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help a newbie with land question ?

AveryDumpling Wahwah
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Amethyst Jetaime

Amethyst Jetaime

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A 1024 lot is not big enough for a music venue, unless you are only talking about a music shop where you sell music. A full sim is set at to hold 40 people. If you have 10 people there for a performance or DJ, it is not fair to only pay for only 1/64th of a sim and expect to be able to monopolize 1/4th the avatar slots and sim resources. 

You may or may not be able to get away with it on mainland but your neighbors could and I suspect would eventually AR you for unfair use of resources, unless you luck out and get land on a sim where no one is home when your venue is active.  I would be very surprised if any estate owner would allow such a thing on such a small lot either.  You may be able to buy or rent the land initially but it wouldn't be long before you were given the choice of moving to a much larger plot of land or getting evicted.

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Phil Deakins

Phil Deakins

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You are mistaken (again) about your "fair use" idea, Amethyst. LL would do nothing if the owner of a 1024m parcel had 10 avatars on it, because it wouldn't be affecting the other land owners in the sim. The mainland allocation of 40 avatars per sim is never shared evenly according the amount of land a person has in a sim. Never. The only time that LL would do something is when someone has so many avatars on his/her land that it affects other land owners in the sim. E.g. if the owner of 3/4 of a sim has a club with 40 avatars in it and other people can't get to their own land in the sim because the sim is full.

Your post in this thread is the second one you've posted in the last few days in which you've said the same. But you are very much mistaken.

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Amethyst Jetaime

Amethyst Jetaime

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Phil Deakins wrote:

You are mistaken (again) about your "fair use" idea, Amethyst. LL would do nothing if the owner of a 1024m parcel had 10 avatars on it, because it wouldn't be affecting the other land owners in the sim. The mainland allocation of 40 avatars per sim is never shared evenly according the amount of land a person has in a sim. Never. The only time that LL would do something is when someone has so many avatars on his/her land that it affects other land owners in the sim. E.g. if the owner of 3/4 of a sim has a club with 40 avatars in it and other people can't get to their own land in the sim because the sim is full.

Your post in this thread is the second one you've posted in the last few days in which you've said the same. But you are very much mistaken.

You should never say never Phil.  Actually I have personally known them to intervene in at least two cases that I recall off hand and have heard of a few more.  The two I remember:

The first happened when so many people were in a club on a small parcel with all their AO's dance huds etc. plus all the club equipment that it was causing excessive lag when added to what else was going on in the sim. The other parcels were using a reasonable amount of resources.  My friend got sick of it and reported them.  LL came down on the small parcel owner.

The second when people couldn't get to their land because a landowner of a small parcel had half the slots filled up and others in the sim had a few on their parcels too so the total added up to 40.  This happened several times a week.  A landowner couldn't get to their land and called LL to help. LL came down on the small parcel owner hogging half the avatar slots.

You are not all knowing and seeing Phil.  Regardless of what you think.  I wouldn't have posted what I did if I didn't know that they had.  There is also a AR category for abuse of resources.

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Hugsy Penguin

Hugsy Penguin

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I can think of four ways to search for land.

1. Use one the 'Parcels for Sale' forums.  In there, you can look for something that might work for you.  Or, since the only two 'Wanted' forums are for full regions and homesteads, I believe here is where you can make a 'parcel wanted' post.

2. Click 'Buy Land' above, make your way to the land auctions, and see what's available.

3. Use the in-viewer land search tool.

4. Bring up the map and turn on land sales.

I don't think there's any real easy way.  You're going to have to scrounge around.

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "near some traffic" so I'll assume you mean you want land near another place that's somewhat busy.  If so, that would be difficult to search for.  I suppose you could look for piles of green dots on the map and then try to find land near there.  I'm not sure how effective that would be though.

I don't go to clubs/music venues very much at all.  It does seem that 1024m² is a bit small.  On the other hand, that could give it a cozy vibe.

All this said, you should pay attention to the general gist of what Amethyst and Phil are, uh, conversating about.  Basically, be advised that if your club (and/or its visitors) is going to cause excessive lag in the sim or prevent others from entering the sim, expect a lot of complaints and even LL coming in and putting a stop to it.

Good luck with your venture.

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Phil Deakins

Phil Deakins

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The word 'never' applies perfectly, Amethyst. What you described in your second post is quite different to what you described in your first post. Your second post gave examples of where one parcel was affecting the whole sim. In those cases, LL would act. But your first post simply said that, if a parcel the size of 1/64 of the sim had a quarter of the sims avatar capacity on it, LL would act. They would never act in anything like that circumstance, because the avatars wouldn't be affecting the functioning the whole sim.

Your argument, for the second time in the last few days, has been about pro-rata use of sim resources - specifically avatars. You argument is wrong, though. LL would never act unless the number of avatars affected the functioning of the whole sim; e.g. land owners couldn't enter the sim because it is full, and excessive lag caused by the owner of the small parcel - as in one of your examples. LL would never say that a parcel can only have its pro-rata share of the avatar slots. For one thing, it's obvious that exceeding the pro-rata share would not in itself cause any problem for others in the sim. And for another, it's obvious that your thinking cannot be true because it would mean that anyone with less that 1/40th of the sim cannot be on his/her own land, which would rule out all owners of 512s, 1024s, and 1536s. It would also mean that a person would need to own 1638m before s/he would be ok to be on his/her own land and even then s/he couldn't have a friend over. The whole idea is preposterous, and 'never' is the correct word.

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Orca Flotta

Orca Flotta

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When I was busy working as estate manager we made a rule of NO clubs, NO venues, NO shops on our homestead sims. When anyone was looking to build a music venue or such instead of selling them 1/4 homestead we gave them 4096 m² on a full sim. Same prim count but much better script handlng ability.

BTW, yes, I think 4096 is the minimum size parcel for any publicly used venue.

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Phil Deakins

Phil Deakins

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There was a very brief period when LL staff told users that businesses were allowed on Homestead sims. Then, when lots had been sold, they said that businesses are not allowed on Homestead sims, and lots of people had been 'cheated' out of money by LL. So you did right not to allow such things on your Homestead sims.

The other thing is that I knew a tiny club - 10m x 10m at the most, including a bar, and I think it was actually smaller - that used to get packed every day. Unfortunately I've forgotten its name, but incredibly tiny clubs are possible.

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Hugsy Penguin

Hugsy Penguin

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Phil Deakins wrote:

The other thing is that I knew a tiny club - 10m x 10m at the most, including a bar, and I think it was actually smaller - that used to get packed every day. Unfortunately I've forgotten its name, but incredibly tiny clubs are possible.

Sounds like The Elbow Room; it's about that size.  WAY back in the day, I do believe that place was rather popular.  Also, there's a blues club one sim over from me that's on 288m² of land.  I don't recall ever seeing much action there though.  A person or two once in a while but never any events.

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Freya Mokusei

Freya Mokusei

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At risk of agreeing with you twice in one day (gosh! I promise I'm not developing a crush, even though I did like your shoes)...

My friends and I spend a lot of our time (to this day) on a mainland sim, where the parcel occupies less than 20% of the overall sim. This location often maxes out the sim (to 40), preventing access to any other parcels or from passersby in vehicles. (I do see another issue, where avatars on this parcel will frequently occupy up to 30Mb in script memory each :P)

LL could care less, and although more space is becoming increasingly necessary, the proximity and scale is no issue.

I have taken to calling bumping other avatars 'loveshoving', however, on account of it happening so often there (and there rarely being any malice in it).

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Perrie Juran

Perrie Juran

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AveryDumpling Wahwah wrote:

Does anybody have any ideas about the answer to my question?

I'm not aware of any way to search for land by "traffic."

Maybe there is a way on Tych Sheperd's Grid Survey report.  http://gridsurvey.com/index.php

The closer you get to Blake Sea the more traffic you are likely to see but generally the land prices are much higher, in some cases astronomical.

I am guessing you want a high traffic area so people will find your Club??

It's going to be a hard way to go like this.

Building and running and growing a Club can be a lot of work.

 

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