EliseAnne85

Ironically enough, SL being "boring" is one of the chief complaints. To me, SL will only be boring if there is no one there and it's a bunch of interactive "bots" of some kind.

It's a reminder of gambling, I think. It's like me in SL. I don't even drink what are supposed to be recreations of alcoholic drinks because it reminds me. However, I don't think SL should ban all alcoholic-looking drinks because I and others here in SL may have been alcoholics at one time. We may be recovered alcoholics. I mostly do not even think of alcohol at all as I've been off alcohol for approx. 30 years and I don't go to bars in SL. This topic is reminding me of the addition aspects of alcohol rather than gambling to which I have no gambling addition and never had. I like to spin for prizes every once in awhile like at a real life Arcade. Win a few (like about 3) prizes a year and that's it. The Casino thing is a reminder (but could be a dangerous reminder), and those amounts to pay for some kind of non-transferable chips is astounding. But, even if it were free, it would still be a reminder of gambling and could lead the recovered gambler right back into rl betting and casino gambling.

No shirt, no shoes, no service. Sorry.

Ha~! We posted at the same time. But, yes, that's where the word comes from - Greek Mythology.

Greek, sun god. Helios: the god of the sun in Greek mythology compare sol.

I'm beginning to think there are two main kinds of value: One is what is called "sentimental value". To me, sentimental value is something that is subjective to the user and would probably cover all non-transfer items in SL as non-transfer items cannot be "readily converted" into anything. In real life, sentimental value means the thing doesn't have any readily converted monetary value, it is a thing that holds sentimental value to the individual. The second main definition of value is "monetary value" and it usually means something that can be sold for money and/or exchanged for something else of value that could also be readily converted into money. Such as trading a vintage teapot with a neighbor for a bracelet. Thus, I'm beginning to think the poorly written definition from the SL TOS above really should read nor traded for something of value which also could be readily converted into lindens or real money. I, personally, think these chips have a value in that a person would get to do something with them which is spin more which could win more free spins but they cannot readily be exchanged for lindens nor into real life money, thus they get a pass. In short, they are an object that cannot be exchanged, they are no transfer. Therefore, my conclusion is I don't see any reason why nice prizes could not be given out as long as they are no transfer. See TOS of SL above from their Gambling Wiki^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ They need to define the above better because there are two kinds of value - sentimental and monetary.

I think it means monetary value because it says in the TOS "as long as it cannot be readily converted". It's like when we have things in our home and we can sell them, they have value. It's poorly worded as per the usual of most TOS, imo. But, we don't need to debate the definition of it. Value is subjective such as some people loved Beanie Babies, others hated them. I think it means money really, such as I could say "I'm going to keep this for a few years as I think it will go up in value". VALUE Definition: relative worth, merit, or importance:the value of a college education; the value of a queen in chess. monetary or material worth, as in commerce or trade:This piece of land has greatly increased in value. the worth of something in terms of the amount of other things for which it can be exchanged or in terms of some medium of exchange. equivalent worth or return in money, material, services, etc.:to give value for value received. SL TOS: If the "payout" involves objects that are more akin to novelty objects that cannot readily be converted into Linden dollars, real-world currency or value, then that activity will likely be permitted.

I thought in the TOS when it said "or value" it meant the value was that it could be turned into lindens or real life currency. What is the value in something that one cannot sell for lindens or real world currency? What does it mean there by value? People give out giftcards at events, that has value. Any idea how to define value here in the TOS if a person can only keep it in their inventory or use it for themselves? If the "payout" involves objects that are more akin to novelty objects that cannot readily be converted into Linden dollars, real-world currency or value, then that activity will likely be permitted.

That should be up on video screens there.

I feel that way a bit too. I was wondering if LL is more or less saying it's all role play and role play is valued by the individual because we don't actually own anything in SL. The main licensed owner is LL and for certain other things they are user licensed. Once AI generators come along though, we all could own more things probably. Sometimes I wish they'd make virtual goods actually worth something. Like people can own for real their own virtual land in SL and/or own our virtual items (but they'd have to mod/transfer) to own them and for the virtual items to have value upon resale. But, I think copy-botters ruin the idea of owning our virtual items. Just my .2 cents on that. No response is necessary.

I haven't looked up TOS yet but I'm guessing interfering with other's enjoyment of SL? Maybe. I honestly don't know either.

They are all sharks. lol When my ex-husband and I were first married, I almost talked my ex into being a croupier. He hates gambling like I do, but he had the personality for it. He was a very funny guy and quite entertaining. He eventually got saddled to a job with honestly more corrupt bosses than Casinos probably have. He also eventually caught these bosses on tax evasion. He needed to get them for human abuse via the Labor Board! Unfortunately, the business made everything look all shiny when the Labor Board came out to give them their bright and shiny 'you pass' checkmark. My ex's bosses were worse sharks than I think are in Vegas.

That's what I thought the signs were, not really protesting, but the signs are information on gambling addiction with a helpline. This is what happens in real life, too, at Casinos. It's not really protesting, it's info and a helpline. Some need it, most are occasional gamblers. I don't even play the lottery. I just don't care for gambling. I do like arcades in real life where I will spin a few times for a random prize. But, that's an occasional thing like arcades at a Summer beach boardwalk on vacation. Still, a simple ban would have sufficed as you posted above. I still don't see why other's could not do this? You simply cannot have prizes that can be exchanged for lindens and/or real life money. That could be gamed, that's why probably. There are times when the bad apples really do spoil the whole bunch. Most everything on the internet can eventually "be gamed". If it's not AI or copy-botting, it's something else. I miss being able to have fun but someone's always gotta ruin it, imo, by cheating.

I did not know protesting was against the TOS, especially since protesting around Casinos happens in rl too. Nevertheless, I am sorry to hear that as I think all role play there should be acceptable including beggars AND protestors. But, it's their land, so they decide what is acceptable. Still, sorry to hear that.

LOL Doubt it, you might get something like "sorry, this whole row of machines are taken"...try over there > . Nickel machines oh my gah. I played the dollar ones. But, I've only played a few times in my life. I actually hate gambling. I wish they'd bring back Gacha WITHOUT the rare and just have commons. I like getting surprise surprises or random prizes. Something interesting of note, is Ebay is full of Dopamine rush stuff and it usually revolves around something that is "rare". Same with auctions, people bid up stuff like crazy because it's rare. I like Gacha because it was like real life. Taking a stroll along some out of the way shop to find something unique. I never needed nor desired the whole collector's set nor even the rare. I just bought what I liked and it was cool...like it's so cool...I found this. For some Gacha people it was about finding unique things. As far as hanging around a Casino to win more spins, I'm not too hip on it as a passtime.

So, it was the script was fixed by owner of machine that was the issue. Well, that's how gambling works in some ways. Slot machines and lotteries are some "programmed" types of gambling, I'd guess. But,, receiving a prize out of an arcade machine in real life is not gambling. One knows one gets a prize out of the machine. However, LL has something in their policy, I was just reading, that we cannot use "payouts" for things that can be traded for lindens or real money. So, that could be the issue that came about with Gacha and that's why these casinos cannot give out lindens but only tokens that cannot be exchanged for real money. However, LL Casino's all the tokens are not truly "free". What if no Linden dollars or other "consideration" are accepted or paid out? If entry is truly "free" (as with a promotional sweepstakes), and the game's operator requires no "consideration" or payment from other players or entrants, then that activity will likely be permitted, assuming compliance with all other applicable laws. If the "payout" involves objects that are more akin to novelty objects that cannot readily be converted into Linden dollars, real-world currency or value, then that activity will likely be permitted. https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Policy_Regarding_Wagering_in_Second_Life?_gl=1*aiccdb*_ga*NzU3NTE0ODc3LjE2NzgyODc3MTQ.*_ga_T7G7P6DCEC*MTY4MzY4NTA5Ni4xNC4xLjE2ODM2ODUzMjguNjAuMC4w

I've been wondering this myself as I am sure other's have also. I stop short at wondering if we issue some kind of token, does it involve the "no banking rule" in the TOS which really is only for lindens I think. So, the no banking rule is probably not involved although I haven't doubled checked it. So, maybe but having a winner and a loser is the real definition of gambling especially when one has to pay in to play so can't do that part. It's like the ante. One pays into the ante to play poker which then becomes the pot of money as people continue to bet they will have the winning hand or they bluff they have a winning hand by raising the bet high even though they may have a junk hand. That's what real gambling is. So, this no one wins except tokens to play more is an unknown thing to me. I have no idea what it is. Right now, it is defined as "role play" Casino. So, why not?

What law exactly for Gacha? I wasn't there when the Lindens may have spoken or written about their reason for eliminating Gacha. I do NOT see Gacha as gambling. With gambling, like a lottery ticket, one can win or one can lose it all. With slot machines, with poker, with Black Jack, with roulette, with craps one can win or one can lose it ALL. With Gacha, you get a prize every time but it's a surprise. It only had a hook in that it had a rare and I mostly never like the rare anyways. It was a rare Gacha that I like the rare. But, you could trade your Gachas that you didn't like like one trades marbles in real life. And, again, no one has to play Gacha. I never found it addicting so I didn't understand that aspect of it. But, so are shopping and sex possible addictions. And, they don't do away with alcohol because some are addicted to it. Gambling is a win or lose situation. This is what ChatGPT had to say about gambling: what is the truest definition of gambling ChatGPT Some examples of gambling include casino games, sports betting, lottery games, and card games like poker. The element of risk and uncertainty is central to gambling, as the outcome of the activity is unpredictable and can result in either a win or a loss for the gambler.

Read other thread, it has screenshots and more info on it. There are two threads going at this time on this topic. It's the So They Banned Gacha, But...thread.

Well, I doubt the profit is because "they need to eat". They've probably set this up because they need or want to put their kids through college and profits are way down for most businesses in this post-Covid and wartime world. The U.S. is broke; we've hit the debt ceiling. They should sell the business to someone who *can* whether this financial storm we are all in if profits are indeed the problem. This is so bizarre - spending money to lose and to where one can never cash out back into lindens. To me, it's like throwing money away. If it's role play, it's way expensive role play. If there is more than meets the eye here as to what is actually going on, perhaps we will hear from them soon as this is causing quite a stir.

The world has officially gone nuts. It's official now. I need a relaxation type of group now, where I can rest and de-stress from this. Is LL playing us in some way saying whatever we spend on role play is all the same? I pay my DJ's for playing some very unique stuff and tip the venue. At least they have taken time to provide something, a theme of music (like one Dj did all space-themed songs) or it's a uniquely talented real life musician streaming into SL, and both put in effort.

They had some kind of Pawn Shops that would give you quick money in SL, but it used to be for Gachas. I never went to one though. I'm sure the price given was fairly low at those SL Pawn Shops though. I bet some still exist as I still have Gachas boxed up in my inventory. I'm just keeping them for now. SMH, at LL though still at this funky kind of set-up that isn't gambling because you cannot win anything.

Maybe they can give people colorful and useful fish. We needs more fish. Oh my gah.

But really, Katherine, all I was really trying to say is you don't waste money. This comes with a premise of wasting money. Some say it's so the Lindens can eat. That sounds unbelievable. I don't think the Lindens know what it's like to not afford a pair of shoes. I've been there. I doubt they have. But, even if they have in their olden days, I don't think they know what's like to not be able to afford a pair of shoes nor how much this inflation is nearly breaking us. Some products have gone up 30% to 60% per item where I live. My rl money is low, very low. But, it's really the thing that the premise is based on wasting money, imo, because the basic premise is you will only get back tokens that cannot be used for anything but "spins" or really just clicking something with a cursor.

I would do the beggar thing. lol It might sound funny but I would. There are beggars in Las Vegas. They swarm there. It's sad but true.