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Eric Castanea

Message to LL: Why should I run V2 when there are other options with twice the performance?

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Gadget Portal wrote:

Play with your grahphics settings. In V2, if I'm standing still, I peak at 95 FPS. And that's still with most graphics settings maxed.

You should probably know that anything faster than 45 FPS is overkill, since you're not getting additional frames out of the region servers.

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Eric Castanea wrote:

I stated explicitly that that V2 runs at 5fps. I can get 25fps with
EVERY
other viewer I've tried. There is nothing wrong with my system configuration. Evidently, you didn't read or understand the original post. Many other people have this problem, as you can see by the multiple threads in this forum.  And I certainly don't need your "help".  I didn't ask for it, either.

You're still not really providing any system specs, which might provide some insight.  Help > About Second Life has all the information you need in an easy-to-copypasta format.

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Yoki Enoch wrote:


Gadget Portal wrote:

You've offered no technical details or system specs. Seemed more like you were just saying V2 doesn't run well. I was offering evidence that it can, depending on your system and your settings.

If you want helpful feedback, post your system specs and some of your settings, maybe we can figure out why your system is having so much trouble with it.

Should any of that be necessary if V2 was well designed in the first place?

Yes.  You're talking about a complex piece of virtual reality software, not a simple videogame.

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Gadget Portal wrote:

I never claimed it was well made. This is easily the buggiest, most poorly designed software I've ever used.

You've never used Microsoft Windows, Internet Explorer, Autodesk AutoCAD or Microsoft Office?  I mean, if we're going to talk about bloated, buggy crap, might as well point out the eggregious offenders first.

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on a 5 year old computer with viewer settings on high, with my avi standing in the same location:

 

SL V2: 37 FPS

Kirstins 30 FPS

Firestorm: 22 FPS

 

The SL V2 beta is even faster, but barely works.

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Baloo Uriza wrote:


Gadget Portal wrote:

I never claimed it was well made. This is easily the buggiest, most poorly designed software I've ever used.

You've never used Microsoft Windows, Internet Explorer, Autodesk AutoCAD or Microsoft Office?  I mean, if we're going to talk about bloated, buggy crap, might as well point out the eggregious offenders first.

I've used all of those but Office pretty extensively, although it's been some years since I used AutoCAD. My opinion stands. SL is still the buggiest system I've used.

And I know 95 FPS is overkill. My point was that it's possible to get good FPS with V2. Doesn't matter if it's 45, 65, or eleventybillion. If someone is having trouble getting good FPS, they should post their system specs so that the problem may be more easily found.

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Catwise Yoshikawa wrote:

I don't need to buy a new computer each year to work with 3d or video editing, so why should we need to buy a new computer each year just for SL? no sense, sorry.

Would agree updating a 5 year old  pc, but they can't ask people to update computers each year...

 

I didn't say buy one each year. I said get a modern system. Every five years, for example. Or, even better, something that can be upgraded over the years. Get a basic 64 bit PC now, and as time goes, add more RAM or a better GPU, or perhaps a better CPU. One part at a time as the years go, to keep costs down.

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Frame rates above 45fps aren't a total waste. Anything that is done client-side (texture animation, prim rotation, avatar physics, flexiprims) will look smoother.

That said, frame rates above 60fps ARE a waste on most modern computers, because that's the refresh rate of your display. People with retro computers with CRT monitors or fancy 3D-capable flat panels with 120Hz refresh are exceptions.

 

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Anything beyond about 45-60 FPS is a waste on a human level because the brain has a hard time even perceiving individual frames beyond that even looking for shutter stutter.

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Baloo Uriza wrote:


Catwise Yoshikawa wrote:

I don't need to buy a new computer each year to work with 3d or video editing, so why should we need to buy a new computer each year just for SL? no sense, sorry.

Would agree updating a 5 year old  pc, but they can't ask people to update computers each year...

Because certain builders take a "I have a super-badass computer and if you don't, screw you" attitude towards not building for efficiency and not becoming a fully competant designer who
can
 do more with less.

 

I mean that I should have similar fps using old viwer, phoenix or whatever than using the last viewer 2 version. No sense for me having 35 fps and just 5 with last viewer 2.

Maybe was a bug, but viewer 2.7.4. freeze not only SL but my whole pc.

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Gadget Portal wrote:

You've offered no technical details or system specs. Seemed more like you were just saying V2 doesn't run well. I was offering evidence that it can, depending on your system and your settings.

If you want helpful feedback, post your system specs and some of your settings, maybe we can figure out why your system is having so much trouble with it.

Ok, then. Please tell me why I can only get 5fps with this laptop with LL's latest viewer.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CPU: AMD Turion 64 Mobile Technology ML-42 (2412.36 MHz)

Memory: 2047 MB

OS Version: Microsoft Windows Vista 32-bit Service Pack 2 (Build 6002)

Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation

Graphics Card: GeForce Go 7900 GS/PCI/SSE2/3DNOW!

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Eric Castanea wrote:


Gadget Portal wrote:

You've offered no technical details or system specs. Seemed more like you were just saying V2 doesn't run well. I was offering evidence that it can, depending on your system and your settings.

If you want helpful feedback, post your system specs and some of your settings, maybe we can figure out why your system is having so much trouble with it.

Ok, then. Please tell me why I can only get 5fps with this laptop with LL's latest viewer.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CPU: AMD Turion 64 Mobile Technology ML-42 (2412.36 MHz)

Memory: 2047 MB

OS Version: Microsoft Windows Vista 32-bit Service Pack 2 (Build 6002)

Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation

Graphics Card: GeForce Go 7900 GS/PCI/SSE2/3DNOW!

Well, right off the bat, that's 5 year old technology. Single core and an old GPU, and only 2 gigs RAM. That can be partially to blame. That said, you are right, you should be getting better FPS than you do.

What driver version are you using on the GPU, is that up to date? And the other troublehsooting question that has to be asked is if you're running other software, background programs, etc.

With that system, you should be able to get at least 15. My partner has a much weaker system, and we greased 15 FPS (on a private estate, not mainland) out of it with some effort.

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Eric Castanea wrote:


Gadget Portal wrote:

You've offered no technical details or system specs. Seemed more like you were just saying V2 doesn't run well. I was offering evidence that it can, depending on your system and your settings.

If you want helpful feedback, post your system specs and some of your settings, maybe we can figure out why your system is having so much trouble with it.

Ok, then. Please tell me why I can only get 5fps with this laptop with LL's latest viewer.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CPU: AMD Turion 64 Mobile Technology ML-42 (2412.36 MHz)

Memory: 2047 MB

OS Version: Microsoft Windows Vista 32-bit Service Pack 2 (Build 6002)

Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation

Graphics Card: GeForce Go 7900 GS/PCI/SSE2/3DNOW!

Are you using Aero as your theme or one of the Windows Classic-based themes?  The glassy eyecandy in the desktop kills 3D performance.  Is your laptop set to use switchable graphics or discrete graphics?  The latter will force your laptop to use the better GPU instead of the Intel "integrated" GPU common on laptops that have a higher end GPU (and the GeForce Go and Radeon Mobility lines tend to be almost as power efficient at desktop tasks as the Intel GPU anyway).

 

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"That said, V1 versions are history and there's no point in discussing them; they will become unusable after mesh rolls out to the grid. As far as V2's are ocncerned, you obviously need to tweak your settings when running LL's V2."

first:  v1 based viewers are more than 2x as popular as v2 based viewers. This is by users whos have tried several viewers adn conscioulsy chosen.  That being said, some viewers seem to work better depending on the computer being used. For most people that will be v1 based viwers, but not always.

One problem with v2 is that it likes to reset graphics setting on logging in, so, if you have an average system you usually need to go to graphics settings and readjust for what works for you. Sure it wont look as good wehn you lower graphics settings, but tht just part of v2.

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