How to optimise an object for uploading to SL?

[VonWulfen]

Hello all.

I have just created a plate in Blender for my SL home.

When I calculate weight and fee, the plate has a land impact of 32.

How to optimise the model so it has a much lower LI, preferably 1?

Edited March 16, 2020 by VonWulfen

[ChinRey]

37 minutes ago, VonWulfen said:

How to optimise the model so it has a much lower LI, preferably 1?

Get the triangle count for the high LoD model down to no more than 288, mid LoD model no more than 144, low model no more than 72 and lowest preferably 18 or less. You'll need to use the loose vertice trick to get the lowest LoD model down to that tiranlge count without bucthering it.

For physics model you either use a cube or a single triangle.

Edited March 16, 2020 by ChinRey

[Wulfie Reanimator]

You might also need a physics model, which could just be a (flat) cube. The physics model created by the importer is not great.

What does the Edit view look like? As far as I can tell from the shading, that plate looks to be in the tens of thousands of triangles.

Edit: Oh, you can tell from the lower-right corner. 15K triangles is very heavy. You should remove most of the edge loops from the plate as there's too much detail in that plate that won't ever be noticeable.

Edited March 16, 2020 by Wulfie Reanimator

[VonWulfen]

59 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

Get the triangle count for the high LoD model down to no more than 288, mid LoD model no more than 144, low model no more than 72 and lowest preferably 18 or less. You'll need to use the loose vertice trick to get the lowest LoD model down to that tiranlge count without bucthering it.

For physics model you either use a cube or a single triangle.

Many thanks

Should I try to reduce triangle count in blender and if so what is the best way?

[VonWulfen]

4 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

You might also need a physics model, which could just be a (flat) cube. The physics model created by the importer is not great.

What does the wireframe look like?

Many thanks.

How to add a cube physics model?

 

[ChinRey]

Looking at that model: wow, that's way too many vertices and triangles! Remember that each and every one of those has to be downloaded and rendered and you should never ever have more of them than the model actually needs.

What you need is something like this:

Curve resolution 24 and no vertices in the middle of flat surfaces!

For the mid LoD model, remove evey other vertice around the circles:

You may also want to delete the tris on the bottom surface and maybe even the very narrow quads along the edges (unless it messes up the normals badly).

For low LoD, go down to 6 or possibly 8, curve resolution and eliminate all tris you can:

You may also be able to eliminate an edge loop on the outside:

For lowest LoD, I'll probably try something like this first:

 

24 minutes ago, VonWulfen said:

How to add a cube physics model?

You make each and every LoD model and the physics model as separate files in Blender, export them as separate dae files and choose "Load from file" for all of them. Never ever let the uploader generate models for you, it's horrendously bad at it.

Usually you make those models by simplifying the high LoD one but for physics you might as well make two reusable ones, a cube for items that don't need detailed physics and a single triangle for items that don't need physics at all. All models will be scaled by the uplaoder to the same overall dimensions as the high LoD one so it doesn't matter which size they are.

Edit: Just for the record, I am already working on a series of platters, bowls, vases and such simialr to this. That's why I could give such precise answers right away.

 

Edited March 16, 2020 by ChinRey

[VonWulfen]

3 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

Looking at that model: wow, that's way too many vertices and triangles. Remember that each and every one of those has to be downlaoded and rendered and you should never ever have more of them than the model actually needs.

What you need is something like this:

Curve resolution 24 and no vertices in the middle of flat surfaces!

For the mid LoD model, remove evey other vertice around the circles:

You may also want to delete the tris on the bottom surface and maybe even the very narrow quads along the edges (unless it messes up the normals badly).

For low LoD, go down to 6 or possibly 8, curve resolution and eliminate all tris you can:

You may also be able to eliminate an edge loop on the outside:

For lowest LoD, I'll probably try something like this first:

 

You make each and every LoD model and the physics model as separate files in Blender, export them as separate dae files and choose "Load from file" for all of them. Never ever let the uploader generate models for you, it's horrendously bad at it.

Usually you make those models by simplifying the high LoD one but for physics you might as well make two reusable ones, a cube for items that don't need detailed physics and a single triangle for items that don't need physics at all. All models will be scaled by the uplaoder to the same overall dimensions as the high LoD one so it doesn't matter which size they are.

Many thanks.

I cant get my head around this aspect of modelling objects for SL. But its only my second object, previous one was a book that came in at 1LI.

I still have so much to learn about Blender And SL but its all good experience

[Wulfie Reanimator]

18 minutes ago, VonWulfen said:

How to add a cube physics model?

You would just add a new cube to the scene and export it, then add it to the "Physics" tab of the importer. (There's an option to "Load from file")

I can tell from the wireframe that you probably used a Subdivision modifier, which is fine since it gives that smooth look, but a real-time environment like SL, the model should be optimized to get rid of as much geometry as you can. For demonstration purposes, I made a similar plate from a cube:

You can select entire "loops" with Alt-Click. (Hold Shift to select multiple) The easiest place to start reducing geometry is in the flattest surfaces, like the top rim:

You can press X for the "Delete" menu, and select "Limited Dissolve" so Blender will try to delete things without breaking holes into the surface.

It doesn't have to be perfect quads (squares) either when you're optimizing. If you open the command search (Space for me, not sure what the default is), you can type in "Select Linked Flat Faces" and then "Merge" (Alt-M) whichever way works best. For example, here I would just merge at center:

TLDR on how to optimize: Step 1: Select loop. Step 2: Delete.

[ChinRey]

9 minutes ago, VonWulfen said:

I cant get my head around this aspect of modelling objects for SL.

There are lots of advanced tricks and techniques, subtle nuances and exceptions to the rules but there are three fairly simple basic principles:

1. If it doesn't show, remove it
2. If it does show, don't remove it
3. Do it yourself
   • The SL uploader offers several options to do various tasks automatically but it's important to remember that although LL may have an army of "rockstar programmers", none of them have any knowledge or understanding of practical modelling worth mentioning. They're certianly doing their best but to them it's all abstractions and what works in theory doesn't always in practice.
   • As for uploading models made by others (yes, I know you don't do that but I mention it for the sake of completeness), apart from the legal issues (which may or may not be a problem) you can't expect them to be SL ready. Most of the time you can't even expect them to be game ready.

[Chic Aeon]

Some additional advice and keeping it simple.

 

Stay AWAY from the sub-surf modifier. If you DO use it, never set it higher than "1" and THEN take out a bunch of edge loops on the model where they really aren't needed. So for example you might want to have a nice smoothly rounded edge but certainly don't need all the extra vertices that come WITH using the sub surf modifier). 

 

While you are learning, stick to things that are fairly cube like so you don't fall into the "OMG it looks so smooth and lovely I just have to leave it this way even though it is laggier than hell" trap.

 

NOTE that MANY 3D modeling tutorials are made for RENDER objects (those that will be used as photographs) and NOT "game asset" models which is what we need for SL.  

 

Also I don't think anyone mentioned that there are three parts to the upload cost with the final cost being the greatest of the three.    Typically (if you use a cube or a hexagon for a physics model)  it will be the DOWNLOAD cost that will be the biggest number.  For most simple items of small to medium size (not a house) your upload cost should not be more than 12 lindens (typically 11).  

 

For example here is a set of furniture. All of these (except the desk and that was because I became lazy) are one land impact with long LODs.  I DID use a sub-surf modifier here (set at 1) but then deleted MOST of the extra edge loops that were not needed.   

 

[VonWulfen]

16 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

You would just add a new cube to the scene and export it, then add it to the "Physics" tab of the importer. (There's an option to "Load from file")

I can tell from the wireframe that you probably used a Subdivision modifier, which is fine since it gives that smooth look, but a real-time environment like SL, the model should be optimized to get rid of as much geometry as you can. For demonstration purposes, I made a similar plate from a cube:

You can select entire "loops" with Alt-Click. (Hold Shift to select multiple) The easiest place to start reducing geometry is in the flattest surfaces, like the top rim:

You can press X for the "Delete" menu, and select "Limited Dissolve" so Blender will try to delete things without breaking holes into the surface.

It doesn't have to be perfect quads (squares) either when you're optimizing. If you open the command search (Space for me, not sure what the default is), you can type in "Select Linked Flat Faces" and then "Merge" (Alt-M) whichever way works best. For example, here I would just merge at center:

TLDR on how to optimize: Step 1: Select loop. Step 2: Delete.

Many many thanks. I will give it a go

How did you create with a with a cube? Is there a video tutorial that would cover this?

[VonWulfen]

18 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

There are lots of advanced tricks and techniques, subtle nuances and exceptions to the rules but there are three fairly simple basic principles:

1. If it doesn't show, remove it
2. If it does show, don't remove it
3. Do it yourself
   • The SL uploader offers several options to do various tasks automatically but it's important to remember that although LL may have an army of "rockstar programmers", none of them have any knowledge or understanding of practical modelling worth mentioning. They're certianly doing their best but to them it's all abstractions and what works in theory doesn't always in practice.
   • As for uploading models made by others (yes, I know you don't do that but I mention it for the sake of completeness), apart from the legal issues (which may or may not be a problem) you can't expect them to be SL ready. Most of the time you can't even expect them to be game ready.

I have no interest in uploading other peoples work. I am interested in learning to create my own simple things for my home and to improve my knowledge and skill with Blender.

SL has given my inspiration and a eagerness to improve my modelling skill, for they do need a lot of improving

[Wulfie Reanimator]

11 minutes ago, VonWulfen said:

How did you create with a with a cube? Is there a video tutorial that would cover this?

Tadaa.

Edited March 16, 2020 by Wulfie Reanimator

[VonWulfen]

14 minutes ago, Chic Aeon said:

Some additional advice and keeping it simple.

 

Stay AWAY from the sub-surf modifier. If you DO use it, never set it higher than "1" and THEN take out a bunch of edge loops on the model where they really aren't needed. So for example you might want to have a nice smoothly rounded edge but certainly don't need all the extra vertices that come WITH using the sub surf modifier). 

 

While you are learning, stick to things that are fairly cube like so you don't fall into the "OMG it looks so smooth and lovely I just have to leave it this way even though it is laggier than hell" trap.

 

NOTE that MANY 3D modeling tutorials are made for RENDER objects (those that will be used as photographs) and NOT "game asset" models which is what we need for SL.  

 

Also I don't think anyone mentioned that there are three parts to the upload cost with the final cost being the greatest of the three.    Typically (if you use a cube or a hexagon for a physics model)  it will be the DOWNLOAD cost that will be the biggest number.  For most simple items of small to medium size (not a house) your upload cost should not be more than 12 lindens (typically 11).  

 

For example here is a set of furniture. All of these (except the desk and that was because I became lazy) are one land impact with long LODs.  I DID use a sub-surf modifier here (set at 1) but then deleted MOST of the extra edge loops that were not needed.   

 

Many many thanks for the tips

[VonWulfen]

2 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Tadaa.

Awesome! I really do appreciate this, its so very helpful to me

[VonWulfen]

19 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Tadaa.

Many thanks

I followed your example and came up with this

[Anna Nova]

Hey guys!  Isn't it nice to meet a new builder who actually wants to learn to do it right?  Instead of telling us how skilled he is and how terrible SL is with his 'superior' models.

Welcome VonWulfen.

[VonWulfen]

3 hours ago, anna2358 said:

Hey guys!  Isn't it nice to meet a new builder who actually wants to learn to do it right?  Instead of telling us how skilled he is and how terrible SL is with his 'superior' models.

Welcome VonWulfen.

You are too kind

I am very inspired by so many marvellous creations I have seen

Now I want to make it into a meat pie.

Any tips on how to make a pie crust are most welcome

 

Edited March 17, 2020 by VonWulfen