wrong weight maps assigned to the wrong vertices after uploading a rigged mesh

[Utilizator Mode]

when uploaded my mesh, some vertices fore some reason have completely different weight maps than they had in blender, they are asigned to the right bone isntead of left.
it cannot be an error on my side because i simply only riged one half of the model and than mirrored and applied all the weight maps, the model deforms perfectly in blender and there are no anomalies, i double checked everything and there is nothing wrong with the model, but when i upload it i get a few vertices following the wrong bones for some reason

this is really annoying because i spend all day and a lot of L$ reuploading the model and trying to figure out what is wrong with it, no mater what i did i always got the same exact result, i tried deleting the half of the model that glitches and mirror a fresh half of it with all the weight maps but it didn't solve anything. i am wondering if this is a problem with SL or is it a problem with blender's colada exporter.

 

has anyone ever had this or know whats going on? help would be apreciated, i also tried posting this issue on jira but its a ghost town

 

 



[Utilizator Mode]

i noticed even more anomalities, basicaly the whole inner part of the leg was efected by the right bone to some extent even if there where no vertex groups asigned to those points, i did an experiment, i cut out the whole part that gets screwd up and pasted it as seperate object and uploaded, and it no longer gets effected by the right leg bone what is going on

 

 

edit, i examined the body closer and found that the whole left side is screwed up, points folowing bones they shoulnt and its not even neseserily the right side bones

[Prep Linden]

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Utilizator Mode wrote:

when uploaded my mesh, some vertices fore some reason have completely different weight maps than they had in blender, they are asigned to the right bone isntead of left.

it cannot be an error on my side because i simply only riged one half of the model and than mirrored and applied all the weight maps, the model deforms perfectly in blender and there are no anomalies, i double checked everything and there is nothing wrong with the model, but when i upload it i get a few vertices following the wrong bones for some reason

this is really annoying because i spend all day and a lot of L$ reuploading the model and trying to figure out what is wrong with it, no mater what i did i always got the same exact result, i tried deleting the half of the model that glitches and mirror a fresh half of it with all the weight maps but it didn't solve anything. i am wondering if this is a problem with SL or is it a problem with blender's colada exporter.

 

has anyone ever had this or know whats going on? help would be apreciated, i also tried posting this issue on jira but its a ghost town

 

 



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Typically when I see an errant vertex weight like that, it's because the vertex used did not find a proper weight in it's lookup upon import - so what this means is that if the importer fails to find an weight for a specific vertex that you've specified, then we fall through to our (current implementation) of get nearest vertex and uses that associated weight list.

So what you end up with is a weight that pulls the vertex to an incorrect bone. What you can do is make sure that every vertex is in a group and weighted in blender, that way the importer won't fall into that bit of code. We should eventually fix this failsafe - probably I'm looking at replacing the current code w/ topological flood-fill that searches for nearest verts as well as changing the lookup to use the indices instead of the vert positions.

 

-prep

 

[Utilizator Mode]

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Prep Linden wrote:

 

What you can do is make sure that every vertex is in a group and weighted in blender

 

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it is in a group and weighted, otherwise it wouldnt even load. if your model has atleest one point that doesnt belong to any kind of vertex group and doesnt have a weight of atleest 0.001asigned to it, the model will not show up in the preview window at all and the polycount for all the levels of detail will be N/A, besides, if those points wouldnt be asigned to any group, id see it in blender when i try to pose the model and both sides od the model would be corupted when imported.

i had an older version of the model that worked fine before i tried uplaoding this one (this one has some bugs fixed in the shouder area)

the older model was uploaded with an older viewer before i updated my viewer. i tried uplaoding the same file of the older model that doesnt glitch before and surprise surprise, it gliched too, so im guessing something is wrong with the latest releases.

 

long story short:

same DAE file + diferent viewer versions = diferent results

in older version of the viewer the results where perfect

new version, model is corupted. it no longer works with clothes created for it too

 

i put the both meshes on, the corupted parts are clipping through the proper mesh uploaded with the older viewer, both meshes are the same dae file

 

so yeah, does anybody know where i can download the older versions of the mesh project viewer? nothing i download from the sl wiki lets me log in, tells me i need to download 3.0, is there a way to bypass this?

[Chip Midnight]

There definitely seems to be some issues with the current release and beta viewers. I have a model with three vertices on the inside of one leg that swear they're attached to the bones on the other leg even though they're not. I've checked and triple checked the weight table, reassigned the weights a dozen times, and nothing fixes it.

With the same model if I add one level of subdivision and use Skin Wrap in 3ds Max to derive the weights from the lower poly version the legs are fine but then I have several verts at the fingertips that flicker and shoot off to infinity. Same kind of deal. The verts are properly assigned to the bones with a weight of 1.0 but no amount of fiddling fixes it.

There's definitely a problem with the current versions of the importer.

[Phoenix Steampunk]

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Utilizator Mode wrote:

so yeah, does anybody know where i can download the older versions of the mesh project viewer? nothing i download from the sl wiki lets me log in, tells me i need to download 3.0, is there a way to bypass this?

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You should always use the latest version of the importer. Jumping back to an by now outdated version just cause it worked back then doesn't mean it would be a fix. What kind of software do you run and do you use for exporting your meshes? Maya 2012 user have reported issues with the build in DAE plugin that wouldn't be supported by the SL importer since its based on a newer version of the dae. Even tho meshes exported with it could be uploaded it caused issues with materials as well as rigged meshes. Correct me if I am wrong but the latest supported version that SL supports should be DAE 1.4.1. Their workaround was to export their model as a 2011 FBX and use the external FBX Converter to produce a SL valid DAE. At least the clipping issue might be based on that.

The latest dev builds can be found here: Mesh Development Builds

 

As for the other weighting problems that have been mentioned. I didn't run into any issues like those that have been mentioned with the latest dev builds (3.0.X - 3.0.3 (239683)), but then I havent done test with multi LOD rigged assets yet. At least for single LOD rigs for me it seems to work as intended.

(Sidenote: The problems with the arbitrary verts could be based on ghost verts that aren't asigned to the rest of the geometry, lamina or zero faces. But since you guys mentioned you have double checked everything I doubt its an issue of unclean geometry before weighting. Weird.)

 

[Chip Midnight]

Uploading the same dae file with tne new version of the mesh project viewer produces just one vert that thinks it's attached to the wrong leg... on the other leg this time.

 

[Utilizator Mode]

i mentioned a few times that im using blender, i tried both 2.4 and 2.5, got same results

 

i guess i should just give up on riged meshes for now till like 5 sl updates later LL realizes theres a problem and decides they shouldprobably fix it like they allways do

[Phoenix Steampunk]

Fill a jira if it is a consitent problem you can repeat with more than just on rigged mesh and support them with as much informations you got. Mesh project isn't final yet, so don't expect everything to work.

[Chip Midnight]

I've managed to work around this problem. It seems to be related to the scale of the model when exporting. I use the SLAV importer for 3ds Max. If I import the av skin and rig at anything but a scale of 1, the model is the wrong scale relative to the bones when imported back to SL. Unfortunately this makes for a rig that's tiny in 3ds Max. I've found that if I then use Max's select and scale tool to scale the model and rig up to an approporate real world  scale I do not get the problem with the verts when exporting to DAE. I just have to make sure to adjust the scale in the importer so that it's again an appropriate real world scale (around 1.8 meters tall).

[Phoenix Steampunk]

Gotcha, yeah the import still reacts somewhat critical if you don't take care for scaling your model SL ready before uploading, strechting ISL still results in some strange behaviour, might take them a while till they look into that.