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The resident who provided the previous content, if any, has replaced it with this generic statement.

Qwalyphi Korpov
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Storm Clarence

Storm Clarence

Posted
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Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

Some people play that their AVatar is a character.  So what the AV does is character role playish stuff.  Others play that the AVatar is their self.  So what the AV does is an extension of the RL person.  Which leads to misunderstandings and drama.  But how does the
legal world
view the interactions? 
When an AV says 'I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a service today" is that a verbal contract offer from the RL person or just role play chat from the AV?

I am unaware of any court in the civilized world that would allow a me to 'sue' a chipmunk for libel, or for not delivering services as agreed.  This would hold true for vampires, bots, elephants, faeries, tinies, and other pixalated animations.  

However, a kangaroo may sue and/or be sued in a kangaroo court.  

 

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Syo Emerald

Syo Emerald

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As a passionated roleplay in different gamesettings (not here in SL) it lets my heart bleed to hear what is sometimes thrown into the same pot with it. Roleplay is so much more than just saying "Thats my avatar, not me." The people who often get called "roleplayers" in this case are more the kind of people who just play around and don't want something serious outside of second life. Thats it, nothing more.

Someone who would really fit the category of a roleplayer would just roleplay in the invironment which the charakter is made for and would not throw his or her roleplay on people outside of the roleplay.

Stop calling them roleplayers, please :catsad:

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Storm Clarence

Storm Clarence

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The last paragraph of the 'paper' you link to states:

"The argument for a zoning defense in virtual worlds is stronger
than that in the real world. Individuals in the real world may be faced
with no choice but to pass through an offensive zone, but in a virtual
world it is always the individual’s choice, once warned, to subject
herself to the possibility of offense. An understanding of this should
prevent the courts from experiencing the feared flood of torts."

 

 

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Syo Emerald

Syo Emerald

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Its just....what role do they actually play? None. They don't think about her charakters background, they don't think about their characters opinions, feelings, characters knowledge or anything else that leads to imagination. And those people even talk about their real life! They don't make a cut and state out that they now speaking out of character...no you can directly ask them what they had for lunch today.......

They are playing around with others, thats all. This is less roleplay than a couple do when she gets some short nurse dess on and they pretend that hes her patient....:catembarrassed:

 

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Storm Clarence

Storm Clarence

Posted
Posted

Syo Emerald wrote:

Its just....what role do they actually play? None. They don't think about her charakters background, they don't think about their characters opinions, feelings, characters knowledge or anything else that leads to imagination. And those people even talk about their real life! They don't make a cut and state out that they now speaking out of character...no you can directly ask them what they had for lunch today.......

They are playing around with others, thats all. This is less roleplay than a couple do when she gets some short nurse dess on and they pretend that hes her patient....:catembarrassed:

 

 I had chicken for dinner last night in RL.  Can a SL chicken avatar have me prosecuted for "cannibikenism"?

Please take note of the neologism.  

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Storm Clarence

Storm Clarence

Posted
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Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

  Also the TOS has some language about fraud.  So suppose two residents make an agreement to exchange services for Linden Dollars.  Can contract fraud occur?  The services are exchanged for Linden Dollars which have no monetary value.  Therefore there is no consideration?   Consider that.

 

Didn't RL people lose tons of SL money with the great bank scam a few years back?  Isn't it, and hasn't it always been LL policy to not get involved in personal disputes between residents?  

PS We are strictly speaking about the legal aspects--not the moral aspects in any of the above.   

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Storm Clarence

Storm Clarence

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The 3 laws of avatars:

  1. An avatar may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
  2. An avatar must obey orders given to it by Linden Lab, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
  3. An avatar must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Laws.
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Ceka Cianci

Ceka Cianci

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ya i agreed with linden lab that i won't be trying to use their own currency with them as payment for anything ..that i'll use real money with them..that they can take those linden dollars from me at any time..

that has nothing to do with there being a market where linden dollars/tokens can be exchanged for real world money that makes them a real world value...or any agreement that me and another user have bartering with something of real world value..

we have permission to trade back and forth.. from linden lab with those tokens..they don't say they are of no value to me and the other user..

 

5.1 Each Linden dollar is a virtual token representing contractual permission from Linden Lab to access features of the Service. Linden dollars are available for Purchase or distribution at Linden Lab's discretion, and are not redeemable for monetary value from Linden Lab.

 

 

 

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Venus Petrov

Venus Petrov

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Any monetary (i.e.., L$) agreement one resident enters into with another resident is a private matter.  If one rents land from another resident and the landlord decides to vacate the sim, defaults on tier payment, and the renter's stuff is returned what recourse does the renter have?  Not much.  And LL will not arbitrate resident-to-resident disputes.  Caveat emptor.

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LittleMe Jewell

LittleMe Jewell

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Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

I think that's the issue as Linden Lab likes to view it.  What is the outside legal world view though?  Is there history of disputed agreements between residents settled outside of LLs control?

Here's one guy that took a few things to court:

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Ceka Cianci

Ceka Cianci

Posted
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Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

Venus Petrov wrote:

Any monetary (i.e.., L$) agreement one resident enters into with another resident is a private matter.  If one rents land from another resident and the landlord decides to vacate the sim, defaults on tier payment, and the renter's stuff is returned what recourse does the renter have?  Not much.  And LL will not arbitrate resident-to-resident disputes.  Caveat emptor.

I think that's the issue as Linden Lab likes to view it.  What is the outside legal world view though?  Is there history of disputed agreements between residents settled outside of LLs control?

actually yes..but you won't find any threads on it or any newspapers going on about it..this case i mean..hehehe

really there is no way i could prove it to you with telling you about it because only a few of us knew about it that were involved..

i never ended up going to court but the other two did and i was told my logs did as well..all the logs did o.O :smileyembarrassed: it ended up pretty expensive for the one trying to scam the other..

it was over agreements not met and attempts to steal some sims..

i know it's no proof that it happens outside of sl.. but it was enough for me to know that it does..

i just remember trying to forget that time period as hard as i could ..because i really didn't believe  someone so close could betray so many all at the same time..

for me that was a real game changer as they call it..or SL changer  hehehe

 

 

 

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Ceka Cianci

Ceka Cianci

Posted
Posted

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

Ceka Cianci wrote:

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

Venus Petrov wrote:

Any monetary (i.e.., L$) agreement one resident enters into with another resident is a private matter.  If one rents land from another resident and the landlord decides to vacate the sim, defaults on tier payment, and the renter's stuff is returned what recourse does the renter have?  Not much.  And LL will not arbitrate resident-to-resident disputes.  Caveat emptor.

I think that's the issue as Linden Lab likes to view it.  What is the outside legal world view though?  Is there history of disputed agreements between residents settled outside of LLs control?

actually yes..but you won't find any threads on it or any newspapers going on about it..this case i mean..hehehe

really there is no way i could prove it to you with telling you about it because only a few of us knew about it that were involved..

i never ended up going to court but the other two did and i was told my logs did as well..all the logs did
o.O
:smileyembarrassed: it ended up pretty expensive for the one trying to scam the other..

it was over agreements not met and attempts to steal some sims..

i know it's no proof that it happens outside of sl.. but it was enough for me to know that it does..

i just remember trying to forget that time period as hard as i could ..because i really didn't believe  someone so close could betray so many all at the same time..

for me that was a real game changer as they call it..or SL changer  hehehe

 

 

 

hmmm... then I could be in trouble if I... um.... roleplay promise to pay on Tuesday...

OOC... when I said I would pay you Tuesday I was just playing around... I don't got money for u really.. I never pay nothin'

... So, sure I'll pay you Tuesday for your services today....

really you can try to sue anyone for anything..proving it is the hard or easy part..depending on the actual proof..

when i saw a case where a burglar sued the people that owned the house he broke into because he couldn't find a way out of their garage..and then also won..i knew anything was on the table then  lol

 

 

 

 

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Venus Petrov

Venus Petrov

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Posted

Qwalyphi Korpov wrote:

Yeah.. it's crazy sometimes what happens.  I hear it's expensive in RL  to sue.  & a tactic to increase costs for the other side where you can.. well, I heard that.

Change of topic a min - with all the drama in world with disputes and stuff - where the Lindens won't get involved - and i'ts too expensive or rediculous to take it to a RL court -

How come there's no in-world dispute resolution businesses or... even better - reality show type stuff?

The residents could agree to have their disputes resolved ... like in a TreeTV show with witnesses n stuff

... "Sure, I was there when they did the deal... he said he's pay for ... blah blah & then months later I hears nuttin' got paid fer".... 

Dats entertainment.

Qwal, you make me chuckle.

 

That may be amusing to watch if you are into that kind of drama but there would be no 'teeth' to make the losing party fork over the penalty (or whatever).

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