Desktop replacement help pls

[Liaa Nova]

Hey everyone

Yep, me again wittering on about what to do

I'm definitely going to replace my desktop pc this week so have a few questions i'd love some help on please

1) I don't have an SSD, and will get one. My current HDD is 500GB & only 50 full (in almost 7 years), so if the new desktop has a 1TB HDD, will I need a 120 or 240GB SSD? (Assuming just Windows & SL willl live on it and maybe Internet Security?)

2) Tempted by a Ryzen 5 2600x 3.6GHz, but would the 1600/1600x be better/is it overkill? I use SL with watching You Tube (might be taking photos in SL, happy to ditch YT when I do), maybe 2-3 webpages. I don't know that i'd use 6 cores, and don't want to spend what I don't need. (Looked at i5 but more expensive, but happy to check those too)

3) 8/16 memory?

I want this one to last at least 5yrs, my current one has lasted almost 7years on 4GB but is now struggling quite a bit

4) Are liquid coolers needed

Finally

Is a 1050Ti ok 4GB, or should I get the 1060 6GB? If the 1050 would allow Ultra graphics for photos only, not all the time (fun photos not ones paid for) i'd be happy with that

I want to be online in SL for about 10hrs a day, mostly talking and sometimes taking photos just for my own fun, not as any paid business. Would like Ultra just for the shadows etc for photos, but not generally

Not sure what else to ask yet, just have a bad habit of getting what I don't need, partly as I don't know what i'd use in SL eg cores

ty for any help, sorry I get long winded x

[ellestones]

1 hour ago, Liana Wildmist said:

Is a 1050Ti ok 4GB, or should I get the 1060 6GB? If the 1050 would allow Ultra graphics for photos only, not all the time (fun photos not ones paid for) i'd be happy with that

I want to be online in SL for about 10hrs a day, mostly talking and sometimes taking photos just for my own fun, not as any paid business. Would like Ultra just for the shadows etc for photos, but not generally

i have a 6 year old computer which I got made for me back then.  It had a 660GTX and a 1920x1080 monitor.  I recent upgraded the card and monitor to 1050TI and 2560 x 1440 curved screen monitor

in SL the 1050TI drives my 2k monitor at about the same FPS as the 660GTX did on the 1920 x 1080. Shadows about 24 FPS, no shadows and busy then upto about 45FPS. Not busy then easy hits 60FPS. So same same except at higher resolution. Monitor resolution is something that can be underestimated when we get computers. More pixels resolution for same speed cost is to me a better deal than faster pixels and less screen resolution

i didn't get a 1060 or higher as I would have had to replace the motherboard and the power supply to fit it in. Which would have mean't basically building a whole new computer so I didn't

with mesh in SL a whole lot more than 6 years ago then is a whole lot more CPU computation. While a i5 is ok, suggest get a i7 if you can afford. I got a i7 and 16MB RAM 6 years ago and have never regretted it. No regrets as I end up future proof my computer with those in terms of this upgrade. I don't need to add extra RAM or think about upgrade the CPU now. Just stuck in the new graphic card and plugged in my 2K monitor and happy as I am

i also have a 240MB SSD boot drive and 1TB platter drive. Both are still going good and I haven't filled them up either yet

basically get the most you can for your budget. The way I buy buy big stuff like computers, household appliances, cars, etc is not to look for deals and then try to work out how I am going to pay for it.  I start with how much money have I got to spend on this ? and then I try to get the best equipment I can for that amount. I don't try to save money when deciding. I spend it all

 

 

[Liaa Nova]

1 hour ago, ellestones said:

i have a 6 year old computer which I got made for me back then.  It had a 660GTX and a 1920x1080 monitor.  I recent upgraded the card and monitor to 1050TI and 2560 x 1440 curved screen monitor

in SL the 1050TI drives my 2k monitor at about the same FPS as the 660GTX did on the 1920 x 1080. Shadows about 24 FPS, no shadows and busy then upto about 45FPS. Not busy then easy hits 60FPS. So same same except at higher resolution. Monitor resolution is something that can be underestimated when we get computers. More pixels resolution for same speed cost is to me a better deal than faster pixels and less screen resolution

i didn't get a 1060 or higher as I would have had to replace the motherboard and the power supply to fit it in. Which would have mean't basically building a whole new computer so I didn't

with mesh in SL a whole lot more than 6 years ago then is a whole lot more CPU computation. While a i5 is ok, suggest get a i7 if you can afford. I got a i7 and 16MB RAM 6 years ago and have never regretted it. No regrets as I end up future proof my computer with those in terms of this upgrade. I don't need to add extra RAM or think about upgrade the CPU now. Just stuck in the new graphic card and plugged in my 2K monitor and happy as I am

i also have a 240MB SSD boot drive and 1TB platter drive. Both are still going good and I haven't filled them up either yet

basically get the most you can for your budget. The way I buy buy big stuff like computers, household appliances, cars, etc is not to look for deals and then try to work out how I am going to pay for it.  I start with how much money have I got to spend on this ? and then I try to get the best equipment I can for that amount. I don't try to save money when deciding. I spend it all

 

 

Thanks for the reply! I'd love a Ryzen 7 (don't want i7), but i'm not sure i'd use 8 cores when people say SL only uses 1? Not really sure how processor speed works, as in mine's 3.6 & so is a Ryzen 5 2600x, but I don't know what makes the processor better if the same speed.

I can't spend everything if I can save some, because my medical treatment costs a fortune rl and due to the illness I can't work, so really don't want to buy something i'll never use, if that makes any sense.

I won't upgrade anything, after 5-7 years i'd just want to buy a new computer but I am going with the 16GB RAM so hopefully it helps later on, being as that's one issue this has now, tho not until recently. I'm a pretty basic user I think, more a talker than anything else, SL is a pretty chatroom for me!

I'll get the 240 SSD unless anyone thinks it's too much for those 2/3 things, then i'll get the 120. Seems I have a bit more money I could use tho due to some for an early big birthday gift, so that i'll feel less guilty putting towards it as i'm not paying for medical stuff out of birthday money!

 

[Wulfie Reanimator]

If after 7 years you've only spent 10% of your relatively small HDD, there's no reason to go for 1TB. If you're absolutely terrified of opening your computer and plugging a cable in, you could go for a new 500GB one very safely. If you're even a little courageous or know someone who can do it for you, you can use your old 500GB HDD and put that into your new computer after it arrives. Free extra space!

16 GB of RAM is probably for the best, some everyday programs like Chrome will eat up memory like there's no tomorrow. You don't want your RAM to be running out, that'll cause lots of horrible lag on your entire computer.

My SSD (which has Windows, all the temp files, and SL cache on it) only has 91.7GB of files in it, so I would guess the smaller SSD should be enough for you.

Liquid coolers are absolutely not needed either. Those are intended for gaming with intense graphics and/or with an overclocked processor (CPU), which you have absolutely no need for.

As with cores, I would actually recommend one with 4 cores instead of 6 or 8 if you can find one for cheaper. The thing about CPU speeds is that in the real world, they're all limited by the "weakest link" or whichever core happens to be the slowest. The more cores you have, the lower speeds you can expect from a single core. This is important for programs like SL or gaming in general, because they rarely make use of more than 1-2 cores. A 4-core CPU at 3.6GHz will be better for games(/SL) than an 8-core CPU at 3.6GHz.

I personally have a GTX 1060 (3GB) as my graphics card and it works perfectly* fine for SL and games, even with max graphics, advanced lighting and projector shadows. You would probably be fine with even the 900-series.
* You can't expect to run SL with 30-60 FPS in crowded areas with everybody visible, sometimes not even in places with few people, because the objects around you are poorly optimized by creators.

[Liaa Nova]

1 hour ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

If after 7 years you've only spent 10% of your relatively small HDD, there's no reason to go for 1TB. If you're absolutely terrified of opening your computer and plugging a cable in, you could go for a new 500GB one very safely. If you're even a little courageous or know someone who can do it for you, you can use your old 500GB HDD and put that into your new computer after it arrives. Free extra space!

16 GB of RAM is probably for the best, some everyday programs like Chrome will eat up memory like there's no tomorrow. You don't want your RAM to be running out, that'll cause lots of horrible lag on your entire computer.

My SSD (which has Windows, all the temp files, and SL cache on it) only has 91.7GB of files in it, so I would guess the smaller SSD should be enough for you.

Liquid coolers are absolutely not needed either. Those are intended for gaming with intense graphics and/or with an overclocked processor (CPU), which you have absolutely no need for.

As with cores, I would actually recommend one with 4 cores instead of 6 or 8 if you can find one for cheaper. The thing about CPU speeds is that in the real world, they're all limited by the "weakest link" or whichever core happens to be the slowest. The more cores you have, the lower speeds you can expect from a single core. This is important for programs like SL or gaming in general, because they rarely make use of more than 1-2 cores. A 4-core CPU at 3.6GHz will be better for games(/SL) than an 8-core CPU at 3.6GHz.

I personally have a GTX 1060 (3GB) as my graphics card and it works perfectly* fine for SL and games, even with max graphics, advanced lighting and projector shadows. You would probably be fine with even the 900-series.
* You can't expect to run SL with 30-60 FPS in crowded areas with everybody visible, sometimes not even in places with few people, because the objects around you are poorly optimized by creators.

Thanks, a lot of good info there

They are all Hexa core up except a Ryzen 5 1500x Quad core 3.6Ghz (out of the R5 line)

Nobody to do anything to it for me and i'm disabled so it's not possible for me to. I think they do a 500GB HDD, will have to look. The 3GB card will save a fair bit I think too.

Will see what I can save with all above info, ty

[Liaa Nova]

Just had a look, the 500GB HDD is a few quid more expensive than 1TB, guess maybe they buy the 1TB in bulk or something, so may aswell get the 1TB

[animats]

Much to the annoyance of everybody who needs fast graphics, NVidia has discontinued the 1080TI. Prices on remaining 1080TI boards have increased sharply. NVidia is now pushing the 2080TI, $1200 and up. It has a ray-tracing unit. The ray-tracing unit is not only unused by SL, it's unused by all games currently shipping. Other than that, it's about as fast as the 1080TI.

Used 1080TI boards are available. Don't buy them. They're left over from cryptocurrency mining and have been heavily used.

Thus, the high-end graphics board situation currently sucks. Price/performance is worse than two years ago.

 

[Liaa Nova]

3 hours ago, animats said:

Much to the annoyance of everybody who needs fast graphics, NVidia has discontinued the 1080TI. Prices on remaining 1080TI boards have increased sharply. NVidia is now pushing the 2080TI, $1200 and up. It has a ray-tracing unit. The ray-tracing unit is not only unused by SL, it's unused by all games currently shipping. Other than that, it's about as fast as the 1080TI.

Used 1080TI boards are available. Don't buy them. They're left over from cryptocurrency mining and have been heavily used.

Thus, the high-end graphics board situation currently sucks. Price/performance is worse than two years ago.

 

I'm looking at 1050Ti or 1060, 1080 is way more expensive than I can afford sadly

[cykarushb]

On 11/7/2018 at 4:10 AM, Liana Wildmist said:

1) I don't have an SSD, and will get one. My current HDD is 500GB & only 50 full (in almost 7 years), so if the new desktop has a 1TB HDD, will I need a 120 or 240GB SSD? (Assuming just Windows & SL willl live on it and maybe Internet Security?)

2) Tempted by a Ryzen 5 2600x 3.6GHz, but would the 1600/1600x be better/is it overkill? I use SL with watching You Tube (might be taking photos in SL, happy to ditch YT when I do), maybe 2-3 webpages. I don't know that i'd use 6 cores, and don't want to spend what I don't need. (Looked at i5 but more expensive, but happy to check those too)

3) 8/16 memory?

4) Are liquid coolers needed

Finally

Is a 1050Ti ok 4GB, or should I get the 1060 6GB? If the 1050 would allow Ultra graphics for photos only, not all the time (fun photos not ones paid for) i'd be happy with that

1) SSD will help with boot times, its good for SL cache as its significantly faster than an HDD so things like pre cached textures and objects will load much faster. A good combo is a boot disk with room for your common applications with a "scratch disk" hard drive. So a 120/240gb SSD with a 1tb HDD is a very common solution. Just windows and SL, 120gb will be fine. SATA vs NVME isnt too much of a big deal for the average consumer, it has more to do with form factor than it does speed unless youre have some real drive intensive applications that rely on fast storage.

2) A 2600x is a great deal, theres not to drastic of a difference between Zen 2 and Zen, so a 1600/1600x would also be fine. SL is very single threaded and wont utilize multiple cores much, 6 cores is definitely not going to be used even with SL and multiple other things open. But it doesnt hurt to have and the R5's arent too much more expensive than the R3's. I have an i5 4570 and its juuuust about on par with the R3 1200, 4c/4t 1st gen Zen: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-4570-vs-AMD-Ryzen-3-1200/2770vs3931
It would be a good choice if you wanted to save a little more money if this PC isnt going to be used for things like photo/video editing or more intensive games where you would need more cores. Overall single threaded performance is a little better on the 1600 but nothing crazy.

If you go with Ryzen 3, get a 2200G as it costs about the same and performs slightly better and has integrated graphics as a backup (or as hybrid crossfire with an AMD gpu in applications that support crossfire, works similar to Nvidia PhysX where the lower tier gpu handles things like physics)

3) 8gb is fine, 16gb is recommended just to be certain. Web browsing + SL wont use crazy amounts of ram, i have 12gb and rarely top 6-7gb with a ton of crap open.

4) Not needed, more of an idea for overclocking or aesthetics. A good aftermarket air cooler can outperform most AIO water coolers, i personally like them though and think they look really nice. If youre not going to overclock, the stock Wraith coolers on zen processors are really good and will do just fine.

If youre looking at cheap hard drives, Western Digital greens cost nearly nothing, however they are fairly slow since they have "parking" to reduce power consumption. Its their big drawback but theyre used by server farms since they reduce overall power costs when you have thousands of them.

GPU wise, a 1050ti is a great card and will do what you want, but with a Ryzen 5 2600x i would suggest something more high tier to adequately pair with the system. A 1050ti will pair fine with a Pentium G4560 or i3's, Ryzen 3 or whatever. Ryzen 5 is best with the 6gb 1060 to something like a 1080ti. You will definitely be able to crank up to max settings for a photo though.

If youre on a tight budget, used GPUs are also a good option. An RX 580 post crypocurrency mining boom is around 170-180$ on ebay now and will perform like a 6gb 1060. This generation of AMD gpus is a fairly safe used buy since they stayed fairly cool under 24/7 max load unlike the R9 series which resulted in a lot of burnt gpus. Nvidia used post mining isnt a safe buy however since many people used the stock blower cooler designs which ran hot as hell. I have a metric crap-ton of GPUs and theyre almost all used and ive never had problems with them, just investigate what is and isnt a safe buy.

Used Maxwell cards (960/970/980/etc) werent good at crypto mining and all the used ones are safe to buy. A 970 will run you under 150$ and perform above the 6gb 1060's performance.

In fact, as im looking at these, this one is 150$ shipped: https://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-GeForce-GTX-970-4GB-GDDR5-FTW-GAMING-w-ACX-2-0-04GP42978-KR-04GP42978KR/264035484625?epid=220470984&hash=item3d79bdc3d1:g:xI4AAOSw9g1b6LvI:rk:1:pf:0

 

So tl;dr version, on a budget, R3 2200g, 8 or 16gb of ram, 1050ti OR 1060 6gb. More budget, R5 2600x and 1060 6gb. Used gpus optional, Zen 1 or Zen 2 optional. 120gb SSD will handle OS and SL without issue and be useful. Stock coolers fine, water cooling optional.

 

[cykarushb]

Heres some builds, minus OS, just what i would build and recommend.

I like Mini ITX, so heres a mini itx option, it has the cost premium of about an extra 70$ compared to micro atx:

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/fqdPcY

Heres a micro ATX option:

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/L4N4jy

Or the super budget option if you dont care about this PC looking good or being easy to work in the case:

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/fWrsWD

The drawbacks there are a cheap case, ive done a lot of work in cheap cases and theyre just a pain in the butt to build in but they work fine and airflow isnt much of a concern with just a 1060 and a 2200G. And the power supply is just bronze rated and its nothing fancy, its not cheap crap but its not a high end PSU. I personally dont like cheap power supplies because for the extra 20-40$ you tend to get a better warranty and higher efficiency (less heat), i actually have a 1000w PSU in a system that draws under 300w at peak synthetic load simply because it runs passively, no fan, at that load.

[Liaa Nova]

On 11/12/2018 at 3:48 AM, cykarushb said:

1) SSD will help with boot times, its good for SL cache as its significantly faster than an HDD so things like pre cached textures and objects will load much faster. A good combo is a boot disk with room for your common applications with a "scratch disk" hard drive. So a 120/240gb SSD with a 1tb HDD is a very common solution. Just windows and SL, 120gb will be fine. SATA vs NVME isnt too much of a big deal for the average consumer, it has more to do with form factor than it does speed unless youre have some real drive intensive applications that rely on fast storage.

2) A 2600x is a great deal, theres not to drastic of a difference between Zen 2 and Zen, so a 1600/1600x would also be fine. SL is very single threaded and wont utilize multiple cores much, 6 cores is definitely not going to be used even with SL and multiple other things open. But it doesnt hurt to have and the R5's arent too much more expensive than the R3's. I have an i5 4570 and its juuuust about on par with the R3 1200, 4c/4t 1st gen Zen: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-4570-vs-AMD-Ryzen-3-1200/2770vs3931
It would be a good choice if you wanted to save a little more money if this PC isnt going to be used for things like photo/video editing or more intensive games where you would need more cores. Overall single threaded performance is a little better on the 1600 but nothing crazy.

If you go with Ryzen 3, get a 2200G as it costs about the same and performs slightly better and has integrated graphics as a backup (or as hybrid crossfire with an AMD gpu in applications that support crossfire, works similar to Nvidia PhysX where the lower tier gpu handles things like physics)

3) 8gb is fine, 16gb is recommended just to be certain. Web browsing + SL wont use crazy amounts of ram, i have 12gb and rarely top 6-7gb with a ton of crap open.

4) Not needed, more of an idea for overclocking or aesthetics. A good aftermarket air cooler can outperform most AIO water coolers, i personally like them though and think they look really nice. If youre not going to overclock, the stock Wraith coolers on zen processors are really good and will do just fine.

If youre looking at cheap hard drives, Western Digital greens cost nearly nothing, however they are fairly slow since they have "parking" to reduce power consumption. Its their big drawback but theyre used by server farms since they reduce overall power costs when you have thousands of them.

GPU wise, a 1050ti is a great card and will do what you want, but with a Ryzen 5 2600x i would suggest something more high tier to adequately pair with the system. A 1050ti will pair fine with a Pentium G4560 or i3's, Ryzen 3 or whatever. Ryzen 5 is best with the 6gb 1060 to something like a 1080ti. You will definitely be able to crank up to max settings for a photo though.

If youre on a tight budget, used GPUs are also a good option. An RX 580 post crypocurrency mining boom is around 170-180$ on ebay now and will perform like a 6gb 1060. This generation of AMD gpus is a fairly safe used buy since they stayed fairly cool under 24/7 max load unlike the R9 series which resulted in a lot of burnt gpus. Nvidia used post mining isnt a safe buy however since many people used the stock blower cooler designs which ran hot as hell. I have a metric crap-ton of GPUs and theyre almost all used and ive never had problems with them, just investigate what is and isnt a safe buy.

Used Maxwell cards (960/970/980/etc) werent good at crypto mining and all the used ones are safe to buy. A 970 will run you under 150$ and perform above the 6gb 1060's performance.

In fact, as im looking at these, this one is 150$ shipped: https://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-GeForce-GTX-970-4GB-GDDR5-FTW-GAMING-w-ACX-2-0-04GP42978-KR-04GP42978KR/264035484625?epid=220470984&hash=item3d79bdc3d1:g:xI4AAOSw9g1b6LvI:rk:1:pf:0

 

So tl;dr version, on a budget, R3 2200g, 8 or 16gb of ram, 1050ti OR 1060 6gb. More budget, R5 2600x and 1060 6gb. Used gpus optional, Zen 1 or Zen 2 optional. 120gb SSD will handle OS and SL without issue and be useful. Stock coolers fine, water cooling optional.

 

Thanks, and to all, i've ordered it and it'll be here next Tuesday, 20th! I didn't go for liquid cooling in the end, though was tempted to just for more RGB lights (yes, i'm that sad!)

I got the 1TB HDD 7200 as the 500GB was a bit more expensive (I guess maybe they buy 1TB in in bulk so get them cheaper or something), and a 250GB SSD

16GB RAM @ 3000  the 2600X R5 with the 1060 6GB GPU

It'd better be better than my FX lol x