Deja Letov

I doubt they will raise it anytime soon but I sure wish they would. Or...as mentioned I wish more of the groups I'm required to be in would go to being subscriber based. As a merchant, I'm in around 15 or more groups that are specific to vendor groups...as in i'm in their VIP program or a paid fee group to get discounts on their full perm groups. Plus all the shopper groups like Fable fridays, 60L weekends, etc all I am required to be in if I want to participate. PLUS all the hunt groups. hunt groups are killing me right now because I do so many and of course on the good ones you don't want to leave right after the hunt ends because then you miss notices of their future hunts. I think 42 is actually a good number of groups, I just wish more would start using the subscriber options, especially for merchants who only need to receive updated vendor packages.

Take a guess. It will probably be as close as anyone elses answer to that.

Toy is Inwordlz the only other grid you are on currently?

It's not steam who does ratings. The ESRB is a completely separate entity that assigns content ratings for all video games. Steam will just list what they rate it as. And even with adult content on G sims, that's sort of what we're discussing...the fact that ESRB doesn't typically rate a game based on user created content and all that adult stuff on G sims is user created. That's exactly what we're all kinda speculating about.

Actually, this stuff today has definitely got me thinking. Even if we aren't yet quite comfortable with the security of the open sim, I wonder how it can be used in a non commerce point to further grids that do produce content. Ok, here my brain turning there? What I mean to say is something like this.... I own a goth store. A large base of my clients are into the whole bloodlines and even non bloodlines RP aspect for Vampires and Wolves. What I am thinking if what if I could create a place to advertise from my locations in SL, Inworldz and Avination or wherever else I may open a store and promote the open sim location as a goth RP sim. And back in the RP sim...promote the world stores in all those other closed grids. Especially if one day any of them open up...like Avination and allow items to be available on the open grid. It could all possibly work together to promote each other and build even more customer loyalty up by spending a little bit of money to create an RP sim for customers and potential customers. Who knows if it would be successful but at the cheap rates of an open sim (or even free if Czari was right) it would simply be a sink of time to build it up...which I would potentially do.

Luna I'm glad you brought that up. I was actually just reading on her blog where she was talking in another post about the fact that anything can be copybotted at any time. There are also not TOS in place to stop copyright infringement. I was getting kinda excited reading about all of this today, but it seems like in it's current state all this open sim stuff is more for freebie content stuff and not really an ideal place for merchants to go to to expand a business. Obviously as you said, closed grids like Avination and Inworldz are ideal and so I'm looking into those more and more. I haven't heard of Spoton3d, I will definitely check that one out. Any other closed grid systems I should look into?

This may be a silly question, but are all these grids setup the same way SL is with linden or some sort of currency that can be cashed out? I know inworldz and avination are. But is it pretty standard to assume all the rest are as well? i'm aslo curious how these other "grids" (am i thinking of the right word here? ) are found. Like if someone opened a sim on the osgrid how are people finding them since it's not a closed grid. or am i just completely confused? Really nice blog by the way...I'm reading over past posts now.

Talla Slade wrote: @ Deja You said... "I'm also expanding into some other grids. Although I'd love to know where the more competive grids are because all the grids I have checked out so far have been pretty dead, which would explain the low tier, but what good is low tier if you can't turn a profit due to no traffic?" As a merchant expanding into the open Metaverse grids the choices are limited if you think only about traffic and not in what the potential is for the long term. However, the busiest walled garden grid is easily Inworldz but they are not likely to open up to hypergrid as they have forked server code that is somewhat different from the mainstream Opensim core code. Most open grids work on the mainstream code which is very stable and will support hypergrid. A new version of Hypergrid, HG2, is expected to be released soon which I mentioned in my last post. Once that is in use more grids will open up to the greater Metaverse so this is what I mean by taking a long term view and getting established. It is not expensive to have an outlet on the open Metaverse so being in both worlds can't be bad. I don't say jump in and abandon SL and I will say you wont make a fortune yet :womansad: but the market is going to grow and already there are over 200 separate grids with around 100 connecting with the rest via HG so the market is somewhat hidden presently until you understand how it is all building. Each of those grids have small communities, some very small and others bigger. There is a growing demand for virtual goods I am sure and online market sites like Total Avatar Shop are building a reputation and have their sights firmly set. The Open Metaverse is a growing market. check my blog for more information and articles on building business in Opensim... This article in particular... Second Life Shrinks as the Hidden Metaverse Expands and this one... Building Role Play Across the Hypergrid I can definitely see the long term potential, the problem is getting there. Getting businesses (people) like mine, to go in and spend money on tier, to make absolutely nothing. When you're talking about seeing a grid with less than 100 people on at once...it's hard to fork over even the $75 a month. it just feels like a waste. however, I am definitely on board with trying other places. Right now I am in a little shop on a friend's sim that he owns, trying out avination. So far, no sales, but I haven't really done much marketing in there yet. In worldz will be my next attempt and hopefully can make a go of it. Thankfully...my favorite full perm vendors are all there To be honest, this is my first venture into other virtual worlds. Before the last few months. I didn't know a whole lot about these other places. i'm still not entirely 100% certain as to how they all tie together, but I'm learning. Of course, i'm working on learning it even more now that I would like to go into these other worlds.

Jez Ember wrote: Delivering only a free HUD when the listing is for a full game is not a yard sale. I did notice that the listings are limited quantities - whenever they run out they get topped up within a day or two. I guess I'll DMCA the listings for using my descriptive text. Jez i agree that's pretty shady but I was reffering only to your suspecion of it being a "cloned" item. not weather he was actually delivering what he says is delivering.

True but it's more than just interactions that I'm talking about, even more than just a region where someone else provides content. it's actually a level of access deemed as "adult" in the game SL. Even though SL isn't providing the content, they are giving a direct path to get to that adult section and are governing it to a point with age verfication. my guess would be that in other games where user content is provided such as maps and skins, there aren't specific places they are required to upload for adult maturity and other places for PG material. But I wonder...would they then classify it as 2 separate games or at least 2 separate ESRB ratings based on your subscription? perhaps one minor and one adult (teen versus mature).

Toysoldier Thor wrote: As Darrius was pointing out... I cant recall in any commerce threads that I have been involved in nor my own long history of doomsday speaking that a specific date was ever mentioned.... until Darrius's last posting But when many of us have been "chicken Littling" over the years, we were not wrong. If you look around, the sky has been falling - but as is the case with most business evolutions / devolutions... things do not happen overnight. I am going to speak for myself. Since early 2009 when I started to post in the merchant forums of Secondlife, I can safely point a finger at myself as being one of the biggest chicken littles you are referring to. In fact, you can ask Dartagan himself to confirm that I was one of the chief "nay sayers" since 2009. We were pretty much the Generals on either side of the debate about LL's business model and the health of its future. I was the King of the Commerce Thread trolls and he was the King of the Merchant cheerleaders. The debates were pretty heated at the times and the Lindens never liked me because of my harsh negative opinions. But the reason I was a Chicken Little since 2009 was because I already saw clear signs that there were several fundamental business evolution flaws showing with LL. When I was predicting LL's ultimate demise in 2009, it was because LL's business organization and corporate culture was refusing to shift from its early "Initiation & Contageon" business evolution stage to the more mature "Control" stage. Forget about LL as a company, several businesses that cannot successfully evolve to the CONTROL stage often end up dying on the vine or get acquired by stronger business that are being vultures. I wont go into all the signs I was seeing then and continue to see now, but I will say that Sr Management immaturity and LL's unbreakable startup ego culture and "we are successful so why should the business model change" entrenchment were and are primary factors. That being said Deja, I do not believe I was not wrong about LL's sky falling. Look all around you in the SL / LL environment and compare it to how SL was in 2008. The sky has been has been falling and the fall is picking up speed. In June 2010 LL's laid off 1/3 of its staff. This was the one major event that finally made Dartagan come to my "dark side" and drop his pom poms Last year 1800 sims were abandoned. In the past 2 months ~ 800 sims were abandoned. The deflation of the SL pricing and economy has already significantly collapsed. Sales for may merchants are degrading. Large numbers of SL residents have been migrating to more competitive priced grids or left SL all together. As Darrius, myself and others have mentioned... Rodvik has started executing a "close all communications with the customers" policy - Gagging Jiras is a screaming example of Rod's policy LL has been pulling out of any active participation of inworld activities (like its own 8th birthday) Rod is desperately seeking out an entirely new poor-fit customer base (the "Gamer") for SL to tap into while at the same time pretty much sticking his middle finger at the current existing customer base. This is a "Last Gasp" move which if it fails - which many of us are convinced it will - he will have destroyed the loyal customer base and not secured the new customer base. As such I can see September 2013 as being a potential demise of SL as we know it. The thing is that in the business world when a very successful upset fails to continue growing and begins its process of imploding, it doesnt happen in a few months. It can take years before the ultimate demise - whatever that looks like - will occur. So.... the Sky has been and is falling.... the debris just hasnt reached the ground just yet. STAY TUNED ! I agree things do not happen overnight. Absolutely. I do business consulting and I've seen it take that time. But I've also seem some HUGE F ups and the company turn it right around by completely rotating out almost the entire user base. I'm not saying that is their plan here, but with the onset of Valve...it wouldn't surprise me if their hope is to replace a lot of those missing people who have left SL with a whole new fresh crop of people to disappoint. And then you will also have people, who have completely opposite experiences of the negative ones or who feel they aren't affected by so much of the changes in place (and not just the jira, I'm talking years of changes). Me...I'm an opportunist. Last year 1800 sims were abandoned like you said and several businesses have left SL. What did that do for me? Well to be honest, it's given me the exact opposite results of your next line. Instead of deflation or pricing or decreased sales, I think I've picked up the slack where a lot of business people have left. I've taken over many of their customers and now because of it, my sales have been the highest they ever have been. I've also not ever lowered my prices, not since day 1. Now, I'm not stupid, i'm not going to sit here and say it's all due to others leaving and they have no where else to shop, a lot of it is my own marketing efforts, but I do feel the lack of choices plays into it. I have other stores as well that are getting the same kind of thing. I do think you are right though that it is definitely a really piss poor thing to do when you **bleep** all of your loyal customer base and exchange it for a new one. We are the ones spending money right now, we are the ones bringing life to SL. Just not so convinced it will be dying out anytime soon....but just in case...I'm also expanding into some other grids. Although I'd love to know where the more competive grids are because all the grids I have checked out so far have been pretty dead, which would explain the low tier, but what good is low tier if you can't turn a profit due to no traffic?

I think he's reselling some of his old transfer items. I looked through this listings and see lots of recognizable items and they are all transferable and all with limited quantitys. Sounds like he is just having a marketplace yard sale.

Zaphod Kotobide wrote: Deja Letov wrote: of course....could it be rated on the status of the sims (pg, M, Adult). If so, then it would be the highest rating possible, meaning adults. I don't think that would necessarily be true. Linden Lab publishes and markets and promote the platform for 13 and older, and keeps adult content segregated on an adult-only section. Technically I see no reason they couldn't receive a Teen rating. I agree to a point, but I've been pouring over the esrb website the last day and I don't know which way they will go with this. They don't typically give a different ESRB based on access ratings in a game. It seems to be an overall general rating of the entire system. if you went by "can we keep the kids out of the adult" then sure, teen would work. but if ESRB rates the way they claim to on their website, it would be highest level of content in the game, which would be mature. Guess we will have to see which way they go.

Are you by chance uploading mesh?

I would be curious on the rating as well. According to the ESRB website "User-generated content is not rated by ESRB". But I'm curious since the entire game us user generated how that will be handled. Otherwise, Sl can be judged on nothing more than a bunch of empty grids. of course....could it be rated on the status of the sims (pg, M, Adult). If so, then it would be the highest rating possible, meaning adults.

Tamara Artis wrote: I don't plan to move, was just curious to see how is it out there lol. I'm not moving either, but extra locations won't hurt...so long as they are profitable! What we need is more consumers on those other grids. Right now it's like a bunch of dudes hanging out at a party waiting for the girls to show up. Total sausage fest over there!

Toysoldier Thor wrote: Deja Letov wrote: Jacob Cagney wrote: I am not sure why anyone is surprised, stunned, whatever. Rod is a gamer. Rod comes from a gamer backbround. Rod hired gamers when he took over as CEO. 99.9999999% of gamer companies do not have public bug reports. I agree with this. The way SL has been going lately, it wasn't long before they started adopting the ways of other gaming companies. To be honest...as a gamer...I've VERY rarely used the Jira. I tend to file support tickets or post something in the forums, since that's what I do with other games. Sure when someone posts a link and wants me to go vote on it, I will just to be supportive. But this change, really won't affect me, since it's not a system I use regularly. I'm not saying I agree with it and I honestly think it sucks...but I guess I just don't see the same "the sky is falling" attitude about this. I guess maybe it's more or less going to affect people who have had major bug issues to report or who regularly follow jira's? Ahhh but Deja..... This is where you are not correct (statement in red). Because you personally dont use the JIRA and actively participate in the jira to report bugs and work with LL on jira issues to diagnose and resolve SL grid, Viewer, and Marketplace problems, doesnt mean it doesnt affect you. It will. You might not participate in JIRA's but a smaller but quite dedicated portion of the SL community actively engages in many jira issues and works to identify, report, diagnose, and resolve countless SL-wide problems via the jira. I have seen many very serious SL / Marketplace issues solved thanks 100% directly because of LL working with this smaller portion of SL residents via the jira. Many of thes solved bugs directly impacted you. If the jira did not exist - you would have suffered many times for much much longer from serious bugs on the marketplace when LL deployed DD and maturity filters and search "improvement" and the move from xstreet to MP, etc. etc. etc. You would have suffered much longer from viewer bugs, and the countless LL created bugs from new server code releases if these SL residents with a lot of skills and talents and problem solving skills did not assist LL staff in isolating the problems and fixing them. So I hate to be blunt but.... Rodvik gagging the customer jira will 100% affect you in the months to come (as long as SL stays alive). There is no question about that. LL staff is very small and their skills talent pool is not deep enough to develop and support the size and complexity of environment that SL has become. THEY NEED SL STAFF as freebie support staff. Rodvik has just fired 100's of volunteer staff from LL's support team. He is just not sharp enough to realize he did this. I can accept that Toy and you're probably right. I guess we will all just have to wait and see. I did follow your link you gave and gave my opinion on the matter in that survey. I was kind of a meany in it too. LOL

Czari Zenovka wrote: Hey, Deja I think one of the reasons many people are outraged is because this decision cuts off an avenue of communication from resident to Lindens. From reading most of the posts on this decision, both here, on the SLU forums and various blogs, it appears that the Lindens, or more likely Rod, are saying, "Go away, you're bothering us." Then there's the whole technical side where many bugs/issues within SL were noticed first by residents, a jira was submitted, others perhaps contributed to the issue, and a resolution was found either sooner than it would have been if a Linden just happened on the issue or at all. In Toy's VLM thread he lists the URL for the most recent UG meeting he attended and, from reading that, one can see even some Lindens are clueless about why this happened and they also concur that a lot of great "group think" in debugging came from the jiras. Oh no, I totally understand why people are outraged...I guess I just don't see how this is the "fall of SL". I guess I'm just used to changes happening in SL, nobody likes them, everyone claims it's the end of SL and it's dying...then people go on and so does SL. I'm totally sympathetic towards people not liking the descision, I agree it sucks, but I just don't see the same dramatic effect of it as some others seem to do. I will continue to create, continue to sell and see what happens, but my being able to access a jira has yet to effect me personally.

I think there are a lot of assumptions being thrown around but the fact is nobody knows until it's made public what their deal is. personally, I doubt very much that SL is just going to give a percentage of all of their profits away to Valve because frankly, I don't see the majority of sales coming from Valve. I also doubt very much that SL will be turning SL into a Valve based game requiring us to login there. I think...and hope...all it is..is a listing on the Steam directory and nothing more, in which case most likely it will just be SL paying Valve either per download or a flat fee for the listing. It just doesn't make any sort of financial sense for them to give away the entire pot when Valve is only showing up with a cup worth. And...if it does turn out that Valve will take a cut, I don't think of o the players will absorb it. That's a cost of marketing and most likely will be an expense through LL.

Jacob Cagney wrote: I am not sure why anyone is surprised, stunned, whatever. Rod is a gamer. Rod comes from a gamer backbround. Rod hired gamers when he took over as CEO. 99.9999999% of gamer companies do not have public bug reports. I agree with this. The way SL has been going lately, it wasn't long before they started adopting the ways of other gaming companies. To be honest...as a gamer...I've VERY rarely used the Jira. I tend to file support tickets or post something in the forums, since that's what I do with other games. Sure when someone posts a link and wants me to go vote on it, I will just to be supportive. But this change, really won't affect me, since it's not a system I use regularly. I'm not saying I agree with it and I honestly think it sucks...but I guess I just don't see the same "the sky is falling" attitude about this. I guess maybe it's more or less going to affect people who have had major bug issues to report or who regularly follow jira's?

Tamara Artis wrote: So.. seems SL is dying and I am seeing people giving advices to move to another online world. I would be happy if some of you had any suggestions or experiences to share:) Thank you in advance! I'm not sure I would say SL is dying quite yet. Yes of course people freak when a change happens and oh my god the sky is falling...it's been that way for years and probably will...until SL actually does die out. I however, am loving being in SL, my revenues in my business go up every month and I add new friends to my list...practically daily. It is what it is, and it seems to be working for me pretty good. That said...other worlds, so far I've tried Avination and InWorldz. Both remind me of SL about 5 or 6 years ago. I've started up a small shop in one of them and haven't seen anything come of it yet. I think the problem is traffic. There just isn't much on either of those grids yet. But who knows, if people keep thinking they need to jump ship then perhaps they will grow. I'd personally love to see those grow because it only helps the community as a whole.

Spinell wrote: Hi everyone. I have a reletively enw shop in the marketplace, still no in-world shop until I get some more money rolling. But I know it's possible to do "promotion" for your shop inworld. However, I'm a little lost on this. I really don't know what my options for Promotion are. The only thing I can think of, other than hanging some promo pictures on rented boarda around some sims, is to enter in one of those hunts. But, I have no idea how to enter whenever I hear about a hunt, it's already going on. Also, like I said, I have no in-world store. So, I wanted to ask for some guidence: what are the ways to promote a shop in SL? Thanks for all the support! With the current hunts, and really any hunt in a good size, you need to have an inworld store location. I like the idea of the MP hunts that someone else mentioned, but keep in mind, it's not done yet, which means the first few if someone took it on would be tiny and probably not very lucrative. Hunts are easy to get into, find the hunt, join the group, apply, you're in (assmung you aren't suck). They are a great tool and I use them a lot. But get a store. Even if you can't afford a full blown out store, just get a little 512m plot with 4 walls, your logo on a sign and a couple of product vendors in boxes. Or rent from someone you know, who will do it cheap. At least you have some sort of presence to get into hunts. Now, once you get that setup...once you have ANY sort of presence...then I can throw a bunch of ideas for marketing your way! Unfortunately for MP I just don't have many. I would however, not bother with the ad boards you mentioned. They don't work. Think about it...when was the last time you clicked on one?

This happened to me last week when I listed a brand new product, and I'm not on MB anymore. It lasted for about a day and then I was able to edit it and resave as active. Not sure what was going on with it.

Can you list out the steps you are doing? I had almost 300 products I changed over and was done in just a couple of days, and that was back when it was running super slow. Now I get a new item up in about 30 seconds or less if I have it all pre-written. Maybe you're doing something you don't have to. If you could list what you're doing we can try to help. I'm also not sure why you would have to update all of your items every few weeks. I have listings I haven't touched since I converted way back in March.

bejjinks wrote: Deja Letov wrote: there is truly no point in even making a post like this except to get a rise out of people. You know the answer for yourself to every question asked...does it really matter what others think? Of course not...it's just a futile attempt at spreading the word of God around and attempting to convert people My hope is not to get a rise out of people. I do have a motive other than getting a rise out of people and other than trying to convert anyone. I'm aware of the risk but I'm hoping for something other than a feud of people trying to convert each other. I don't have the answer for every question. I know my own experience and that is all I know. I do care what other people think so long as those people don't discredit my experience. In fact, I really do want to know what other people think. Some have shared what they believe or think and that was great. But some have done nothing but criticize me for thinking. Like you haven't shared what you believe or what you think. I'd like to ask you the question you asked me. What do you believe and what is your evidence? I promise I will not accuse you of trying to convert me the way you are accusing me of trying to convert you. Actually I did say my thoughts on the belief in God...on page 2 of this thread (my giant wall of text) and other pages as well. I would consider myself agnostic more than I would atheist. Mainly because I tend to seek truth based on actual and factual evidence. I can't say with certainty that there is no God...what I can say, is that based on scientific evidence and the liklihood of a magical man in the sky who nobody has ever seen, that it most likely isn't true. I have read tons of scientific articles, watched documentary's and even studied religion in college, and science leads me more towards there being no God, than there is to being one. I hope one day I am proven wrong on the existance of God and we find out that maybe there is something else out there. I would like to believe that there is a place we all go to after we die. What I hope to never learn is that God is the same God that some crazed men wrote about in a book many many years ago. The God described in the bible is not a God I would want around and certainly not one I would want to hang out with in the afterlife. But as of right now, nobody has shown me one fact based piece of evidence that the existance is even remotely possible. So I equate the reality of the bible to be about the same reality as a superman comic book. Entertaining to read maybe but definitely nothing to live your life by.