Rigged Model - Maya -> Blender

[Zak Kozlov]

Hello!

 

A friend and me got a huge problem since a while

He's working on Maya, I'm working on Blender, He need me to make something to a scene and we simply can't transfer everything, or at least things that would allow me to take it from there

 

The opposit is super simple, save as FBX and it's in Maya in a few clicks, but Blender can only export FBX.

 

I'm not sure why, we tried many formats / options / software and we just can't get the darn thing in Blender from Maya

I can even save things in .DAE and reimport them in a fresh Blender scene and all infos are in

 

(side note: Maybe it's dumb from me to think that, but Maya appear to be more limited to me, I mean a DAE is a DAE, The format is not proprietary for either those programs so, why can I save pretty much a whole scene infos in a .DAE in Blender, but Maya can't seem to be able to save anything much in the same format? )

 

What i'd need is at least the custom skeleton made in Maya so I could just rig the thing from scratch

We are pretty much out of options now and don't know what to do

 

Maybe someone here with more experiene working with both of those programs would know how we can at least get the skeleton?

 

Thanks

[Gaia Clary]

hi.

I have recently started to investigate how we could better support exchanging data between blender and Maya. I also found that the integrated Maya Collada exporter (or Maya 2013 at least) seems a bit limited (it sometimes creates wrong collada data) Actually i have no idea yet why that is so, but well...

There is an alternative Collada exporter for Maya available, based on the openCollada library:

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/OpenCOLLADA/wiki/OpenCOLLADA-Tools

Since Blender also uses openCollada, there is at least a small chance that this improves your situation already. However i have not yet tested that plugin, so i can not tell if it realy improves your situation.

Note that the blender collada support has been significantly improved in Blender 2.66. So if you are not already using that version of blender, then i recommend you try it out. It has improvements especially when it comes to importing rigs.

If you still fail for any reason, then please file a report to the blender bug reporter and provide the .dae file that does not import correctly to Blender. Or if you do not like the reporter (which i can understand) then contact me. I will take care then. But not before next week.

Happy easter ;-)

[Codewarrior Congrejo]

http://www.shapeways.com/tutorials/exporting-from-maya-with-collada-3dprinting

or 
http://colladamaya.sourceforge.net/
http://collada.org/mediawiki/index.php/OpenCOLLADA
https://code.google.com/p/opencollada/downloads/list

In case you are using maya 2012 or above, the collada export became unsupported or in newer formats of DAE that SL or older versions of other 3D software couldnt read.

In that case you can get the FBX  2011.3 standalone converter and convert from there to collada.
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/item?siteID=123112&id=16126812

Another Solution - if you have a maya 2009 version at hand is to Make the file in maya 2012 and save it as .ma file, open it in 2009 and export to DAE from there.


In case you don't need any scene Data (like lights etc) and only the models and their materials. a simple export to OBJ (wavefront) is the easiest compatible across all platforms.


Cheers.

[Chosen Few]

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

 

He's working on Maya, I'm working on Blender, He need me to make something to a scene and we simply can't transfer everything, or at least things that would allow me to take it from there

---

What exactly are you havng trouble transferring?  Basic things such as geometry, skeletons, simple materials, bindings, lights, cameras, etc.,  should be able to move from program to program without much trouble. 

Things that are proprietary, like Maya hair, or paint effects, or anything else along those lines, will only work in Maya, of course, so if that's what your'e after, forget it.

 

 

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

The opposit is super simple, save as FBX and it's in Maya in a few clicks, but Blender can only export FBX.

---

There are FBX import scripts out there for Blender that you can try, or you can use Autodesk's free stand-alone FBX conveter to convert FBX to COLLADA.

 

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

I'm not sure why, we tried many formats / options / software and we just can't get the darn thing in Blender from Maya

I can even save things in .DAE and reimport them in a fresh Blender scene and all infos are in

 

---

I can think of four possible causes.  It could be any or all of these:

 

• Your friend's version of Maya is writing a different COLLADA version than your version of Blender can read.
• Your friend doesn't have his COLLADA export settings configured correctly.
• You don't have your COLLADA import settings configured correctly.
• You're trying to transfer things that are not supported by the COLLADA format.

My guess is it's the first one, but as I said, it could be any or all of them.

For what it's worth, my own Blender installation is having serious COLLADA problems right now.  If I try to import any .dae that has bones in it, Blender insta-crashes to desktop.  I haven't had time to try to hunt down the cause. (And frankly, I haven't had much reason to care, since I hardly ever touch Blender.  The only reason I have it at all is to so I can help answer questions about it, when and were I can.  Maya's my everyday workhorse.)

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

 

(side note: Maybe it's dumb from me to think that, but Maya appear to be more limited to me, I mean a DAE is a DAE, The format is not proprietary for either those programs so, why can I save pretty much a whole scene infos in a .DAE in Blender, but Maya can't seem to be able to save anything much in the same format? )

---

Think about the logic of what you just said.  Maya can read and write COLLADA files without a problem, but Blender evidently cannot read some COLLADA files.  Maya can read and write FBX files just fine, but Blender cannot read FBX at all (at least not without third party help).  Yet somehow Maya is the one that is more limited.  I'm not sure how that makes sense.

 

In any case, it's not quite as simple as "a DAE is a DAE".  There are many different versions of the format, and different programs have different implementations of each.   When COLLADA was first invented, it showed some promise as a good in-between file format.  But for whatever reason, it never got the traction that FBX did, and standards for it were never really enforced.  It's become quite fractured by now.

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

What i'd need is at least the custom skeleton made in Maya so I could just rig the thing from scratch

---

If you're talking about rigging for SL, you should know you cannot use a custom skeleton.  You can only use the pre-existing avatar skeleton.  It's available in just about every format you could think of, inlcuding .mb, .ma, .blend, .dae, and .fbx, just to name a few.

If you're talking about making stuff for a different platform than SL, that's a little beyond the scope of the SL forums (at least for now).

 

If it really comes down to it, you could always just recreate the skeleton from scratch.  All you need is front and side pictures of it, and a listing of the bone names, and you can recreate just about any skeleton in a matter of minutes.  Skeletons are really simple things.

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

 

We are pretty much out of options now and don't know what to do

---

It may be true that you (temporarily) don't know what to do, but you're certainly not out of options.

 

 

 

---

Zak Kozlov wrote:

Maybe someone here with more experiene working with both of those programs would know how we can at least get the skeleton?

---

If you want the SL skeleton, you can get it in about a thousand different places.  For example, you can find some in .blend format right on he SL wiki: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Mesh/Uploading_and_wearing_a_rigged_mesh#Creating_a_rigged_avatar

I had been hosting one in .ma and .dae format for a long time, but I forgot to pay my web hosting bill, and my website got nuked.  Oops.  I haven't had time to rebuild it yet.

If you Google "Second Life skeleton", you'll find tons of places to get it. 

Or, as I said, you can just make your own.  It's only 26 bones. If it takes you five minutes, you'd be doing it slowly.  The bone names are also on the wiki:  http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Mesh/Troubleshooting#Rigging

 

 

 

 

[Gaia Clary]

---

Chosen Few wrote:

---

I can think of four possible causes.  It could be any or all of these:

 

• Your friend's version of Maya is writing a different COLLADA version than your version of Blender can read.
• Your friend doesn't have his COLLADA export settings configured correctly.
• You don't have your COLLADA import settings configured correctly.
• You're trying to transfer things that are not supported by the COLLADA format.

My guess is it's the first one, but as I said, it could be any or all of them.

---

Hi, Chosen. Here are some results from my own invstigations on Maya Collada. I am really only starting and i am surely missing a lot still. However this is what i found:

 

1. Maya2013 apparently uses Collada-1.4.1 which is supported by Blender. I assume that older versions of Maya won't use newer versions of the Collada specifications. However i may be wrong here.
2. Blender should simply ignore all it does not support. So it's interesting which export settings would make the Collada file unreadable by blender.
3. Blender import settings are currently limitted to "Import Units" which only has influence on the scaling of the imported Data.
4. And yes, Blender's importer is not yet stable. It should never crash blender. However it does. We are working on that.

---

Chosen Few wrote:For what it's worth, my own Blender installation is having serious COLLADA problems right now.  If I try to import any .dae that has bones in it, Blender insta-crashes to desktop.  I haven't had time to try to hunt down the cause. (And frankly, I haven't had much reason to care, since I hardly ever touch Blender.  The only reason I have it at all is to so I can help answer questions about it, when and were I can.  Maya's my everyday workhorse.)

---

It would be very helpful to report such failures to Blender. And if you dislike the blender bug reporter, then just tell me. It would be sufficient to send a short note and an example collada file attached. That realy would help!

---

Chosen Few wrote

---

Think about the logic of what you just said.  Maya can read and write COLLADA files without a problem, but Blender evidently cannot read some COLLADA files.  Maya can read and write FBX files just fine, but Blender cannot read FBX at all (at least not without third party help).  Yet somehow Maya is the one that is more limited.  I'm not sure how that makes sense.

In any case, it's not quite as simple as "a DAE is a DAE".  There are many different versions of the format, and different programs have different implementations of each.   When COLLADA was first invented, it showed some promise as a good in-between file format.  But for whatever reason, it never got the traction that FBX did, and standards for it were never really enforced.  It's become quite fractured by now. 

---

Well, fbx is a proprietary file format. Blender has actually an fbx importer in the development, but it has not been pushed to official blender. There is even an ongoing discussion about replacing Collada with fbx. However i guess that Collada is still the better choice for non autodesk programs, mainly because autodesk places some restrictions to the usage of their fbx SDK, which IMHO is a bad decision. But well, thats life, and we can not get all...

The main problem with Collada is that it leaves so much room for interpretation of the data. That's why importers tend to be complicated pieces with sometimes weird behaviour, there is one popular example for that right behind the corner and you know what i mean ;-)

[Zak Kozlov]

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

What exactly are you havng trouble transferring? Basic things such as geometry, skeletons, simple materials, bindings, lights, cameras, etc., should be able to move from program to program without much trouble. Things that are proprietary, like Maya hair, or paint effects, or anything else along those lines, will only work in Maya, of course, so if that's what your'e after, forget it.

---

Nothing in the scene is proprietary to Maya, only rigged meshes

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

There are FBX import scripts out there for Blender that you can try, or you can use Autodesk's free stand-alone FBX conveter to convert FBX to COLLADA..

---

This FBX to COLLADA stand alone seem like a good option, i'll look into it, thanks

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

I can think of four possible causes. It could be any or all of these: Your friend's version of Maya is writing a different COLLADA version than your version of Blender can read. Your friend doesn't have his COLLADA export settings configured correctly. You don't have your COLLADA import settings configured correctly. You're trying to transfer things that are not supported by the COLLADA format. My guess is it's the first one, but as I said, it could be any or all of them. For what it's worth, my own Blender installation is having serious COLLADA problems right now. If I try to import any .dae that has bones in it, Blender insta-crashes to desktop. I haven't had time to try to hunt down the cause. (And frankly, I haven't had much reason to care, since I hardly ever touch Blender. The only reason I have it at all is to so I can help answer questions about it, when and were I can. Maya's my everyday workhorse.)

---

I got Maya 2013 to help him figure out this trouble. So we don't have to wait for each others at every options hehe and I learned some very very basics with Maya

I'm not sure about configuring COLLADA export settings, is there anything else to do in Maya other than the general setting on the export window ?

What we are trying to export is only a skeleton now

 

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

Think about the logic of what you just said. Maya can read and write COLLADA files without a problem, but Blender evidently cannot read some COLLADA files. Maya can read and write FBX files just fine, but Blender cannot read FBX at all (at least not without third party help). Yet somehow Maya is the one that is more limited. I'm not sure how that makes sense. :smileyhappy: In any case, it's not quite as simple as "a DAE is a DAE". There are many different versions of the format, and different programs have different implementations of each. When COLLADA was first invented, it showed some promise as a good in-between file format. But for whatever reason, it never got the traction that FBX did, and standards for it were never really enforced. It's become quite fractured by now.

---

I admited to not be deep into that file support subject hehe but my thoughts were the opposit. that Maya had trouble to write COLLADA, not Blender to read it, that could be a possibility no? I had some indication of it being that, since I can export a whole scene in a collada from Blender, and reimport it properly in a fresh blender. to me the logic want me to believe that Maya have the problem to write it, not blender to write / read it.

Not even mentionning all the tricks I gave to my friend to rig things and he ended up saying that Maya cannot do X, which is partly the reason that we are looking to get the things in Blender now so that I can do the job

I mean all my first moves with Maya are giving me the impression that it is more limited, but I might be wrong of course, and i intend to learn Maya to find it out hehe and it's always good to be able to use all tools around

 

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

If you're talking about rigging for SL, you should know you cannot use a custom skeleton. You can only use the pre-existing avatar skeleton. It's available in just about every format you could think of, inlcuding .mb, .ma, .blend, .dae, and .fbx, just to name a few. If you're talking about making stuff for a different platform than SL, that's a little beyond the scope of the SL forums (at least for now). If it really comes down to it, you could always just recreate the skeleton from scratch. All you need is front and side pictures of it, and a listing of the bone names, and you can recreate just about any skeleton in a matter of minutes. Skeletons are really simple things..

---

of course. by custom Skeleton I dont mean a T-Rex skeleton or sumthing hehe but a very SL compatible skeleton that have slight difference in size and positions

---

Chosen Few wrote:

 

If you want the SL skeleton, you can get it in about a thousand different places. For example, you can find some in .blend format right on he SL wiki:

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Mesh/Uploading_and_wearing_a_rigged_mesh#Creating_a_rigged_avatar

I had been hosting one in .ma and .dae format for a long time, but I forgot to pay my web hosting bill, and my website got nuked. Oops. I haven't had time to rebuild it yet. If you Google "Second Life skeleton", you'll find tons of places to get it. Or, as I said, you can just make your own. It's only 26 bones. If it takes you five minutes, you'd be doing it slowly. The bone names are also on the wiki:

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Mesh/Troubleshooting#Rigging

---

Thanks. I did all that before hehe

I started using the good old avatar.blend, then since i was working with smaller avatars and since I want to learn everything there is about 3D modeling, even those things more or less useful for SL like rendering, mesh animations, physics and such, I made my own skeleton ... Today i'm working mostly with avastar for SL rigged things

[Zak Kozlov]

---

Gaia Clary wrote:

hi.

I have recently started to investigate how we could better support exchanging data between blender and Maya. I also found that the integrated Maya Collada exporter (or Maya 2013 at least) seems a bit limited (it sometimes creates wrong collada data) Actually i have no idea yet why that is so, but well...

There is an alternative Collada exporter for Maya available, based on the openCollada library:

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/OpenCOLLADA/wiki/OpenCOLLADA-Tools

Since Blender also uses openCollada, there is at least a small chance that this improves your situation already. However i have not yet tested that plugin, so i can not tell if it realy improves your situation.

Note that the blender collada support has been significantly improved in Blender 2.66. So if you are not already using that version of blender, then i recommend you try it out. It has improvements especially when it comes to importing rigs.

If you still fail for any reason, then please file a report to the blender

bug reporter

and provide the .dae file that does not import correctly to Blender. Or if you do not like the reporter (which i can understand) then contact me. I will take care then. But not before next week.

Happy easter ;-)

---

Thanks

 

I just tried this exporter, its just crashing Maya almost instantly when I try to export with it, shame cause it seem more complete on options and that might have be it

 

I'm using Maya 2013, is that evul?

 

I'll try to update Blender, i'm still using 2.65, but since Blender to Blender .DAE save are going great I was thinking that the problem was Maya not exporting things properly, not Blender hehe I'll try an update, if not i'll report it

[Kwakkelde Kwak]

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Zak Kozlov wrote:

I'm using Maya 2013, is that evul?

I'll try to update Blender, i'm still using 2.65, but since Blender to Blender .DAE save are going great I was thinking that the problem was Maya not exporting things properly, not Blender hehe I'll try an update, if not i'll report it

---

All 3ds Max 2012 and the first 2013 Autodesk Collada exporters (2013.0 and 2013.1 I think) didn't work with SL. You can download a higher version though from Autodesk. Version 2013.2 works, I think version 2013.3 does as well.

Since 3ds Max and Maya seem to have the same issues with exporting for SL and both programs being owned by the same company, I suspect what is the case for 3ds Max is also the case for Maya.

Autodesk FBX plugin (2013.3)

[Slythe Sirbu]

Because I was having this problem for the past week, and found a solution that worked for me, figured I'd post it here.

 

Someone wrote a FBX importer plugin for Blender.

Export Maya FBX, import directly into blender

Plugin here: http://blenderfbx.render.jp/

 

I had a rigged mesh, complete with weighting exported from Maya in FBX, and that imported it into blender quite well!