PBR is coming...

[Wulfie Reanimator]

2 minutes ago, benchthis said:

Say I have a linden home and I have wild neighbors. I don't want to move but I wish to look out my windows and see a reflection of the official surroundings homes & landscaping. 

Will parcels have about land settings for reflection probe options that would only be seen if physically within the parcel? 

The parcel boundary would need a hollowed out rectangle with the material crome maybe dropped in to see the world outside vs world within. One panorama photo used as the image to reflect on to the surface of the rectangle. If all sides are transparent except for the internal hollow part of the rectangle would others see it from outside the parcel? 

It's little confusing. Here's video showing kind of what I mean. Notice blenders world texture is reflected onto the sphere. 

I'd like that sphere hollowed out and put around my linden home and the world texture reflected inside the sphere to create my own little world. 

 

This question was asked during the recent livestream. It will not be possible to define your own "world texture," at least not initially. They want to focus on doing the normal thing first, which is to have reflections that represent what's actually in the surroundings.

[benchthis]

15 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

This question was asked during the recent livestream. It will not be possible to define your own "world texture," at least not initially. They want to focus on doing the normal thing first, which is to have reflections that represent what's actually in the surroundings.

Ty, nice. It would be neat to change the reflection to a remote location for events and feel like you are really there but are reflecting somewhere else. I would like to live in fantasy home and reflect around my parcel a view of campwich lodge from across the water, I would not mind a live view of the boats passing by Maybe an official world texture that could be controlled by lindens to let users know of different events via plane with banner or sky writing if provide official updates is enabled. Holidays could be creepy around themes, valentines could be sky writing cloud hearts.

just blahing out stuff. going to be very cool.

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by benchthis

[benchthis]

8 hours ago, ChinRey said:

Maybe, maybe not:

No need for a JIRA. Those are known issues, listed in the release notes. But they need to be fixed or the whole project is DOA. LL seems to be confident they can but time will show.

Edit: I just did a search on the release notes and appears to be known issues with the huds too. 

 

I've also noticed one of my common huds are totally transparent now and warped.

I wear a camera hud for my little animal avatar and I have several copies of backups and non of them can be seen unless transparent obects are shown and even with transparency manually set to zero the hud textures are all messed up and just noticed the hud is warped. This is me running the PBR viewer logged into the main grid not the test grid. Not sure if that was reported by anyone. Not sure if the cause was me moving the location of the hud from the default position? Never had a problem before. I didn't move the location of the hud on screen, it was purchased that way, it appears to have been manually moved by the creator? Just little tips just incase any of this is useful. 

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by benchthis

[benchthis]

9 hours ago, ChinRey said:

Maybe, maybe not:

No need for a JIRA. Those are known issues, listed in the release notes. But they need to be fixed or the whole project is DOA. LL seems to be confident they can but time will show.

This is a strange model uploader bug. When using the PBR viewer on the main grid and attempting to upload the PBR viewer physics cube the LOD values look messed up the medium value is less than the low value. Generating strangeness. I searched the notes for this bug could only find uploading material problems. 

Edited February 10, 2023 by benchthis

[ChinRey]

1 hour ago, benchthis said:

This is a strange model uploader bug. When using the PBR viewer on the main grid and attempting to upload the PBR viewer physics cube the LOD values look messed up the medium value is less than the low value.

I think that's the new MeshOptimizer that replaced GLOD recently. I had a similar experience with the bog standard Firestorm:

And yes, as Rick so subtly hinted at in the title of that thread, uploader-generated LODs are still the Devil's vomit even after LL changed the algorithm.

[benchthis]

13 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

I think that's the new MeshOptimizer that replaced GLOD recently. I had a similar experience with the bog standard Firestorm:

And yes, as Rick so subtly hinted at in the title of that thread, uploader-generated LODs are still the Devil's vomit even after LL changed the algorithm.

Sweet I think I found another one, searched PBR viewer notes for Omega and nothing came up. Apparently when applying the following script to a cube on the test grid the x axis rotation appears to be at least 50% slower than the Y and Z omegas. Works fine on main grid but test grid problem. Not sure if it's a test grid problem or what. Here's the script I used that shows the problem.

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0.5,0,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}
 

Above is the problem one. If you pop the next two scripts into 2 cubes you will see what I mean on the test grid. 

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0.5,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0,0.5>, 1, 1);
    }
}

[arton Rotaru]

20 minutes ago, benchthis said:

Sweet I think I found another one, searched PBR viewer notes for Omega and nothing came up. Apparently when applying the following script to a cube on the test grid the x axis rotation appears to be at least 50% slower than the Y and Z omegas. Works fine on main grid but test grid problem. Not sure if it's a test grid problem or what. Here's the script I used that shows the problem.

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0.5,0,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}
 

Above is the problem one. If you pop the next two scripts into 2 cubes you will see what I mean on the test grid. 

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0.5,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0,0.5>, 1, 1);
    }
}

Doesn't repro for me. They spin all the same for me, using the GLTF viewer.

[benchthis]

22 minutes ago, benchthis said:

Sweet I think I found another one, searched PBR viewer notes for Omega and nothing came up. Apparently when applying the following script to a cube on the test grid the x axis rotation appears to be at least 50% slower than the Y and Z omegas. Works fine on main grid but test grid problem. Not sure if it's a test grid problem or what. Here's the script I used that shows the problem.

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0.5,0,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}
 

Above is the problem one. If you pop the next two scripts into 2 cubes you will see what I mean on the test grid. 

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0.5,0>, 1, 1);
    }
}

default
{
    state_entry()
    {
        llTargetOmega(<0,0,0.5>, 1, 1);
    }
}

Opps I made a goof my bad I had 0.05 in my problem one. I think I should wear my glasses now. False alarm. Sorry. 

[arton Rotaru]

1 minute ago, benchthis said:

Opps I made a goof my bad I had 0.05 in my problem one. I think I should wear my glasses now. False alarm. Sorry. 

No problem. Happens to all of us.

[arton Rotaru]

Also a FYI, the release notes page known issues list is super out-dated. Many of these issues there were fixed a long time ago, but several other (new) issues not listed there are present in the current GLTF viewer.

Edited February 10, 2023 by arton Rotaru

[benchthis]

17 minutes ago, arton Rotaru said:

No problem. Happens to all of us.

Hehe, I'm trying to upload materials I found for free here: Dull Brass PBR Material – Free PBR Materials

But after downloading 3 different zips and saved to desktop unzipped the upload materials browser does not like any of them. 

Wondering if anyone has a link to materials that can be uploaded to sl for experimenting and what is the supported file type. 

Edit: found the file type I think. GLTF or GLB. Wonder if blender can convert them. 

Edited February 10, 2023 by benchthis

[arton Rotaru]

7 minutes ago, benchthis said:

Hehe, I'm trying to upload materials I found for free here: Dull Brass PBR Material – Free PBR Materials

But after downloading 3 different zips and saved to desktop unzipped the upload materials browser does not like any of them. 

Wondering if anyone has a link to materials that can be uploaded to sl for experimenting and what is the supported file type. 

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/tree/master/2.0

For example: Download this one (Save target as...) https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/blob/master/2.0/DamagedHelmet/glTF-Embedded/DamagedHelmet.gltf

Import the .gltf into Blender. Export the model as collada. Upload the collada. And use the .gltf as the material.

[benchthis]

2 minutes ago, arton Rotaru said:

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/tree/master/2.0

For example: Download this one (Save target as...) https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/blob/master/2.0/DamagedHelmet/glTF-Embedded/DamagedHelmet.gltf

Import the .gltf into Blender. Export the model as collada. Upload the collada. And use the .gltf as the material.

Thanks, this will connect a lot of dots, I can feel it. Collada I've used that file type before when dabbling with texturing. 

You're process is bringing in a model into second life also brings in the material if the collada is file is uploaded. Vs searching for a material only gltf without the model. The collada would be uploaded to SL using upload model or upload material? I'm trying to upload a material only, but I like the way you do it because in blender I can see how it's all set up. I'm a nod noob. 

[arton Rotaru]

You would upload the Collada (.dae) as Model. The .gltf will have to be uploaded on it's own as Material.

Alternatively you can upload the texture maps as images. Create a new material in your inventory (the little + sign at the bottom), double click the new material, and drag and drop the texture maps on the appropriate swatches in the material editor.

Edited February 10, 2023 by arton Rotaru

[benchthis]

19 minutes ago, arton Rotaru said:

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/tree/master/2.0

For example: Download this one (Save target as...) https://github.com/KhronosGroup/glTF-Sample-Models/blob/master/2.0/DamagedHelmet/glTF-Embedded/DamagedHelmet.gltf

Import the .gltf into Blender. Export the model as collada. Upload the collada. And use the .gltf as the material.

Just in case anyone else is dabbling don't click download, right click the download button and save as. If you click the download button will bring up bunch of scripting stuff. 

[benchthis]

I'm going to cheat a bit, just uploading the GLTF file and going to make copies of that material, change name, mod values, and make templates. I did get it the material uploaded to SL woot. now I can play.

[benchthis]

I'm able to make materials now. I made a wonky brass and a wonky chrome. I had to go back to the PBR SLU video where Strawberry Linden Rezes the sphere and then adds the material to the sphere and then she brings up the edit materials window kind of shows how that window is supposed to look. Tomorrow i'll dabble with finding PBR material values and looking for PBR charts for default material piddles. 

I did notice a couple of problems. First one was taking a cube and making a mirrorish shape applying the material, what's odd is when the object is rotated the material rotates too, wierd took screen shot the 3 in the back. like the reflection is upside down when object is upside down. When same objects are rotated they behave differently. 

With spheres noticed something wonky that put a seam when dropping a chrome material I made to it. It did not mess up when I went into build tools PBR searched for a blank material and then entered the values of the wonky one. My piddle area is here secondlife://Aditi/secondlife/Rumpus%20Room/179/238/23 Just in case. 

[benchthis]

Figured out something cool, from the test grid we can create new material by clicking inventory and clicking the plus + icon. That's pretty simple. I was just thinking; I wonder if we can create materials like we can notecards and scripts and we can. Maybe the material can have a drop down menu with all the the basic materials to choose from to populate the data in all the fields or if the materials folder will contain premade materials? 

[benchthis]

17 hours ago, benchthis said:

I'm able to make materials now. I made a wonky brass and a wonky chrome. I had to go back to the PBR SLU video where Strawberry Linden Rezes the sphere and then adds the material to the sphere and then she brings up the edit materials window kind of shows how that window is supposed to look. Tomorrow i'll dabble with finding PBR material values and looking for PBR charts for default material piddles. 

I did notice a couple of problems. First one was taking a cube and making a mirrorish shape applying the material, what's odd is when the object is rotated the material rotates too, wierd took screen shot the 3 in the back. like the reflection is upside down when object is upside down. When same objects are rotated they behave differently. 

With spheres noticed something wonky that put a seam when dropping a chrome material I made to it. It did not mess up when I went into build tools PBR searched for a blank material and then entered the values of the wonky one. My piddle area is here secondlife://Aditi/secondlife/Rumpus%20Room/179/238/23 Just in case. 

I figured out why my PBR Material was swirling. In the editing material window the base color, metallic-roughness, emissive, and normal were set to blank instead of non. I was able to edit my PBR materal by clicking each of the spaces and selecting None instead of blank. Attached images showing difference between the good and the wonky. 

I noticed something odd though. After realizing my problem I deleted the red glow hollowed cube and there was a good lag time updating that to the other models around. Not sure what the object refresh rate is we know based on strawberry's reflection on the floor that avatar updating is very fast but when objects move or change there is noticeable lag time. 

I have a few more experiments to dabble with later on. pretty cool. 

Going to have to to make something extremely cool soon to test. 

Edited February 11, 2023 by benchthis

[arton Rotaru]

5 hours ago, benchthis said:

I noticed something odd though. After realizing my problem I deleted the red glow hollowed cube and there was a good lag time updating that to the other models around. Not sure what the object refresh rate is we know based on strawberry's reflection on the floor that avatar updating is very fast but when objects move or change there is noticeable lag time. 

There are 2 types of reflections. Those from the cube environment maps, the reflection probes generate, and screen space reflections. The latter will only reflect what is actually on screen (hence the name) and are in real time. The cube maps do update every 5 to 10 seconds or so. Kinda odd for us SLers, but something we will have to get used to I guess.

Edited February 11, 2023 by arton Rotaru

[benchthis]

2 hours ago, arton Rotaru said:

There are 2 types of reflections. Those from the cube environment maps, the reflection probes generate, and screen space reflections. The latter will only reflect what is actually on screen (hence the name) and are in real time. The cube maps do update every 5 to 10 seconds or so. Kinda odd for us SLers, but something we will have to get used to I guess.

Thanks, I've gone cross eyed. It hurts my brain. When you say there are 2 types of reflections, that's the probes right 2 types of reflection probes 1 users can create with a prim or one that we assume will be in a region we are? Or the cubes UV map behaves differently than a UV map of a sphere? I never heard of cube environment map before, is that what that means? 

 

Also, I did not have screen space reflections ticked, not sure if that had anything to do with anything but my computer sure did not like that major lag. Also did not have the reflection detail set to realtime. No idea if that had anything to do with anything. 

When I try to create a reflection probe from a cube it creates a transparent sphere scaled at 5 meters. Not sure if by creating my own within a larger reflection probe in a region, which I have no idea how they got the reflection probe so large, would goof anything. I have not tried to scale the transparent sphere I can create yet. Wonders if the reflection probe must be sphere. I thought I heard that within a box/cube shape would be the reflection probe for room spaces. Not sure what happened to the cube/box probes? Sure we can create a probe from a cube but it auto turns into a sphere when made into a reflection probe? 

Edited February 12, 2023 by benchthis

[arton Rotaru]

A cube map is what is the environment map. It's called cube map, because it's folded on the inside of a cube.

I did not watch the video, but I guess that Strawberry had screen space reflections on, which would make her Avatar react immediately in the reflection.

When you create a reflection probe from a prim, it will be the 10 meter sphere by default to prevent that there are tiny probes all around. To make that a box probe, go to the drop down menu in the reflection probe section of the build floater, and set it to Box. The sphere will turn into a box. Then you can scale this up to the usual prim limits. 64 meters. The bigger the better, or lets say,  a probe of just 1 or 2 meters is pretty useless.

When creating a probe for the inside of a room, you want to slightly penetrate the inside walls, floor, ceiling of said room, by a few cm so that the walls are also captured in the cube map.

Edited February 12, 2023 by arton Rotaru

[Love Zhaoying]

Will all those old builds that faked "floor mirrors" by duplicating prims under the floor be table to take advantage of this, have "true" floor reflections and save on prims (since they won't need the extra prims to "fake" the reflections)?

[arton Rotaru]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

Will all those old builds that faked "floor mirrors" by duplicating prims under the floor be table to take advantage of this, have "true" floor reflections and save on prims (since they won't need the extra prims to "fake" the reflections)?

Sort of. It won't be as nice and accurate looking as the actual duplicates.

[benchthis]

6 minutes ago, arton Rotaru said:

A cube map is what is the environment map. It's called cube map, because it's folded on the inside of a cube.

I did not watch the video, but I guess that Strawberry had screen space reflections on, which would make her Avatar react immediately in the reflection.

When you create a reflection probe from a prim, it will be the 10 meter sphere by default to prevent that there are tiny probes all around. To make that a box probe, go to the drop down menu in the reflection probe section of the build floater, and set it to Box. The sphere will turn into a box. Then you can scale this up to the usual prim limits. 64 meters. The bigger the better, or lets say,  a probe of just 1 or 2 meters is pretty useless.

When creating a probe for the inside of a room, you want to slightly penetrate the inside walls, floor, ceiling of said room, by a few cm so that the walls are also captured in the cube map.

cool thanks again