hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 My aim is to get Linden Lab to translate their TOS because many children (underage) are in Second Life and they cannot read English.. currently.. the TOS is only in English, Linden Lab need to have it translated otherwise more and more children are going to join SL! I will be glad if Linden Lab can translate the TOS becuase not just children carnt read English there are plenty of adults what dont speak English in SL now. Before you comment on that the TOS is translated here is the web TOS evidence (please note I choose german for this)http://dl.dropbox.com/u/54034745/Proof-WEB.pngHere is the VIEWER proof of that the TOS is not translated! (not many people read this but people have said I should put this into thought before making this)http://dl.dropbox.com/u/54034745/Proof-Viewer.jpg Thanks,HamiltonRP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Lohner Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Interesting but kinda worthless. Anyone signing up for Second Life has to enter their birthday before they can get an account. In order for an underaged person to join, they would have to lie about their age at this point in time. This is before they are given the TOS to read. Translating the TOS isn't going to stop people lying about their age in order to get an account. --Cinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Yes true, But what about the other stuff.. The people who grief... They dont know the rules. Yes you can run it though a google translater but it doesnt always work and many people carnt be botherd to go though that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceka Cianci Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 true they would never really know the rules..who knows how it would turn out if put in a translater..it could end up all kinds of different than whatit actually says.. i really didn't know they only had it in english hehehe Oo you would think when dealing with international crowd let alone a a country where there is so much mixes of nations that there would be more than one language version.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Lohner Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Your whole argument for this is to keep children off of SL cause they can't read the TOS cause its in English. I simply pointed out that translating the TOS has no value in stopping kids from lying about their age in order to get an accout. I think you should decided what you are really trying to accomplish first, before you start throwing solutions at the problem and then asking the rest of us to jump on your bandwagon. --Cinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syo Emerald Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Its LindenLabs own fault, that it is so easy for kids to lie about their age. As I joined, it was necessary to prove your age with a part of the passport, driving licence or anything equal to that to get age verified. Now you simply say yes and set some birthdate. This shows that LindenLab doesn't really care about it at all. I don't care about children either. Its there own problem, if they want to acess SL. I'm not their nanny or mother. Oh and I also don't agree with the point knowing the TOS might stop griefers, everybody with a working brain knows that anger others is not nice. Its what they call fun and they won't stop untill they get banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orca Flotta Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 The people who grief... They dont know the rules. Uh oh, careful what you're implying here! Griefers don't know the rules? If they only knew the rules they would stop griefing? WTF??? I see the whole TOS thing like this: LL is an American enterprise, they are bound by US laws, as are we when we decide to enter a business relationship with them by joining their platform SL. SL's language is US-English. Not German, not Spanish, not Manadarin, just plain colonial English. If you wish to enter SL it's completely up to you to deal with that basic fact. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Before we continue, Please note I am not just complaining about underaged people .. All I am doing is making sure that everyone in the world who signs up for Second Life can read the TOS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Lohner Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 hamiltonRP wrote: Before we continue, Please note I am not just complaining about underaged people .. All I am doing is making sure that everyone in the world who signs up for Second Life can read the TOS. Really??? Isn't this your ad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Yes ok, I am picking the underadged becuase that is the biggest issue right now with the spanish,german etc talking kids.. But it ISNT just about the underaged.. It is simply becuase the TOS should be translated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venus Petrov Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I agree with Caity. Open your feed so all SL can read it and write whatever you like on whatever subject matter you care to write. Spamming the feeds of others is not good. You will only alienate the feed owners and your comments will be whacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceka Cianci Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 just want to say that my response had nothing to do with your political things at all.. Only that i do think it should be where everyone that uses sl can understand the TOS..nothing more nothing less.. because everyone should be able to understand what they are agreeing to and also understand their rights and also what they can and cannot do ect.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Yes You got it! that is what I am trying to get to everyone, and sorry to everyone what I posted my links to this..was a bit to much. But yes Ceka you have the same thought as me:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladi Hazelnut Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Quite simply it is not LL's job to translate everything into every language on the earth. When you join SL you are stating that you agree to and understand all the rules. If you can't read English and agree to something you don't understand it is on you, not them. If you don't understand it, there are plenty of translators on the internet you can plug the text into and have it translated. How well it gets translated is another story. But in the end it is up to the consumer to understand what they are agreeing to. As for griefers and people that sign up that are under age, knowing the rules means nothing. These kinds of people don't care about the rules period. They are liars, cheaters and trouble makers. Knowing the rules means little to them. And to be honest, most of the rules they enforce hard are pretty much common sense for anyone. As for the viewer, I am not sure, but I think you can pick the language of the viewer, and there may be third party viewers in different languages as well. How many different languages I really don't know, I never looked since I only speak English. But I have seen videos where the viewer is in a different language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caitlin Tobias Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 hamiltonRP wrote: My aim is to get Linden Lab to translate their TOS because many children (underage) are in Second Life and they cannot read English.. currently.. the TOS is only in English, Linden Lab need to have it translated otherwise more and more children are going to join SL! I will be glad if Linden Lab can translate the TOS becuase not just children carnt read English there are plenty of adults what dont speak English in SL now. Before you comment on that the TOS is translated here is the web TOS evidence (please note I choose german for this) http://dl.dropbox.com/u/54034745/Proof-WEB.png Here is the VIEWER proof of that the TOS is not translated! (not many people read this but people have said I should put this into thought before making this) http://dl.dropbox.com/u/54034745/Proof-Viewer.jpg Thanks, HamiltonRP This 'crusade'of yours reminds me of someone. Anyway, I do not agree. Some is already pointed out to you by others in this thread. Also, your statement that 'children dont speak english'...I can assure you that the younger generation in my country (The Netherlands) has a better grasp of English than the 'old ones'. I can imagine this goes for lots of other countries as well. Griefers are griefers because they dont know the ToS? LOL! I personally think they know the ToS better than the majority of 'good' citizens, why else would they make alts and live on the edge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Boyle Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Ceka Cianci wrote: you would think when dealing with international crowd let alone a a country where there is so much mixes of nations that there would be more than one language version.. For translating legal documents, you need high quality translation, which is quite expensive. You also need to have it back-translated by a different translator, and then check to see if significant differences were introduced, which doubles the expense. If they were, then you have to have it worked on some more, which is more expense. To have a document like the TOS translated into a single language would cost thousands of US, not linden, dollars. There is also less legal risk for LL if they don't provide translations. There will always be some risk that the translated version does not mean exactly the same thing as the original English version. If LL provides only an English version, the customer assumes all risk when signing it. If LL provides a (mis)translated version, they are responsible for any legal consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Boyle Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Syo Emerald wrote: Its LindenLabs own fault, that it is so easy for kids to lie about their age. As I joined, it was necessary to prove your age with a part of the passport, driving licence or anything equal to that to get age verified. Now you simply say yes and set some birthdate. This shows that LindenLab doesn't really care about it at all. It was just a little harder for the kiddies to lie then. First, I doubt there were many twelve-year-olds who couldn't surreptitiously access mom's or dad's info to age-verify. Second, a lot of people used Elvis Presley's info, which was available on the Internet, to age-verify, and it worked fine. The only way that I can think of that I can think of that LL might actually effectively enforce age requirements is to require people to show their faces and an official photo id in a live video call. That's not foolproof, as it would be easy for a child to get past if she could find an adult accomplice, which must be pretty easy judging by how easily they get alcohol. It would be prohibitively expensive and would be offputting to a lot of legitamate adult customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theresa Tennyson Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 hamiltonRP wrote: Yes true, But what about the other stuff.. The people who grief... They dont know the rules. Yes you can run it though a google translater but it doesnt always work and many people carnt be botherd to go though that. That's where you said, or at least implied, that translation would would help to stop griefing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladi Hazelnut Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I would agree that most people, especially the younger ones in other countries do have a pretty good grasp of the English language and others. Especially in Europe. We had two foreign exchange students in the 90's one from Switzerland and one from Denmark. They both spoke and understood perfect English. As a matter of fact the girl from Denmark was helping me assemble a piece of furniture and I asked her if she could read me the instructions while I put the stuff together. I made the mistake of asking if she could understand the instructions lol. Her reply was " I read and speak at least 4 languages fluently, one of them being English, how about you?" And she was only 17. Kind of made me feel like a dumb ass considering I only speak English. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 The Second Life Terms Of Service should be translated END OF STORY! I dont care about the underaged, I dont care about the mainland stuff, I dont care about the griefing, I dont care about all the other stuff on the TOS, The TOS should be translated END OF,Ok? ( I do follow the TOS I am just saying I dont care so much about the TOS it self I care about the translation!) No more comments about the greifing and the underaged part of it. Just think and say about how the SL TOS could be so usefull if it would be translated! Thanks, HamiltonRP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Lohner Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Take your underaged graphic rant off the marketplace and I maybe I can believe you dont care. And don't send me any more private messages. We discuss things openly on the forum or not at all. --Cinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Lohner Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 HI Jenn! You make a good point about the cost of tranlations. I think with free translators available that people forget the importance of GOOD translations when it comes to things like legal documents. I did product management for a number of years and when it came time to localize the product for multiple countries, we had to budget about $35,000 per language! --Cinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 I have created a bug report for this issue- https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-4442 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonRP Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Ok I have removed the bill board (marketplace).. It seems pointless becuase I cannot go on about one thing in the TOS.. I am about the whole TOS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeHere Absent Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 End of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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