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Group Chat JIRA has been open for five years + with no action, so....


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As many of us have experienced, group chat is fairly often useless.  A JIRA was opened on it in Novemember of 2007, more than five years ago.

This weekend it was especially bad.  The group we have has FOUR members.  We're often on the same sim. There should not be any errors.  Yet IF we can start a group chat at all (often we cannot) we get dropped messages, messages coming out of order, messages taking 5 minutes to post. 

It's beyond ridiculous.

 

So in response to LLs attention to this matter, a matter that is critical in a world where communication is the cornerstone of activity and commerce, I have decided to tweet the following EVERY time a group chat problem occurs. 

@SecondLife @Rodvick Group chat messages dropped or unable to open at all. Why has this not been addressed? JIRAs been open for FIVE YEARS.

Maybe a massive and more public flooding of the interwebs with bad feedback might get them to actually look at the problem. 


I hope you will ALL join me.  It's a simple message, and will take but a moment out of your day to post. Though if you get dozens of errors as I do, and post this message after every one, you may spend too much time on it. Use your discretion :P

 

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They actually did put a bunch of work into group chat, and rollled out the modifications in mid-2011. This was after a long project to test out several alternartive systems. The changes were really good. it worked so well that people started to use it more than ever, and the new system ran into a brand new brick wall. So, they have gone back to the drawing board.

CHUI has some interesting interface changes, but I don't think it will do anything to help the server side load issues.

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not immediately. so agree about that

what it do tho is provide a good clientside platform to go forward on. like get the clientside working good then fit the serverside to it. sometimes is better to do that way round

+

just add

is lots of or studies and projects that shows most gains in streaming comes from improvements on the client side. percentage wise

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i dont understand where they getting lost serverside

normal way for a large numbers of clients is make partitions. say if can only handle max 128 messages C(128) per sec on your whole serverside hardwares then for 131,072 messages need 1024 serversides partitions P(1024) to do in realtime T(1) = 1 sec

if havent got P(1024) then

P(512) = T(2) :: P(256) = T(4) :: P(128) = T(8)

if C(256) then

P(512) = T(1) :: P(256) = T(2) :: P(128) = T(4)

if C(512) then

P(256) = T(1) :: P(128) = T(2) :: P(64) = T(4)

etc

these hardware arithmetics. is hard limits. so usual make the softwares to fit in these

+

if messages getting lost then the C() and P() queues overflowing

if overflowing then need more C() and P() to approach T(1) or settle for T(4 or 8 or ?)

more faster/leaner softwares algo not going to solve it. if algo is optimal already. have to chuck more hardwares at it

this the usual way is done. dunno if linden do. seems strange that they wouldnt tho

+

i thought the idea of the CHUI was to make handling of messages on the clientside more efficient with the serverside. communication-wise. as well as redo the UI to make more sense to the user

 

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16 wrote:

i dont understand where they getting lost serverside

normal way for a large numbers of clients is make partitions. say if can only handle max 128 messages C(128) per sec on your whole serverside hardwares then for 131,072 messages need 1024 serversides partitions P(1024) to do in realtime T(1) = 1 sec

if havent got P(1024) then

P(512) = T(2) :: P(256) = T(4) :: P(128) = T(8)

if C(256) then

P(512) = T(1) :: P(256) = T(2) :: P(128) = T(4)

if C(512) then

P(256) = T(1) :: P(128) = T(2) :: P(64) = T(4)

etc

these hardware arithmetics. is hard limits. so usual make the softwares to fit in these

+

if messages getting lost then the C() and P() queues overflowing

if overflowing then need more C() and P() to approach T(1) or settle for T(4 or 8 or ?)

more faster/leaner softwares algo not going to solve it. if algo is optimal already. have to chuck more hardwares at it

this the usual way is done. dunno if linden do. seems strange that they wouldnt tho

+

i thought the idea of the CHUI was to make handling of messages on the clientside more efficient with the serverside. communication-wise. as well as redo the UI to make more sense to the user

 

math4.gif

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jejejejee (:

can be like that sometimes

+

I just count on my fingers mostly (:

you know how people say can count up to 10 on your fingers. can actual geeky count up to 255 on your 8 fingers. and can use your thumbs as operators. so 1024 altogether if you want

some people also use their tongue as well as a operator. like poke it out different sides depend on where they are in their counting. can easy double and triple your capacity. i seen quite a few people do that way. seems to work quite well for them q; (:

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Cerise Sorbet wrote:

The problem is that the messages are lost before they are ever sent to the client. No amount of interface work can fix that.

This.

I have seen CHUI was available but haven't played with it yet. I thought it was for individual communication though, IM and local chat and such. I didn't realize it was meant to improve group chat.  Nothing I read about it said anything about group chat at all.

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Eve Greymoon wrote:


Cerise Sorbet wrote:

The problem is that the messages are lost before they are ever sent to the client. No amount of interface work can fix that.

This.

I have seen CHUI was available but haven't played with it yet. I thought it was for individual communication though, IM and local chat and such. I didn't realize it was meant to improve group chat.  Nothing I read about it said anything about group chat at all.

on the blog they specific mention group chat in the voice paragraph. and more enhanced conferencing for all forms. could have been a typo tho about the group chat. dunno

 

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I just put here a pic of the CHUI convo window

Chui.jpg

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i am chat to myself and my other self on it (:

on the left list:

1) i am in a IM with my other self

2) Sixteen group

    is 2 active in the convo. Elizabeth - 16 and Elizabeth - sixteen. she is get cheeky to me so i have to mute her (:

3) Nearby (open) chat

   is just me on the sim so only me on the list. i not invite that other one to come by me bc she smells. jejejejeje (:

+

the idea i think is to get all communications to work in integrated way on the clientside with mostly new codes api/library. then make each of the dif comms servers go better. am pretty sure that is the plan. well hope so

 

 

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