Review Etiquette: Always Remove Stars For Features You Wish It Had

[Codex Alpha]

Remember, when reviewing a product on the marketplace, ensure that you remove stars because

1) it didn't have the permissions you wanted (but you bought it anyway)

2) you thought you could edit it, copy it or resell it (but you bought it anyway)

3) it didn't come in the color you wanted, or wasn't available in pink (but you bought it anyway)

4) the seller didn't get back to you about your questions on the product within 5 minutes (but you bought it anyway)

5) the product didn't have any animations in it (but you bought it anyway)

6) the textures are not as clear 'as you would like" (whatever that means, but you bought it anyway)

7) you can't read, and therefore don't understand what the product includes or not includes (but you bought it anyway)

8) you have buyer's remorse, so use the review system to gain leverage for a refund

After all, this is a valid use of the review process. It isn't about how and why you rated the product, but more about your emotional response, ie., 'frustration' and 'disappointment' (both of which sound pretty whiney and self-entitled).

I am still learning about all this, and realize that my good intentions are seldom appreciated. Sometimes I include free gifts in my product packages - and THEY are the cause of lower reviews, so perhaps I should discontinue such generosity.

If I include features that are difficult for newer users to use, even with explicit instructions, and repeated messages inworld whenever you rez/touch/operate an item, this can result in claims "product does not work".

Of course, I don't get contacted inworld for the most part about any of this, no requests for help, no questions or requests. Instead I will get the review sections being used to express this instead.

Bonus Tip: If the creator/seller meets your needs, wipes your tears away for your 20 cent investment, never ever thank them at all. Also, do not revise your review to reflect the changes - leave it up in perpetuity. (Disclaimer: There are a lot of polite customers out there, you know who you are, but you are a rarity, but appreciated)

The point is, amongst other changes to SL and the MP that I have suggested in my time here, the review system needs another look at. Changing to a simple LIKE/DISLIKE system would require customers to commit to one or the other, and to also back up their statements. Much like YouTube and other sites, there is no context to a 2-4 star rating, because it is rarely provided - nor can someone understand the thought process of the reviewer. In the rare event that I review a product myself (I hate giving any less than 5 stars) - if I do, I will always give context to why, and make it relevant.

"I would rate this 5 stars but it doesn't have copy/mod permissions" is hardly a valid review.. or is it? It's all opinion. Do you mean you purchased the product just to come back and remove stars because it didn't have features you wanted?

Changing the review system would also cut down on flag reports for seemingly 'questionable' reviews that simply do not have an appropriate category to flag for.  What is 'inappropriate content->Off Topic" mean anyway? Did they talk about hockey or some movie? Where is the keyword "irrelevant" instead?

I've got a thick skin, but sometimes this attitude bums me out. I'm coming out with some really innovative products soon, and spending a lot of time learning and refining - the last thing I want to see is some crap review because my product didn't include the banana dance in it... Huh? Where did I advertise it was supposed to have banana dance?

[Pamela Galli]

Somebody sure changed his tune.

[Alwin Alcott]

like nobody can review without this manual....

[Theresa Tennyson]

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entity0x wrote:

 

"I would rate this 5 stars but it doesn't have copy/mod permissions" is hardly a valid review.. or is it? It's all opinion. Do you mean you purchased the product just to come back and remove stars because it didn't have features you wanted?

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You seem to think that if you make the decision to buy something your review should default to five stars. This isn't always the case. Sometimes you'll buy something that the description says isn't exactly what you need, but it you buy it because there isn't a better alternative.

Is it fair to give an item one star because it doesn't have a certain feature and that lack was clearly noted in the description? No, because the expectation is you won't buy an item that you'd consider a one-star item before you'd buy it. However, how is it unfair to say that an item isn't five stars of perfection when it isn't, even though you already knew that when you bought it? The purpose of a review is to give information to other shoppers and the maker. If it could be better, why give it five stars?

[Codex Alpha]

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Alwin Alcott wrote:

like nobody can review without this manual....

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It's sarcasm. Comprehension issues?

 

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Pamela Galli wrote:

Somebody sure changed his tune.

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Not at all. Anytime I have left a review I have always supported why I gave it the stars I did.

You don't review a movie and then give it less stars because "Robert Deniro wasn't in this film.  I would have given 5 stars but the director didn't include Deniro"

I also suggested (assuming you read it all before responding), that simply making the marketplace review section LIKE or DISLIKE might be better, as well as adding more specific options to flag errant reviews, such as "outdated due to updates"

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:

You seem to think that if you make the decision to buy something your review should default to five stars. This isn't always the case. Sometimes you'll buy something that the description says isn't exactly what you need, but it you buy it because there isn't a better alternative.

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So by your logic, you would like to see the color Pink on the product, but you bought anyway... then you return and use the review to give it 1 less star or 2 because it didn't come in pink?

If you like the product, and it has some shortcoming that you would like to see, or if you didn't understand something, shouldn't you contact the seller/creator then and see what is possible?

I'm not expecting 5 stars on everything.. 5 stars is unrealistic as it means PERFECT, and nothing is perfect, everything can be improved... But how you rate something should be provided with context - and you don't punish the creator because the product doesn't come in Pink, and you think it should come in pink.. so one less star..

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:

Is it fair to give an item one star because it doesn't have a certain feature and that lack was clearly noted in the description? No, because the expectation is you won't buy an item that you'd consider a one-star item before you'd buy it.

The purpose of a review is to give information to other shoppers and the maker. If it could be better, why give it five stars?

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Even though you set it up to disagree, we agree on these points, since that's the point I'm making.

"I would give this sofa set 5 stars, but I took 1 star off because it wasn't in pink, another cuz of no copy/mod, and another because it doesn't include 20 sitting animations that I would like"

[Callum Meriman]

That original post is actually very good, and something I understand more and more each day.

People don't realise how much time and care is put into a product, not just the design work, but all else including the unread manuals, the packaging and double checking, the photos, the marketplace process itself.

And then the support for gormless idiots who usually IM wanting their answer whilst you are doing something important. The answer being the first in the manual.

It's disheartning to get that one star review because "The item isn't in my inventory"

[Rya Nitely]

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entity0x wrote:

Sometimes I include free gifts in my product packages - and THEY are the cause of lower reviews, so perhaps I should discontinue such generosity.

 

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This is the reason I stopped giving freebies. In my mind a freebie is a gift. You have now been around long enough to understand how it feels to get a one star review for the freebie that you gave out of generosity, as a gift. You have changed your tune, but let us not argue about what you said then, and now.

I agree with your post. Welcome to our world.

 

[Codex Alpha]

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Callum Meriman wrote:

That original post is actually very good, and something I understand more and more each day.

People don't realise how much time and care is put into a product, not just the design work, but all else including the unread manuals, the packaging and double checking, the photos, the marketplace process itself.

And then the support for gormless idiots who usually IM wanting their answer whilst you are doing something important. The answer being the first in the manual.

It's disheartning to get that one star review because "The item isn't in my inventory"

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Yes, over the long term, this kind of thing can take away someone's drive to create cool things for them

Of course, the customer, who had no real issue to complain about features that were never advertised to start with, still got everything they wanted with an update I made out of good faith.

Did the two missing stars taken away due to missing features get returned, along with a glowing review on customer service? Nope.. not even a thanks in a pm.

This is what self-entitlement looks like, I guess. My only solace is that the product has improved anyway, I guess. All feedback can still be used for improving.

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Rya Nitely wrote:

This is the reason I stopped giving freebies. In my mind a freebie is a gift. You have now been around long enough to understand how it feels to get a one star review for the freebie that you gave out of generosity, as a gift. You have changed your tune, but let us not argue about what you said then, and now.

I agree with your post. Welcome to our world.

 

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No, I haven't changed my tune that freebies can be reviewed as well. My beef is not with reviews and constructive feedback,but rather with misuse of the review section.A few scumbags aren't going to stop me from giving gifts to SL'ers.. Hell I loved and appreciated gifts and $0 items when I started - I'm giving it back.

I also stand by my statements that freebies should be the same quality as paid products - since is represents us as creators. Freebies are not only gifts, but let's face it, it is an advertiser, and a 'loss-leader' to other products - so it better be good quality too.

I'm more posting about the annoyance of a rash of reviews post relating to what is not there. You don't give a restaurant less stars because "It didn't provide chicken soup on the menu - If you had chicken soup I'd give you full marks", what is up with that strangeness.

Every review can become a 5 star, if the seller meets and exceeds the issues you had with it. But as we see from Angie's List, to Yelp to Steam and other online reviews, people tend to leave negative and uninformed reviews long before they give constructive ones.

Don't get pissed off at me though - I give you 3 out of 5, I'll tell you why, then come back and give you 5 if possible.

[shaniqua Sahara]

i find a lot of what is on your list is because the seller made it confusing, vague or misleading as well as showing misleading images.

most are great at hyping it but not so interested in making things clear and concise.

[shaniqua Sahara]

we're all customers so basically you're just saying people suck...........or is it just your customers?

[Artorius Constantine]

Just last week my Roaming Falconer NPC got 1 starred because "...It's a Joke ... it is all linked".

Well yeah, what good would it be if it wasn't linked?

You want 15 prims as a coalesced object? I don't get it.

I think they just wanted the bird but didn't bother to read the first 2 lines of the listing, or the Title, or the rest of the listing, or look at any of the several pictures, or contact me before 1 starring a perfectly good NPC that is exactly what it says it is.

Not sure why "it''s a joke", but what the hey. I just left a nicely worded reply about reading the listing and hope people read it. and yes, I see the irony in that.

[Pamela Galli]

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shaniqua Sahara wrote:

i find a lot of what is on your list is because the seller made it confusing, vague or misleading as well as showing misleading images.

most are great at hyping it but not so interested in making things clear and concise.

---

Baloney. Some may be derelict, but you have no basis for asserting that most are. 

[shaniqua Sahara]

ok maybe not most, but a good amount.

[Tamara Artis]

Hahahhaha this is fun!

And I understand your point, the thing is, whatever we do and however we run our stores - it doesn't matter because there will be at least one person (never one) who will come to the conclusion that your way of running your own store and your way of making your own products isn't good because they KNOW better! 

There is a thread in the Fashion part of the forums started by a customer who couldn't get a shirt the way they wanted it! Can you believe it?? The whole new thread to say how merchant is wrong for not wanting to make the item as they imagined it...

Customers are always right. They don't need to read the description because, even if the description is not the way they imagined, they can complain and say they'll leave a bad review and the merchant will fill their wishes  

Few days ago I see in my email inbox that someone has sent me a notecard titled "an issue" although I stated in my profile that people should just write what they need. I can't login in-world the same moment something comes up but I could write a message and help them the same moment they ask for help.... so the customer has to wait... Later that day I login and see that he bought an item that comes with instructions how to use it, of course he did not read that notecard lol, instead he supposed he will be able to "make it work" with the power of his own will... when that didn't happen they couldn't do anything else than ask for help from the creator... so I explain one more time, every step he should do.

Next day that same customer sends me another notecard saying "I finally fixed the issue with your product" and explains to me what needs to be done in order to make it work... basically he acted like the product had flaws which he somehow managed to fix lol, nevermind that the "fixing" meant to just follow the steps I told him - same steps that were in the notecard he got with the product.

Its the reality we live in, we can't blame the customers for expecting to get everything for nothing, the same moment they wish for it! I would rather blame merchants who act like servants and fill every possible wish they customers might have, and also for selling too low. 

 

[Codex Alpha]

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Artorius Constantine wrote:

Just last week my Roaming Falconer NPC got 1 starred because "...It's a Joke ... it is all linked".

Well yeah, what good would it be if it wasn't linked?

You want 15 prims as a coalesced object? I don't get it.

I think they just wanted the bird but didn't bother to read the first 2 lines of the listing, or the Title, or the rest of the listing, or look at any of the several pictures, or contact me before 1 starring a perfectly good NPC that is exactly what it says it is.

Not sure why "it''s a joke", but what the hey. I just left a nicely worded reply about reading the listing and hope people read it. and yes, I see the irony in that.

---

Yes, you have to wondered why they bought it... for the creation or as a parts kit?

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Tamara Artis wrote:

 

Its the reality we live in, we can't blame the customers for expecting to get everything for nothing, the same moment they wish for it! I would rather blame merchants who act like servants and fill every possible wish they customers might have, and also for selling too low. 

 

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True, for this how we've probably arrived at the self-entitlement displayed by many customers, who instead of approaching you in a sensible manner, they'd rather try to force you to bend to their will.

This is how you see some products with 200 animations in them... somehow the creator thought that THAT was needed in order to compete or sell their item - then customers come to expect 200 animations from others.. soon anything less than that is unacceptable.

As I don't rely on SL as a primary source of income, and every $L I make gets re-invested into it and developing skills for, it doesn't matter to me - but for other creators that do I can see it being quite taxing after awhile.

I think customers need to be educated. I've never believed in 'the customer is always right" - that's a corporate mentality put out to make us workers cater to them. In my own dealings, I believe in "Be courteous, but firm. Educate the customer"

However, in our culture, customers have bought into that myth "Customer is always right" but it's about as real as the value of diamonds (also created by a corporation).

[Rya Nitely]

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entity0x wrote:

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I think customers need to be educated. I've never believed in 'the customer is always right" - that's a corporate mentality put out to make us workers cater to them. In my own dealings, I believe in "Be courteous, but firm. Educate the customer"

However, in our culture, customers have bought into that myth "Customer is always right" but it's about as real as the value of diamonds (also created by a corporation).

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Customers are generally rational human beings, who are just like you and I. They're not a different species. You are really talking about a very small percentage of difficult people, who may be customers or merchants. But these types are not usually open to suggestion or education.

[Codex Alpha]

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Rya Nitely wrote:

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entity0x wrote:

---

I think customers need to be educated. I've never believed in 'the customer is always right" - that's a corporate mentality put out to make us workers cater to them. In my own dealings, I believe in "Be courteous, but firm. Educate the customer"

However, in our culture, customers have bought into that myth "Customer is always right" but it's about as real as the value of diamonds (also created by a corporation).

---

Customers are generally rational human beings, who are just like you and I. They're not a different species. You are really talking about a very small percentage of difficult people, who may be customers or merchants. But these types are not usually open to suggestion or education.

---

I never mentioned customers were any sort of way, but rather stated my opinion on how I like to deal with customers, in RL or otherwise. Many customers are simply wrong - it's my job to educate them so that we can both arrive to an understanding, rather than catering to their delusion, which can only enable future problems in the relationship.

Quit trying to turn this into me insulting people. It is actually out of respect that I treat them with courtesy, but firmness. In my experience, they appreciate it in the end versus the salesguy who just nods and leads them down the golden path, then they find out later he was bs'ing them the whole time, even condescending, just to get the sale.

[Gunner Grun]

I had one today give a 1 star review because she thought you had to unpack the rezzer box and put the house togther yourself. Shakes Head I contacted her to see if I could help but she didnt have time.

[Codex Alpha]

Yes, it's interesting that some 'don't have time' to resolve the issue, just like they 'didn't have time' to contact you inworld with any questions before purchase, or if there are any problems with set up.

What probably happened is that she realized the error of her ways, figured out how to do it, but sure as hell was never going to admit she was wrong.. Hell no... just no response instead.

[Pamela Galli]

This is why I have started saying in the MP listing and NC, how the thing is rezzed, whether it has a rez box, what is in the rez box, what are option accessories you can place or not, etc. 

Not that they read it but LL will remove reviews that give one star because the buyer didnt like or understand rez boxes/no rez boxes.

[Nutria2016]

What if you have legit criticism, and the vendor chooses to respond with "message me before you review" to a 4/5 stars review?

[Codex Alpha]

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Nutria2016 wrote:

What if you have legit criticism, and the vendor chooses to respond with "message me before you review" to a 4/5 stars review?

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Hold your ground, leave the review up, and if the seller attempts to harass, belittle, threaten or abuse you in IMs, just block them.

I did say the same thing to a customer once "You should contact me before you review", but only because the beefs were about features that were not included in the product, and not about the product, it's usage or functionality.

Only you know if your review is fair and ethical. If it is, don't be intimidated. Noone should expect a 5 star, since there is probably always something that could be improved.

This is probably why the majority of customers don't leave reviews, as it opens up the possibility of conflict or drama, which most of us could live without.

Personally, I always try to do my best, but since I'm a perfectionist, I have to force myself to release something, so I will probably be more aware of shortcomings (real or imagined), so no review is going to surprise me.

 

[tabletopfreak Toocool]

while we're on the topic... i rate 3 if the item is what i expected .. 4 if its more, 5 if im blown away... people are handing out 4-5 like candy sometimes 

[Alwin Alcott]

5 hours ago, tabletopfreak Toocool said:

while we're on the topic...

come a bit more often to the forums... so you can keep rhe sleeping threads just that...

[ChinRey]

On 17.11.2016 at 5:30 PM, entity0x said:

Remember, when reviewing a product on the marketplace, ensure that you remove stars because

...(list omitted)

 

That is potentially eight stars removed...