Mesh Deformer & Mesh Avatar Discussion

[Medhue Simoni]

Is it me, or is it strange that no1 has posted a Deformer thread yet? So, considering the Lindens have put a big red notice because of me talking about how custom mesh avatar are affected. How this is not relevant, I'm clueless. In any case, I'm talking about it here, where they suggest. 1 word to the Lindens tho, If this deformer goes out without addressing this problem, you are definitely going to get an ear full from me.

Yesterday, I tested out the deformer by Qarl. Watching his video, it seemed to work relatively well for the purpose intended. Great! It immediately struck me that full mesh avatars would also be affected, and things like the facial morphs would seriously affect the mesh in weird ways. I was able to create a default shape and wear that, but still the head on my Lycan was quite distorted. The avatar has some unusual rigging, with the jaw, eyebrows, and tail rigged to the neck. Eventually, I was able to get the head to look normal. The worst problem was not related to the head tho. The worst was my Lycan's back, which has a large hump and requires some creative rigging. With the deformer, the hump was no more, and the shoulder blades stuck out. The bottom line is, unless we can edit which areas are morphed, the deformer should not be used with mesh avatars.

This is sad because creating avatars which can be fully modified by the shape, would be pretty huge. Pretty dang revolutionary. The only thing that comes close is Dazstudio, which is not a virtual world.

If you have tested out any mesh with the deformer, please post your experiences here, especially when related to full mesh avatars. 1 thing I forgot to try was facial expressions. Just thinking about it gives me shivers.

[Ashasekayi Ra]

Why should the Lindens get an earful about the deformer when they didn't create it? As for the effect the deformer has on mesh avatars, Qarl has already stated that an on/off switch needs to be added since every rigged mesh won't need the deformer.

[Medhue Simoni]

Yeah, Qarl has stated it, that does not mean it is ever going to be done. If it were going to be done, then the proper response from LL to any1 talking about is, "We understand the problem and we will address it". The proper response is not putting a big red banner on the jira telling people not to talk about it. They implement the code, hence why they will get the ear full.

Like I eluded to, what I would like to see is compatibility. Take the time to make this work for every mesh, whether that means including morph targets into our mesh or whatever. Admittedly, I've little knowledge of the working of morphs, and only briefly played around with them, but a mesh avatar which can have endless modifications in a game, it is very revolutionary. I can't even imagine the talented artists that would flock to SL, and the customers that come along.

Just another thought but, Why does the avatar height even have such a limited range? Why can't we just use the slider to make our avatar be whatever size they need to be, without doing some funky scaling?

[161488303349]

i understand the process is that qarl will make something. he then get feedback from users. he keep modding til he is satisfied. he then submit a code contribution to linden like everyone else does. linden will then look at it and decide if they can use. if they can use will probly be decided by how much extra work they may have to do to integrate into the sl ecosystem

qarl already signal that his code only a proof on concept at this stage and not production code. he say in the video that runitai linden probly going to have a fit when he sees the code bc the code pretty much use brute force at the moment

for proof of concept is ok to do that way. at the moment the code is kinda like a powerpoint presentation of a website and not a actual website. not yet anyways

tpv makers putting in some their viewers bc they just want to see the presentation and so they can give feedback to qarl

is long ways to go yet. is exactly ur kinda feedback that qarl needs. u make animations and i already seen how the deformer not working very well with more involved animations. why i have no idea. u probly got a way better understanding of it than me

[Ashasekayi Ra]

Well, I *hope* that by the time Qarl feels the code is finished that LL will work with him on adding an on/off switch of some sort for the deformer. It really shouldn't go live without it.

[Melissa Yeuxdoux]

"This is sad because creating avatars which can be fully modified by the shape, would be pretty huge. Pretty dang revolutionary."

Indeed it would. As a member of the SL prim breast community, I would be ecstatic if I could get the figure I want without having to use attachments, and also not be cut off from what I hope will be the new center of SL couture, mesh clothing. (And it's not just breasts--if running into someone dressed exactly like you is an embarrassment, how much more so if the other person looks exactly like you!) I hope that mesh avatar makers will try out clients with the mesh deformer code and make mesh avatars that work and play well with it.

UPDATE: I didn't explicitly say it here, but in my mind, where the sky is lime green, I was imagining a world in which mesh clothing would fit any humanoid mesh avatar--that's going to require some way to map from one mesh avatar surface to another, so that mesh clothing for one mesh avatar can be worn by another. That, of course, is another problem, though OTOH, wouldn't that be the same kind of mapping the mesh deformer does?

[Maggie Bluxome]

I see my friend is looking in the same topic as I am. I'm just coming in to this a bit later. Hello, Melissa.

 

A topic that has come up recently is, does Mesh Deformer allow facial expressions. It has been described that facial and hand movements are morphs within the standard avatar.

 

Will the deformer code allow the same thing with mesh avatars?

[Medhue Simoni]

@Mellissa and Maggie -

Take this with a grain of salt, as I'm just an animator that understands a little about mesh. Mesh Avatars will likely never work with mesh clothing made for the default SL avatar shape. The deformer is referencing the SL shape. For the deformer to work on all avatar, then the deformer would need to know when to reference the mesh and when to reference the SL shape. How it would know when to reference what, would be difficult, and it could get very messy.

I will also say again, that a mesh avatar will likely not use the deformer, as all the face, hand, and feet morphs would mess up the mesh so much that the use of the deformer would become pointless and completely uncontrollable by the creator.