DISAPPOINTED AND ANNOYED - "FREE SIMS FROM LL"

StarSong Bright · October 21, 2011

I just have to say Linden Labs that *I* am disappointed, seriously so. Enough so that I am probably going to be letting some of my sims go. Let me explain:

Linden Labs have this promotion going: https://secondlife.com/land/sale

They make it seem that you are getting a "free sim" it says "save 1000 usd" but they LIE! I am annoyed that they are putting this out there in such a misleading fashion - you normally pay $1000 but it INCLUDES the first month. You are NOT saving $1000 on a sim, you are saving $705 - because as soon as they deliver the new sim they are gonna charge you $295 usd for the first month's tier.

But even more, this devalues the sims that are out there, people hoping to sell. Forget selling when people can get it for (or think they are getting it for) FREE. The whole thing just smacks of wrongness. Am I wrong?

Chelsea Malibu · October 21, 2011

Yeah, I feel your pain but I don't recall the $1,000 ever including the first month but they do change things..A lot. Back in the SL heyday, they sold class 5 servers for $2,000 and many of us where sitting on many sims when they dropped the cost to $1,000 which devalued everyone's sims. In the end, many like Anche Chung ended up with hundred of sims that where now worth 1/2.

In the end, I look at SL as any other telco/hosting provider. It's a commodity and the values will go up and down. It will always be a high risk venture though the potential for revenues are on very slim margins for most. When you buy bandwidth with a hosting provider/telco, you have to make a commitment to insure a good rate but more often than not, you will have price compression where you suddenly find yourself paying more than those new to sign up. It's sort of the nature of SaaS and Bandwidth.

If you treat this has a hobby and perhaps get lucky enough to make a few buck, all the power to you but I really don't encourage anyone to look at SL as a sound business investment.

carolechung · October 21, 2011

StarSong Bright wrote:

I just have to say Linden Labs that *I* am disappointed, seriously so. Enough so that I am probably going to be letting some of my sims go. Let me explain:

Linden Labs have this promotion going:

https://secondlife.com/land/sale

They make it seem that you are getting a "free sim" it says "save 1000 usd" but they LIE! I am annoyed that they are putting this out there in such a misleading fashion - you normally pay $1000 but it INCLUDES the first month. You are NOT saving $1000 on a sim, you are saving $705 - because as soon as they deliver the new sim they are gonna charge you $295 usd for the first month's tier.

But even more, this devalues the sims that are out there, people hoping to sell. Forget selling when people can get it for (or think they are getting it for) FREE. The whole thing just smacks of wrongness. Am I wrong?

Advertising and marketing are all about twisting the truth. Regardless, this is a very good deal. This is what LL should have been doing some time ago - waiving these alleged "set-up" charges. It is too late though. The market has fallen through anyway. Too little too late. You can pick up fantastic deals on some of those remaining grandfathered sims, as sim owners are desperately giving away the store just to hold on.

Griffin Ceawlin · October 21, 2011

"Grandfathered" sims are just... sims... since upon transfer they cease to be "grandfathered." Aren't they?

Loki Omegaman · October 21, 2011

When I purchased my 2 fulls and 2 homesteads, the initial month wasn't included in the setup fee. So for the first month I had to pay $1295.

What I'm gutted about was I purchased these like 2 months ago only, so that's $2700 extra I might've not had to pay if I was patient.

Chelsea Malibu · October 21, 2011

LOL, yep, that's my point. Perhaps their land group needs a new slogan:

"We cheat others and pass the savings on to you"

Knowl Paine · October 21, 2011

The Terms and Conditions are clearly stated at the bottom of the page in the link.

For the duration of the "sale", resale prices of existing Regions may be effected, if a potential Buyer is aware of the sale. (this thread may help)

Freemarkets and protecting equity; can we have both?

An unregulated market will rely upon consumer price discovery (index) to determine the worth or value or a product or service.

A regulated market, like the one we have in SL, will utilize profit price discovery. Profit is listed as a Cost and is the primary motivator.

Profit is an excellent ideal when it is not defined as money.

Sweet Valentine · October 21, 2011

anyone have a cheap mesh umbrella for sale.... i need to protect myself from the second life falling skies

Lindens you have chewed off and spit out the hands that feed you far to many times

this is the stupidist move ever...when do us Sim owners get a break from paying a Sim Payment tier? I pay on time every month and im preminum for over 5 years when do i get a Deal ???????????????

Gooden Uggla · October 21, 2011

The results of this sale will not end well, mark my words...

NicholasWhite · October 21, 2011

Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

"Grandfathered" sims are just... sims... since upon transfer they cease to be "grandfathered." Aren't they?

Yes, but when you can lease them for 65,000 L per month from other land owners and have full admin rights, they are a better bargain than this LL new offer.

Qie Niangao · October 21, 2011

65,000 L per month

That can't be that great a deal on a sim with grandfathered tier, can it? Not sure I'd jump at the chance to pay somebody else's Estate for a full sim and get only a 10% discount to paying LL directly. I guess people do it, though.

LL's real gift to existing Estate owners is continuing to reserve Homesteads to only those who already own at least one full-prim Estate sim. If they ever allow mere Premium members to own Homesteads at the same fees as Estates, then both Estates and Mainland would hear a big "whoosh!"

Jennifer Boyle · October 21, 2011

Chelsea his the nail on the head. You simply cannot realistically expect that LL will not do something that will ruin the value of any investment or make any business model untenable without notice and without explanation. In late 2007 and early 2008, I was doing pretty well buying and selling small parcels of land. My business model was exploiting market inefficiencies. I would find parcels that I could buy for less than I thought I could sell them for. and I was right most of the time. Then LL, without warning, rapidly drove the price of land down to a fraction of what it had been. I was lucky to be able tio unload my inventory fast enough so that I still had an overall profit on my venture.

I learned a valuable lesson: it is folly to actually risk mioney in SL. SL is a dictatorship run by a benign but rather stupid dictator who thinks it needs no advice from anyone and makes arbitrary changes in the law and the economy on a whim, without regard to the effects on residents. Ever since my experience, I play this GAME for fun, and nothing else.

Jacki Silverfall · October 21, 2011

Gooden Uggla wrote:

The results of this sale will not end well, mark my words...

This ^^^^

Here's to more yellow squares on the map! screeming cat.jpg

Naughty Feila · October 22, 2011

Lets see... I own a business, in which i make a significient investment with my supplier. Now, my supplier also has my FULL customer list, and a list of everyone that can be a potiental customer.

Then, without warning, decides to market all of them, to buy directly to them, cutting me out. Oh yea, and for LESS then I am able to sell for, sinve they are offering them the same price they give me, a large customer.

Sorry, in any market, thats just bad business eithics.

Gally Oz · October 22, 2011

I'm disappointed for a different reason: Still need a full region before getting a homestead.

I can't afford 300USD a month, but could afford a homestead.

oh well. their loss.

Ina Centaur · October 22, 2011

Personally, I'm just amazed that the forum threads are only 2 pages long on this? Is there really no one on SL out there nowadays?

Back when they changed the sim setup pricing from $1600 to $1000, there were dozens of pages of forums.

And yes, I wasted over $5000 purchasing sims just a few weeks short of the $1600 to $1000 price change. But, I'm used to it, so I'll just summarize this Linden Lab company usual for their long-term residents as, "Gyped, once again."

Ciaran Laval · October 22, 2011

This is a weekend deal only, plus these forums ain't what they once were in terms of activity.

Ciaran Laval · October 22, 2011

Chelsea Malibu wrote:

Yeah, I feel your pain but I don't recall the $1,000 ever including the first month but they do change things..A lot.

The setup fee has always included the first month's tier, you pay for an Island and then pay tier a month later.

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Rikihana · October 22, 2011

I agree 100%

MarmelaGramela Doesburg · October 22, 2011

Froma ll the isiotism that i have seen LL do in the last years, this beats everything. Not only is it an insult to us people who paid big bucks for the land over the years, also this is being done at a time where sims shoul;d be deleted and not added - since there are already way too many. I for my part will give every sim up that stands vacant in the future.

Atreju Jungsten · October 22, 2011

I am a current sim owner and friends with several others. I think I understand what LL is trying to do. There have been countless sims go under in the past year(s) and they're trying to get some of them back and running creating revenue. Linden Labs is the SOLE proprietor in the land market. Please do not make the mistake that you are doing nothing more than investing in THEIR market with the hopes of turning it around and making a buck. If anyone is cheating anyone it's the land prospectors buying from LL and then selling said product to another customer(someone just like you). I came by chance upon a sim that was being abandoned and paid the transfer fee and have been paying tier ever since. I would never have dropped $1000 on a sim in hopes that I'd turn it or gain a profit. Why? Because that's Linden Labs area of making money, not mine. $1000 is rediculous to pay for a simple press of a powerbutton on an existing server. Now that LL is selling them without that fee they might regain some sim activity. As for land owners that are miffed that they got "cheated"? Who was the one that shelled out $1000? Did LL hold a gun to your head to shell out that kind of money? You gave it to them of your own free will. Now that they're selling cheap, please don't blame them for your buyers remorse.

MarmelaGramela Doesburg · October 22, 2011

This sure is an amazing heap of nonsense-talk. Btw - Sl was marketed as a business platform patially. But that was years before you came here and guess what it was VERY profitable back then and supported by LL....now....SL losing land? If so then due to poor leadership (I just say Zindra and Xstreet, the wonderful tools that have killed inworld business and the general land market) ...But yes that would be nice..I assume thatr 20% or probably more of all land is currently standing vacant and for sale , so sure - let's add some more! You'd make a good addition to the team with this logic....

Melita Magic · October 22, 2011

If I could afford to do this, I would do it. I have wanted a stand alone estate island for ages. And ages. The terrain texturing alone. The estate controls. Has me drooling.

But, there was so little warning. I'd need to dump all my existing land and do this, or at least, carry the extra land and tier for a month hoping it sold, and then probably dump most of it anyway - because I'm already at 292 tier monthly. I asked myself, would it really improve my playability in SL? Is it better to have everything in one big location, or to have some of the flexibility of mainland?

Right now, I have no bad neighbors. That's always a big factor for me. I did have to dump some land to make it that way but c'est la vie. Dumping that land put me much closer to the next lowest tier level - something I had had trouble deciding to do for a long time. So now with the timing of this free land and setup, I had a big decision to make.

The most active parcel I have is fairly entrenched in that location. Lots of people have that landmark. To uproot it would be stressful for me and possibly for my 'regulars.' Then I'd have to build up a new sim very very quickly, to try not to disrupt the quality level or experience for visitors, such as it may be. Would I be able to build something else up that quickly?

Not having any neighbors is tempting but there is no crossing into the surrounding waters with an island sim. At this time I have that ability, since one parcel fronts Linden oceans. I went back and forth with all of these pluses and minuses for the entire day and night yesterday. And still am battling inside today in a weaker way.

But I've decided not only to forego this offer but, to tier down. If I can get rid of some empty land before next month's tier, it will put $100 USD in my pocket every month. It was a hard decision, though. I truly love Second Life, and I love every minute I spend there. I'd looove to have a whole island to play on, decorate, etc. If I had no obligations to anyone else, in SL or in RL, and it were all about me. I'd probably even be willing to carry the credit card debt if it came to that. But...

The only responsible thing to do was to bypass. But it is like watching a beautiful ship roll by. Maybe one will pass by again later.

I do think the future of the world depends upon the little guy, the middle class, being the priority with all corporations and governing bodies. Not the few fat cats, land barons, what have you. With a decent life in reach, he will find the spring in his step again and the world will recover. With a few serving themselves, it never will - and they have forgotten without the many those few have no future either.

Faithless Babii · October 22, 2011

Melita Magic wrote: