Hypocrites, hypocrites everywhere.

[Serafuku]

So here's something I have noticed in my short time that is fairly strong within the SL community; Getting told that I play a child avi and apparently even reported for it.

Let's put aside the fact that I actually play a 1.93m high sized character (That is the max height you can set yourself as a female), which I got reported for. But why is it that I ultimatively get a warning for it? Does the staff not check your avi or actually want some sort of photo evidence that you actually played a character like this? Why is it that bright, cheery clothing is giving everyone on SL the impression that you play a 2 meter sized 12 year old or something when they play characters themselves at around 1.50m? Which is another problem I have encountered; Grimdark/Ghetto Clothing is apparently the de facto standard of SL to not be a child avi (Yes, this seems to be a proven method to still be pedophile bait if you play a 10 year old with lots of makeup and black, skimpy clothing without getting warnings). I have seen plenty of thin and mini avis that follow this rule and they are in SL for years, yet when someone like me who plays an avi that wears striped leggings, boots, a plaid skirt, hoodie and twintails is consired a child avi and gets a warning on the first day? Another strange thing is that the proportions of height are **bleep**ed too thanks to the people that are completely disillusional and play 2 meter characters. If I play a 1.70 cm character this is completely average for an adult woman, I don't see why people would get upset when I would join an adult sim with that height and mentioned clothing. http://pediatrics.about.com/library/growth_charts/ngirlstwo.htm

Can someone enlighted me this perversion the SL community has with grimdark clothing and the hate for bright, white clothing that is considered to be a kid avi regardless of how tall you are? And why exactly is it that the staff doesn't require screenshots to even confirm it?

Eventhough I shouldn't mention this, but this is far from realism and I would haven ever thought I would say something like that about something like SL. It's breaking my immersion. I mean, not even in real life Gyaru Gal would be a fashion style that would make you look like a 10 year old.

[Cinnamon Lohner]

Wow!  You figured this all out in less than 1 day in SL??  Impressive.

--Cinn

[Chelsea Malibu]

I know it does sound odd and moreover, it seems that people absolutely love to throw others under the bus.  You see it here constantly with people sticking their noses in places where one, the do not have a reason to as it does not affect them and two, have no authority or grounds to do so.

From what I see on the forums, its getting worse however, when I was a mentor, it was constant in the mentor Group Channel.

My assumption is that people overall are bored in SL and have little else to do.  Many are here because they are bored in RL and oddly enough, the same attributes that make them boring carry over here.

To me, SL is about being what YOU want to be.  Giving it your all or giving it nothing.  Doing your own thing and growing your talents, skills, assets or whatever. Second Life is about YOUR second life.

In the end, I say let them eat dirt!  Do you thing and screw the objections. As long as you are following the rules, be yourself and have fun.  And most important, stay away from asses as there are many here.

You can play an innocent child and do not harm or threaten anyone but you get reported however, if you wanted to tape bombs around your waist and play a terrorist, this is OK?  I feel your pain Serafuku.

 

 

[Void Singer]

my advice... find better places to hang out. Most people could care less about your height or clothes, and you seem wandered into a nest of nutters.

[Serafuku]

Thank you for your replies. I really wish I *could* be myself and just not care, but I assume that the next time someone would report me that I actually would get banned for it since the LL staff didn't really seem to be interrested in evidence or whatsoever. But I'll cut myself short for now, I don't want to bother anyone with reading through my problems; I really wish there would be a place for myself, but from what I have seen I didn't found it so far.

I cannot join adult sims as I run into the possibility of being reported again for my fashion style and PG/M zones (Yes, despite the vast amount of bikini and raunchy looking characters that play kid avis there -- and let's face it, PG zones aren't very PG because of this, especially if you put purchaseable goods right on the startpoint. Speaking of making the game friendly for minors.) put my character way too much into highlight, since she is taller than everyone else, dresses completely different and is being *that* unique snowflake no one wants to talk to. I mean I play a completely normal woman, normal looks, normal height, no massive chest or bottom and the only nude skin anyone can see is above my collar line. Yet I do get condemned everywhere for my sense of fashion that I apparently play a kid avi. I just want my character to be seen as cheerful and happy which her clothing expresses, but it doesn't seem like there is such a place for myself in SL and I most likely have to rework the avatar.

And I already have made my character down to 168 cm so I won't be consired an outcast in Giggles Beach in comparision to all the skimpy, tiny girls there and the older men...Right. I don't even play a child avatar, my avatar is an adult with sense for japanese pop fashion.

[Penny Patton]

The whole issue with "child avatars", especially as it relates to avatar height, is ridiculous. First, adults around or even under 5' tall are not altogether uncommon. Second, SL avatars tend to be ridiculously large, which is bad for a number of reasons that directly impact us all and should be obvious to anyone who has taken gradeschool geometry.

Couple of things, tho. The height displayed in the appearance editor is wrong. So are any height detectors that rely on AgentHeight alone. In truth, female avatars can be up to 8'6"/2.61m tall with shoes, or 8'/2.44m tall without shoes. A lot taller than merely 1.93m. Men can be up to 8'10"/2.70m tall, but they're usually around 7-8' tall on average.

 Also, what is this perverse witchhunt against child avatars? That goes back a few years to when SL was the target of a disreputable German tabloid which tried to paint SL as a haven for child porn. LL overreacted and basically lead everyone to believe that if they even suspected ageplay was occuring on your land they would delete your land and ban your account, even if you had no idea.

 To my knowledge LL has never, not once, actually done this, but it's made a lot of people extremely paranoid.

 The witch hunt isn't nearly as bad these days as it was just a few years ago.

[Zippity Neutra]

Sadly, there's nothing new about griefing online.

But as Penny points out, this particular case is a hot-button issue because of past press attention (at least that's what I've read, I wasn't in-world at the time thank goodness). I mention this because LL as a company has to be able to say to any local prosecutor anywhere in the world who decides to make their reputation over this kind of issue that yes, in fact, they do review all reports and provide appropriate cautions to residents. Sucks to receive them, and I am speculating here, but I suspect they give these automatic warnings mostly so their lawyers will be able to rebuff stupid lawsuits.

Try to find a way to work through it without feeling like you've compromised yourself or your self-expression. There's too much fun to be had here not to try and get past these people.

[Venus Petrov]

Do not sweat the small stuff. Go to other places. There are many things to enjoy in SL. Do not focus on the negativity.

[Peggy Paperdoll]

I'm having a difficult time here.  My avatar (and even my alt, who wears the same shape) is 1.6 meters in height.  That's measured against a prim box which is much more accurate than than any height detector.  That's my bare foot height, also.  That translates out to my approximate real life height (5' 4"......I'm American so that's the way we measure our height here).  I made the shape I wear some 5 years ago and, as far as height is concerned, I've not varied it at all (I've made my head bigger or small, boobs bigger or smaller, bow legged or knock kneed, big butt to a pancake butt but the height has remained the same).  I've never had a negative comment about my height nor any reference to a child avatar (the most I hear once in a while is "Gee, Peggy, you're short").  Well, it is true since I am noticably shorter than almost every other avatar in a crowd.....I don't take exception to those comments (actually, the comments are mostly in a positive way).

 

Perhaps it's where you hang out or who you hang out with..........or maybe it's your attitude.  I don't know, but since I'm shorter than you and I've never had a problem (never been AR'd or even questioned) I'm taking this thread as some attempt at drama or that you are not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

[Zippity Neutra]

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Peggy Paperdoll wrote:

I don't know, but since I'm shorter than you and I've never had a problem (never been AR'd or even questioned) I'm taking this thread as some attempt at drama or that you are not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

---

What!? Gratuitous forum drama? Surely that's completely unpossible!!1! :matte-motes-big-grin-wink:

[Dogboat Taurog]

which is one of the reasons child avatars should be banned, or at least banned from Adult or Moderate land,

you want to act like a child? do so in the appropriate setting.

[Serafuku]

... With the exception that child avatars are ALREADY banned in adult and some moderate zones.

 

And I'm not sure if you understand the point actually, it's about avatars that aren't kids, neither they look very much like it but are still judged as a child avis.

 

It's somehow about the meta of SL that makes slutty, almost nude avatars in SL mature, while if you are trying to maintain an amount of decency and a normal avatar that you are condemned as kid avi despite even with the height.

[Dogboat Taurog]

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Serafuku wrote:

... With the exception that child avatars are ALREADY banned in adult and some moderate zones.

 

And I'm not sure if you understand the point actually, it's about avatars that aren't kids, neither they look very much like it but are still judged as a child avis.

 

It's somehow about the meta of SL that makes slutty, almost nude avatars in SL mature, while if you are trying to maintain an amount of decency and a normal avatar that you are condemned as kid avi despite even with the height.

---

Child avatars are allowed anywhere in SL provided they have adult verification (at the moment anyway.)

if you look like a child you should be treated like a child.

fair?

 

[Gabby Pixelbottom]

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Dogboat Taurog wrote:

which is one of the reasons child avatars should be banned, or at least banned from Adult or Moderate land,

you want to act like a child? do so in the appropriate setting.

---

 

Who in the heck are you to make a judgement like that? It is up to Linden Research to decide what is appropriate and where, not you. Of course it has been made clear that child avatars are not allowed to participate in age play, this is certainly as it should be but beyond that why can't people just let others enjoy SecondLife the way they like? You have no right to impose your "so called morality" on anyone else, if you don't like what someone does (and it is not against TOS) then just remove yourself from the situation and find somewhere else to spend your time.

[WADE1 Jya]

Hello Serafuku! Sorry to hear you had an unpleasant experience... I think these avatars you ran across are not at all representative of the broader Second Life population. Most people will not harass you over avatar height or dress, since from your description you definitely do not sound one bit like a child av :matte-motes-bored:

Just leave silly people seeking drama behind....

I'd say just forget about these people and go find some nicer people! There's lots of them about :matte-motes-asleep-2:

[Serafuku]

I'm pretty sure Child characters are not allowed on adult sims, it's the ToS of LL and ageplay is pretty much like that.

http://i.imgur.com/7BsZB.jpg

Perhaps someone can tell me if I look like a kid avi in comparision with this, I'm not sure anymore.

 

( I have also been harassed by land owners thanks to this thread now, looks like there is no point in hiding my identity anymore )

[Peggy Paperdoll]

Dogboat has exactly the same right as the original poster of this thread to his "judgement".  We've all been judged to be hypocrites because we may not agree with her.  What's fair is fair.

 

LL has made a judgement on child avatars..........it's clearly outlined and stated in the ToS if you care to read it (I know I have and I'm pretty sure Dogboat has too......but I'm not sure you have).  Dogboat has a different opinion (and I even have a different opinion than both Dogboat and LL).  He hasn't made a judgement..............he stated an opinion that is contrary to your (I guess).

[Gabby Pixelbottom]

You don't look like a child avatar at all judging from those pictures, but even if you did it would not give others the right to harrass you as long as you are within TOS. My understanding in regards to Adult Land is that child avatars are allowed on it as long as there are no "adult activities" in the specific location you are in.

[Dogboat Taurog]

---

Gabby Handrick wrote:

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Dogboat Taurog wrote:

which is one of the reasons child avatars should be banned, or at least banned from Adult or Moderate land,

you want to act like a child? do so in the appropriate setting.

---

 

Who in the heck are you to make a judgement like that? It is up to Linden Research to decide what is appropriate and where, not you. Of course it has been made clear that child avatars are not allowed to participate in age play, this is certainly as it should be but beyond that why can't people just let others enjoy SecondLife the way they like? You have no right to impose your "so called morality" on anyone else, if you don't like what someone does (and it is not against TOS) then just remove yourself from the situation and find somewhere else to spend your time.

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i  am Dogboat Taurog and i have as much right to state my opinion as you do.

its my world also.

child avatars, lolitas and japanese fan teens all have the same thing in common in SL and its creepy.

 

 

[Serafuku]

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Gabby Handrick wrote:

You don't look like a child avatar at all judging from those pictures, but even if you did it would not give others the right to harrass you as long as you are within TOS. My understanding in regards to Adult Land is that child avatars are allowed on it as long as there are no "adult activities" in the specific location you are in.

---

Thank you people for your help, I think I can take a breather and calm down without getting worried that I might run into trouble with LL. I'll just ignore a person now if they keep spurting that they report me to LL for staying in an adult sim with a kid looking character. Certainly very helpful.

[Gabby Pixelbottom]

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Peggy Paperdoll wrote:

Dogboat has exactly the same right as the original poster of this thread to his "judgement".  We've all been judged to be hypocrites because we may not agree with her.  What's fair is fair.

 

LL has made a judgement on child avatars..........it's clearly outlined and stated in the ToS if you care to read it (I know I have and I'm pretty sure Dogboat has too......but I'm not sure you have).  Dogboat has a different opinion (and I even have a different opinion than both Dogboat and LL).  He hasn't made a judgement..............he stated an opinion that is contrary to your (I guess).

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Every one have every right to their opinion. However, in the post I referred to Dogboat went beyond opinion and said specifically that child avatars should only visit pg land, this is up to Linden Research to decide, not Dogboat. He has no right to harrass others that are enjoying their SecondLife within the TOS. That is what prompted me to post, not the fact that he had an opinion. There are definitely avi's that I find "creepy" too in sl, but I don't go out of my way to judge and harrass them, I either bite my tongue or go somewhere else.

[Dogboat Taurog]

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Gabby Handrick wrote:

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Peggy Paperdoll wrote:

Dogboat has exactly the same right as the original poster of this thread to his "judgement".  We've all been judged to be hypocrites because we may not agree with her.  What's fair is fair.

 

LL has made a judgement on child avatars..........it's clearly outlined and stated in the ToS if you care to read it (I know I have and I'm pretty sure Dogboat has too......but I'm not sure you have).  Dogboat has a different opinion (and I even have a different opinion than both Dogboat and LL).  He hasn't made a judgement..............he stated an opinion that is contrary to your (I guess).

---

Every one have every right to their opinion. However, in the post I referred to Dogboat went beyond opinion and said specifically that child avatars should only visit pg land, this is up to Linden Research to decide, not Dogboat. He has no right to harrass others that are enjoying their SecondLife within the TOS. That is what prompted me to post, not the fact that he had an opinion. There are definitely avi's that I find "creepy" too in sl, but I don't go out of my way to judge and harrass them, I either bite my tongue or go somewhere else.

---

Are you somehow different from me in that my replys are judgements while yours are opinions?

 

[Peggy Paperdoll]

In spite of everything Dogboat has stated on this very subject (and that's been a lot over the last year or so), he has never, to my knowledge, ever gone out of his way to harrass, comment on or otherwise bother a child avatar.  He has stated that if you are a child avatar and come to his land he will ban you..........I believe him.  His statement is no differen than yours saying that he "went beyond opinion".  It did not.  It is a deeply felt opinion.  That's all.  It evidently hit a nerve with you and now you're acting like what you are accusing Dogboat of.

 

But the title of this thread does contain the word "hypocrit" doesn't it?  :matte-motes-evil-invert:

[Serafuku]

Judgements are opinions, not facts. So what you said made no sense either. Can you recap what you guys are fighting over because it seems to be unecessary.

 

\/\/\/\/\/ My character is 6"5 ( Which is absurd as hell and I'm probably going back thanks to you guys ) and I still got harassed so much for looking like a kid \/\/\/\/\/\/\/

[Penny Patton]

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Peggy Paperdoll wrote:

Perhaps it's where you hang out or who you hang out with..........or maybe it's your attitude.  I don't know, but since I'm shorter than you and I've never had a problem (never been AR'd or even questioned) I'm taking this thread as some attempt at drama or that you are not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

---

 Like I said in my previous post, it's not nearly as bad these days as it was a few years ago, but you still occaissionally run into overreacting idiots, harassing any avatar under 6'8". You mostly see it in adult sims, but I've also seen it in moderate sims.

 Just yesterday I was in an RP sim where someone was complaining about a "child avatar". Turns out it was because the avatar was only 5'5", otherwise nothing childlike about them. Even more annoying, the sim this occured in actually promotes properly sized avatars, so 5'5" is the ideal height for an adult, female avatar.