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Found 16 results

  1. Sylvia Wasp

    Why does (some) mesh do this?

    OK, so I know it's verboten to say anything bad about creators here so I'm excising any information that could identify the creators involved but I have a serious question so I'm going to (carefully) ask it anyway. I'm trying to make clothes but I don't know blender so I buy full permission mesh and then try to texture it (an ongoing struggle, lol). I'm having trouble with some of the meshes and I don't know enough to know what it is. The picture kind of tells the whole story. What I've noticed is that some of the meshes seem to (at various sometimes random times), degrade into a very low detail version. All I can compare it to is back when we still used sculpties and they went through that tedious multi-level rezzing kind of thing where you had to wait for it to get more and more detailed. With the meshes though, it sometimes just refuses to go to the "most detailed" level at all. But then sometimes it does. The skirt in the picture (texture removed), often rezzes just fine, but then for days at a time it won't get any more detailed than you see in the picture. There seems to be no way to force it to rez properly and no way to tell when this will happen. Before anyone answers (hoping that they do), I will close off some obvious avenues: - I'm running a new-ish workstation class 8-core computer with dizzying computational power, dual graphics cards with 6GB of RAM each and 16GB of system RAM. - I run SL by itself, in a separate account on the computer so that there are no background processes etc. - I run with all the settings on Ultra, except I often turn off Ambient Occlusion, and I keep my particle count low because I don't actually care about particles - All my LOD sliders are at maximum (objects and sculpts at 4.00) except trees, because almost no one even uses Linden Trees anymore. - The picture was taken 1,000's of metres in the air, with no major scripts running and nothing that should slow things down. - The situation seems random, with the exception of the association with certain creators. Like, it's not that it happens under heavy load or whatever. On the negative side, despite it being one of the fastest computers you can buy, my computer *IS* a Mac, so the terrible, years old code-base that Second Life uses is an issue, but that issue doesn't as far as I know, affect mesh in any way. The chief downside of running a Mac seems to be just that Second Life graphics are about one third as fast as they would be on a similarly specced Windows box, and of course the dreaded "grass lag" is a big issue because of the alpha. For those that don't know, a grassy field will lag a Mac into the ground most of the time. OK ... So what I suspect is that the creator of this mesh (and this happens with a couple of other creators as well) has somehow "built-in" to the mesh a sort of LOD that can't be changed by the user. Does that make *any* sense? I've noticed that certain creators mesh will also disappear completely, or change back into a simple 2D plane, when you back away from them. This always happens at the same viewing distance, but that distance *differs* from creator to creator. Like creator A's stuff will vanish from your body if you zoom out to distance X, but creator B's stuff won't do that unless you zoom out TWICE as far. This seems very consistent from creator to creator. Is it possible for the creator to "build in" this sort of thing when making the mesh and is it possible for me, the owner of the mesh to alter it? thanks for any help, Sylvia
  2. Bloodsong Termagant

    LOD Models Voodoo

    okay, i was banging my head against this for THREE WEEKS... and i still haven't figured it out. so i have a couple of poll questions. A: Have you ever built a lower-LOD version of your model from scratch (and had it work/upload)? IE: for some reason you didn't take the full-res object and decimate it somehow or other to get the lower-res version. B: Does the SL mesh importer stretch the lower-LOD models so that their bounding box matches the full-res model's bounding box, the same way it stretches/squashes the physics model? tl;dr------------------------------------------------------- i made a simple cushion/beanbag chair, and then i built a really low-res physics model for it. (if i had been older and wiser, i would have had the foresight to just have saved the original box model i started with, but. oops.) the automatically generated lower res versions were... crappy. and had more triangles. 'i know!' i said, 'i'll use the physics model as the lowest res model!' but all i ever got was 'material is not a subset' errors. and yes, i worked through all the fixes on this page: http://www.pader.world/fixing-errors-on-mesh-upload.html i took the physics model and i put the three materials of my object on it. my 'object' was also technically TWO objects in a linkset. (one with 2 materials, 1 with 1 material.) so i divided off the 3rd material's faces into a separate object, also. this is where i got the weird result of this square, which was supposed to be the flat bottom of the mesh, ending up as a diagonal plane through the seat of the chair. (leading me to suspect some bounding box thing was going on, though i could not find any reference to that, anywhere.) since i can't get, by hook or by crook or by ImportLegacyMatching, this thing to recognize my other model's materials as a 'subset' of the original model's materials (yes, the same exact materials, no .001s)... i'm starting to wonder if the actual VERTICES need to be... i dunno, actual vertices that were in the original model somehow. :/ OR... maybe it can just never work on two separate objects uploaded as a single mesh thing? looking for clues, so that's why i'm asking those with more experience in mesh than me.
  3. With all of the talk lately about how any effort to get content creators to optimize their work might "force content creators out of SL" I thought I'd make some tutorials showing just how easy optimization can be. So for this first tutorial, I'm tackling LOD. Here is the link to the tutorial. I hope you find this information useful.
  4. ChinRey

    Building lessons

    I have some time to spare the next few months so I'm able to offer private lessons to those who want to improve their technical skills in Second Life building. I'm happy to help you with your build in any way I can but my main speciality is the technical aspect of content creation, particularly: For mesh: LoD (Level of Detail): How to make good LoD models without sky high land impact Physics: How to make efficient, low LI physics models Land Impact: Reduce the LI, not the quality! Mesh landscaping: How to make low LI walkable ground mesh or surround landscapes. Either from scratch in Blender or by cleaning up JVTEK or prim-to-mesh converter meshes How to clean up in Blender meshes created by Mesh Studio, Mesh Generator or Firestorm's/Singularity's mesh export function. For textures: How to make alpha cutout textures with paint.net. (Warning: creating alpha cutout textures is not for the impatient!) Filter Forge beyond the factory presets. The basics of modifying and creating your own Filter Forge filters. I know my limitations and do not teach fitted mesh - sorry. For most of the mesh lessons you need some basic knowledge of either Blender or Mesh Studio/Mesh Generator and although I can give generic lessons, they will be far more effective if you have your own project we can work on. Practical details: Each lessons lasts between 45 minutes and one hour. Lessons are in English and text, not voice. I do not have voice enabled and you want to keep a written log of it anyway. Time by appointment. I live in Western Europe and I am usually available during regular waking hours in that time zone - between about 1 AM and 6 PM SL time - but I may be able to schedule lessons at other times of day too. Price, 4,000 L$ per lesson - half in advance. The advance payment is refunded if you cancel 24 hours or more before the appointed time. After that it is not refundable but I will try to reschedule if you contact me before the lesson is supposed to begin. Make sure you get the time zones right so you can be there on time. Apointment times are always SLT. If I have to cancel, you will get the choice between a full refund or a rescheduled lesson at half the price. If we have to cancel becasue of technical problems neither of us are responsible for, you get a choice between a refund or a reschedule. Ideally the lessons should be held on the beta grid so you can do test uploads without having to pay for them. But we can do it on the main grid if neccessary, either in my workshop or at your place. (I will probably need rezzing rights at the location during the lesson.) Payment is of course on the main grid, not on beta. You may bring a friend or two as observer(s) if you want to and let me know in advance. Give me as much details as possible about your project in advance. The more info I have, the better I'll be able to help you. For more info or to make an appointment, send me a private message on the forum or an IM in-world to ChinRey Resident. I will usually respond within 24 hours but on rare occasions it make take a little bit longer.
  5. animats

    Mesh level of detail at Uber

    I'm at the "Uber" monthly show, where mesh designers show off their work. This is the good stuff? Here I'm viewing a building at the lowest level of detail. It's a collection of random triangles. This is a close-up view of what it would look like at distance. Looking around Uber, almost every non-clothing item is like that. Buildings, furniture, and vehicles all half-disappear at the lowest level of detail. This is a show; it's supposed to be the good stuff. What's going wrong? I took a look at the code in Firestorm that uploads meshes and generates low-LOD meshes. It's not doing anything that evaluates how good it will look visually. There's no code for selecting triangles based on size, or being in the interior of a patch It's just discarding triangles arbitrarily. This is probably the source of most really bad low-LOD meshes, since it's the default if you don't do anything by hand. (The code is in LLModelPreview::genLODs of llfloatermodelpreview.cpp, if you want to look it at. If you read C++, you will wince.) A smarter algorithm there, coupled with not boosting level of detail levels so much, would improve SL's viewability and speed.Not an easy fix. Open source code exists for better mesh reduction. Not something that could be dropped in, but something to look at. For the really low level of detail, where the triangle count is around 12 or even less, impostors are the only way. Decimating down that far just makes a mess.It would be a big job, and the code is messy, but most of the pieces of code needed to do this during mesh upload are already is in Firestorm and the LL viewer. The viewer generates a preview of the mesh to be uploaded and shows it in the upload dialog floater. It can render meshes that have not yet been uploaded to SL. That code could be reused to generate images of the object from various angles during upload. Then, those images could be pasted on a box or cross mesh to create a simple textured impostor. You'd see distant objects as solids with low-detail texture, instead of a collection of random triangles. The user would get to see the preview during upload, and could tweak the parameters so it looked OK. Perhaps LL will look at this as part of Project Arctan. Now the really ambitious, but effective, thing to do would be to do this server side on existing content. Have some server quietly going through existing mesh objects with crappy low-LOD models and generating better ones. Probably would speed up SL considerably.
  6. Fionalein

    Good LOD bike

    hello, Forum folks I'm counting your collective swarm knowledge to help me. I am still looking for a bike with good enough LOD to stay a bike at full draw distance (usually they loose tires long before at default LOD weight settings). I'm OK when they turn octagons at LOD level 4 but at least retain the tires. Come on, car designers, even plane designers manage to do it. Why are bikes only fully visible if the are close enough to lick them? There must be at least one decent bike designer out there, right? I would be happy if you could point some out to me, if not I'll stay happily with my LOD-stable bicycle =^.^= . Thanks in advance, Fio
  7. Here's a potential feature for the viewer. At present, if a sim has to be displayed, but it's outside the draw distance, it displays as water. That always looks strange. A first step would be to display the texture from the world map. That lets you see roughly what's out there. But that's flat. So a second step would be to use the ground elevation data (which is only 64x64 for an entire sim) and texture the world map onto that. Then you could see mountains in the distance. Much like Google Earth at low level of detail. Then, when you were flying a plane, you'd be able to see the airport and runway. You could see for miles. Like looking at the world map, but in perspective and relief. The world would feel bigger. This could be done entirely in Firestorm, without any help from Linden Labs.
  8. animats

    LOD fail of the week

    Level of detail fail of the week. Elaborate vault door to hide what's inside. Back off a little, and you can see into the vault. Back off a bit more and the whole vault door and frame disappear. This is why blindly using "Decimate Triangle" in Blender to create lower level of detail models with very small numbers of triangles is a big mistake. (This vault is for sale on Marketplace for L$3,990.)
  9. One of the best ways to tell if content has not been optimised for Second Life is when the creator puts a notecard in the product telling you to ramp up the debug settings. It was common practice, when Sculpties were dominant, to increase the "Object details" setting in prefs or even go directly to the debug setting RenderVolumeLODFactor. This was because, for the most part, the creator had little or no control over the lower LODs (not without sacrificing vertices in the High LOD at least) and it was horrible to walk along the streets and watch the building collapse into heaps of triangles. With mesh, this changed. One of the biggest advantages of Mesh over its sculptie cousin was that the creator has full control over the LOD models. Good content creators focus on providing an object that looks nice to the majority of users, over the expected normal set of viewing conditions. Yet still, we see a lot of cases where (often beautiful looking) content is tossed into SL without a second thought for the LOD behaviour and rather than fixing the content the creator tells the user that they should change their settings "to view it properly". This is simply bad advice, and in following it you are making your machine work harder than it needs to simply to compensate for one creator's inappropriate design. Because of changes in the forthcoming release of Firestorm that intend to discourage this behaviour I wrote a blog post that I hope manages to explain things in an accessible, non-techie way. For LOD's sake, Stop! - Why bad advice may be slowing you down. I hope it helps to explain the terminology and persuade people that the time to get more selective about your purchases is now. There are new features on the way in 2018 (such as animesh) that will enhance our Second Life experience but these will expect our computers to do more work and any effort our hardware wastes on poorly optimised creations will be effort it cannot use on other things. Beq
  10. Hello I'm trying to import a fairly small mesh. The hi-res version looks good but my next LOD down says I have a load more verts than it should.. To make the medium LOD all I did was delete some edge loops, checked for isolated verticies then exported. 3ds max says there are 163 the importer says 563. I understand the vert count wont be exactly the same because of the uv map but I have no idea why there are way more verts than the original high res mesh.. Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Thanks for reading.
  11. Ivanova Shostakovich

    LOD models' relative position in space.

    When I create my LOD models for something, do they all have to be in the same position in the 3d space of my modeling program when I export them? I'm assuming, at this time, that they all snap to the same position when they are specified, like a physics model. Is this the case?
  12. Sunbleached

    Mesh upload. Huge vs normal models

    Hello! Does it make sense to upload huge mesh models but with a low LOD, so that later, by shrinking, them to get a model of higher quality? Or is it better to load the usual but with high LOD? Thank you!
  13. Devriv

    LODs affecting physics complexity?!

    Hello Everyone. I have a small shelter with triangle/plane physics (no analyze). When I upload it using my own LOD models, rez it, and check the physics under render metadata, the physics model is yellowish in colour. The same model, with the same no analyze plane physics model, uploaded without its lower LODs, using the uploader’s own lower LOD defaults, displays the physics in Blue! I don’t know why. I don’t believe it’s relevant but my LODs models have all the exact same dimensions, and that’s the only possible factor that occurred to me was causing this difference in the display of physics complexity. I've left both models here in this sandbox: secondlife://Aditi/secondlife/Mesh%20Sandbox%203/13/8/23
  14. anna2358

    Lower LOD for Linksets?

    My other half and I are building a very complicated house at our parcel in Ogilvie. It is an SL model of a real building, and we are making it together, so in the end the High LOD version will be a linkset of some of my Meshes made in Blender, and some of hers made in world of prim, and converted to mesh using this mesh converter. Now I understand (a little about) how to make lower LOD meshes in Blender, and I guess she can make simplified prim-mesh things too. This is how we plan to make the medium-LOD versions. However, doing it this way means that we will always have the same number of items in the linkset as the LOD or view distance changes. Is it possible to make a lower LOD model to replace a Linkset at distance? I'm actually thinking that at long distance a solid 2-prim block would suffice. And, yes, I may be out of my mind (making things for SL does that). Anna
  15. buubbleguum Emerald

    Mesh LOD distortion problem

    I have created an entire rigged outfit using blender. I have created different LODs for this outfit which are mostly working fine except for the top. When I zoom out it is severely distorted. I'm confused as to what is wrong as I have made the top in several sizes and only 2 of the sizes seem to be distorting, the rest look fine. Here is a screenshot.
  16. Ryker Silvercloud

    Mesh and LOD

    Hello I have a problem with mesh objects that keeps bothering me - as maker and shopper as well - and it seems like a mysterious the more I focus on it. I`ll try to demonstrate the problem through a series of pictures. All snapshots were taken at LOD 4. Image #1 Here you have a couch I`ve made in Blender and uploaded to SL. The base frame and cushions are 2 objects exported unjoined as a linkset dae. The two throw pillows are 2 meshes saved and uploaded as 1 object. I did not custom made any LOD models. The lowest LOD was set to zero and physics set to lowest. As you can see it holds it shape across the sandbox at Mauve. Image #2 Panel #1 Here you have the same couch. I`ve added a chair, a coffee table and a rug. The grid is made by 10x10 meters unlinked prims (not mesh). I am standing about 20 meters away from the seating group. Notice the brick wall to the right. (The coffee table has actually dropped down to the medium level at this distance. It`s only to be expected and tells me that the LODs are behaving correctly at this state.) Panel #2 I walk over behind the brick wall. Panel #3 Here I step out from behind the wall and walk up to the same place where I started. Now the cushions and the throw pillows have dropped to the lowest LOD depsite I have returned to the same state as in panel #1. I did not touch the camera during this exercise. The cushion and pillows will stay like this as long I stand still - like stuck at the lowest level - however, and here comes the mystery, I can trigger the LODs to switch to a higher level by either walking forwards or backwards - even pulling my camera back ! Panel #4 In the last panel I`ve pulled the camera back to upgrade the LOD and now the couch looks right - but notice the camera is farther away than in panel #3 . That`s the thing I don`t understand. I see this issue in my own mesh builds - foremost cushions and pillows - but now and then I see the same thing occure at other home furnishing stores around SL. I use the LL Viewer (see details at the bottom) and have experimented with different settings but nothing seems to help. Nor does the issue seem to depend on how I set my LOD factor. The same problem occurs at LOD 2, LOD 4 and even LOD 6 Last week I started to read back on almost anything I could find about the mesh uploader and LOD in this forum. Depsite I have gained a lot of other useful information on how to optimze my mesh I haven`t found any explanation to this specific problem. To be exact: 1. What happened to the couch while I was behind that wall ? 2. How come the the cushions won't upgrade when I walk up to exact the same place as where I started ? 3. How come you can trigger the LOD to switch to a higher level by walking backwards or simple pulling your camera back ? I greatly appreciate any suggestion on this problem. Thank you for reading my post =============== Details: I use the SL Viewer version 5.0.4.325124 Internet Speed Test: Download 85.7 Mbit / Upload 47,62 Mbit Draw distance: 128m Bandwidth: 500kbit/s LOD factor: 4 Render quality: 2 / 7 Advanced Lighting Model: Disabled Computer: CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4700HQ CPU @ 2.40GHz (2394.45 MHz) Memory: 12172 MB OS Version: Microsoft Windows 8 64-bit (Build 9200) compatibility mode. real ver: 10.0 (Build 10586) Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation Graphics Card: GeForce GT 750M/PCIe/SSE2 Info Couch Image #1 Image #2
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