Toysoldier Thor

Well that is stupid if that is true that that you cannot sell a partial mesh item on MP if you havent done the MESH TEST and have PIOF. This is the perfect example.... the creator of the item being listed was not the MESH CREATOR.... he / she is only the assembler of a mix of imput material. Why has LL decided that only if Mesh is involved must a selling merchant have to abide by all requirements for creating a mesh. They are not creating the mesh... only using it as an input. If this is the case, why is LL not demanding that merchants that use my sculpty maps for their builds not being asked to do this test or have PIOF? This is silly and a half baked idea. As for a user having or not having PIOF... that is the merchants choice and no one should question why. I personally didnt want to have PIOF and only did it eventually in order for me to withdraw my profits from SL. The decision is personal and I understand the reasons why he wouldnt - I surely didnt want to.

Yes I heard that SOPA was killed. This is good news but as many in the Internet industry are already fully aware.... the "greedy lazy" copyright owners in the world will lay down and accept that they could not get their Government officials in Washington to get this law put in place. They will surely start a new and more sneaky lobby effort to Washington to pass on the protection of Copyrights to others. What I find so sad in this Congressman's published announcement of withdrawing his SOPA bill was this... "It is clear that we need to revisit the approach on how best to address the problem of foreign thieves that steal and sell American inventions and products," Smith said. Talk about protectionist propaganda that has likely been fed to him via constant lobby brainwashing from these big Hollywood industry players. So Smith has become convinced that this is yet another "WAR ON AMERICA" from all those evil illegal pirates of copyright content of "AMERICAN" content. Talk about wrapping the flag around a law that only serves the right lazy copyright owners that dont want to fight their own fight. As is typical for a US Politician, spin this bill so that it looks like this problem is a National crisis that effects ALL AMERICANS from the EVIL FORIEGNERS! Disgusting! As if there are no American citizens that are pirates of American content? As if this law would have served the interests of all americans when we all know it only serves a fraction of 1% of all US citizens. As if this law was not going to hurt countless other Internet dependent business in America that this Congressman was so naive and brainwashed by the rich Hollywood lobbyists to understand his own bill? Just by reading this Congressman's explanation of why he is pulling the bill and next steps that everyone that was against SOPA, PIPA and the ever slowly growing Governments support of ACTA that we all need to know this was only a won battle - the war against these lazy greedy copyright holders is far from over.

WOW... wasnt that easy to figure out from your posts what was driving you to be one of the RARE people that support SOPA and PIPA and likely ACTA. Sorry for being blunt WADE but you are one of those that are in the category of GREEDY, UNAPPRECIATIVE, and also LAZY. I was dead-on in saying that this law has been created for and is being pushed and supported by a very small portion of the population. It serves NO ONE ELSE but movie / music industry players that are getting a portion of the profits. This is either a large or high profile creator tha is compensated by sales but moreso this proposed law is heavily being pushed and promoted by those that have NO DIRECT INPUT in the creative process. They are the financiers and business people and agents of the creators that get rewarded directly from the profits of the creators. So you are in this group - as predicted. Funny thing is that you say you are smaller but even you admit that you are too small to be able to effectively leverage even the existing laws that YOU are responsible for using to protect your copyrighted creations (if you actually create copyright content - you might be a RL middleman). As you said, you need to ride on the coattails of the giant industry players that have the war-chests and teams of lawyers to go after all the pirates. Unlike 99% of creators with copyright creations, you are lucky enough to have connections to get others to fight for you. If it wasnt for your connections, the value of SOPA or PIPA have no direct value to you unless your big boy bodyguards take down a site that just happened to pirate your content too. Good for you on being one of the lucky ones. So.... now that we know where you stand in RL... I also know that there is nothing that can be posted that would convince you otherwise from your perspective. So I will just respond on a couple points. WHY ARE YOU LAZY? Because you support a set of new laws that will force by threat of legal action and threatened criminal charges everyone else (other business, organizations, and individuals) to protect your copyrights. Right now THIS IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY - no one else's. But you support a law that forces players that have no interest in your content or business to be legally responsible to protect YOUR CREATIONS! The ISPs, the Search Engine Servinces, the Government, the streamers and platform providers, the owners of clubs or any one facilitating a potential pirate would now all be responsible to protect YOUR content and at a cost to them and at a profit impact to them. YOU LOSE NOTHING for this law going in place - you just sit back and force others to do your dirty work, your fighting, your responsibility to proetect your content. As you see your profits continue to skyrocket, countless other business take hits on their business models and profits and even possible existence... But as long as you get more of your share - that is what counts... right? Yes you do have full rights to protect your creations (if you do actually create). You also have laws on the books now that YOU can engage and leverage to protect your content. In fact, it has been proven many times including this week when the Hollywood legel bigboys took down megadownloads.com and had charges laid on the owners. Funny... they were able to do this without SOPA, PIPA, and ACTA. They did this by using the laws already in place and not being lazy and actively protecting their copyrights. BUT... now we get to why you are not only LAZY but GREEDY.... You are lazy because you want others to protect your copyright as you sit back... You are GREEDY because you dont want to spend any of your gobs of profits created from your created content to protect your content. You would rather keep your profits for yourself, lower your budget on protecting YOUR content and bamboozle the US Government into thinking that its their responsibility and the responsibility of everyone else that participates in making the Internet the amazing creation it is now to take on your expense and fight against the pirates. The Hollywood giants have the legal tools to continue the fight against piracy but they dont want to spend the $millions to protect the $ BILLIONS they make on their copyright content. They would love to BS the Government to force all others to take on this financial burden when they get no share of these $billions in profits. BUT now why are you unappreciative? We already established that in previous posts.... You are more than willing to tap into and leverage the amazing reach and potential sales generation that the Internet provides you, but, you are more that willing to criticize and attack and destroy huge aspects of what makes this same Internet successful for all others and that was a part of the profits that your content generated for you - just because you expect to get 100% of the benefits from your creation. Internet be Damned.... I want ALL MY REVENUE FROM MY CONTENT - at all costs. Finally about the BS you and many in your industry try to fling around to convince everyone that SOPA and PIPA and ACTA are required..... this notion that amazing creations from the teams like Puss n Boots from Dreamworks should deserve to get 100% of the reward from their efforts. So lets slam that BS door shut. Except in some few situation, exactly how many in this team of digital creators - the farm of computer graphic designers - are getting anything more from that movie than a 9-5 salaried pay? How many of the Actors, Graphic Artists, Lineart specialists, and other staff from these huge copyright owning organizations like Disney, Dreamworks, Sony, James Cameron, etc. are getting a percentage of these profits you are saying they are losing to piracy? I am sure you will find examples but for the most part, most of them lose NOTHING because James Cameron's Titanic only earn $1.5 billion from all proceeds vs $2 billion (those are guessed estimates only of the profits). That Disney and Sony and James Cameron shut down Megadownloads.com will not make one penny of difference to these creators that actually made the creation. Another funny thing for your to think of is that you sit there supposedly puzzled (and I know you are not puzzled - just greedy lazy) why there is such an outpouring of anger and hatred for SOPA and PIPA... why massive sites like Wiki Flickr, Google, and even creative sites like my own Deviant Art (which is a site dedicated to artists and their creations) are openly protesting SOPA and PIPA...... But funny thing is that when megadownloads.com was being threatened to be taken down, the news reported that even high profile celebs that are in the copyrighted content being pirated were supporting megadownloads.com. WHY??? You explain Why these creators and creators like me with copyright content do not see SOPA and PIPA as being a good thing? Why WADE? Its not that you and the lazy greedy industry players are confused at the overwhelming protest againt SOPA... its that you realized that most of the Internet community saw through your scam to put YOUR RESPONSIBILITY in everyone else's hands.

Ann Otoole wrote: The venue is accountable for a performance license from several label licensing authorities. This will not change. If enforced the number of "clubs" in SL would be dramatically reduced. However some would have a license and enjoy max capacity crowds. The DJ is not accountable. Are you sure about this statement Ann? I know a few DJ's and the rare one has actually bought some kind of right to play licence from their music library - I cannot recall now what they call it as it was some time ago when it was explained to me. The DJs in many cases in SL are independent contractors to the club - ie they DJ at many clubs since a good DJ (or any DJ for that matter) is not an easy person to find. I can see in RL that the Club owner would need licenses for so many things - including the DJ - but the library of music the DJ uses to perform his/her job is his/her responsibility from what I understand. Laws like SOPA & PIPA will make DJs in SL extremely rare - but if Club Owners are also going to be held legally liable to protect the content owner's copyright... then you are correct, the number of clubs in SL will collapse. SL's economy is based on micro-payments and existance. Its fragile already. If Virtual DJs and Club Owners (who 99% operate at a loss already) will be forced to pay RL licence costs for music.... POOF!!! GONE!!! Its not rocket science - they will be gone. Even the more successful profitable ones will be gone. SL will likely only be left with a few clubs that are likely already run my RL professional organizations - I am thinking like THE ROCK.

Rene Erlanger wrote: You fail to see the bigger picture though.....without music available inside Second Life, you'd be selling your beloved SL products to a greatly reduced audience. It directly impacts LL in 2 ways....User concurrency and their Sim tier income!.....not to mention threat of being closed down at any time! I dont think Wade is stupid so I think there are personal private interests for Wade that would be of benefit if SOPA . PIPA become law. Either a secret large music artist, large hollywood actor / director, Sr. VP of a movie or music industry or has an interest in a company that would see a large competitor hurt by this new law. Any average citizen, musician, artist, content creator will gain nothing from these laws. Its purely designed to be a crushing hammer for only the big players with a gaggle of well paid lawyers to used to protect their own personal interests. So Wade must fit into one of these players in some way. Do you care to tell us WADE what RL interests you might have that this law will personally benefit you?

Rene Erlanger wrote: Toysoldier Thor wrote: These laws are being developed to serve one industry only.... it serves NO ONE ELSE and it will damage most everyone else that loves the Internet. Just like the current US Online Gaming laws were to protect the interest of large US Casinos. YUP Rene... Exactly. The US SOPA & PIPA laws will be for Hollywood and the Music Distribution industry what the US Online Gambling Art was for the US Bricks & Mortar Gambling industry in Vegas. Both sets of laws were put in place and are planned to be in place only to serve the interests of the largest industry players in both the Movie / Music and Gambling industries. NO ONE ELSE. Wade... to put in perspective, unlike the DCMA which likely you and countless of even the smallest copyright owners have engaged and used, do you in any way honestly believe that you will take advantage of the laws that would engage in SOPA / PIPA? If you actually answer YES.... please explain when how and why? If you are reasonable about tthis debate your answer should be NO unless you are secretly a Sr. Executive of a large movie or music industry player or distributor. If not, you are defending a set of laws that will pretty much in no way benefit you directly. In fact, it will more than likely only hurt you. If you are selling content to the inworld population of SL, you will surely see a quickly eroding SL population as the already weak SL inworld economy dries up as countless SL resident abandon SL as a fun place to hang out. Most clubs will close and most SL DJs are likely not using their own legally licensed music libraries and in no way could afford to buy a library just yo make $5 or $10 US per gig. But at least you will feel good that a law that does nothing positive for you personally will benefit only the largest copyright players in the industry. Just not sure what your personal motivation is for defending a law that does nothing for you - unless maybe it does

Ann Otoole wrote: IMHO people need to pressure the EFF to join with the other major tech companies and form a Super PAC to fund independent candidates that have brains and are not corrupt to get elected. The only way to fix this issue is vote out all republicans and all democrats, install honest people as elected reps, and then the new government make political corruption a capital crime. This will never be fixed until the oligarchy is destroyed and the existing 2 party corrupt system is destroyed forever. If that dream could ever be accomplished - great - but Americans cant get their heads around anything but a 2-Party system. But maybe the "Average Joe" Americans can use the Internet and collect enough $ to become a powerful Lobby Group for the Average American. Ten they can use their power and buy off enough politicians in Washington DC to introduce a new Act to pass as law. It would become the... S I P S C P A STOP INFLUENCE PEDDLING of STUPID or CORRUPTABLE POLITICIANS ACT This Act would be a set of laws that would force all Lobby Groups to be identified and all their activities monitored and if any Amercian citizen suspects or has enough evidence to show that a Lobbyist or a Politician in DC were in the act of influencing, bribing, or being influenced / bribed by a Lobbyist, the organization leaders would be brought up on charges and face jail time for violation of the SIPSCPA. Ohh and this new law would allow anyone in the world to bring a suspect lobbyist or politician up on these charges. It would be enforced unless the accused can prove otherwise. (sorta like the SOPA will allow a lobby group member from Hollywood to file a order to shut down a site unless the site owner can attend in person and prove their innocence). I wonder how fast this act will be endorsed by Washington politicians? lol

Honestly Wade.... If the original content providers that are crying soo much about content theft and the evils of piracy - specially those that RELY UPON THE INTERNET FOR THEIR CONTENT BEING DISTRIBUTED - they should shut down all use of the Internet in their business. The cry-babies are the same ones that have reaped 10 fold more benefit from the massive reach of the Internet then the losses they have encountered from it. The Internet is the most massive and pervassive distribution arm that ANYONE has access to. But what some creators and more sickenly the leech middleman agents of the creators who didnt even create the content have so conveniently forgotten is how much the reach of the INTERNET has done to make many of them known that would have otherwise never started or left their basement as just a personal hobby. They have forgotten how those that were popular prior to the Internet have been able to massively expand the popularity and revenue by tapping into the Internet.... Yet they are the same creators and greedy middlemen that want to shut down this same INTERNET for bit of negative it impacts these creators with. They love the 2000% (or even infinate) increase in revenue they have attained because of the Internet but they want to bite the hand that feeds them by shutting down the 10% 30% that they lose to the darker sides of the Internet. So.... for these content creators..... if you dont like losing a portion of your content $ that the Internet takes from you because of piracy etc.... then DONT USE THE INTERNET AT ALL. Dont have a website. Dont publish and promote on the Internet. Dont electronically publish your content or send it over the Internet. Dont stream on the Internet. I am a content provider of both 2D digital art as well as virtual creations with SL (my landscape sculpties) so I am not speaking as one who doesnt understand the other side. Am I naive in thinking that some of my digital photo art that I display on my sites like Deviant Art, Flickr, and my own personal website are not easily copied and downloaded and used elsewhere? NO! I know a good portion of my art is likely taken and used without my permission. Do I like that this happens? ABSOLUTELY NOT! But, would I want to go to a world where I do not have an INTERNET where I could show the world my art on the websites I use? NO! How stupid do you think I am? My new growing popularity of my art and my life as a budding artist would never have ever happened if it were not for the Internet. Same holds true with SL. I sell full perm Sculpty Landscapes. I do this because the vast majority of my customers on SL are honest and appreciate the skill and effort I put into my creations that they love. Do I know that there is a small % of users out there that disrespect my rights and ownership of my content and likely either free free copies of my sculpties to their friends or even possibly sell my sculpties to others in places I have not discovered? YES I do know. I dont like it either and I will do what ever I can to stop it if I find out. BUT... I would not want to see laws like SOPA or PIPA or ACTA destroy the very Internet that allowed me to make the money I have just to stop the small percentage of theft of my content. I am not greedy and I appreciate the fact that the massive enormous good that the Internet as we know it now has done far more to help me than it has to hurt me. I had ZERO without the Internet. So... SOPA PIPA and ACTA are laws for the unappreciative greedy content creators and their middleman agents.... They do not speak for the majority of creators that they keep harping to the stupid US politicians that they are supposedly speaking on behalf of. GREEDY GREEDY GREEDY!

After reading the posts above a few responses... SOPA & PIPA are technically laws created by greedy American special interest groups (primarily from Hollywood) and handed personally to several Internet-Stupid US politicians with likely some sweet personal perks that were slid under the table. They have no clue how the Internet works and how devastating and far reaching these naive laws would be to so many. They also have no clue how the ones that Hollywood and the naive politians are actually targeting would be the first ones to get around most of the limitations. Although SOPA & PIPA are US Laws with no jurisdiction outside the US borders, these US laws would begin to destroy many of the most popular Internet services that are base within US Borders. It would impact Search Engine providers (like Google), ISPs, multi-media distributors (YouTube), and any US operated services like SL. ACTA is not world-wide enforced BUT many Governments of many countries (like the naive current government up here in Canada) are actively working on adopting ACTA regulations. So, NO not all countries have yet endorsed it but unless Internet users put pressure on their Government, many countries will start adopting it because all their neighbouring countries are. So... taking a "ACTA wont happen to me" attitude is being naive too. I think it was Ziggy that said... streaming music content illegally within SL is wrong and it shouldnt happen. Yes you are completely right. BUT, as long as you understand the impact of doing what is completely right in SL. I would guess that the VAST MAJORITY of SL Club DJs are ameteurs that download and stream music to clubs in SL which are not legally acquired. As such, the Right Thing will surely mean that most sims in SL as well as most clubs in SL will go silent. Since there will basically be almost no DJs left and even a lot of Live "recorded backtrack" singers would have to shut down.... SL will have done the right thing but it will be a DEAD EMPTY shell of sims. Heck, even the SL Karaoke community I so much love in SL would likely come to an end as most karaoke singers use music tracks from sites like youtube or sing over their own downloaded songs. So... SOPA & PIPA may force LL to wipe all the evil illegal use of copyright material on the grid... but... LOL... there wont be much left on the grid when LL is done. And before you respond that..."all these DJs have to do is buy a licence to all these songs they play and they can be a DJ or singer legally".... remember that SL is a world of Micro-Pay. Most DJs would not be able to afford to be a DJ if they have to get licensing for all they play so they just wont be DJs anymore. It was also said that if people would read the details of SOPA they would see that its fair and sites cannot be shut down without a fair hearing.... COUGH COUGH... yeah right! WAKE UP! The second this law comes into place, HOLLYWOOD Billion $ movie and music companies will use this huge hammer they bamboozled US Politicians to create for them and start swinging it. Courts in the US will start blocking sites... illegal and legal but not favored by these companies... and if because many of these targeted sites are not American.... how do you think these small site owners will have any $ or means to travel to the US to fight their blockage. It simply will not be feasible and Hollywood will also stand by the ready with truckloads of their $ to challenge anyone through the courts into submission. To dismiss the abuse and misuse of SOPA & PIPA & even ACTA as "ohh sure there will be some abuse of the law but generally these laws will be used fairly and Hollywood $ wont have any influence" is utterly naive. vGenerally proposed laws like SOPA, PIPA, and ACTA might have good intentions on the surface but these laws will be used by Greedy Hollywood industry players that dont like that they can no longer control their stranglehold on distribution and they can no longer get their unfair cut on Artist's talents. In their blind greed quest to regain control - they will destroy all that makes the Internet as popular and powerful as it is now. These laws are being developed to serve one industry only.... it serves NO ONE ELSE and it will damage most everyone else that loves the Internet.

LOL.... Well based on the level of posting activity in this thread, either... its going so so so well that its not even worth these brave Open Beta Tester's time to post here to tell us how ell its going (with the exception of CouldBe that did some basic testing and documentation improvements over LL). OR other than a few brave Merchant souls... no Merchants want to waste their time and effort becoming LL's free testers. So the DD is not being tried by most merchants. I guess LL should not have gagged all the Close Beta Testers that actually were enthusiastic about participating and actually do have TRUE insight of the real weaknesses of the solution but even to this date they are bound by LL's secret society rules and cant tell us what worried them during them closed beta. I think there would be a lot more help is LL openly announced here that ALL CLOSED BETA Testers can now speak freely and openly about their experiences, concerns, etc. so the general community can validate if these concerns still exist. Asking the general Merchant Community to step in on the 11th hour 59th minute to do some quick testing to find out bugs about a system we have no real strong understand of is POOR TESTING practice. The Closed Beta Testers have a year of insight and they know how LL developed this DD and they know what SHOULD be tested. Ohh well.... as long as I am the last Merchant to transition from MagicBox to DD and as long as just engaging DD into production does not break the current MagicBox merchants... all would be good for me.

Thanks! Yes I had to rewrite the test and although from the welcome sim you see no other sims on the grid - when i searched MESH i saw lots of sandboxes. This will be a godsend to try different mesh pipelines. I am experimenting with 3D Coat. Ohhh... when I logged in I had 68,147L. Not sure how they calculated that and why I have so much. but there is tons here. Can I cash it out?

Kwak.... I was able to successfully log into the SL Beta grid (I assume that is Aditi). On the map there is only one sim visible and I cant rez anything on this sim. Its the Barbarossa Ferry Terminal and Infohub. But I couldnt even generate a mesh on this beta grid as I get a "you dont have rights to upload a model" error. Maybe I went into the wrong grid but this was the only grid option available / visible to me on the phoenix 1.6... SecondLife grid and SecondLife Beta grid. What up? LOL.... I met a dude on here that was just as lost as me. we both could rez anything but our inventories were all there from the main grid and we both had tons of fake lindens - the beta grid gave me 68000. It does say it was aditi. But there is only one sailing sim with a secret treasure cave.

Drongle McMahon wrote: "They wont change unless something inspires them to change." Exactly. If anyone is determined to accelerate mesh adoption, they have to make stuff must-have enough to get people to make the changes. It's up to mesh propopnents to do the convincing. Not for me; I am much too lazy. "The least they could have done is not charge an UPLOAD fee" The beta upload fees were MUCH higher when they were introduced towards the end of the closed beta. When everyone told them that would make mesh dead in the water on release, they set the current values, supposedly as a temporary measure (see kb). I hope they don't go back to the higher fees. There would be much wailing and gnashing of teeth. Some are already much too high. My 1089 vertex sculpty-like landscape physics shape, with just boxes for visible mesh, was L$ 53. I don't know the algorithm or the motivations behind it. I think it should be a L$ 10 fixed rate, like textures and everything else (if I remember that right). I totally agree with you on the upload fee. At minimum LL should be doing everything possible to encourage development of Mesh by setting the upload to a fixed 10L like most other imports. At best IF LL really had some Business Smarts (and most of us know that Customer Service, Business Smarts, and Business Development Strategy are major weaknesses for LL), they should have gone hard on promoting Mesh to the general builder / merchant community and throw the Merchants a big incentive of FREE MESH UPLOADS for 2012... then return to a 10L per upload in 2013. To me LL is double dip gouging their customers. They already are charging heavy LI charges on rezzing the mesh but then also discourages mesh development by penalizing builders from creating mesh with the highest upload fees of all import fess. I am not even sure how upload fees are calculated and why they are charged. Uploading is a 1 time event. Why would there be a formula to charge you 53L to upload a mesh? Mine were all under 20L but I am not even sure what factors calculate a higher upload and what the logic was for doing this?

My perception of your feelings and beliefs on Sculpties is only a reflection of your posts. Read some of your past posts in this thread. Whe you say things like how disgusted you are about sculpty tress.... I can only read your position from your posts. Your posts are not as militant as Medhue's Evangelical Love for all things Mesh but your posts do strongly indicate you hate sculpties. Thats all I will say about that. As for Medhue... you last post crystalizes everything I have been saying about your utterly blind love for Mesh... and your clearly posted anger and frustration for anyone that does not drinking from his "SL MUST BE ALL THINGS MESH" fireshose. So I guess according to Medhue - I am DEAD as a Merchant. Actually Medhue from your last post I really amd personally so happy for you. It is a rare moment in every human's life when all the stars align and one gets to come from the darkness of suffering and darkness and arrive at their personal perceived utopia. Its clear for Medhue that LL delivered that personal utopia. Life must have been so hard and dark and the suffering for you must have been intolerable all these years on the SL Grid. Each day preying that someday LL will relieve him from this suffering of the evil Sculpty! Think of the enormous power you now wield Medhue. Your top of the mountain superior skill knowledge and insight in the deep secret pure powers of the MESH. An insight that only you and a few others guardians of the Mesh are aware of. With this power you will be able to sweep through the Marketplace and take over all of your competitors markets. Since you will never make anything other than a mesh ever again because of your insight.... think of your new explosive market in selling MESH CUBES to all those builders in SL that thought the basic free reazzing prim cube was so great. Now you can actually do what many used to joke about... you can make and sell MESH CUBES on Marketplace. When a Customer asks you "but Medhue why would I pay you 10L for a Mesh Cube when I can make one for free and scale up for the same 1Prim when yours keeps getting more expensive when I scale it to 50M or add a script to it?". You can say "listen Mr ignorant customer - trust me that this mesh cube has powers beyond your comprehension - trust you will feel better in the long run". I predict that in 2 years they will rename the LL MarketPlace to Medhue All-Things-Mesh Marketplace. I bet Medhue will be able to even figure out how to tap the inner powers of mesh to make mesh scripts and meshed textures. Ohhh hold on.... didnt someone earlier say.... "even a prim cube is a mesh?"!! I think Medhue is trying to scam me! LOL..... Happy for you Medhue. Now with your supreme skills and unending evangelical passion for MESH.... take over the SL grid and become LL's biggest new Millionaire! Just remember us losers that never believed you.

lol how did i know that would be your response? LOL it means you are entrepeneurial and creative. I would have done the same thing.

I totally agree. I love mesh and I am excited about mesh entering the SL grid. I am taking time now to learn more about it so I can see if there are aspects of my category of the SL market that mesh will work better than sculpties. But right now I dont see a huge demand for mesh landscapes. I think mesh already has huge potential for hair and some clothing (except for the mjor limit of not having this deformer). My early experimentation with mesh already tells me that it will be a godsend for creating 3D art !! I love freeform hand sculpting of non structured shapes. That is why I fell in love with trying to create the non structured natural flow of nature like rocks and water and waterfalls and earth formations. Its also why my first mesh models were of human statues. I could never have accomplished this with sculpties (others better than I have created amazing sculpty statues but they were very complex to assemble in sl). So I am real excited about Mesh building of freeform 3D art. but my current sculpty packs - only 6 of them - still generate over $70US a week in sales. I dont think personally right now that if I introduced a Mesh version of these landscape packs that they would sell a fraction of that weekly sales - nor might they ever. shrugs - i could be wrong but right now I dont think i am. So I think its best we all stop debating the future of MESH - we all know it will be the dominent technology in the future. Just help us MESH DUMMIES understand the complexities of mesh you all already seem to know.

I know my business Medhue. I know what my customer base wants for what I sell. I also know when is the right time in the evolution of a new technology for me to consider investing my time to create and put to market these new products. Right now, specially for what I make - Landscape features - the time is not right to put too much effort into creating MESH landscapes. For those Merchants like you and others that feel the time is right to be the bleeding edge leaders in making Mesh Landscapes.... more power to you! I am sure you will get a few customers that are as leading edge on buying mesh and rezzing them on their lands for 40% of thier visitors to see as you are convinced its time to spend effort to create package and sell them. You deserve harvesting these leading edge experimenting customers. My model is much more pregmatic and I will enter the market with Mesh Landscapes when I believe the SL critical mass of customers are ready for it and when mesh technology is perfected on the SL grid / environment. That will likely not be until this summer at the earliest. You do what you do... and I will do what I do. As for LL's statement that 20% of all SL sims have at least 1 rezzed Mesh on it..... that is the biggest laugh statistic coming from LL. First of all, even if it was accurate - 20% adoption is even less that I would have predicted. Secondly, LL not even clarify what that stat meant. So if I had a Mesh hair and I TPed onto the sim - that counts as 1 of the mesh'ed sims? Regardless, it was a stat that only embarassed LL. Finally, what we as the general SL Sculpty Merchants / Creators dont need are mesh cheerleading posts from a squad of SL Users who love mesh and hate sculpties. In fact, it insults all us Sculpty Creators when you or others come on to a business thread and tell us in your postings (even though you dont even see how you word your posting ) that MESH IS IT and if you all dont get off Sculpties you are ignorant dumb creators for continuing to create sculpties and why havent you all started to believe like me, you dont win many friends ande convince them to start building mesh. We need logical unbiased business / creator conversations and postings and discussions. We need LL to step up and and talk directly to the Merchant / Creator community... not just their comfort zone of fellow Mesh geekoids whom have already been won over long time ago about mesh at all costs. LL needs to educate the greater Sculpty building / selling community. They need to hear and respond ro our concerns that are more oriented around the BUSINESS of making and selling mesh... not just the fun of making lil mesh creations on private sims. They need to be offering incentives to get more sculpty creators to introduce MESH PACKS. i.e. like a 6 month window of FREE UPLOADS OF MESH. None of that is happening Medhue... so be upset.... think that the general builder community is ignorant and doesnt understand the light that you have seen in mesh. But the rest of us sculpty creators will begin to engage in mesh when each of us are convinced by the market and LL and the maturity of the technology to enter the market. If you really think I HATE mesh..... why do you think I am on this forum? Why do you think I have created my first experimental mesh models and learning new tools and methods and trying to find the most efficient PIPELINE for my mesh builds? You being condescending to creators like me that dont yet understand the incredible complexity of mesh development and importing into SL does NOTHING to convince us to build mesh. It only polarizes us to like mesh less because it must only be for you mesh geeks. Just keep that in mind next time you get on your I LOVE MESH I HATE SCULPTIES soapbox.

thanks for the advice. this will be very helpful.

I agree with you on the EVENTUALLY. This slowwww adoption of Mesh I predicted last August (I said Q2 2012 but now even I think I was far too optimistic) was so easy to predict for those that looked at the world pragmatically. An amazing new technology that replaces a HUGELY entrenched older technology will take a ton of time, promotion, education, bug fixing, culture & systems adoption, etc. before you can start to turn the tide and move this new technology to reach a CRITICAL MASS of Adoption. LL has so far done very little to help move Mesh to become the new norm. All your Mesh Loving builders that have lived and breathed Mesh duing LL's long closed beta and have been deep dive mesh modeling techies might think the LL has done everything in their powers to promote MESH. Guess what? They havent. Outside your insulated Mesh community that you all live in within SL.... a larg majority of SL residents still either have not even heard of Mesh, or have heard the name but have no clue what Mesh is, or they dont care about mesh because they have no technical smarts to understant the technical superiority of mesh. Since LL has done little to promote the culture of it, most SL Residents have not even upgraded their viewers to see mesh. I have realized just how resistant SL residents are about mesh when this past couple weeks when I wanted to show my first mesh models to all my friends.... more than 1/2 could not see it since they didnt have the latest mesh viewers nor were they inspired to upgrade the viewers to see my models. I know this infuriates you all and you are puzzled but this is how most of the SL Population is. They wont change unless something inspires them to change. LL has not promoted mesh to the big public. They have made mesh development hugely more complex to import into SL than sculpties. They have not taken the bull by the horns and educated all the Sculpty creators / Merchants to better understand mesh and incent them to start creating mesh. And they penalize builders with larger upload costs then sculpties. The least they could have done is not charge an UPLOAD fee to further influence quicker adoption. So again... although you all believe LL has done everything to speed up adoption of Mesh..... SORRY... NOT TRUE. The 1000's of Sculpty makes have countless Sculpty products on the market and 100% comfort on how to make more sculpty products very quickly. And they costs to create and the lower and fix costs keep them making more sculpties. Many of us Sculpty Creators will slowly move to Mesh over 2012 and into 2013. But until we do this... Mesh adoption will be very slow. It will eventually take over as the dominent technology over sculpties... but not for a couple years. LL could easily speed this up but we all know LL is not a Customer Smart company. They are a culture of Tech Geeks that just like to sit in their Labs and develop new features and throw it over the fence and go on to the next feature. They dont even like fixing old tech bugs on Jira... So... Mesh will evolve... just not as fast as you all would dream it could.

I used Phoenix 1.6 and the latest beta of Firestorm. I also have other viewers for Inworldz. I do not use LL's Viewers. I will see if I can find it tonight. I assume it would be listed in the scroll down of grids at login?

I wont go through your multiple postings where you constantly tear apart the evil Sculpties... but here is one of your recent ones... @Drongle - I won't use sculpty trees. I have a neighbor that surrounds his tiny plot with sculpty trees and mountains, so much you can't see into his parcel. Whenever I get close enough to see his parcel, there is a long freeze as they all rez. It pisses me off to no end. So... if you have a PC that has more power than 95% of the SL Population.... maybe you better figure out how to configure a reasonably powered PC I have a PC that is as powerful as yours and hmmm... I dont have all your issues with sculpties. You know Medhue... it is alright for you to have a blinding bias for mesh and against all things Sculpty. You can sit and post how life before Mesh was a life of intolerable hell and suckiness. But just dont get all upset when the majority of the general population that have lived in all that is SL do not agree with you and actually have enjoyed the beauty that Sculpties introduced into SL. And NO Medhue... this might shock you but MESH LOVERS like you were not the only ones that ran aound and continue to run around sims and interact and get on sims with 40 to 70 avatars on them etc. But LOL I guess you want to believe that only you moved around in SL.... again.... you can believe what you want and hate what you hate. Just dont be too upset that thanks to LL.... Sculpties will be in your world a LONGGGGG time unless you want to live alone on your Mesh-only sim. Your neighbours and a majority of SL residents will take years to fully transition from all that EVIL Sculpty crud that you hate so much. Too much invested in sculpties and too much complexity and penalties on Mesh for sculpties to go away for a longgg time.

Do you really think I test things on a crappy PC? Well, yes I actually do. I own, use and run 4 different computers, all with different specs. That's how I test things. 2 of my pcs are probably better than what 95% of SL users use. None of my computers are more than 3 years old. 2 of them were purchased this past year. Plus, I got 2 video cards this past year. Based on your previous posts.... YES I do think you must be using a crappy 10 year old PC because I have been on SL for 4 years and all these evil crappy Sculpty blobed trees you talk about at your neighbours place and how HORRENDOUS they are and that they dont even rez for you .... hmmm.... who is flinging the BS here Medhue?? So either you have the oldest PC known to man or you are blowing Sculpty lag WAYYYY out of proportion. I think its the latter. But thats ok.... we all can be blindly in love with something. Yours just happens to be Mesh. I am just unbiased about Sculpties or Mesh. I think both are good. You on the other hand have a 100% fully promoted HATE ON ALL SCULPTIES!

Thanks. So anyone can log into the Aditi grid and upload test mesh models? Is this one sim that eveyone stands on and does what they need to do? Do I have to register to Aditi or is my accound live there automatically? I would love to have the freedom to upload many sample models and test the rez quality to the level of decimation I did to my models? Also, to test different ways to get the model uploaded with a texture on it and have it look good. Then ... next is to figure out how to place a texture on clearly distinct surfaces / sides of a single model. I will have to try to get on Aditi.

NOWWWWWWW Getting back to the OP (me) of this thread.... I am trying to figure out how to get the fully baked textures of a model I created in Sculptris or 3D Coat into SL in a level of beauty that i see on these 3D modeling tools. But I think Drongle already answered that this is not yet possible until some other LL project completes. I can get a degraded version of these textures into SL and the model but they surely do not look as good as they didn in the 3D tool. Also, even though I bring these textures in at 1024x1024, when they are applied to the model it looks blurred and almost pixelated. Not sharp like a 1024 SL image looks like normally. sigh... i will keep playing... the other aspect of this learning process is how costly it is getting to experiment. Unlike Textures where you can upload a FREE Temp texture... sadly it seems this in not the case for mesh objects. I have already spent a lot in uload fees to get my test models into SL - only to end up throwing them away. The model uploader preview screen is horrible in and you cant really get a good impression of how the model looks like on the grid from this preview. LL needs to create some kind of MESH MODEL Free Upload of Temp models. Say that the model will only exist for 24 hours before LL deletes the model. That would be so darn helpful to us Mesh NOOBS.

They made the Mesh penalty into Rocket Science that generally only tech geeks of Mesh can understand. Even if your point is true and a limiting penalty were need to reduce the factor of run away inefficient mesh builds... they could have done this with some simple easy to understand restrictions - Much less granular. I know as a mesh building technoid - this would grate at your very fibre since you know all the fine details of what makes a mesh efficient versus laggy on the sim.... But in almost all case the KISS Principle wins.... They could have set much more basic upper limit thresholds before imposing a penalty. instead LL Tech Geeks and all of the CLosed Beta users around them that loved all that was TECH in Mesh ... went on a feeding frenzy of creating this hugely complicated variable cost model that penalized mesh in every aspect that could cause lag... download costs, physics costs, embedded script costs, model size costs..... STUPID for REAL LIFE ADOPTION. You all are proud of yourselves for creating the perfect lag-incurring cost calculation models for mesh, but you all made creating a mesh the technology for the FEW... ahhhh but maybe that is what you all wanted ??? STUPID ME! You wanted to make sooo utterly complicated and secretive in how to make the best low cost mesh model that only the most mesh model geekiod could create them and thus dominate the future market in mesh!! Now I get it. You didnt want simple. You could have easily created a very simple model for cost penalizing mesh models that were too crazy and been far more forgiving for reasonable mesh models..... but you and LL didnt. Lightbub is going on now... Mesh was deployed in SL for the Technical Elite and with the objective of scaring away the hobbyists and technical noobs that all had started figuring out sculpties. very smart.