Fluffy Sharkfin

Yohan Roux wrote: It seems many of you didn't like my view of content creators that sell, ok why not give them away, all I have heard here is how people are being hit by the lindens going into competition with them, well the lindens went into competition with me, forced me to fight them, that is life here, one must swallow that and move on not cry about it, market place has killed the malls, I know how they can be revived but it is impossible to share because of the competition that exist between creators, this clearly shows that your view as to why creators are here is wrong, this thread shows all traders here are here for profit. In which case you clearly haven't bothered to read every post?! As for your complaints about the competition that exists between creators, I find them a tad ironic considering your post in the LSL scripting forum where you told someone asking for help with a combat system "as you are a competitor I should not help you" (since the main function of that forum is as a place for residents to seek help with scripting problems, I can't help but wonder why you'd post there if all you were willing to offer was cryptic suggestions?) Anyway, regarding the original topic, you may want to consider the difference between a "trader" and a "creator". Pretty much all traders are creators, but that doesn't mean that all creators are traders, and to ignore the opinions of those that create without seeking to profit (or deny their existence entirely) simply because they don't agree with your point of view isn't going to strengthen your position or make your arguments seem more valid, it simply makes you appear rigid and uncompromising.

http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Prim-rights-bug/td-p/1172303

I must admit I'm still a little dubious about the parametric deformer idea. Not that I'm suggesting Qarl isn't capable, given the tremendous contributions he's made to SL over the years it's pretty obvious that he's more than capable. It's just that, even with the additions/changes being discussed since people saw the initial version (i.e. using multiple vertices to calculate deformation rather than just the closest vertex), it's still not going to make rigged mesh "perfect". I'm not saying that it isn't a step in the right direction, but the improvement in quality and usability of mesh products is as much reliant on creators learning to use it properly as it is any code that LL or a 3rd party can implement. Incidentally one particular problem I foresee relates to the point you made about mesh clothing deforming with avatar shape (or at least the parameters that define joint positions rather than the "fat" sliders that only alter the avatar mesh), since for every "right" way to make a certain bodyshape there's usually several "wrong" ways to create an almost identical looking shape by altering completely different sliders (for instance, "stubby torso/long legs" vs "stretched torso/stubby legs"). If using a parametric deformer, it would seem logical that those two almost identical looking shapes are going to have quite different results on the deformation of rigged mesh clothing.

Irene Muni wrote: Yohan Roux wrote: lol, get real, those that create and sell are here for the money, end off, If you think that, you know not fully the reality of SL. Sadly I think a lot of people share that misguided belief, mostly thanks to LL spending years pushing the "Join SL and get rich!" myth. It's not uncommon for people to assume that everyone elses motives for doing something are similar to their own, however it is a little narrow-minded IMO.

Just to add, if you turn on the Polycount display (Display Menu>Heads Up Display>Polycount) and then press the 1, 2 and 3 keys you can see the polycount for your model increase dramatically as that 'smoothing' occurs.

Stanton Sinister wrote: Smells a troll..... Then get your nostrils checked, you may have one lodged up there?

Hmm I thought it was a thread about how one creator has decided to stop creating content in SL, as someone that enjoys creating I don't see why my involvement in it would be in any way 'odd'. My response (not my first in this thread but my first response to a post of yours) was to your sweeping statement concerning creators thinking they were gods and being arrogant and lazy, I merely referred to your previous post about traders being hostile. Anyway, all that aside, good luck with that "mall" thing!

Yohan Roux wrote: lol, thats ok, to you this is a social network, but i know how to break the hold that market place has. Actually for the most part I'm very reclusive (apart from the odd occasion where I "spaz out" and start posting on forums ), so for me SL is more of a digital canvas/sandbox than a social network, since the majority of my time is spent alone creating weird things for my own entertainment. I'm not really sure how to respond to the second half of your sentence (other than to maybe repeat my "tad strange" comment).

The concept of 'mesh' has been around a long time, LLs implementation of it is still relatively new though, they have a lot of kinks to iron out. Even sculpties had issues to begin with and those were just a different type of prim rather than an entirely new form of asset.

Yohan Roux wrote: ... you can dislike me now cos you don't see tomorrow... Oh I don't dislike you, though I confess I find you a tad 'strange'

Maelstrom Janus wrote: I dont expect Lindens to do anything - be it tackling excessive tiers, the increased number of crashes and tp failures ( odd that thats gone hand in hand with mesh introduction) crossing boundaries and least of all tackling a stagnating in world building system - but there'll always be an apologist for Lindens like you around to buffer any comeback from someone like myself who wants a better deal for his money.... If youre happy playing devils advocate for lindens fair enough. Is this really about getting a better deal for your money though? Honestly it seems more like you're annoyed that you don't know how to make mesh and don't want to learn. Or do you really believe that LL could provide tools capable of creating the same quality of content inworld as mesh can offer? When creating mesh you do so using a package that has the tools necessary to create custom UV mapping and procedural textures and bake shadows/lighting directly onto them using advanced rendering techniques. Should LL incorporate ray tracing into SL as well? How about rigged mesh? Considering LL made vague attempts at creating an inworld animation creation system and then abandoned it, do you really think it would be possible for them to create a method of rigging prims to act in the same way as mesh? Prims were a cute idea back in the day, and they still have valid uses, but to expect LL to continue to develop such a limited system and ignore alternatives that are far superior is ridiculous. Also, as I mentioned previously, in the extremely unlikely event that LL did update prims and add new features to inworld building, as soon as you turned on those fancy new features that prim would no doubt switch to using the new Land Impact system and you'll be looking at your "prim count" and wishing you'd made it out of mesh!

Yohan Roux wrote: There are to many traders, those that have planned for that will survive, those that think they can still make a living and expand are going to die, a period of humility is going you teach you just that, humility, thing is most of you think you are gods, lol, and are you for in a shock, no the one that cuts deepest and eats worms will live, the rest will die. Many of you are to lazy to change, lots to arrogant, but that's ok, don't you think that you should be the first to fall, I remember some years ago I had an add at sweethearts, 2000 lindens a month, when the owner saw I was getting business from it he put it up to 8000 lindens a month, just one add, lol, good to hear he has gone, oops I am lucinda bulloch toe rag. Wow, it's not hard to see why you've come to the conclusion that "we traders are hostile to each other" if you go around telling your fellow creators that they're lazy, arrogant and suffer delusions of grandeur...

Pamela Galli wrote: A bit OT but I use Gimp (and Blender). I finally bought CS5 (Photoshop) a few months ago, I like it fine, but I barely touch it. For the things I do regularly, Gimp is just faster and easier. Personally I'd recommend plugging away with Photoshop, but then being a long-term user I guess I'm biased. I do think that being comfortable/proficient with whatever application you're using is more relevant to creating good content than the pricetag/featurelist of the application itself (within reason of course, you can't exactly compare the old MS Paint with Photoshop).

Perrie Juran wrote: Fluffy Sharkfin wrote: Perrie Juran wrote: In SL, they all fit like you used a shoe horn to put them on. Unless they're mesh but i like showing off my sexy derriere and I have no doubt that particular spectacle is often met with widespread approval

Perrie Juran wrote: In SL, they all fit like you used a shoe horn to put them on. Unless they're mesh

Pamela Galli wrote: Someone asked me if everything I make will now be mesh. That is like asking a Lego builder if he is going to go back to using Tinkertoys. Indeed. I've often tried to explain the difference between prims, sculpts and mesh by saying "if a prim is a block of lego and a sculpt is a spoonful of clay, a mesh is the equivalent of a fully equipped workshop, a plastic moulding facility and a warehouse full of raw materials!"

Maelstrom Janus wrote: I have no argument with anyone who thinks building outside sl using a mass of complex software and then paying to import the stuff they made is a way of being 'drawn into' SL ...my problem with mesh has always been - and its quite obvious - that while Lindens have promoted mesh it took away the onus on them to provide building software - even the lindens 'tutorial' on mesh was nothing more than a warning about copyright breaches - no advice on the software to use or how to go about making mesh based items ! It also caused a total stasis in inworld building with nothing new ( bar the introduction of 64 m prims as standard - still not big enough !) when we could be getting new methods of shaping and cutting prims, newly shaped prims etc. Lindens should be providing the tools to build with in view of the fees they charge and they should be adding new features to those building systems to keep the art of inworld building alive and vibrant. The introduction of mesh basically stopped any development with the inworld building system at all. And as a result in world building is becoming dull and repetitive..... Mesh takes away the pleasure of inworld building and turns building into labouring over complex software only to then pay to import something you dont even know is going to look good once it arrives in world. I have to agree with you to some degree, since I've noticed a distinct decline in the time I spend inworld since the introduction of mesh. As for wishing they'd improve the inworld building tools/prim options be careful what you wish for, since it's almost a certainty that if they did add additional prim options the use of them would most likely make them subject to the new method of calculating Land Impact, and I'm betting that under that system they wouldn't compare favourably to the mesh equivalent.

As Pamela already mentioned there's the Mesh forum, also you could try joining the Mesh Volunteers group in SL, and there are some excellent tutorials available online from other SL creators. As for software Blender seems to be a very popular choice simply because it's free (or as an alternative you could try Daz Studio Pro 4/Hexagon which are currently available for free from the Daz 3D site).

Love it! I think mesh is a huge step forward for content creators, and has done more to rekindled my own interest in creating content than any other addition to SL's creative toolset. I think, with the exception of mesh clothes (the benefits of which are pretty obvious to most people by now), it will take a little longer for non-creators to appreciate the significance of mesh simply because it's going to take time for enough high quality content to become available to them.

At this point you might want to post the entire script you're testing, I've just been staring at the command Rolig provided and can't see a single thing wrong with it either.

Hehe, yeah, what Rolig said! :smileyvery-happy:

Rotations in lsl use a Quaternion rather than a Euler Vector. There's a detailed explanation of Rotation in SL on the SL wiki and it's also worth checking the page on llEuler2Rot for an example of how to convert a euler vector to a quartenion.

Stanton Sinister wrote: I think th Fluffy Sharkfin wrote: Stanton Sinister wrote: Why should people continue to create content in a virtual world that is supposed to be created by the residents when Linden Labs has decided to start providing their own content for sale... Because some people simply enjoy creating and really don't care too much about profit? I suppose there is validity in that but my discussion was geared toward content creators who desire a profit for their time spent creating content. I consider SL to be an investment of my money and time and I consider the linden created content to be a threat to my investment. I also consider SL to be an investment of my money and time but, honestly, if the only return from that investment that interests you is profit then there are probably more lucrative opportunities out there which would provide you with less stress. Creating content in SL is a great way to earn a little money (or, for a handful of creators, a lot) but the stress and other negative factors will almost always outweigh the rewards if the only benefit is profit, and if you do actually enjoy the creative aspect of what you do in SL, why not focus on that rather than how much money you can squeeze out of it?

Here's a basic explanation from the SL wiki "Error threshold: Increase this value to decrease the amount of detail retained during simplification. For example, setting this value to 0.1 results in a model that is simplified to 90% of the original model's accuracy."

Stanton Sinister wrote: Why should people continue to create content in a virtual world that is supposed to be created by the residents when Linden Labs has decided to start providing their own content for sale... Because some people simply enjoy creating and really don't care too much about profit?