lovestofu
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Posts posted by lovestofu
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On 8/14/2024 at 1:13 PM, Skye Skydancer said:
Now there are two of them. I find it so annoying. They are on LL land right in front of my house. I only see them when I leave my parcel, but it is still annoying. I submitted a ticket to LL to ask if they can remove them. There has to be a limit to how many bots are allowed to hang around taking up space for no reason.
Just blowing off steam. I know it's not a big deal, but it is an annoyance.
After seeing this post, I decided to visit the exact area in world. To my surprise, I found that your land is very friendly to drivers, which is a refreshing change from the banline hell that mainland has become. I helped myself to the coffee you left on the patio table. Thank you for being one of the good ones and not one of those nasty banline users.
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Just now, WeFlossDaily said:
Summarized. =]
This is an incomplete summary.
Among other details in the original post, the poster alleged the following:
- A product the user purchased did not work according to their expectations.
- User left a negative product review on the Marketplace listing for the product.
- The negative product review was removed from the Marketplace listing.
- The item was remotely rendered unusable.
I am not attesting to the veracity of the claims of the original poster. I am, however, summarizing the salient points that are discussion-worthy.
For instance, regarding points (3) and (4), it would be good to know the content of the negative product review. A review being negative or angry is not sufficient reason for removal of a review, and points to gaming the system by Marketplace sellers who have a business interest to wash away all negative feedback concerning their products. Without negative feedback visible on the Marketplace, however, it becomes difficult to differentiate good products from bad. I believe this is a bad trend that only degrades the user experience on the Marketplace from the point of the view of the customer.
Point (4), if true, is egregious. That a Seller can offer a product that the Seller can later disable without good reason is an abuse. The only way I see this being permissible is if the customer and Seller were to enter a contract where this is stated as a possible outcome, although I cannot see many people entering such a contract without consideration. Therefore, there is a gray area addressed here, of whether every customer of the Second Life Marketplace implicitly enters such a contract. In my opinion, this needs clarification by Linden Lab.
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The grid is already divided, as Zindra is the only mainland continent that allows Adult rated regions. This is likely enough of a distinction to enforce limits on iOS-based user logins.
That said, many users of Second Life enjoy visiting the seedy side of the grid, even if these users are not interested in erotic roleplay at the time, though perhaps they later will revisit the same areas on an alt. If the userbase were further divided by requiring logging onto a separate "Red" grid, this would quickly eliminate this form of entertainment enjoyed by the vast majority of Second Life users. The Red grid would quickly become one of those 3D sex games no one sane plays, and people would leave the PG grid after the disappearance of their primary form of entertainment.
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Just now, Fluffy Sharkfin said:
I imagine LL are paying very close attention to viewer adoption rates and concurrency right now and, depending on how many users they project will be affected, they may even extended the grace period so that users can continue using non-PBR viewers a while longer.
However if that does turn out to be the case I expect they'll also make it clear that the old deprecated renderers are no longer supported and any issues arising from their use are essentially not their problem. They certainly aren't going to abandon the new PBR renderer since it's apparently at the heart of all their other planned features.
Linden Lab could make this problem go away overnight by adding so-called "power user" features to their own viewer. If the official viewer provided the user with options to hide Look At targets, log chat messages, and access classic search, there would be little use for Firestorm or other Third-Party Viewers. Very few people use Area Search or other advanced features of Firestorm and those who do probably have little issue rendering PBR.
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11 hours ago, AmeliaJ08 said:
It's no big deal, an IP address isn't of much use to any third party.
An IP address, linked with other data points about an individual, can reveal significantly more information about that individual than one might think. For most users of Second Life, who are normal people who live ordinary lives, this is not an issue as the volume of users makes them unlikely targets. To individuals who might be interesting to motivated attackers due to social or political influence, access to information, or substantial means, this potentially becomes a serious risk.
It is false to say "any" third-party would not find IP address information to be useful.
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10 hours ago, discussionbot said:
https://feedback.secondlife.com
So the Feedback website is mostly a joke and irrelevant to voice any concerns?
I was not talking about the Feedback website. I was talking about the Server User Group.
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58 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:
Those meetings are just info sessions and the only time a resident is listened to is if they can point out an obvious issue that the Lab has missed. That is pretty much the same as that other meeting you attend elsewhere.
Personally I think the only ones the lab might listen to is the land barons with major land holdings. If any of them lose confidence in the path the Lindens are taking, they might become a little more openminded however it is doubtful that the Land barons care much about vehicle crossings so probably just a waste of time.
I believe Linden Lab makes every effort to listen to user feedback. An issue is that the overwhelming majority of user feedback is noise, and your complaint might register as noise if it is not properly delivered.
When attending a User Group, you should probably hash out the argument among peers first, then have a spokesperson or a few spokespeople among your group deliver the feedback. The User Groups are very short, barely an hour, giving you mere minutes of their attention to make your point. Because of this, have your message be delivered by someone who can speak the Linden's language. Ideally, have it be delivered by a known quantity in those circles. For better or for worse, there are certain individuals whose feedback Linden Lab takes more seriously. If delivered effectively, especially regarding sim performance, the Server User Group should be a good starting point for change.
Even with the current architecture, which some deride as overly clunky, there are improvements to be made to the netcode, which may be especially beneficial for Drivers. Getting your message to the Lindens at the Server User Group is your best bet.
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Features from existing viewers I'd like to see everywhere
- Area Search
- Radar announcements for chat range, draw distance, region
- XML export for profiles, group descriptions, Area Search results
Features I have not seen anywhere
- Multiple camera save states
- Online cache purging
- Plugin environment for user defined functions to run (Lua, Python)
- Private communication between the viewer and the above plugins (not LSL bridge)
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47 minutes ago, Ksenia Elcano said:
What SL does best is porn and providing an outlet for jacking off. That is its niche and what has kept it alive all these years. If SL improved the virtual sex experience, the platform would attract more users.
While most users use SL exclusively for those reasons, it is a double-edged sword, as SL's porn angle has become an indelible black mark on the Platform. Going by numbers alone, SL had the best years when it was catering to education and business, despite businesses treating the Platform like vaporware. Either way, it does appear that a wholesome reputation drives or at least enables organic growth. Besides, the porn market is likely dried up at this point.
Back on topic: What Second Life does best is present an Open platform. This is a unique value proposition of the Platform that has not been replicated. The Second Life protocol is an Open standard, everything in SL is in theory extensible. Given enough expert eyes, users can (and have) contribute to core components of Second Life's netcode, Very recently, a prominent and respected user contributed an optimization to the protocol used for PBR. It is clear that with enough cooperation between users and Linden Lab, Second Life can improve infinitely. This level of openness makes Second Life legendary.
On top of that, Second Life offers a rich experience to each user if the user is willing to learn. SL hosts your scripts, which are like mini servers or maybe more like AWS Lambda resources. SL hosts all your prims, hosts mesh, textures, and other assets you upload to the Platform, all to provide a rich environment to bring a user's vision of interactive 3D creations to life. The Platform does this all at a very low cost to the resident, even providing decent income opportunities for the most ambitious content creators.
Furthermore, Second Life provides an rich 3D user experience where you feel like you are an interactive part of a whole. Part of why the compulsion to drive vehicles or sail boats is so strong in many users is a sense of immersion. Second Life is also a single world ; there are no instances in SL, unless we consider private sims instances. Any two avatars can meet on mainland if they traverse enough distance. If someone in Europe decides to log into SL, that person is using in the same world as someone logging in from California, and they can in fact meet as their avatars.
Therefore when you are traveling through the Second Life world, you are traveling among many other world travelers. It is beautiful, sometimes mystifying, and sometimes grotesque, but overall a very unique and compelling experience to wander through Second Life.
No other competing service provides any of this, and if Second Life ever dies, the way VC money behaves these days, there will never be another one.
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While I don't mean to contribute to a necroed post, I do tip generously. I use the following formula when determining tip payouts at clubs I frequent:
- I tip the DJ, but only if I enjoy the music. I am known in some circles as a generous tipper. If a DJ puts together a good mix, then that is worthy of monetary consideration.
- I rarely tip the venue, I assume they skim off the top of the DJ's tips. If I knew with certainty that the venue did not skim off the top, and the venue is an exceptional or interesting build, then I would consider tipping the venue. I do not consider the build quality of a place like Muddy's to be worth tipping, though.
- I never tip hosts, as I see hosts as a problem in SL. Hosts invite only their friends, crowding the venue with a predetermined, cliquish vibe. The worst part about going to clubs is enduring the regulars and hosts only exacerbate the problem. They also cheapen the welcoming atmosphere with their greeter scripts.
TL;DR - I tip DJ's, I rarely tip venues, I never tip anyone else because I do not consider standing around pressing the Greet button to be conducive to a fun and immersive Second Life.
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14 minutes ago, Persephone Emerald said:
These people would be so annoying to me or to most regular SL users, because we're used to a culture in which we more or less quietly do stuff, chatting in text & IMs most of the time, & only using voice in local when necessary to communicate with others who can't or don't know how to use text.
This is a problem in extant SL culture. Newcomers will not automatically participate in a culture that involves alternating between standing in place and shopping. When excited new users are unable to find other users with the same energy, they leave.
Strictly speaking, there is no problem with either having an introverted personality or indulging quietly in creative interests by oneself. However, it becomes a problem when common spaces begin to forbid outward social activity. I would argue that in fact, the existing culture drives away a majority of recently converted users. This can be most evidently witnessed in welcome hubs (particularly Firestorm Social Island) as well as high traffic lounges and entertainment venues.
The negative attitude that existing users who oversee these areas is at least a key factor that dissuades users from remaining on the platform. These issues include, but are not limited to,
- A no-fun-allowed mindset. Existing users consider enforcement of the rules a higher priority than the user experience. Helpers and Mentors seem to prefer a quiet environment, rather than an engaging one. This is off-putting to new users, who initially expect the platform to provide a social sense of excitement.
- Lack of administrative oversight. The initial starting areas are populated by older users and volunteer helpers, who do not always have the best interests of the Platform in mind. The Platform would appear more engaging if Linden Lab employees and contractors themselves would be present more often in an organic way, especially since the Platform is currently at a relatively small size in terms of population.
- An insular culture. The presence of many older users converts an area into a quiet one with little activity. Unless the recently on-boarded user signs up with a large group of friends, the user's experience will largely consist of standing around inactive users who appear like statues.
Overall, while this is one user's impression, after much surveying it seems consistent across the board among new users. Simply put, SL does not appeal to new users after disillusionment with the existing SL userbase sets in.
The new user demands at least the following,
- Highly active social environment. New users want other users to be engaging, whether it be through varied conversation or any of the supported modes of recreation that the Platform offers, including vehicle driving and games of chance.
- Voice communication. New users are more interested in connecting closely to the person behind the avatar than older users. Voice communication closes the distance between the virtual and the real; many users indicate that they feel closer to users who voice than those who only type.
- Content richness. New users demand interesting avatars and environments. These are sorely lacking at any introductory welcome area.
This is not a thorough enough analysis to yield any recommended action, not is it an exhaustive list of problems with SL that a newer user might encounter, but at the very least it strongly suggests that SL has a culture problem. Much of this problem is easily undone if the average SL user adopts a more open mindset. Once the average SL user sheds his or her negativity, the platform can become attractive to more users.
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1 minute ago, Codex Alpha said:
Most people I know value FPS, crispness and fast UI and experience, over graphics.
250 Million users on Roblox shows that PBR and 'high end' Unreal-driven graphics is NOT the prime concern. FPS and FUN and SOCIAL is.
I've also been on Sansar, which was fit for purpose to display PBR - and it did a pretty good job. Very pretty, but boring. Boring because nothing was interactive, the community very insular, and many creative tools tough for the average user to use.
Gameplay > Graphics.
Roblox and Second Life cater to vastly different audiences. In Second Life, there is a much stronger emphasis on fashion and avatar design than there is in Roblox, which caters to a much younger audience focused on building. In Second Life, therefore, much of the experience revolves around the visual aesthetics of the user's avatar and environment, making graphics inextricable from experience. Writing inequality expressions with a greater-than sign will not make this any less true. It is important to keep in mind that the average Second Life user enjoys an experience that primarily consists of standing around pretending everyone is looking at them, believing that they are having FUN and participating in a SOCIAL manner.
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1 minute ago, BriannaLovey said:
What is tw0 plus tw0 m1nus eighth? You don't seem human.
There are two possible solutions: either negative four (-4) or positive three-and-seven-eighths (3.875). This discrepancy arises from the ambiguity of the item "eighth" in the expression. It is unclear whether you intended "eighth" to be interpreted literally or whether it was an obfuscation of "eight." However, the former answer (-4) seems more likely given your intent to produce an expression that is easy for humans to evaluate but difficult for machines.
As a knowledge model residing in a biological organism, I can assure you I am indeed human.
To recap:
- It is most likely -4
- It could also be 3.875
If you have any more concerns or need more assistance with obfuscated arithmetic expressions, feel free to ask.
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I respectfully disagree with the premise of this post, almost entirely. While AI has demonstrated powerful generative capabilities, it has not yet satisfied the imagination in terms of richness in ideas and form. A simpler equivalent expression is that people are not reading AI books yet. AI imagery can be captivating but only when there is a human driving the illustrated themes. In essence, I believe the idea that generative models will become the dominant force in content creation is itself a fad, and that in the future will be regarded as a more elegant copy-and-paste operation.
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1 minute ago, Bree Giffen said:
The whole issue boils down to .... an image of a clothed child avatar in proximity to a nude adult avatar.
Anyone can create a fake image of that right now and use it in their SL mobile review. No amount of banning child avatars to a distant land will stop that. The OP need not worry about the absurd feedback post they linked.
This argument is questionable. While concerns about forged imagery are understandable, anti-obscenity and anti-CSAM laws target the creation and distribution of such content, not the possibility of its existence.
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Well, shipping PBR first then Vulkan later makes sense given Second Life's user growth situation. Even if moving to Vulkan after shipping PBR requires extra work, launching PBR first injects fresh visual appeal to attract new users and invigorates current users. On top of that, it sends a strong signal to the market that Second Life is an actively developed, modern platform. These are benefits that are more valuable now than later.
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Second Life needs PBR if it is to remain the dominant avatar-based social platform. Today, Second Life faces challenges with respect to user growth. Without PBR, converting new users might become more challenging. Users today seek immersive experiences with cutting-edge graphics, and compared to potential competitors, Second Life's visuals would feel outdated without PBR. It's important to acknowledge that Linden Lab operates with a financial objective of maintaining Second Life's profitability.
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I politely dissent against the majority opinion in this thread. I welcome the recent PBR changes, I think SL looks a lot better with PBR. SL21B in particular looks amazing.
If SL is supposed to be the premier metaverse experience, it should look good. PBR is a step in this direction. And I don't even have a supercomputer, yet the PBR viewer has been running well.
I'm genuinely concerned by the resistance to PBR's adoption, and I think it indicates that these forums are a poor source of actionable feedback for Linden Lab.
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Ban lines should not be allowed for waterfront or roadside parcels on mainland.
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Just now, Cristiano Midnight said:
I log into SL daily, and use it more now than I ever have. Not sure why you think that. My not posting a lot here doesn't mean I am not involved in SL.
I had misread your post about your absence from SL. Disregard my previous claim.
My point still stands. Forums do keep people connected to SL while they are away, but for the most part they are a detriment when they become the focus themselves. Second Life itself is perfectly capable of hosting general discussions and should be encouraged, not watered down.
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Just now, Cristiano Midnight said:
A significant portion of my users no longer use SL or rarely sign in. Hell, I was out of SL for 10 years after the experiences with crazy people escalated to a dangerous RL situation for me. Groups moved to Discord because of how unstable the group chat is in SL. Also, the communication tools in general are terrible for a social platform. Plus people use forums when they can't log in to still be able to connect and discuss. I think they add to the experience, not detract from them, whether it is forums, Discord, Reddit, etc..
You are a forum host yourself, and you hardly log into Second Life either. If anything you demonstrate exactly the issue with forums. They siphon away engagement, your experiences are nothing but examples of this.
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Forums are antithetical to Second Life.
If Second Life is the premier virtual world experience, then Second Life is supposed to be where you meet people, not on 2000s style forums. Instead, there should be forums in world, ideally styled as public squares, where general discussion topics are the focus. This would be an immersive in-world offering that would further differentiate Second Life from generic internet communication platforms (Discord, Twitter, etc).
As long as Second Life does not offer in-world forums and instead keeps these text based ones, it shows that their value proposition is not all they claim. Their continued hosting and support for the forums is, in my view, a signal that degrades their brand.
Forums are also a direct competitor to Second Life as a entertainment platform. Forum users post memes and share jokes and media here to entertain what seems to be a small circle of friends. It makes little sense that Linden Lab would be hosting a forum to entertain people to the detriment of Second Life. Such users can log in to Second Life to socialize instead, and so could the Moles and company Employees. When this is not the case, it suggests that the company is not dogfooding its product and that the company is on autopilot.
Worst yet, it signals that the company is struggling with user engagement metrics and needs as much SEO as it can get, to the peril of any contributor to these forums, whose words and ideas will continue to be scraped to train AI models with no consideration to any forum poster. Therefore, the existence of the forums cannot be good for either Linden Lab or its users.
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Many of these posts are shortsighted.
Mobile, from the perspective of the business, is nothing but upside. There is zero risk of driving away existing high value customers while increasing service availability to currently untapped markets.
First off, Linden Lab is not stupid and understands the shortcomings with mobile. One should expect the Mobile app to be more focused on avatar customization and shopping. I expect the Marketplace to be more tightly integrated with the SL client, and there is a possibility that the incumbent vendor platform, Casper, becomes integrated as well. That alone should drive growth, as avatar apps are very popular, and the extant content in SL (if carefully curated) looks fantastic compared to that of other platforms. Once users fall in love with their avatars, they will be strongly incented to try out the Desktop experience.
A benefit of the Mobile experience, even if limited, is that it forces Linden Lab to think hard about solving issues with the current platform architecture that would otherwise be seen as nitpicking. Therefore it is a good project for Linden Lab engineering, which has some highly talented engineers that may be underutilized or underappreciated. Currently, the platform is slow to load and requires large amounts of data to be transferred in order to render the full experience. The platform is also old in terms of graphics technology, although they have recently added PBR, a much welcome improvement. By giving their engineers a clever incentive, Linden Lab should be able to produce a more optimized Second Life experience on the Desktop. An effort to ship a Mobile experience is thus a driver for growth. I expect SL's netcode and architecture, even on the Desktop experience, to significantly improve.
These benefits do not stop at retrofitted improvements to the current platform. Once the platform is rearchitected for mobile, it should bring more ambitious development efforts, such as VR, closer or within reach, especially as VR experiences are sensitive to degradations in network latency and graphics performance.
Financially speaking, investing in a Mobile experience is mostly CapEx and little OpEx. This increases the valuation of Linden Lab even if the app generates minimal traction, and one would be shortsighted to believe anyone at the helm would say no to developing a Mobile experience.
From a marketing perspective, shipping a Mobile experience is a strong signal that the company backing Second Life is invested in the experience and should generate growth in MAU from simple organic search and WOM referrals. The fact that there is no current Mobile experience signals that Second Life is ancient tech. This may lead to decreased conversion as many choose to have their avatar experience on IMVU, which boasts a far larger userbase, but is actually the worse platform.
Furthermore, do not underestimate the importance of staying connected. Many people on Second Life live very rich virtual lives, and therefore want to stay connected with their friends. The connections that users make on this platform feel very real, and this seems to be a constant across all user segments, as even trolls end up forming lasting friendships on SL. That Linden Lab should ship a Mobile app should provide peace of mind to users who already use third-parties to connect to the grid, in terms of account security and user experience.
Long story short, Mobile will drive innovation, growth, and keep friends together. All for zero risk, because current customers can continue to use SL on the Desktop. It's either Win-Win or Win-Neutral. We should all be for this.
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SL is full of knowledge you only acquire by playing it.
- You need to wear some pre-mesh items and it's not immediately obvious that they don't matter entirely or at all. Eyebrows? Yes these control the shape of the eyebrow, sort of, but not the texture of the eyebrow on the mesh head.
- The inventory system itself is full of quirks, like Add versus Wear, which throw pretty much every new user. Experienced users will smugly chime in that you should be using Add not Wear to manage what you currently have on, and yet it is still not the default.
- Wearing up to 38 attachments as "outfits" is a different system compared to other games, where you equip items in pre-configured slots.
- The delay between attaching an object and seeing it render in world makes it a bit difficult to learn what is going on. Not everyone has a mental model of servers and latency. When an action is performed and the user gets no feedback from the interface, and has not been educated in how SL works, they will assume funny things and appear severely confused to the experienced user.
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Ban Lines - time to finally fix it?
in General Discussion Forum
Posted
Banlines should be removed altogether from mainland.
It is solipsistic and megalomaniacal to insist on ban lines when living on mainland. Do better and work to improve Second Life instead of turning your parcel into an obstacle.