LepreKhaun

Dora Gustafson wrote: Why did you delete it? :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: It is wrong and unsympathetic when a debater rebukes other debaters in areas outside the subject in this forum: "Discuss scripting tips and techniques with other inworld developers" I just noticed that your question hadn't been answered. The OP was asked politely if they had the permission of the original author to be posting their work and they had decided to delete their posting. In the meantime, they had removed the script from the post and real life had called them away before could finish out the deletion instructions. I personally feel that the statements made under your "smiley line" are inappropriate btw and wish you wouldn't do it anymore since it seems to confuse the issues at times.

Since version 3.0 is still in beta, you may want to contact Cecilia Zheng about this issue. It may be an overlooked bug.

Perrie Juran wrote: LepreKhaun wrote: How about we limit people to bringing in no more than 3 scripts from the web before they are actually required to buckle up and learn LSL? Of course, that would mean that kayla would need to start making an effort at this, like the rest of us have had to do: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/LSL-Scripting/Help-with-bringing-two-scripts-in-one/m-p/2098659 Correct me if I'm wrong, but aside from the copyright issues I get the feeling you are looking at the description for this Sub Forum, "Discuss scripting tips and techniques with other inworld developers," and are applying a strict interpretation to it. If we did apply this strict interpretation then it would leave someone like me who occasionally dabbles with things no place to ask questions when I dabble. When the switch was made to Lithium there were several of us involved in shaping the categories in the Forum (The Community Users Group). If I had foreseen that this strict interpretation would become a problem I would have made an argument for including the phrase "get help with" or a separate sub section. And I believe I would have got it. So my thinking is this. All of you have the right to choose whether or not to help someone no matter what their ability. If you feel a request is out of place then exercise your right not to help. If you think a request for help really belongs in the employment section then use the RIC button. That to me keeps everything simple for everyone. No, I was just wondering if a limit of "borrowed without asking" scripts could be set since the consensus seems that somehow it's better to drag them over here than to link to them. The fact that those do haul them around are never scripters wasn't part of my proposal.

Ivanova Shostakovich wrote: Perhaps the ability to animate the texture a projector uses to determine the shape of its projected light (as opposed to the adjunct modulator idea) would be a good feature request. [edit] How do you request features anyway? http://community.secondlife.com/t5/English-Knowledge-Base/How-to-report-a-bug/ta-p/733545. File it under SVC- and be sure to include who would benefit from it and why we should have it.

Innula Zenovka wrote: LepreKhaun wrote: That posting bothers me as well. Because Alicia Stella could actually file a successfull DMCA take down notice on it. I don't think LL would welcome that aggravation. And I also believe they might then decide to take a look at our forum to see if there might be any other time bombs waiting to blow up on them. And after becoming aware of how much we're allowing others to copy and paste from the web, with some even arguing that it's somehow "OK" to do this, there's a chance they could decide it's more trouble than it's worth, resulting in a forced migration out of here to beat all others. I'm sorry, but this seems to me highly improbable. LL must daily receive dozens of DMCAs from in-world creators, complaining their original skins, hairs sculpties and so on have been copied and are being sold on the marketplace by whack-a-mole throwaway alt accounts. Furthermore, there's umpteen mesh items there which are DMCA take-down notices waiting to happen, if only the artist who originally posted the image on TurboSquid or wherever gets to hear that someone's downloaded a free copy and has uploaded it to sell her. The idea that LL would be at all phased by receiving an extra take-down notice from a scripter about something in these forums, when it takes in its stride dealing daily with complaints about IP abuses in the Marketplace, just boggles belief. Given its sanguine attitude to receiving, and acting on, DMCA complaints about in-world and MP content, LL's worrying about unattributed scripts in this forum really would be an example of straining for gnats while swallowing camels. Indeed, the idea that someone sensible like Alicia Stella would actually bother to file a DMCA take-down notice seems pretty far-fetched when, I'm pretty sure, a Report of Inappropriate Content from her would probably achieve the same results (and certainly be a lot less bother). I fully agree we should try to teach people about IP issues when they use scripts they've found elsewhere. But the idea that it's some sort of threat to the forum if we don't seems very unlikely. OK, I agree, that is a slim chance. I guess we could cross our fingers and hope to keep getting away with this. How about we limit people to bringing in no more than 3 scripts from the web before they are actually required to buckle up and learn LSL? Of course, that would mean that kayla would need to start making an effort at this, like the rest of us have had to do: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/LSL-Scripting/Help-with-bringing-two-scripts-in-one/m-p/2098659

I think you may have meant to post this in the Building and Texturing forum. This is the Scripting forum...

And if you have problems understanding how Rolig's excellent suggestion works, study https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetLinkPrimitiveParamsFast and try to get to know one of the most important functions in LSL. It may seem a little daunting at first with all it's options but it's all those options that make it so powerful.

That posting bothers me as well. Because Alicia Stella could actually file a successfull DMCA take down notice on it. I don't think LL would welcome that aggravation. And I also believe they might then decide to take a look at our forum to see if there might be any other time bombs waiting to blow up on them. And after becoming aware of how much we're allowing others to copy and paste from the web, with some even arguing that it's somehow "OK" to do this, there's a chance they could decide it's more trouble than it's worth, resulting in a forced migration out of here to beat all others.

Dora Gustafson wrote: I didn't attack anyone I merely assume you do as you preach I asked politely if you do :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: Some rules are made by lawyers for lawyers. If they were to be taken literally, we had no scripts left with more than one instruction. I see the rules as 'catch-all rules' and they will hopefully never be enforced. It is unsympathetic and outside the framework of the Forum when a debater rebukes other debaters as if he had authorization to do so I beg your pardon then, I misread what you were saying. In answer to your question, I do strive to live ethically. Meaning that I try to be both good and careful. [ETA] And I'll also admit to not being entirely successfull at times.

Dora Gustafson wrote: LepreKhaun wrote: Dora Gustafson wrote: ... [snipped]... I don't worry about what any intellectual organization has to say on the matter in this place What worries me is the thread and this forum has been hijacked for purposes it is not intended The General Discussion Forum would be a good place to discuss the subject :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: I don't know if you're trying to say the citizens of Chicago should travel to Dallas to discuss any issue regarding their city unless it's directly involved in meat packing or that ethics shouldn't be a part of programming. Either way, I disagree. You are missing the point. There are no rules telling you to go from Chicago to Dallas If there were you would of course do it because you are not the first not to do what you preach Are you? :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: Some rules are made by lawyers for lawyers. If they were to be taken literally, we had no scripts left with more than one instruction. I see the rules as 'catch-all rules' and they will hopefully never be enforced. It is unsympathetic and outside the framework of the Forum when a debater rebukes other debaters as if he had authorization to do so Saying a person doesn't practice what they preach could be seen as a personal attack unless some proof along those lines could be offered..

And this illustrates how bad this problem has gotten by not being addressed: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/LSL-Scripting/LSL-Scripting-Hud-need-help/m-p/2503057 That's not even a script from the web, that was pirated from the Marketplace.

I don't know, these things can get kind of murky and muddled at times and a case by case consideration is needed. I just see a pattern of misuse of this forum that ranges from A. Someone having a great idea, googling a script that does something and coming here with it asking how it might be modified. That case is obvious and definitely belongs in the Wanted forum. To C. The user whose first posting on an hour old account is a compilable intermediate level script with no headers that they claim to have been "working on for oh so long" and they're botching an if conditional that they'd be "so grateful for any help on this problem that has been slaved over for days now. kissee kissee". And that should obviously be someone that needs a bit of schooling in ethics because they're lying, pirating someone else's intellectual property and being manipulative to get some free work done on a scrpt that they'll end up selling no mod on the MP. Using us for their own personal scripting puppets. Through B. The user that sees A and C getting away with it and decides, well I'd be foolish to pass up that deal. And within that range it isn't so obvious what we're looking at. And it can be difficult to distinguish whether an OP is A, B or C and the most appropriate way to respond to them. The solution I suggest is, make it a rule that if the code already exists on the web, it must be linked to. I fail to see one good reason for copy and pasting from (as irihapeti so eloquently says it) "SL freebie dumpsters" but know of at least a dozen reasons why trashing a forum this way is wrong. If nothing else, it has been the reason forums have been shut down.

Dora Gustafson wrote: ... [snipped]... I don't worry about what any intellectual organization has to say on the matter in this place What worries me is the thread and this forum has been hijacked for purposes it is not intended The General Discussion Forum would be a good place to discuss the subject :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: I don't know if you're trying to say the citizens of Chicago should travel to Dallas to discuss any issue regarding their city unless it's directly involved in meat packing or that ethics shouldn't be a part of programming. Either way, I disagree.

irihapeti wrote: ObviousAltIsObvious wrote: that was available in the beginning. somehow the 2003 manual survived all the reorganizations. http://s3.amazonaws.com/static-secondlife-com/downloads/textures/guides/LSLGuide.pdf thanks very much for this (: is pretty good to have + just as a matter of something else completely different this official SL User Guide settle once and for all the massive debate we all had over the street from page 71 "A.177. llSay llSay(integer channel, string text) Say text on channel. Channel 0 is the public chat channel that all avatars see as chat text. Channels 1 to 2,147,483,648 are private channels that are not sent to avatars but other scripts can listen for through the llListen api." from this can know that "0" is the official usage for LSL documentation (incl. wiki) and not PUBLIC_CHANNEL. So PUBLIC_CHANNEL must of been deprecated way back then. Not unless some rogue troublemaking linden with nothing better to do other than eat their lunch snuck it in the meantime since 2003 (: you should post this over the street. and when you do then I will come and agree and change my vote (: I got a kick out of the ASCII art on page 38. One doesn't see much of that around anymore.

irihapeti wrote: LepreKhaun wrote: Section 2- a.5.B " No downstream restrictions. You may not offer or impose any additional or different terms or conditions on, or apply any Effective Technological Measures to, the Licensed Material if doing so restricts exercise of the Licensed Rights by any recipient of the Licensed Material." by posting (which we already established earlier the ToS allows) the OP does not impose any additional/different conditions on LL that would restrict LL from exercising the licensed rights of the material edit: italics . additional/different I see that you registered here after the initial noise died down so it's understandable that your unfamiliar with the (as yet unresolved) issue I've raised. Here are two links so you might understand how the CCA-# license may not quite square up with the "Service Content License" clause within the current ToS. Serious Changes to ToS & the Fallout & Updated LL TOS Claims FULL RIGHTS to ALL CONTENT (has links to many others). You'll note I said "may". I don't know because I'm not a lawyer. It just doesn't read to me that the CCA allows anyone to add that type of license on top of it. I'm pretty certain only the original author can enter into what is termed a CLA when it applies to source code. But I do know that ethical behavior will further one more than any other path. In the computer industry it results in keeping work, staying out of jail, keeping products on the Marketplace, not losing accounts in forums and not having an injunction placed against a web site. It is so important, that to get a [ETA] CS Bachelors degree in an accredited university, you're required to take a course titled "Computer Ethics". In fact, there's even a 10 Commandments of Computer Ethics, written by Computer Ethics Institute. And if you became familiar with them I'm certain you'd make an A in that course. And, with about 20 years experience in SEO work, I am certain that search engines keep track of where original content is first published on the web and those sites that end up copying do get penalized in the rankings. And I kind of doubt that Linden Lab wants that to happen. What do you think?

Follow the recommended steps at http://wiki.phoenixviewer.com/fs_voice . If doesn't help, you may want to consider using another viewer that does work correctly for the times voice is important.

Sounds like a move in the right direction for sure! Let's hope it gains momentum...

irihapeti wrote: agree from the CC license: "you cannot sell this or derivative code by itself, but you may share" from the BSD license: "Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without modification, are permitted" provided that you accept the terms of the licenses then you have a lawful right to the contents from the LL ToS: "Each time you submit any User Content, you represent and warrant ... that you have a lawful right to submit User Contents" ETA: to make even more clear: Section 2.1 of ToS: ""You acknowledge and agree that Linden Lab and its’ licensors own all right, title, and interest in and to the Service, including all Intellectual Property Rights therein, other than with respect to User Content." You may be unaware of Section 2- a.5.B and how that may apply within the recent (and somewhat controversial) change made to our ToS. This is not the proper forum to go into all that but I do ask that you're familiar with what you are speaking about. [minor grammar correction made with edit.]

Killian Jayaram wrote: Problem from when i come from PHP and JS the rules change, I will try making the vector to a list and output based on string and see if that works nay better as if and else make this to long and to much of a lag. I feel that would be an excellent approach to the problem! I wish you good luck in implementing it and if you encounter any problems with it, just ask.

Though that is supported in some languages, LSL limits us to changing only the values within named variables, whose names are pretty much written in stone. Now, if only we had a switch statement!

It's a bit unclear what you're attempting but if you're trying to dynamically change the name of a variable, that can't be done. If you're wanting to use different textures according to a letter in a supplied string, extract the letter into a string variable and then use an if else chain to set a variable to the one you wish to display.

[edited to add the quote for casual readers] Dora Gustafson wrote: LepreKhaun wrote The proper way to refer to content found elsewhere on the Web is to link to it. Says who? :smileysurprised::smileyvery-happy: It is wrong and unsympathetic when a debater rebukes other debaters in areas outside the subject in this forum The subject is: "Discuss scripting tips and techniques with other inworld developers" If you're asking on what I base my opinion on, The World Intellectual Property Organization addresses this very well.

/me passes Rolig coffee and kudo bagels...

irihapeti wrote: agree from the CC license: "you cannot sell this or derivative code by itself, but you may share" from the BSD license: "Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without modification, are permitted" provided that you accept the terms of the licenses then you have a lawful right to the contents from the LL ToS: "Each time you submit any User Content, you represent and warrant ... that you have a lawful right to submit User Contents" ETA: to make even more clear: Section 2.1 of ToS: ""You acknowledge and agree that Linden Lab and its’ licensors own all right, title, and interest in and to the Service, including all Intellectual Property Rights therein, other than with respect to User Content." If you can count on one hand the number of times the LL ToS explicitly states you must either (1) be the original creater or (2) have the consent of that creater to upload any intellectual content , you've lost count. And that's not even including the entire document linked from the ToS trying to make their position as clear as possible

LulaMoo wrote: I got the scrpit from free sl script they said i could cuse it alsong i didnt re sell it for money Yes, I understand your confusion. "Using" a script is not the same as "publishing" the source code for it. The proper way to refer to content found elsewhere on the Web is to link to it. A Copy and Paste of some other person's intellectual property, regardless of how you or anyone else might interpret any license of use, results in problems for the host offering the service which enables us to publish our own, original work. A DMCA takedown notice is not a stroll in the park to deal with, which is primarily why the gracious hosts that offer communal forum facilities (a means of self-publication which has only been possible recently), restrict their users to uploading only original content or the intellectual property of others with the expressed consent of the original authors. If anyone could just paste into these forums anybody else's work as they wished, you'd soon have to search for this community on the Tor Onion Network with other warez sites. And I'm certain you'd not want that. I hope that helps clarify things.