Alright, so I have a question (pls don't hurt me)

[Zion Ravenhurst]

Yo! So I'm genuinly curious about something. There's still a lot of people who prefer to use the classic LL body and its "painted on" textures unironically when they have more than enough lindys to upgrade. I'm just wondering what people see in it. Personally I think it's terrible and the first thing I did when I had the lindens for it was move on to a mesh body. I feel like I've triggered everyone who still uses it but I'm just wondering. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[VaelFaye]

The "painted on" textures come in handy when you suddenly get the urge to wear five sweaters all at the same time.

 

...What? I get cold. :matte-motes-shocked:

[Freya Mokusei]

I wear mesh clothes (about half the time), have mesh hair (took me a couple years though!), but keep my system body. For context, I usually don't change my 'base' very often - same face, same hair, same identifiable marks - and I'm often complimented on my distinctive appearance.

Lots of reasons, not the least of which is the size of my non-mesh wardrobe and my custom-painted skin (+ tattoo layers), and the ability to adjust my shape (incl. alpha, body physics, tattoos, cyborg implants) just using RLV folders. I can also make the clothes/alpha layers/tattoos myself without any hassle* (HUDs, amateur scripts, appliers) or modelling. My avatar has spent a really really long time lookin' good already, using a generic mesh* or piling a tonne of time* into trying to do the same thing using more tris* and stacks of appliers* isn't practical or efficient. I'd have to figure out a lot of not-very-practical-skills* just to make my own bodyparts look the same as they do now and I'd lose functionality ('cause just about every part is scripted or RLV-accessible).

No shade on the folks that choose something else, but I'm pretty happy with how things look right now. If I wasn't, I would look at alternatives - like I did with my hair.

Hope that helps.

*Subjectively. I'm sure some folks, some products, could reduce the hassle and some of the skills might be useful sometime eventually but I've got stuff to do with my life.

[Amethyst Jetaime]

The short answer for many is simplicity.  While many want to look as good as they can, what they do in SL is more important to them then spending time messing with mesh.

They don't want to use HUD's to alpha out small portions at one time to wear mesh clothes or have to mess with appliers.  Some bodies require special mesh clothes made for their body so selection is limited for those bodies.

Since so many appliers come with legacy avatar layers and so many creators are producing them, legacy avatars have a wide range of fashionable clothing to choose from.  I wear a mesh body and I'm not a fan of clothing appliers.  They really are a step backward IMO to just wearing the, as you put it, 'painted on' clothing.  I'll only buy appliers for tats, makeup, and occasional pieces to wear under mesh clothes such as a lace top.

I kind of agree with the people you are posting about, some days .  Mesh bodies and clothing is a bigger hassle to wear. Before mesh, I might change several times a day on a whim, because I could change in less than five seconds once I was past the newb stage. Now I find myself changing far less and even wear the same clothes more than one day, unless I really have to change for some reason.

I've heard people who have been around since before mesh complain that people who wear mesh bodies and heads all look alike.  It's true to a degree because so many buy bodies and heads and just wear the skin supplied with them, so they do look like thousands of others.  I don't wear a mesh head since you can't change it much.  I also look unique because I don't wear the shape that came with my body and no one else has my shape since I made it.

[Sassy Romano]

Pretty much the same as what Freya said. Plus I associate "me" with my avatars appearance and changing that to some other stock standard mesh would no longer be me.

 

Then factor in that I have my exact shape in blender and can make mesh clothes that fit me perfectly. Contrast that with the restrictive practices of most mesh body creators, some of which won't make the body dev kit available and I have no time or inclination to buy into a closed technology solution based on limited supply and a no mod item that cuts off my creativity.

 

Others may prefer to have their options entirely dictated.

[Conifer Dada]

System shapes look fine if they're properly crafted with nice skins.  Also for tight-fitting clothes, painted on look fine too.  Mesh is great for shoes, loose clothing including skirts and dresses and for hair.  

It's true that mesh is better for fine detatiling and smoother joints, but so many mesh bodies, presumably ones that are adjustable, have totally unrealistic shapes.  That's probably down to the owners, not the creators.

Also, mesh bodies take ages to rez, and then applier textures take even longer and often don't rez fully at all.

I'm waiting for an upgrade to  the system shape. That would be great - better hands and feet, more polygons smoother joint articulation.   

The types of unrealistic shape crazes in SL have changed.  When I joined, before mesh or sculpts, it was the 7ft Barbie look, with long thin legs and also a race of 8ft shirtless bald men witn short and impossibly muscular arms.  Then along came those sulking little pear-shaped sourpuss avatars, usually dressed in grey, that frequented house music clubs in particular.  Now there seems to be a craze for female avatars with normal realistic proportions from the waist up but with huge tree-trunk legs and butt!

Anyway, at busy clubs 50% of mesh avatars appear as jelly dolls to me because that's how I've set my graphics !!!

[CassieMaia]

I just haven't come across any compelling reason to buy a mesh body. I do have Slink hands and feet for my main account avi.  I have found several skins that I like the look of on my system body. I like being able to wear either mesh clothing or system clothing (or sometimes a combination of both) and I like being able to easily and quickly change outfits without having to worry about appliers, etc. I'm not a fashionista in RL and don't feel any need to be a fashionista in SL.  So, basically, I've found looks that I like and that feel comfortable for me, and don't want the extra complications/steps/inventory clothing changes that come along with having a mesh body.  <shrugs>

[Zion Ravenhurst]

All of these are pretty good points, actually!

[Teagan Tobias]

I can't say I haven't looked at the mesh bodies, I have three DEMO's that I looked at for weeks. But with 65K inventory, a lot of it mesh clothing, and none that will fit the mesh bodies I've demo'ed I decided to keep my classic body and let others spend money on the mesh bodies. One reason is my finances are limited and it would take a 100% reboot to go to a mesh body, that is just not going to happen.
I am rather fastidious dressing and my classic avi can't be to bad, I have been asked to model and asked to be a host, not sure that means anything, but I felt good thinking it did as I politely said no.
Another thing is the work involved with the mesh bodies, wow what a chore just to get dressed, unless the demo has nothing to do with the product I am assuming it would be the same if I switched to a mesh body. And my Slink “Size” shoe collection, not spending as much as slink is asking for feet but there are other feet that the shoes fit, and a lot of mesh bodies you can't use them with.
But the biggest problem with the mesh bodies is for the creators, instead of getting a dress in 5 Standard Sizes, now its sizes for each body, Standard Size, Fit Mesh Sizes (the biggest ugly mess ever on SL).
But I have found I can wear the mesh that fits some of the mesh bodies (not often), remember to try all the sizes on from the demo because some of them not intended for the classic body do fit.
And last but in no way the least is that I keep my clothes on, so some of the aspects that make the mesh bodies so appealing to some people do me no good at all. If I'm going to cover it with clothing, why spend thousands of Lindens on a mesh body.

[Rhonda Pinion]

About 9 years of getting Rho to look like she does - and about 40000 outfits in her inventory. (Ok. Admittedly, it would help clear my inventory some, but I happen to like most of her stuff...)

Yes, there are times when taking pics that a mesh body may be easier to work with, but I still like her.

The only thing I have splurged on for her are Slink feet. Mainly for stockings - and not having to deal with those attrocious system feet if I want to wear any. LOL

[Kelli May]

If your question is purely about those still using system bodies and system layers, then I suppose most of the points have been made. People identify with that avatar they've had for years, they want a very low render cost, they've got a lot of system outfits they like - that kind of thing.

The other variation is to use the system body with mesh clothes, like the current (and previous set) of starter avs. I can understand why people would do this, too. If you work around the obvious defects of the system body, you can look very good with mesh clothes. The more your clothes cover, the less of the system body you have to worry about. It's possible to get most  of the benefits of a mesh body without actually owning one

[Penny Patton]

I use a mesh body myself, but I agree with what a lot of the others are saying. If you want access to the widest variety of clothes and customization options, there's no competition for the system body.

Mesh bodies all have a limited selection of compatible clothing (some have more than others, but even the body with the most clothing options has nothing compared to the system body) and in addition, most mesh bodies are no-mod, restricting you even further. As good as the mesh heads/bodies look, everyone wearing them looks more or less the same, or at least cut from the same cloth, because of that lack of customizability.

 The system body is also easier to work with. Every mesh body has its own quirks and issues that need to be figured out and worked around, compared to that system bodies are no-fuss.

But you're right, the system body is showing its age and was always flawed even from the beginning. I really wish LL had chosen to update it rather telling us all to move on to mesh bodies.

[Teagan Tobias]

Penny said:

But you're right, the system body is showing its age and was always flawed even from the beginning. I really wish LL had chosen to update it rather telling us all to move on to mesh bodies.

 

LOL, I'm always the last one to get the message, but, LL said or implied that we should all get mesh bodies? Because I've tried and its just not going to happen, mesh bodies are way to much work and way, way, way to expensive, now what? Where did they say this, I'm sure it was not meaning that we will lose our system bodies, but I'm curious.

[Pixieplumb Flanagan]

I think it was somewhat implied with the mesh starter avatars introduced a while ago, since superceded by better classic avatars with mesh clothing/hairs/accessories, but still in our library folder.

As we all have to wear a shape, skin, eyes and hair/bald cap/ eyebrow shaper, even when none of these are visible, there is no danger of LL removing our system bodies.

There will continue to be a market for classic texture clothing alongside standard size mesh for as long as SL lasts, probably.  Whilst I do use a mesh body, and I do think appliers look better than texture layers, it would be foolish not to supply both to our customers, especially since in the huge majority of cases it is the identical texture and it takes only moments to make texture clothing pieces.

[Penny Patton]

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Teagan Tobias wrote:

LOL, I'm always the last one to get the message, but, LL said or implied that we should all get mesh bodies? Because I've tried and its just not going to happen, mesh bodies are way to much work and way, way, way to expensive, now what? Where did they say this, I'm sure it was not meaning that we will lose our system bodies, but I'm curious.

---

Back when mesh was still on the horizon there where a lot of people questioning LL on when we might see an update to the default mesh, especially since the uploaded mesh content was going to look so much better than the outdated and badly made default avatar that it would create an uncanny contrast.

The Lindens of the time replied that they had no intention of updating the default mesh body and justified the position by stating resident made mesh bodies would fill that need.

 Of course a lot of us who know how these things actually work knew the problems this approach would create and when mesh was released and no updated avatar was forthcoming, those problems did indeed all come to pass, leaving us still wanting an updated standard avatar.

 LL really needs to hire someone with experience in the field as an art director so they stop making these agonizingly avoidable mistakes.

[Codex Alpha]

Frankly I have found few mesh clothing that doesn't simply make me look frumpy, or that I'm wearing a hand-me down.

I've bought some nice jackets and pants and stuff, but don't wear them because in the end they look oversized and stiff when compared to my outdated (but sleek) avatar-based clothing designs.

I'm still wearing "Average Male Shape" default from the day I joined SL. Perhaps it is not me who is outdated but designers who need to rig or design better fitting mesh wear for me

[FameSaka]

i like this:matte-motes-wink: