDrug]

They I know Melita, the English language itself varies according to all different regions n countries so sometimes I do have problem communicating with other English speakers as well. But like, the insults n threat are there, becos they think they can just threat the owners to get wot they want.

Actually I never report those ppl becos I try to talk to em for hours n the problem usually eases down for bit, so I really dont insult back or shout hate words back cos thats not who I am. 

And I totally agree wit you that this online environment gives you a sense of anonymity that eventually causes a harmful behaviour among others so its very upsetting to deal wit it almost daily bases.... even when I try to set out simple stuff like group gifts ppl still complain n accuse for defect when they are in perfect condition. So I really dont know wot their problem is...

[HisaDrug]

Nooo Its not hate talk, trust me. 

I dont hate em. If i ever did, i woulda never bothered to post this threat, let alone try helpin em out for hours. Im just asking for the coping skills how to handle those kinda situations. My english sucks tree but I try to be accurate when they dont understand english so the problem is the threat they start up with. its really really strange that they do that for no reason. 

[HisaDrug]

Thank you for yer tip Echo, but my real life profile isnt the issue here. n its kind of a joke that I play on some ppl. 

I dont swear to other ppl, trust me. I never say F word in my own casual conversation wit others becos Im not that kinda guy who just try to be tough on others. Im really friendly n patient since all my friends are from asia n europe, I kno how to sit down n talk em through the situation cos its SL for gods sake, i believe we can talk it out no matter wot. 

My threat was started from the idea of customers abuse the owner from scratch. They just come off n say (for example as IM started) "Im report you cos you products work not, i dont cant use it no fix it pls. I report you linden lab, fix this or i report i come" So I Tp the person to see wot the problem is, usually they wouldnt come at the first few times, Idk wots up wit em, n when they do, the product on em is slightly rotated (this happened alot). So i give em tips how to rotate it back, n if they cant do it anymore, I'll replace the product so they can just wear the new one back.  you kno wot i mean???

Then they still talk shyt to me like I report you!! ok so.... I'd eventually say 'Look, don't get upset. I'll help you. Calm down and listen to me please." n so on. 

 

 

[HisaDrug]

Thank you so much for yer reply Paula. It means alot to me.

This is defo not the place for confrontational subjects lol.... I just realized it now. I feel like a noob. 

I just wanted to gets some intellectual n positive feedbacks on how to take care of those tough noogies situations wit non english speakers n so on n on, but mostly I got some kinda English lessons n ppl just say ok dont buy here ! uh oh he talks about english when hes not even the perfect one!!  I think ppl get real touchy about language issues n if i care so much of it, would i talk this way like Im talkin to a friend?

I'll just delete this post as soon as I can becos I think theres no point of presenting new prejudice among others, cos most of the users in SL are customers, not shop owners so they wouldnt really understand this type of dilemma as a shop keeper, n how excruciating it is to deal wit ppls diverse needs at once. 

Thanks again for paying attention to this post.

[Melita Magic]

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HisaDrug wrote:

 But like, the insults n threat are there, becos they think they can just threat the owners to get wot they want.

even when I try to set out simple stuff like group gifts ppl still complain n accuse for defect when they are in perfect condition. So I really dont know wot their problem is...

---

It's answered in the first part, there. They have learned that to abuse others, they get what they want. It's horrid.

Really, most people who rent land, offer a service, or sell things in SL make no money or barely cover tehir expenses. So they put up with all that abuse really for free. It is especially egregious when the person acting badly is receiving a gift. 

My grandma would say "they were raised in a barn."

 

[Melita Magic]

Don't delete your topic, you are doing fine. These forums can be tough noogies themselves.

I would post a sign saying in the case of a gift there will be no complaints. 

I can see you are very polite. I have learned the hard way, some people just love to argue or to abuse others. You cannot ever win with those types. They will drain all of your energy and not burp. 

In the case of prim adjustment problems or how to delete a script - include such instructions with each product, and ask them to read it, if they have a problem.

You must draw a firm line in the sand, or people will kick it in your face.

ETA: and the first time they abuse you, curse or call you a name, tell them 'this conversation is now over' and leave. Do not reply to their IM. You tried to help them, they would not listen, so they cannot be dealt with in a rational way.

[Tiffy Vella]

Hisa..I just try to be helpful, because you said creation and your business gives you joy, and you deserve to have fun, as you obviously do a lot of quite good work.

Your written English is very casual. Mine's overly formal, probably, and polarly different to yours, and I worry that I always come off as preachy-sounding when I don't intend to be. As I write, I hear my voice in my head, and it's familiar and friendly-sounding to me of course, which is what I wish everyone would hear, but I'm aware that it won't sound like that to someone just reading my words without knowing me. Likewise with you, you are familiar with your inner voice, but others aren't.

Nobody's perfect.

Streamline a way to give most of your customers most of their answers in most languages before they have to ask you. Then you may get more joy, and less rude.

 

Melita..I sympathise too, with what you say...we all cop a bit of that at times. I only seem to have issues with malcontents when they aren't paying.

 

[HisaDrug]

well I can tell you this straightahead. 

When I talk to my customers who dont speak english, I simplify my sentence just in case they might be using translator to understand me. I dont speak perfect english myself n im horrible at it when im drunk, but Im not a dumbass who are inconsiderate about those issues. I go word by word for their best understanding n frankly this is ridiculous that you point out my english skills becos this is not a contest that you win n you speak better than me. I believe this is becoming like Youtube phenomenon where ppl dont look at the vids but spell check others becos they are pretty good at english. 

My post was about coping skills wit the particular customers who happen to speak foreign language that I dont understand. I use translator in their language n try to make sense to em. If yer so good at english, woy cant you read the title, cos thats the topic of this post, not how horrible my grammar is. You think ereone went to Harvard or somthin lol.... cmon.. At least I dont pretend Im smart or austin power like when Im not even there. I just love ppl n helping em n communicating wit em so I made this post to SWAP SKILLS TO HANDLE THE PROBLEMS N CREATE A HAPPY PLACE  IN SL. 

I might be an illiterate but have a good manner n a good sense of humour, n uhhh often times, even if you do speak perfect english, you could never control their temper or report-threat cos its really not about English. Its about charisma handling the fellow buyers n thats the point of my post to trigger others to respond to this stupid subject. 

Since I posted this, ppl look at my profile n point out my picture..lollll.. n I'll never start up a personal story on here ever again. This is kinda ridiculous n very unprofessonal.