CelestineDemetria
-
Posts
34 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Forums
Blogs
Knowledge Base
Posts posted by CelestineDemetria
-
-
How about Auction houses for Various Items? That people would still like to Collect and Trade.
Just an Idea.
-
20 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:
At this point, seeing any merchant using that systems will tell me, and I'm sure many others, just what that merchant is all about. But you know what? People will be lining up to play...right after their GA meeting.
But without the thrill. You already KNOW you're buying something you don't want. That anticipation, waiting for the notice of what you got? Gone. Crap, the next thing isn't what I want either. Dangit. This one isn't it either but I'll buy it anyway. Oh hell, have to pee....can't leave or I'll get locked out and that person next to me will swoop in and get the one I want. Rather comical.
Side thought. Is this not like people who open up lootboxes or similar selling "Boxes" and sell off the items as people see them? Bunch of "DUD items pop out but Ohh a Cool item, I'll take it.
Its just a opened "Gacha" where you can choose to get through the content you don't want in hopes of that one cool thing popping up that you do want.
Shrugs. Smh
-
2 minutes ago, CelestineDemetria said:
People will honestly just use alts. Boop between both and get to the item quicker. If ya just have to be in proximity of the machine easy enough.
Right.LOL.
Side thought. Is this not like people who open up lootboxes or similar selling "Boxes" and sell off the items as people see them? Bunch of "DUD items pop out but Ohh a Cool item, I'll take it.
Its just a opened "Gacha" where you can choose to get through the content you don't want in hopes of that one cool thing popping up that you do want.
Shrugs. Smh
-
9 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:
At this point, seeing any merchant using that systems will tell me, and I'm sure many others, just what that merchant is all about. But you know what? People will be lining up to play...right after their GA meeting.
But without the thrill. You already KNOW you're buying something you don't want. That anticipation, waiting for the notice of what you got? Gone. Crap, the next thing isn't what I want either. Dangit. This one isn't it either but I'll buy it anyway. Oh hell, have to pee....can't leave or I'll get locked out and that person next to me will swoop in and get the one I want. Rather comical.
People will honestly just use alts. Boop between both and get to the item quicker. If ya just have to be in proximity of the machine easy enough.
Right.LOL.
-
3 minutes ago, xAmbiguityx said:
Exactly, it's disturbing it is even being considered as allowable. The only difference is what you're gambling for, you're still not getting what you want either which way.
Though they understand the law/regulations at the moment, they should also look into the future. Gachas have always been gambling but they skirted the rules because you didn't lose - you always win, just not what you want. So to avoid another situation like this Gacha ban, it'd be much easier to do a blanket ban, elsewise we'll be having this same conversation a few months/years later down the line - because these two systems are same process. It's all gambling, in one you're gambling for the item, in another your gambling for the chance to pay for the item. Doesn't seem all that appeal does it?
Precisely, which leaves a very bad taste in my mouth; both as a creator and a customer. The whole idea is gross/predatory and will likely come to a head as just as Gachas are now. People need to boycott these systems if/when they come out - otherwise its just a rebranded Gacha Epidemic.
"New" Vendor System. "A Wolf in Sheep's Clothing". Same deal just Rebranding of the model.
Glad as a creator you say something. Because this Idea was supposedly thought up to help the current creators continue to be able to sell. More like the current buyers getting the same "thrill".
-
6
-
-
4 minutes ago, VanessaJane66 said:
🤣 Brilliant...breedable clothes...now you can breed the rares, to hell with gacha 😂
Right!!
LOLS. 🤣
-
1 minute ago, Tari Landar said:
There used to be breedable shoes....
Can't stop laughing. just have one whole herd of shoes. one of pants .. lols
-
1
-
-
1 minute ago, Tari Landar said:
Exactly why they need to re-word that to say something more along the lines of "known/visible or base traits must be disclosed at the time of purchase", although I'm certain they can word it much, much better, lol. Otherwise it's just going to be another point of contention and another 50 pages of personal interpretations. I'm sure they'll fix it though, they'll get enough backlash from people that they'll have to, lol.
Hahaha. Right.
-
3 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:
I could be wrong, and I'm certainly I will be corrected if I am that what LL is saying with this new FAQ regarding breedables is that KNOWN and present traits at the time of purchase need to be clear to the buyer, but unknown (usually just called hidden or breedable) traits do not need to be disclosed.
They merely used coat color as one simplistic example. Let's say you have a cat and it's base traits (the ones you know it comes with, because it tells you this, or you can see it, etc..) are coat, ears, eyes, tail, gender and size. You must disclose that this cat has a blue coat, floppy ears, blue eyes, curly tail, a boy and is size large (insert whatever other examples you'd like there, lol those were just odd choices of mine). You do not have to disclose that this cat's lineage might pass on purple eyes, tipped ears, a floofy tail, a midget size or a brown coat, because it's secondary, and not actually a known factor at the time of purchase (it may not actually pass those on or it may take 5 more generations to find them, etc... breeding is an art form in sl sometimes, lol)
LL should probably ask people more versed in breedables for advice on how to best word that one, they're going to have to be more precise than "as long as they know its color", even if they meant any obvious or known traits. They need to be more clear for precisely this reason, people will assume they only mean color/coat, since that's the example they used, and not every other known trait. It's the combination of obvious/known traits that needs to be disclosed.
To me the way you put it sounds correct. "Known" attributes need to be known to buyer "Unknown" things are okay for down the line.
But who knows it's SL.-Shrugs-
-
15 minutes ago, Elyssa Artis said:
He did, but of the colors, otherwise he would be listing out every color. But again, it obviously isn't clear enough, so if they can state what traits need to be known, as a firm list.
Something like:
Color needs to be known
Color, tails and ears need to be known
Color, tails, ears and 2 generations of genetics need to be known
That would be absolutely ideal, and avoid all confusion.Or just tell Everyone you need to List the First 3 attributes. Color/species,Eyes,Gender and something that may make it different like 1 rare attribute.
Shrugs- Something common all breedables have.
Except trains DK what to do about them.. Hahaha
-
Just now, Elyssa Artis said:
Also, for real? Is that a thing? I gotta see that if it is
Was thinking maybe skirts.. You could breed a whole herd of wearable outfits.
🤪
-
9 minutes ago, Elyssa Artis said:
It's not an example when they specifically reference the other unknown traits and say that's okay.
To me, I think it should be all traits being known. They all contribute towards the item being common or rare.
They have clearly stated that other unknown traits, that they have or develop (presumably through breeding), is okay.my original question I had asked to get clarification. I was asking about the original box from the creator being sold to you "Randomly" only per say knowing it's a cat in a box .- someone stated as long as you know the color- Nope. As Long as you know the Attributes of the Animal being purchased from the Creator at point of sales.
Not the secondary breeding after that is not in question with traits and what not popping out, that I already know is fine from reading it.
-
1
-
-
1 minute ago, Coffee Pancake said:
Your literal misinterpretation is just that. They have provided an example and it's going to be taken as gospel that color alone is some special property and all other properties are not special.
Got what you are saying. Was I guess a bit confusing. Only because they give just one "Trait" or attribute as an example. Take that one thing and run with it .. "Well they said one so one it is "
After the other post I totally get what you mean and they are saying now.
Let's hope others do. Hahaha
-
5 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:
No that is not what they are saying.
You have to know the core features of the item you're buying. This is not just limited to it's color.
That would be like having a gacha that always gave you the green dress, but randomly chose what body it was rigged for.
Okay. Easy to wrap my brain around that.
-
Just now, Elyssa Artis said:
Nope, the way they say it's okay is you will have to know the color you are getting. Other things like tails and ears can be random, but color/coat will have to be known.
Okay, was like well dang. That though, does open a strange door for people to use as it's called atm " Random Bundle, nest whatever animal seller "( Name will have to change probably ) as long as you would put EX: Brown cat on it, and load it up with all brown cats of varying traits.
Hmm.. Shrugs. Or am I thinking complete opposite of what will fly.
-
18 minutes ago, Patch Linden said:
Hey everyone!
The FAQ's have been updated again and we hope this further helps with more clarity on some specific items.
I wanted to thank everyone for the thoughtful discussion to date, along with the many suggestions and questions regarding the policy. In general, we will not be monitoring this thread as closely and as we see any other areas that we need to cover, we will continue to keep the FAQ updated.Q. So a Breedable box from the Creator that says Random breedable at time of sales is Okay? As long as you know it's a EX.cat in the box.
Because most Breedables, not all but some give only that much to work with just a (animal) in a box all other things randomized at time of purchase so you don't know if it's that Blue cat or that Brown cat, it's a surprise.
-
1
-
-
7 minutes ago, Velcon Ethaniel said:
Thank you. The breedables in question that I'm talking about are ones that are RGB based - old school ones, like hunny bunny, alt life turtle, and XS quail. There are literally 10 million different color possibilities so it's not really feasible to make a vendor for each individual quail.
I totally get it.
That would be some nightmare listings. LOL. Prolly be here till ya Great Great Great grandkids trying to list that.
🙂
Clarity on "Description at sales point", with something like that Is definitely needed by the Powers at Be and Their Counsel.
-
2 hours ago, Velcon Ethaniel said:a. Why do 7seas fish now have to be no xfer? They have ALWAYS been transfer. If someone gets a fish from 7seas and gifts it / gives it away, that receiver or buyer knows *Exactly* what they are buying, so why this change / rule?I do not understand why 7seas fish have to be no transfer when selling and trading them doesn't violate gaming laws and isn't gambling. The buyer knows exactly what they are getting.I am going to be so upset at you guys if you force the creators of 7seas to make all of their fish no-xfer. It ruins the game for me and basically everyone else. I understand no Gachas - but at what point is too far?b. How is this going to affect vendors that give out random breedables. For instance: I have a vendor that sells quail eggs...but the quail eggs are all 100% different. The vendor simply states "Female Quail $1L " and no other details. Is this vendor still going to be allowed since I am simply selling them a quail, and they know this, even though the quails color will be random?As someone who breeds breedables, there is literally no way I can put out every breedable of every color into their own separate vendor - especially considering there are millions of colors.
Hey, I would @Patch Linden this Question. Just so in the Long Line of this Thread Maybe he or someone else of authority with the actual LL will answer it.
Have a great one.
Only trying to be helpful and get your Question looked at by powers at be.
-
1
-
-
41 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:
I think I already made it clear about LE starter items and why there can be no randomness to exactly what you see, what you get when you buy.
You must know the actual product you are getting when you buy. - Also what you said "No, all LEs do not all hold the exact same genetics, they are, by design, a bit different," - Tari Landar Both statements by you are conflicting.
Time of sales random then. (if they are all a bit diff as you said.)
Get what you are getting at, said it on page 28, 30 & 53 . - we are on the same page about that- never the issue.- you just made it seem that way.
So besides genders being random. Hidden things in Items being sold to different people would count the same way. - only thing I was getting at- in that initial purchase. Like ya said if all items are the same, the same le's at time of purchase should not hold items that others don't. (your Genetics)( Each product then is not the same- same on outside not on inside- but varying at time of purchase- if some boxes animals hold hidden items and some boxes animals don't)
-
34 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:
Yep, I have since 2008. I'm quite well versed in them. I wouldn't comment if I wasn't, that would be silly.
You literally are talking about breeding. That is secondary to the initial purchase of a LE. If the initial purchase of the LE is as random as starter packs, that is to say the exact known traits (not secondary, not unknown, not "can be breed out later down the line", etc..) that can get called into question. That is indeed a starter pack, and falls under exactly what I already said "LL needs to discuss with their legal team on how to help breedable creators solve this initial randomness". It will likely need to be 100% known at time of purchase, no "you could get brown, you could get green, both are starter colors", that will keep it compliant.
If, in buying the LE animal you know it's basic traits, the known ones, the ones you can see, before buying (it's green with gem eyes, curly tail, floppy ears), then it is not random. What you can breed out of it is irrelevant to this particular discussion.
I don't think you fully understand either what I am saying, or what you're saying. No, all LEs do not all hold the exact same genetics, they are, by design, a bit different, you just have to figure out how (if that's how you choose to play that particular breeding game). If they were not different, there would be differentiation between the offspring they all give off, which is part of that breeding game, lol.
You are actually talking about breeding and what you can get out of, or do with, the item (animal in this case) after buying it. This entire post is about what you can get out of those LEs, through breeding (secondary, involving genetics, which in the case of all breedables is still very much just code, everything in sl is., lol) , which is very much secondary to buying the LE in the first place.
Okay, get what your saying.
What I'm getting at is your playing or paying money to get a Different Item then the previously bought Item as you- put it or say in the Post-. Is that not Randomization? IF each LE pack is a bit different unknowingly to you or not ( is that not like a gacha, if each item coming out is seemingly different from the previous?, but for the same payment) Different items being sent to different subscribers on a chance basis is not allowed. - Is that Quote from patch Linden not the same as what you described. That's what I have been trying to get at.
Then you hope that new desired thing pops out. (hidden trait) unknown item in some of the packs or animals.(money maker) (intrinsic monetary value placed on that item of Rarity- if not all packs contain them)- like you said if each pack is unknowingly different.
Most breeders don't breed to just keep the Animal.
It is Transferable so then you can take it and sell it. You take the initial gamble of first buying (getting a different item then the previous item), Another gamble Breeding, to get that hidden thing (diff trait) . To then sell it on for more or less. So you are gambling that you will receive that item, and make more or less money off the Randomization of the animals being sold as you stated- if everyone is a bit diff. You are not knowing/getting what exactly what you pay for. (if those things are hidden- you don't know if you got the same or different then item previously)
-
20 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:
What does secondary randomization of traits (which with enough work put in can be determined, but does require some work on your part) AFTER initial purchase of an item, have to do with the actual item you bought? There actually isn't as much luck of draw as you think, it just requires understanding how genetics work, and realizing you may have to put some work in AFTER you buy the initial horse to get what you want later down the road, genetically. It's not the same, not even close, to a random factor being added in to the initial purchase of a horse. Perhaps some people don't quite understand breedables the way they think they do, I'm not sure. But the two things are not as related as you might think.
Now, if you bought that horse from a vendor, all sight unseen, like a random vendor, that's not permitted anymore under this policy.
Let's say I get a couch it's an awesome couch, I love my couch. Let's say the creator updates it, or it has features I was unaware of at my initial purchase. It has a setting that randomizes the poses into it's own sequence so I don't have to click buttons.
Do you really want this to apply to all things? Or can we get back to talking about the randomization of initial purchase which is where portion of the legality of these items comes into play.
Do you do breedable? That LE Pack not talking secondary Breeding but the stuff you get from the creator LE PACKS . To breed them LE's together for the hope and chance that you might drop that random hidden item in them. Which they call it that. Random drop- I.E numerical Sequence. Not cause that Other LE Has Anything different than yours they are all loaded with exactly the same things. ( So one person gets it and one doesn't, Even though they put the same money into the initial purchase and anything else required to get that animal to breed) - All with the LE Packs .- (Said that in initial posting Only LE Stuff or Starters Packs)
That is Randomization. ( Chance, Luck ) whatever you want to call it.
Not some secondary stuff about genetics and what not. That is all a sequence of numbers held in a script) You get enough theoretical Stars on a Certain trait and suddenly the trait pops out from the server end.)- Not cause your animal had good blood or anything like that- it's just a randomized sequence of numbers. And if that animal has only a limited set of numbers being placed into it yea it's going to pop out that same set of numbers. ( your so called Genetics)
-
10 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:
That you need one product to make another product work after purchase, such as feeding breedables, is nothing like a gacha, in any way. What an item does after you purchase it (such as with breeding animals giving you offspring) has no relevance in this discussion to the initial purchase of an animal.
They are completely unrelated because there is no randomness, except in the case of starter packs (and random vendors which are being made obsolete regardless, so, a non-issue) which will require LL looking into them and advice from their legal team on how to help creators of breedables proceed with that. I am certain that creators will need to ensure starter packs are no longer random, in order to comply. Otherwise, the remainder is fully complying with both the letter and spirit of the law, as it were.
Ok , so say you and your friend decide to buy an LE pack knowing the coat does not transfer. But you know that in that Item there is a Hidden Item pops out every now and then. Besides all the known traits already in the background that pops out (Randomized)
You and your friend take it home. You both do the exact same thing I.E buy the food, Etc., to have that animal do what it's name intends it to do. (Breed)
You and your friend wait About a month. Wham! your friends Animal which has everything exactly the same, same food, Same Vitamins, same everything that you have given your animal. Spits out that Randomized hidden thing on the Server. (Its a numerical Sequence that decides when it comes out)
What is that Called? Randomization and Luck - A chance that you breeding them 2 LE animals together for that "hidden" thing in them, and you getting the luck or chance for it to come out.
So your friend got the luck of the draw and dropped that new thing even though both of you put the exact same money into that animal.
-
1
-
-
1 minute ago, Viche Hexem said:
I think we're still waiting for an answer on this one. It depends though, someone more intimate with the mechanics of breedable systems will have to lay it out but essenitally the big difference is if the paid component is neccisary to the getting of randomly birthed animals. If you need to buy food to have your animals give birth then it's technically a gacha, if food just speeds up that process then it's like 7seas and, in turn, ok. (as far as I understand this)
I agree with you, for some without that food crystal- whatever incentive. The item does not work as intended.
-
So do Breedables then fall into a different category than the 7seas?
The Item does not work properly without the purchase of additional Items. I.E Food & Vitamins,etc. So if you want the intended outcome of the name of the Animal (Breedable). You the buyer need to Buy into the system and keep buying into the system. So the Item the animal births isn't free. It also is "random" well to what is on the server and what is spits out. If the Birthed animal/item cannot contact the server it's literally just a box it spit out for you. You are just Circumventing paying for that Item that you birthed. To then turn around and sell it for more or less, because they are transferable.
Facebook
Instagram
Twitter
YouTube
Flickr
New Gacha Policy Discussion
in General Discussion Forum
Posted · Edited by CelestineDemetria
Some LE's are in fact are No Transfer.
Yes in theory after you hold them for said period of time you can "Birth " them and then sell them. But in an LE Box you cannot just sell them on as is. You have to Birth said Animal and then yes, you do know all the stuff that does come along with whatever animal it is. That is the case with 3 different Breedables that I do currnetly all different companies, The same thing applies you must pre birth a LE at the time of sales if you would like to sell them on. LEs in Theory they are transferable but not until after birth. Just like any other animal. Even states it on the websites, for commonly asked questions. You cannot just sell LE boxes onto other customers without pre birthing the animal. Can in fact quote said websites. If you would like.