Toysoldier Thor

thanks.... thats a relief.

Charolotte Caxton wrote: It is odd they would be in our Lost and Found. It's ok, paranoia and mistrust are part of the experience, it seems. Yes - these are the fears I have with upcoming DD.... "ooops an error in a setting and all my product line is in everyones SLM folder as full perms and before LL figures it out out to fix it... my entire line of products is out to the masses and will never be recovered" It just takes one of these mistakes and my SL business would be wiped out. So... yeah i am paranoid - specially when the LL Commerce Team has not said any details to the Merchant community on how DD will work or its progreass... etc.

I did but he is offline. But Ann says they are general purpose Avi's in the library. Still not sure how they got in most of our lost and found and what caused it. I am real paranoid with the LL Development Team / Commerce Team working on Direct Delivery in secret if this is part of that work.

SO was just told about and I asked several of my friends in SL to confirm .... that for most SL residents they now have a folder in their Lost and Found folder called "ADAM n EVE Female Dancer Avatar BETA". It is filled with 12 plus more folders of entire sets of male and female skin/shapes/clothing from a creator of Damen Gorilla & Sachi Vixen from what I see. The owner of all this content is Alexandria Linden. And its all Full Perm items from all the items I just looked at. WOW!! I hope Damen is aware that LL just gave to most SL residents, an entire line of his product !! Is this part of Direct Delivery? This is the kind of mistake that I would have feared in my warnings about Direct Delivery. Does anyone know?

Brooke Linden wrote: Hi all, I would like to reiterate that Linden Lab is encouraging merchants NOT to list mesh objects on the Marketplace until all sims on the grid are mesh-enabled. We are providing merchants with the ability to mark listings as mesh, but recommend that merchants do not make such listings active until the entire grid is mesh-enabled. I am working with the mesh team to address other questions raised on this thread by the end of next week. Brooke Thanks Brooke for "reiterating" your statement and that of the LL Commerce Team regarding Mesh on SLM - although I would moreso consider it a correction when I re-read your OP. In the OP you stated quotes like: However, we are not doing anything to prevent selling mesh items on the Marketplace. and... As we are allowing (and encouraging) merchants to mark their mesh offerings, adding those features at a later date will be simple. which far from gave the impression that LL Commerce Team was discouraging the listing of Mesh objects on SLM. I would suggest that you retract position you stated that LL Commerce Team will not be preventing mesh items from being placed onto the Marketplace. LL should NOT ALLOW MESH ITEMS ON SLM until your team fully understands mesh's progress on the grid as well as your team fully understands and can update the SLM Item listing to properly support the listing of a Mesh item and until your team as well as the mesh team can fully document how a mesh item can be properly sold on SLM. But thanks for reiterating LL Commerce's position.

Although this is interesting discussion - it is deviating away from the OP of the thread..... The OP topic is.... "LL Commerce Team is publicly stating that its ok for Merchants to start selling MESH items on SLM and is encouraging it. Is this a good idea at this time of Mesh's stage of evolution and maturity? Should LL Commerce be more interested in protecting the SLM customer that will naively buy cool looking MESH ITEMS when most of them will not work in most sims and for most viewers for at least the next few months & the strong risk that an unforeseen bug/limit in mesh handling could render all purchased mesh model corrupted or useless? If so, who will support the customer in situations like this? Well LL Commerce Team open up a support line for SLM customers if/when all their purchased Mesh Models break? Or when a mesh model crosses into a sim that poofs the model because the sim does not support it? etc. etc.) This is the OP topic.

Madeliefste Oh wrote: Toysoldier Thor wrote : How do you define in the listing the IP ownship rights to the customer).... I think that is not different from how you define the IP right ownership of sculpted products. I don't know how you do it with your products, but I never ever sell any IP rights to customers. I sell objects with a user license, but I stay the IP right owner. This user licenses gives the customer rights to use my products in their own creations, and to distribute those creations with limited perms within the world of SL. It also garanties them that they won't experiences any problems with IP rights as long as they use the product according to the the user license. It won't be different for meshes. At least my 'prefab' meshes will come with user licenses and not with IP rights. Made, As a Sculpt Map pack creator and seller, I put MY OWN created license / IP Rights in my packs base on my own terms and rules. All my fellow sculpty map makers / sellers do their own license & IP rights handling the way the want. There is no set rules or minimum requirements on this that is set out by LL for any product on the SL market. You set your license and IP rights as a merchant with no rules / restrictions set out by LL. My understanding from LL and threads on mesh I have read is that this is not the case for MESH. Uploaded mesh models REQUIRES PIOF on upload and even some tutorial they must have to understand your rights as an owner of the mesh in SL. This is what I am touching on. Also the properties in the Mesh (creator vs owner). And I will also point back to Arwen's post.... 95% of merchants (even most of us Sculpty makers that has somewhat been watching the posts from the LL mesh team) are still very confused at all the details of how the Mesh model operate inworld... how they would be sold by a merchant, what IP and property permissions are vs other prims. If you are telling us that all these answers are available and locked down... then I would think before Brooke opens the gates and invites all merchants to start creating and selling MESH LISTINGS in slm.... her team should be developing a well documented blog/wiki to explain all this and how a MESH would be sold on SLM and what restrictions there are and what added SLM listing development will be needed to support mesh sales and what mandatory PIOF and LL licensing / IP documentation is needed..... Again.... what I see from Brooke's direction is .... Shoot from the hip & JUST DO IT (but dont blame us or come to us if anything goes wrong) strategy. Her team has not even thought this strategy out. Its just the typical LL mentality of "sounds like a cool idea - go ahead and do it".

Arwen Serpente wrote: Brooke, this is rather premature (imo). Mesh is rolling out to some sims, not all, and certainly still going through tweaking, so it's not ready for prime time. Certainly not without a lot more information provided to the potential purchasers of it (whether it is end users, or creators buying prefabs to work with). I am a prefab purchaser for my creations and I understand very little of how these new Mesh objects can be used, let alone the IP rights associated with them, no matter how many Mesh Forum posts or Mesh meeting minutes I read. For instance, one prefab creator has notified their current sculpty customers that they "may" sell the files for download so that creators can upload them themselves and have their name as creator - how's that going to be handled on the Marketplace since the uploader needs to have PIOF and lots of people will buy not understanding that (even if it might be stated in the ad copy). And, then what about the unsuspecting purchaser of such a file that is perhaps stolen/pirated? The purchaser has no idea about that, but once their name is on the object as creator, are they the ones who will be subject to legal ramifications? Maybe before this kind of new product is rolled out for purchase, there should be some official information about it? Not just the info in the Mesh Forum or Blogs or Meeting Minutes, because going through that is quite confusing. We need official information from LL about all the in's and out's of using Mesh. And what you are saying Arwen is EXACTLY examples of what I am saying why LL Commerce should be taking the exact opposite stance / position. TO PROTECT THE SL CUSTOMER & REDUCE WORK ON SLM MERCHANTS. Brooke and Dakota constantly make it clear that they have so much on their plate and backlogs.... so much so that Brooke doesnt even have time to update us on the projects they are secretly working on in the backrooms of LL. They have so little time that they cannot even fix the basic functions of SLM that used to work in xstreet. and yet now Brooke states that she wants to allow and encourage that SLM Merchants start... SOMEHOW... creating new MESH PRODUCT listings into SLM and selling a product that still is only roughly understood by both Merchants and customers.... that has a rough several months of full grid beta activities in front of it (with pretty assured glitches).... that has no guidelines in SLM on how to define a Mesh (where on the listing do you define a PE? How do you define a PE if it can possibly change base on its scale? How do you define in the listing the IP ownship rights to the customer).... that can only be used by a very very very small number of sims and users with special viewers (main LL and TPVs do not support mesh yet). To say that LL endorsing Mesh listing in SLM is premautre is like saying it is premature to put the Titanic out to sea from drydock with part of the hull missing.

Eleni Connolly wrote: ok guys i am a little slow as seems and english is not my native language what the announcement means practicly ? that i have to unlist all my products that contains mesh ? Sorry if it's a funny question but i have to understand what to do . And if i unlist them i will be able to list them again from 1st of august ? Please help i don't want unhappy customers It means that Brooke Linden is saying that LL will allow and encourage that MESH CREATING MERCHANTS can put mesh items up for sale on SLM. Even though the SLM listing features does not have fields that describe the special parts of a mesh - like its PE cost. Even though the LL Mesh team recently announced that Mesh on the grid is for volunteers and that there is a risk that unforeseen problems might require changes on the grid servers that would damage or make all the mesh items currently coming on the main grid as useless. Even though MESH on the main SL Grid is clearly in the early stages of beta (not ready for production - just experimenting for likely the next 6 months). So if you are a merchant that is already selling MESH to SL Customers... even though there is a lot of limitations and risks to any customer that buys your mesh models, LL is allowing and encouraging it. /ME SHAKES HEAD IN DISBELIEF...

Nalates Urriah wrote: In the Mesh Group meeting today Nyx says the mesh format is NOT going to change and that they will not break mesh being uploaded now. Nyx added the caveate that there is no absolute guarantee. Some unforseen problem could force a change. However, the mesh team seems to be feeling confident they have things working well and the chance they will break current mesh uploads is very small. However, changes to the servers, render pipeline, and scripts are likely. So, while a mesh may not break, earlier users may hit some bumps. So you went to the latest mesh group meeting and all you saw was the LL Mesh team giving the thumbs up that its safe enough to start selling MESH MODELS on SLM to the general customer base? I saw the "there is not guarentee" and that unforeseen problems could force a change.... Do you remember that we are talking about LL. Their history on product and services and features development and deployment is ALWAYS based on throwing concepts out too early and letting their customers find all the bugs for them to fix. This is clearly how Mesh will work. Unforeseen mesh bugs and limits and "OOOPSIES" will be happening for 6 months. As such, so you think that Brooke is right that she should allow SLM to start selling mesh models to the customers? And after 100s or even 1000's of mesh products are sold to the customers - because LL / SLM is allowing and and basically endorseing Mesh product sales, a big change is required that wipes out all the mesh models on the grid. Will you be there to say... I thought it was a good idea and I supported Brooke's decision that Mesh Models should have been allowed to be sold so early in the main grid beta of mesh?

Brooke Linden wrote: Hi all, As many of you are aware, sims are gradually being mesh-enabled with the goal of reaching 100% support in-world as quickly as possible. Merchants who wish to sell mesh items on the Marketplace should bear in mind that many customers won’t be able to use them until the full rollout, likely resulting in many customer support requests. However, we are not doing anything to prevent selling mesh items on the Marketplace. The week of August 1, 2011 we will begin allowing merchants who are Mesh enabled to mark an object as partially or entirely composed of Mesh when editing a listing. Will the average purchaser care, or understand, what mesh means? We are not sure of that answer, so for the initial rollout we won’t be displaying a mesh indicator on a product listing or providing a capability to search for mesh objects explicitly. After that time, we will evaluate customer demand for those features. As we are allowing (and encouraging) merchants to mark their mesh offerings, adding those features at a later date will be simple. We’ll continue to work with the Mesh team to make sure that features to support Mesh on the Marketplace “mesh” with their efforts to support creation of Mesh content inworld. Please keep comments and feedback coming! Brooke Brooke, What a shocking message from the person heading up the SL Marketplace. Does Rodvik know you are making these decisions? By NOT ACTIVELY BANNING any mesh product sales in SLM, not only is this a bad idea but even deceptive and unethical. MESH on the SL main grid is so far from PRODUCTION and STABLE. Public mesaages from the mesh team even warned those that are uploading Mesh models to be warned that what ever they upload and use will have limits and even a good chance of risk that their model could be corrupted or lost after a future upgrade to the server sims with any new mesh fixes. You even said yourself that you are aware that most customers will not be able to use the meshes (only LL V2 viewers with the mesh enabled - no main version of V2 nor no TPV supports it) and that not all sims would support it yet. Finally several large scale deployment issues have not even been experienced yet nor has the details of mesh been figured out. I can bet 1 year's salary that MESH will be going through a lot of complications and "OOPPS we didnt think of that at LL" before mesh will be considered ready for real SL market selling. Basically, MESH on SL is now entering a grid-wide beta that will likely last until early 2012. In light of all this.... Brooke, you are saying that you will allow any Merchant of SLM that is unethical and starts selling Mesh to their customers. Instead of protecting the interests of SLM Shoppers and Customers... you are endorsing Merchants to "for for it at their own risk". Dont worry about the customers Brooke. Its decisions like this Brooke that make me so worried at the release of Direct Delivery. THIS IS A BADDDD & UNETHICAL move on LL's part. I think I need to express my concerns to Rodvik as I cannot believe he would endorse your position. Toy

Sally Audebarn wrote: Does anyone know why there has been such a long delay in the posting of SLM update by Linden Lab? We used to receive one every week or so and now I we have not seen one for little under a month which raises some suspicions (some bad, some good). Wonder what surprise they plan on unveiling in their pending post *sighs* We can only hope that its nothing capable of hindering the marketplace’s performance. I’m not sure if we should fear its arrival or anticipate it.   As I mentioned in other recent threads..... Brooke and the SL Marketing Team has fallen into the same evolution of slowly sliding into a policy of Communication Shutdown after an initial entry into the job of "things are gonna be different with our management team and we will be much more transparent and engaging with our Merchant community then the last generation". All the past Commerce Team Leaders and Management followed the same Job Excitement as Brooke did... but now she is doing exactly what all the past management did. This is not critisizing... its simple historical fact that no one can dispute. Do we all remember how engagement and communicating Brooke was in Jan-Mar? Compare that to now... Do you see a difference? Meanwhile major changes to SLM in the works like Direct Delivery, Search, reporting, etc. are in the secret works of the Commerce Team and those few Merchants in the know. Soooo....... Just wait for the BANG

Arwen Serpente wrote: Medhue, I've just read some info from a prefab sculpty/Mesh creator about Mesh. This pertains specifically to Mesh that will be worn by an avatar (clothing, jewelry, shoes, etc), not Mesh to be rezzed inworld like furniture or buildings. Here are a few highlights: 1) Mesh weighted clothing will move with the avatar, however, it cannot link anything to it (i.e., a weighted skirt cannot have floaty prims or sculpted waistband attached - they would have to attach to a different attach point). Further, the avatar cannot really modify it in any way because it is sized to a particular "skeleton" - the original Mesh creator's model, not the model shape of the clothing creator or the end customer, so if parts of the avatar show through, there's nothing they can do other than change their shape (meets with a lot of dislike among customers, totally understandable), or, wear an alpha (also meets with some dislike). 2) The creator name will be the name of the Mesh creator, not the avatar creating the final piece UNLESS the mesh file is purchased and then "re-uploaded" by the purchaser (and only then by an avatar with PIOF). So the cost skyrockets (first buying a full perm Mesh, then uploading it to have your name on it). Most sculptors right now sell their maps with no mod permissions - useable to build with inworld, but not saveable to computer. I suppose this could be worked around by buying the file the same way as buying a PSD file and downloading it, then uploading the final product to SL. The costs could potentially be huge, as right now, when a sculpty pack is purchased inworld, usually it includes multiple varieties of the same item (say shirt collars - you get dozens of options so you can switch between them depending on the build). 3) It wasn't clear if non-weighted Mesh that might be used for jewelry could be linked to other prims or sculpties. Assuming it can be, if an avatar does "stretch" a finished product (combination Mesh, sculpt, prim, say a necklace), then because the PE changes, that would potentially break a build if it reaches more than the allowed "linkable" 256 prims If that's all true, then Mesh is not just another building tool like sculpties and prims. It's really pretty different. Not sure now how I would use it in clothing creation since allowing customers to "mod" to fit is so very important, as well, as having the clothing/jewelry/shoe creator name on it rather than the Mesh maker. I also worry about the inflation of prices for end products using Mesh due to the complexity of working with it. It's really not a great time, economy wise, to be increasing prices. Wanted to check in here to see if you and the other Merchants understand this the same way.  Just another set of added reasons why - as a Landscape Sculpty Map creator - my strategy on how and when I will deal with the future of transitioning/expanding my current SCULPTY MAP PACKS to MESHES is to continue to take a wait & see approach for about 6 months to a year. For those few Sculpty creators that plan to rush in and start pumping out MESH products to the market - I am thankful for them to have the guts to be critical in being LL's gihnea pigs and suffer the pains / limitations / and very little resulting initial sales rewards for their MESH efforts. Their sacrifices on creating and pumping Meshes out on the 1st generation SL MESH grid will be used to eventually get the SL Main Grid to the Generation MESH Grid release. I will enter the market at this time (Gen 2) which I suspect will be about 8 - 12 months from now. I will leverage all the education that will come out of the Gen 1 suffering and I will also avoid a lot of wasted time and effort. By that time, the SL Grid market will likely be to a point where customers will seriously consider buying a MESH and not as much a SCULPTY. I heard the Main Grid will start seeing Mesh on specific private SIMs in the next week. Since there are no main production SL Viewers that support mesh (LL's own V2 nor Phoenix or others), there is no customer base for any Mesh. Plus, LL has already warned that for the next month (if not more), all uploaded meshes are at risk to be permanently damaged if the mesh leaves these special sims or if LL decides to update the Mesh formulas on the SIM Servers. So, I dont even see a marketable SL Grid for Mesh sales until December. I dont see Generation 2 of MESH on the grid until next summer. Just my predictions.

Snickers Snook wrote: For crying out loud, about 10 shapes that I made from scratch have suddenly become "Creator uknown" and, while I still have full perms on them, it really hurts because I can't export them for backup or to use on another grid. I'm also hearing from a few other merchants that their from scratch prims are now showing uknown as the creator. Arrggggghhh! I filed a ticket but this is going to be a black hole of nothingness I'm sure. :womanmad: YUP thanks for the heads up Snickers.... I looked and sure enough a ton of my PRIMS in my inventory - like my selling vendors and countless other prims are set to unknown creator now too! I guess this was the outcome of today's ASSET SERVER snafu. Isnt this marvolous! I dont even know how LL will fix this one! we could open a JIRA but that is like buying a ticket on the titanic with LL - you know the boat wont make it to the other port... most JIRAS just sit idles and not looked at. This will be one of them. Thankfully my sculpty maps - which are textures - do not seem to be buggered up by this screwup.

ATTENTION: Fellow SL Artists and Art Lovers... Toysoldier Thor - Artist and Gallery Owner - is excited to host two GRAND RE-OPENING EVENTS at his completely re-designed and larger Toy's Art Gallery! The new design is simply amazing and classy. Art Patrons will find the experience of the Gallery architecture - all 6 floors - as the 50 artworks that Toy has created and has on display! Secondlife Artists as well as all Art Lovers in SecondLife are invited to be Toy's guest at one of the two events being hosted this coming Sunday July 17th @ 1pm slt & Monday July 18th @ 7pm slt. Its a social event you cannot miss !! DETAILS: WHERE: Toy's Art Gallery > GROJNOWSKI 34 / 18 / 1002 > SLURL: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Grojnowski/37/17/1002 WHEN: Two Celebration Event to satisfy all timezones: > 1st Event : SUNDAY JULY 17th @ 1PM slt > 2nd Event : MONDAY JULY 18th @ 7PM slt OTHER DETAILS: > Dress Code: Formal since most of you will anyway :) > When You Arrive & Rez, follow the dimly lit path up the spiral > The Tour: > 5 floors of 50 of my artworks - many have never been seen in SL ! > The 6th floor Starfield Patio where the reception will be after you finish your tour Hope to meet you all at either today's or tomorrow's event! Toy http://ToyTalks.weebly.com

Medhue Simoni wrote: Here is 1 thing all creators need to remember. Mesh, and collada are common 3d formats. which means that your stuff can be used in other worlds, not related to SL at all. Sculpts will not work in any non SL based world, ever. In a year from now, I would much rather have 100 mesh things, then waste my time on 100 sculpty things that I can't ever use again. Of course, I do not make alot of furniture, and every creator needs to evaluate the situation for themselves. Actually - your statement is either incorrect or a bit misleading .... you said... " Sculpts will not work in any non SL based world, ever.". I read that to mean that you think Sculpty Maps do not work anywhere but SecondLife grid. Sculpt maps will work in SL or in the open grids like Inworlds. So, unless you were meaning to that IW is "SL Based", the statement would be incorrect. I have been selling my landscape sculpty map packs in IW for 9 months now. I suspect you meant Sculpty Maps wont work in non-opengrid worlds. I just want to clarify your point in case others may have understood your statement like I did.

Phil Deakins wrote: Thank you for your excellent replies, Madeliefste. For a personal reason, I didn't bother getting into mesh and I'm glad I didn't as it seems like it won't be any good for my field (furniture) so, even if I were planning on keeping my store for the forseeable future, I haven't missed out on anything by not looking into mesh. I've never made a 1-prim couch or chair because, when the arms and/or back are higher than the seat, as they need to be, the bounding box is no good for a sofa or chair. I used it as a simple example for the question. I agree. I am somewhat relieved actually that the first generation of MESH has so many limitations and weaknesses and heavy initial upload and PE costs associated with it. For my area of landscape sculpty packs, the MESH technology will be completely non-feasible. Can you image the upload and more importantly what the PE cost would be for a large mesh waterfall or shoreline or mountainrange or desert hoodoo??? Since LL is making MESH costs non-competitive to Sculpties and not feasible solutions in the areas of LANDSCAPE SCULPT MAPS... it means that it gives more time for all the bugs to be worked out in MESH for the first year without me having to worry about my competitors running ahead of me making MESH mountains and rivers. Now I can experiment over the next year with new mesh landscapes... LL can clean up the countless limits and bugs that we all know MESH will have... and then they will eventually re PE cost price the mesh to make them competitive. By that time, I will have Mesh landscapes ready as packs. It will be real cool some day in the future to create MESH landscapes for sims that will honor the physics to match the terrain (ie. not massive bounding box or needing to create alpha physics prims ) and where I do not have to dumb down the details of a mountain or a volcano cone. But it seems LL's MESH is still very far away from that target state for SL.

as the response said.... it has been at around $250L / $1US for ever (give or take a Linden). It seems clear that LL keeps it there.

WADE1 Jya wrote: @ Toysoldier: I guess because although they've really flubbed things up on me a couple times, after nearly 5 successful years here, Lindens have earned my trust! :matte-motes-grin: I didn't know you got phished Toysoldier! I am very sorry to hear that. Yikes :matte-motes-stress: Looks to me like they recovered your account okay though (since you are still here), any loss of inventory or anything from that? Gotta be real careful anywhere online I think :matte-motes-not-entertained: MY account was Phished as well as several other SL account within the previous SL Forums when users like me who were already authenticaled into the forums, were hacked by a fake LL message that seemed to have got thru the LL Forums security via the linked images. YEAH You are right WADE - with LL you got to be real careful with your security online since you can even be phishing attacked WITHIN LL's secured and authenticated system. I have expereienced and not fallen for countless Phishing attacks - because 99% of them are outside a secured and authenticated system. This attack was able to occur inside LL's secured site. It was because of this breach of security why for almost a year, MOST ppl lost their ability to attach image signatures in forum posts (even though LL decided that a rare few forum users were still allowed to keep their attached image signatures - rofl this is LL security... its a risk so lets shut it down except for a few of you that already have it in place). Because of the Phishing attack, my ID and Password were posted in the general SL Forums (along with several other victims). It wasnt LL that saved my butt Wade... it was the quick thinking of a couple fellow Merchants who knew quickly what was going on and purposely logged into my account with the exposed password and changed it and disabled it then sent me emergacy IMs telling me what they did to protect my account. It took several hours later for me to get ahold of someone at LL (a real voice) that later helped me re-enable my account and reset the password. That is the only GOOD thing LL did. Remember I am just a guest account at SL. So you can state that you trust LL... I know for experience that you cannot trust LL. You are successful and so am I successful in SL despite LL, not Because of LL. Put it in perspective. As for the Phoenix Firestorm, it is really impressive and its only in Beta 2. LL's Beta 2 of anything with have been riddled with unworkable bugs. @suella... Yes Mesh is likely showing up later this summer BUT, as many of the Sculpty making community is already saynig... MESH will be DEAD AT BIRTH simply because of LL's PE costing model (Prim Equivilent). So unless LL wakes up and realizes almost no Sculpty maker will be incented to build any MESH models because rezzed meshes will be too SIM Costly for any customer to want, the Mesh market will be a small market (except for wearable mesh prims where PE costs have no factor on sim prim land costs). I make Landscape sculpty maps... as much as I would love to build much higher detailed mesh versions of my mountains, cliffs, rocks, shorelines waterfalls, etc... with actual no-bounding-box limits, who will want to rez a 1000+ prim mountain mesh versus a 1 prim sculpty mountain? NOT MANY. Not to mention that prior to Meshes coming live, LL has to also deploy the increased scalable Prim sizes from 10x10x10 to the planned 65x65x65. Meshes do not work on Mega prims and although they can be huge beyond 10x10x10, they can only be the size that the mesh builder made them in the 3D tool. This is a huge limit for us landscape sculpty builders. So... MESH might technically be out but most will not care at first and it will not be a reason why residents will upgrade viewers to V2 from V1 (just like most SL residents didnt move on masse to V2 because of multi-media textures).

WADE1 Jya wrote: @amarock: I would try it but... I get scared :matte-motes-bashful: Maybe I just sounds crazy paranoid but I want to give my account access data to as few parties as possible. Linden Lab gained my trust (somehow). No third-party viewer development group has managed to do that so far. I know there is some very cool viewers around. Maybe I'll sneak onto one with a throw-away alt sometime & play around :matte-motes-grin: Too bad - Firestorm is already awesome and its still in Beta 2. LL is the one i trusted that ended up not protecting my account when my account got Phishing attacked in their forums. I wonder why you trust them???

Darrius Gothly wrote: Here's a perfect example of how that merchant is violating the copyright laws: His listing at https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Enterprise-D/2106942 Is from an image that can be found here: http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Enterprise-D_painting.jpg Note that the copyright on the second page linked states as follows: "This painting appeared throughout Star Trek: The Next Generation and was made by Dan Curry." However, I can't "Flag" it because there is nothing available that allows me to provide the above info. YUP.... you found the merchant. Thats him (or her). And the RL IP / Copyright holder is not in SL to know their stuff is being stolen. And we honest merchants and shoppers cant flag it as a clear violation.... and LL ignores / dismisses its own trademark / branding violation policies .... while they make money on this violator.

Darrius Gothly wrote: Assuming the link to the Marketplace listing in the OP was correct .. that product is no longer visible. One day response .. seems pretty rapid to me. My last DMCA was handled in 2 business days. As much as I kvetch about LL and their actions, this is one place where I have to give them props. They seem to be much more responsive than they were in the past. The merchant I am looking at that you will find when you search SLM for "Skeletor Costume" is the merchant that IMHO is massively violating countless RL trademarks and copyrights. Thanks to LL posting policies I cannot say the merchant's name but you should find him as its the only result I get when you search for that item. Take a look at all the RL trademarks he is selling and tell me that he has rights to all these trademarks? And whats as embarassing is that this merchant is making sales and LL is making commission on these sales even though the Merchant is very likely in violent violation both LL's own policies and the IP owner's trademarks. Maybe someone should contact the owners of the Simpsons, Lord of the Rings, PeeWee Herman, the Muppets, Superman, and all the other trademarks this Merchant is selling products using their brand names.

Not to mention that this Merchant on SLM as we speak - appears to be violating countless RL copyrights and is clearly in violation of LL's policies i.e. you cannot sell content of copyright brand name material without permission from the owners. I see on this SLM Merchant's store, content with Superman, Darth Vader, Lord of the Rings, PeeWee Herman, Star Trek, Donald Duck, Simpsons, and countless more brand names. CLEARLY this SLM Merchant does not have rights to sell these brands on SLM. So why does LL allow this merchant to openly and willfully violate clear copyright and LL policies? If LL is so aggressive on shutting down piracy... why is this Merchant still up and running with pages and pages of viiolation. LL being tough on piracy is a joke. They never have been. And this shows they still are not.

Darrius Gothly wrote: Catwise Yoshikawa wrote: Guess they don't like to reply to some topics, as the one I posted in merchant rountable about reports in Marketplace I think part of the problem is that the only Linden that really interacts here is Dakota ... and with all due respect, Dakota is a front-line grunt. She's responsible for doing, using whatever they give her and isn't allowed much else. I'm quite sure she feeds our comments and gripes back to the actual developers/planners, but I'm also just as sure they ignore her as readily as they ignore us. To me it just proves the "disconnect" in communications isn't based on "Linden Lab vs. The Customers" ... it's based on "Linden Lab vs. Linden Lab"; we paying customers just happen to be collateral damage in the battle being fought within their own borders. I could agree and believe in this theory. This is actually common in many large organizations. Dakota is basically part of the helpdesk, front line customer support ranks and most of the recieved complaints/concerns received by this frontline are often either not formally sent back to the company's product/services team to take notice of/address OR they are formally received but placed into BACKBRUNER buckets of work by the development teams since these teams are actively working on the next cool thing. LL development staff is so small that they cannot solve all the existing problems with their current service AND actively engage is development of new cool features in SL (which will be tomorrow's things to ignore as support by these teams). LL's priorities is to keep trying to deploy new shiny features to SL that they can market and PR and brag about. As such, keeping existing services and features running properly and fixing glitches from past developments is not a priority (you cant really brag to the customer base that "we fixed a long standing bug you all hated"). Perfect examples to prove this policy exists in LL are abundant.... Look at the deployment of SLM that replaced Xstreet last fall. Brooke's team is working on shiny new features like Direct Delivery and deployment of Visitor Maturity Filtering (i.e. LL's Teenification Filters) that have caused nothing but grief for Merchants and Shoppers alike. Yet, basic functions that were in xstreet and have never been addressed in SLM - still sit in the queue of things for LL to "get to in the future"... i.e. never. Even the new features like LL's SLM Teenification Filters that Brooke's team rammed into SLM in February - it still causes lots of grief for merchants - but these complaints have now just become White Noise complaints to Brooke's team. Look even at the bigger issue related to this. Look how many JIRA's sit unresolved for YEARS!! A Jira that has been dear to my heart (VWR-4018) to get resolved and that causes me grief almost weekly in trying to make SL more beautiful - has been opened as a known bug in SL since 2008! This Jira affects almost all SL Builders (even though most dont realize its a bug) and affects all SL residents as it limits the beauty of many builds. LL (Oz Linden) actually was forced to at least post to the JIRA over a month ago - ONLY BECAUSE I GOT THE PHOENIX TEAM TO STATE THEY WOULD INVESTIGATE IT and I made it public on Twitter and blogs to Rodvik that Jiras now have to be addressed and resolved by 3rd party organizations since LL is clearly ignoring JIRAs. Sadly there has been nothing from LL on this Jira since one post from LL about reolving it. Again... why are tons of LL JIRAs opened and untouched? Because LL's dev team is small and their rationed efforts are focused on SHINY NEW FEATURES... So... Dakota is sadly as Darrius described it... a frontline Customer interacting grunt that LL typically ignores. What we should all take notice of is how quickly Brooke Linden has evolved her commitment to communicate with the Merchant community to the same levels as her past members of the role did. You rarely hear from her about her team's activities and no responses from her or her team on even these critical SHINY NEW FEATURES like DD. Not a surprise.

Sassy Dirval wrote: Thor -- I'm a half full kinda person. I try to approach problems from a positive perspective and avoid the counter productive nature of toxic negativism. Don't get hung up on "good." Yes, it is a pain to extract some of the current numbers to Excel but the basics are there. Your right Sassy..... I am happy that the SLM Transaction history is only a 30 day window. It could be worse - LL could have only given us Merchants a 7 day history or no history at all. And really we dont want to bother LL with more important things since the basic raw data is there in enough format that the 10s of thousands of merchants of SLM can turn this data into some useful form of historical data. And lets not be picky by asking LL to come up with a standard of transaction history reporting between SLM and Inworld... what else would we Merchants be doing anyway. Having to transform and ingest two formats of history from the same company should be considered fun and we should make the effort into some form of a month party. Advanced reporting, sorting, etc.... we shouldnt be asking for this advanced stuff - afterall we should just be happy that LL has given all us Merchants some place to sell our stuff. Lets not bite the hand that feeds us. Unlike any other vendor... us LL Customers should not expect much from LL as they could just as easily turn off SLM - right? So... you are right Sassy.... Lets look at what crud LL offers us now and see the bright side of this. If we put up our pom poms and thank LL for all they have done so far... this will sure go much further in convincing Brooke and team to maybe improve (when tell them we are happy for what they have done so far) then to point out to LL how unhappy we are as LL Customers for the large number of major limitations that SLM has for Merchants. RAW RAW RAW !!! LL PROVIDES AWESOME SLM SERVICE AND FUNCTIONS FOR US MERCHANTS!!