How subtle avatar looks affects relationship to others

[Becabecca]

I have noticed with different kinds of looks people treat you differently. And by that I don't just mean the more obvious differences, like a human and a furry. Ive noticed height and hair color have a thing to say here even if all else remain the same.. That also makes me think. For those of you that have/have had longer romantic relationships in SL, is it easier to keep the feelings strong if that other person doesn't change their avi a lot (except changes that could easily be done in RL, like clothes)? I love to play around with different looks and hairs. So all sorts of thoughts come up in relation to that, for example when you feel you need extra big puppy eyes to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good? hehe And would the strong feelings you have for someone be lessened if that someone made a less physically appealing avi? Yes, I know sl is sl and only pixels, but still.. our brains probably react to it anyway.

[Ren Toxx]

That depends on the person –on both, actually–, and on the kind of relationship they establish. Shallowness isn’t an universal constant.

[ZoeTick]

Blokes don't care what their female partners look like in SL; it's their actions that matter.

[Muletta]

---

ZoeTick wrote:

Blokes don't care what their female partners look like in SL; it's their actions that matter.

---

Hmmm...If so, why do they always say then: "You look so sexy!" ?

[Muletta]

---

Becabecca wrote:

I have noticed with different kinds of looks people treat you differently. And by that I don't just mean the more obvious differences, like a human and a furry. Ive noticed height and hair color have a thing to say here even if all else remain the same.. That also makes me think. For those of you that have/have had longer romantic relationships in SL, is it easier to keep the feelings strong if that other person doesn't change their avi a lot (except changes that could easily be done in RL, like clothes)? I love to play around with different looks and hairs. So all sorts of thoughts come up in relation to that, for example when you feel you need extra big puppy eyes to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good? hehe And would the strong feelings you have for someone be lessened if that someone made a less physically appealing avi? Yes, I know sl is sl and only pixels, but still.. our brains probably react to it anyway.

---

A briefly look at the marketplace, shows how important the look of our avatars obviously is.

 

Apparel: 1615736

Accessories: 396112

Avatar appearance: 29115

Avatar components: 220590

Complete avatars: 35065

 

Of course our look affects the way we are treated, whether we like it or not...A lot of people do actually make a living, by speculating in advertising and developing stuff to sell you, regarding to this fact.

The signals you want to send out, and the signals other people seem to receive from you, are not always the same though, unfortunally.

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Muletta wrote:

The signals you want to send out, and the signals other people seem to receive from you, are not always the same though, unfortunally.

---

My experience, both RL and SL, is that they've never been the same.

Pfft!

;-).

[Muletta]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

---

Muletta wrote:

The signals you want to send out, and the signals other people seem to receive from you, are not always the same though, unfortunally.

---

My experience, both RL and SL, is that they've never been the same.

Pfft!

;-).

---

Hahaha Madelaine, and that is exactly what makes the money-world go around...We have to constantly try other purchases, in hope of getting better luck next time... :matte-motes-big-grin-wink:

 

 

 

[Coby Foden]

---

ZoeTick wrote:

Blokes don't care what their female partners look like in SL; it's their actions that matter.

---

Lies, lies...!  :matte-motes-evil-grin:

:smileyvery-happy:  :smileytongue:

[Madelaine McMasters]

It took you seven years to discover fire?

Please tell me I'm the one who got you started.

;-).

[LaskyaClaren]

What an interesting post, and question(s)!

I think that the answers to these will likely depend a great deal on the individuals involved -- and also, maybe, the degree to which they are "augmentationist" (and see avatars as simple visual icons standing in the RL people) or "immersionist" (and have invested in their avatars carefully designed looks and personalities). I've known both -- people who didn't really care what their partner's avatar looked like, and those who cared a great deal.

For me, the more interesting question is the one you ask about the impact of relatively dramatic changes to the avatar. My best guess is that, for most people, this can make a real difference, precisely because the avatar is (for both immersionists and augmentationists, in their different ways) a visual analogue for the person. I suspect our brains are wired to associate impressions, responses, and so forth to visual cues, and that changing those cues dramatically is likely to create at least a moment of cognitive dissonance.

It isn't merely that they may find the change in appearance more or less "sexy" or appealing, but that the change itself compels a kind of radical rewiring of the brain, as old impressions have to be re-associated with a new visual image.

I'm going to guess (and it would make a fascinating study!) that most people in longer term SL relationships change their appearance radically, on average, much less than those who are not.

 

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

I'm going to guess (and it would make a fascinating study!) that most people in longer term SL relationships change their appearance radically, on average, much less than those who are not.

---

It's been quite the opposite for me, in both SL and RL. When I was married, my husband's interests were of some importance to me, so I adapted to them. I toned down my oppositional streak, and so would go out to dinner wearing outfits that made sense. When I had a SL partner it was much the same.

Ultimately, enough of the unadulterated me (read as "containing no adult") showed through in both relationships that they ended. Now that I'm unattached, I'm hardly motivated to do much other than what I please. And that doesn't seem to change radically over time.

Think about your own wardobe. Does it expand or contract when you've got someone else in your life?

[ZoeTick]

---

Muletta wrote:

---

ZoeTick wrote:

Blokes don't care what their female partners look like in SL; it's their actions that matter.

---

Hmmm...If so, why do they always say then: "You

look

so sexy!" ?

---

Because they are not so stupid as to say: "You look like the tart I hope you are"?

[ZoeTick]

---

Muletta wrote:

---

Becabecca wrote:

I have noticed with different kinds of looks people treat you differently. And by that I don't just mean the more obvious differences, like a human and a furry. Ive noticed height and hair color have a thing to say here even if all else remain the same.. That also makes me think. For those of you that have/have had longer romantic relationships in SL, is it easier to keep the feelings strong if that other person doesn't change their avi a lot (except changes that could easily be done in RL, like clothes)? I love to play around with different looks and hairs. So all sorts of thoughts come up in relation to that, for example when you feel you need extra big puppy eyes to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good? hehe And would the strong feelings you have for someone be lessened if that someone made a less physically appealing avi? Yes, I know sl is sl and only pixels, but still.. our brains probably react to it anyway.

---

A briefly look at the marketplace, shows how important the look of our avatars obviously is.

 

Apparel: 1615736

Accessories: 396112

Avatar appearance: 29115

Avatar components: 220590

Complete avatars: 35065

 

Of course our look affects the way we are treated, whether we like it or not...A lot of people do actually make a living, by speculating in advertising and developing stuff to sell you, regarding to this fact.

The signals you want to send out, and the signals other people seem to receive from you, are not always the same though, unfortunally.

---

Here is a partial list of people that women try to make themselves attractive - in rl and sl - for:

1. Other women

2. Themselves

3. Potential partners

.

.

23. Wolf-whistling builders

.

.

47. Passing motorists

.

.

99. Their partners

[Muletta]

---

ZoeTick wrote:

Blokes don't care what their female partners look like in SL; it's their actions that matter.

---

Muletta wrote:

Hmmm...If so, why do they always say then: "You

look

so sexy!" ?

---

Zoetick wrote:

Because they are not so stupid as to say: "You look like the tart I hope you are"?

---

Hehe, and some men are so stupid, that they don't think that we know, that this is exactly what they often really mean, when they compliment us as sexy-looking..... :matte-motes-wink:

[Muletta]

---

ZoeTick wrote:

---

Muletta wrote:

---

Becabecca wrote:

I have noticed with different kinds of looks people treat you differently. And by that I don't just mean the more obvious differences, like a human and a furry. Ive noticed height and hair color have a thing to say here even if all else remain the same.. That also makes me think. For those of you that have/have had longer romantic relationships in SL, is it easier to keep the feelings strong if that other person doesn't change their avi a lot (except changes that could easily be done in RL, like clothes)? I love to play around with different looks and hairs. So all sorts of thoughts come up in relation to that, for example when you feel you need extra big puppy eyes to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good? hehe And would the strong feelings you have for someone be lessened if that someone made a less physically appealing avi? Yes, I know sl is sl and only pixels, but still.. our brains probably react to it anyway.

---

A briefly look at the marketplace, shows how important the look of our avatars obviously is.

 

Apparel: 1615736

Accessories: 396112

Avatar appearance: 29115

Avatar components: 220590

Complete avatars: 35065

 

Of course our look affects the way we are treated, whether we like it or not...A lot of people do actually make a living, by speculating in advertising and developing stuff to sell you, regarding to this fact.

The signals you want to send out, and the signals other people seem to receive from you, are not always the same though, unfortunally.

---

Here is a partial list of people that women try to make themselves attractive - in rl

and

sl - for:

1. Other women

2. Themselves

3. Potential partners

.

.

23. Wolf-whistling builders

.

.

47. Passing motorists

.

.

99. Their partners

---

You ought to also have mentioned: the police (when we have pushed the speeder too much with the foot, and get caught on the highway)

[LaskyaClaren]

---

ZoeTick wrote:

Here is a partial list of people that women try to make themselves attractive - in rl

and

sl - for:

1. Other women

2. Themselves

3. Potential partners

 

---

The first three on this list are surprisingly insightful, Zoe. 

Motorists and wolf-whistlers though don't even figure on the list, for most of us anyway.

[LaskyaClaren]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

I'm going to guess (and it would make a fascinating study!) that most people in longer term SL relationships change their appearance radically, on average, much less than those who are not.

---

It's been quite the opposite for me, in both SL and RL. When I was married, my husband's interests were of some importance to me, so I adapted to them. I toned down my oppositional streak, and so would go out to dinner wearing outfits that made sense. When I had a SL partner it was much the same.

Ultimately, enough of the unadulterated me (read as "containing no adult") showed through in both relationships that they ended. Now that I'm unattached, I'm hardly motivated to do much other than what I please. And that doesn't seem to change radically over time.

Think about your own wardobe. Does it expand or contract when you've got someone else in your life?

---

Yeah . . . good point, actually, although you're talking about something a bit different from what I was getting at.

I think that there probably is, for many people, a difference between how this operates in RL, and how it works in SL, because the latter makes it so easy to experiment. But I'll grant that in both places the existence of a partner probably does dictate, to greater or lesser degrees, how one looks. "Wear that pant suit dress I really like!"  (Who am I kidding?). Or "I really like that one hairstyle you wore when we met . . ."

But what I guess I was getting at is that our own freedom to experiment with our look diminishes when we are in a long term relationship, for precisely the reasons that you give: that there are expectations that we are asked to meet. So, while one might change one's appearance, perhaps even radically, to accommodate a partner's tastes, I think that it probably usually remains relatively stable within those constraints.

But maybe it's not just relationships that encourage us to accommodate to the expectations of others. When I first created Scylla, I used a freebie hairstyle -- "Rocker Girl" or something like that -- that was white streaked with dark. When i finally, after probably a half year or more, decided to actually buy a nicer set of hair, I actually received complaints from friends who, at that point, associated that particular look with Scylla. So, I went back and bought what were essentially nicer versions of the same hair. The complaints ceased. (I actually liked the look, which made me more ready to do so . . . it might have been different I suppose if I hadn't.)

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

Yeah . . . good point, actually, although you're talking about something a bit different from what I was getting at.

---

I think I'm talking about exactly what you're talking about.

It's all give and take. In exchange for sometimes having (and wanting) to dress sensibly (or a certain way), I got partners who encouraged me to do things I'd been uncertain about, and did things I'd asked them to do. It's nice when someone's got your back, even if they're partially blocking your front.

Most won't risk what they can't afford to lose. Partners can provide security. SL's anonymous reincarnation can lower your investment. Either encourages experimentation.

---

But what I guess I was getting at is that our 

own

 freedom to experiment with our look diminishes when we are in a long term relationship, for precisely the reasons that you give: that there are expectations that we are asked to meet. So, while one might change one's appearance, perhaps even radically, to accommodate a partner's tastes, I think that it probably usually remains relatively stable within those constraints.

---

Who needs freedom if you're not motivated to exercise it? My experience has been that any freedom I may have lost as the result of being in a relationship was more than offset by the increase in motivation. My partners may not have felt the same.

If you argue that the average of two individuals is less random than either alone (each knocking the edges off the other), I'll counter that capable teams get more done than capable individuals. Although I'm a loner, my best and most adventurous work (both public and private) was done while part of a team.

That said, I'm still happy as a free agent (read as "working for free").

[Coby Foden]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

It took you seven years to discover fire?

Please tell me I'm the one who got you started.

;-).

---

:matte-motes-big-grin:  :smileywink:

[Venus Petrov]

---

Becabecca wrote:

for example when you feel you need

extra big puppy eyes

to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good?

---

You lost me with the puppy eyes. Wut?

[Becabecca]

Haha, the puppy eyes was just a silly example really. Don't take it too seriously. But it's interesting how even small things can have an effect on how other percieve us.

[Madelaine McMasters]

---

Becabecca wrote:

for example when you feel you need extra big puppy eyes to make your partner forgive you for something, then having bigger eyes for your avi would be good?

---

[LaskyaClaren]

---

Madelaine McMasters wrote:

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

Yeah . . . good point, actually, although you're talking about something a bit different from what I was getting at.

---

I think I'm talking about exactly what you're talking about.

It's all give and take. In exchange for sometimes having (and wanting) to dress sensibly (or a certain way), I got partners who encouraged me to do things I'd been uncertain about, and did things I'd asked them to do. It's nice when someone's got your back, even if they're partially blocking your front.

Most won't risk what they can't afford to lose. Partners can provide security. SL's anonymous reincarnation can lower your investment. Either encourages experimentation.

Well, yes. Relationships are certainly a negotiation -- difficult, or easy, creative or restrictive depending upon who one is and what one is willing to risk. But that "willing to risk" bit is, I think, important, and it 

is 

a risk because it involves something over which one has only limited control: how someone 

else 

interprets or reads us.

I think, too, that relationships often fail, in the longer term especially (and everything happens more speedily in SL) precisely because one partner 

does

change, and the other doesn't like it, or doesn't "fit in" with that change. So, granting that, as they say, "YMMV," I think I'd still argue that change is, in that context, a risky venture.

---

But what I guess I was getting at is that our 

own

 freedom to experiment with our look diminishes when we are in a long term relationship, for precisely the reasons that you give: that there are expectations that we are asked to meet. So, while one might change one's appearance, perhaps even radically, to accommodate a partner's tastes, I think that it probably usually remains relatively stable within those constraints.

---

Who needs freedom if you're not motivated to exercise it? My experience has been that any freedom I may have lost as the result of being in a relationship was more than offset by the increase in motivation. My partners may not have felt the same.

If you argue that the average of two individuals is less random than either alone (each knocking the edges off the other), I'll counter that capable teams get more done than capable individuals. Although I'm a loner, my best and most adventurous work (both public and private) was done while part of a team.

That said, I'm still happy as a free agent (read as "working for free").

I can't argue with you if that has been your own experience. I think that's wonderful, that you've found partners who in some sense made you 

more

creative! To some degree, and in some arenas, I'd agree with you . . . but not always, in my own experience, in terms of changing "who I am." That, sadly, has been 

my

experience. I am envious. :-)

 

---

 

[Snugs McMasters]

---

LaskyaClaren wrote:

I can't argue with you (Maddy).

---

You're just now figuring this out?

I gave up long ago.

[Dillon Levenque]

Oh, you can argue, Snugs.

 

You just can't win the argument. :-)