Shayne Hesten

Sassy, you are never a bad person From my experience, you always manage to cut through the dross and come up with the most relevant and pointed questions - and, yes, I agree with later posts, listening is one thing, but answering does seem to be another. I only came across this by accident, I seem to be out of touch. And I do remember what I had to do for Direct Delivery and how many hours were involved. Ok, so now it is all changing again and I won't moan, these things happen and we have to go with the flow or else just back out of everything and give up years of business. So I will be positive since DD was always successful for me. But now I have a tiny little problem (and you know it isn't tiny). To keep my inventory down, I regularly box loads of things up and have boxes inside boxes. This means, I have absolutely nothing in my inventory with folder names that will match those I have on the Marketplace since once I have uploaded to the MP and tested delivery, that's it for me, all safe and sound. Clearly, with no "associated" objects or folders visible in my inventory, this new system will just not work. I have today begun the tedious process of unboxing everything in the hope I can sort it all out but that is also going to take many long hours and weeks. I was wondering, if I took a test delivery of each of my items on the MP and stored those in a folder in my inventory, would that be sufficient for this new system to work since they would then carry the object/folder names and would contain the items that are delivered to customers (oh how glad I am now that I deleted so much old stuff this year). Any suggestions or advice would be appreciated since the articles I have read and videos I have watched certainly pre-suppose that we all keep exact replica folders in our inventories. EDIT I have now answered this myself. No, I cannot do test downloads and then use those for sale. But at least I have a copy of all the folder names now, I just have to find the content.

An old thread this but it has proven extremely helpful. For some reason, I had not been receiving offline IMs or notices and when I followed this through to my account, hey presto, the box to have them sent to my email was mysteriously unchecked. Nice one, hopefully sorted again now.

Reply to Wanda with apologies for the delay since I was not getting email notifications. I feel you may have misunderstood and my profile says I do not keep an inworld store anymore, it does not say I am not inworld. In fact, I am inworld above 8 hours a day, every day, with no RL holidays, and always available for my customers Yes, keeping SL profitable will keep the present SL alive. Yes, that is profitable for LL since this is not a free game/virtual world/space on the internet. It has to be paid for, it has to continue to make a profit like all business ventures, it is not a charitable venture. By this point, there are many very sensible discussions available for you to read about the future of SL and also the development of the new platform. And there are discussions where Lindens have taken part. In the first reply to your post by Gaia Clary there is a wealth of very intelligent and highly relevant points. Gaia has written excellent scenarios and you can see that panic and worry will see the end, whereas a continuation of love and support for SL will carry it forward for years.

Many years ago I received a telephone call from a relative telling me she had joined this thing called Second Life but was having trouble with the graphics. Could I help? First thing I had to do was create an SL account and log in, wander around Help Island, find my way out and then tell her that I had arrived. We compared notes of our screens over the telephone, and then it was clear, she had to upgrade her graphics drivers. So simple and I should have thought of that, and she went happily on her way to rent a small parcel of land, buy a house, buy hair and clothes and goodness knows what. My good deed done for the day... but I didn't log out, I stayed, and am still here. I had no lindens, no idea they could be bought via the website, no idea where to shop or where to go, and building!!! No way, that was surely only for genius computer graduates. Within an hour I had met someone who immediately offered me a wealth of advice (and we are still friends to this day). My learning curve had begun, and progressed rapidly. I bought linden dollars, I rented a chalet, then an apartment, then a house, then a parcel (you can guess the rest). My inventory moved from a few freebies to a silly amount. And then I began building, later meeting the person who would become my SL partner, SL business partner and RL friend (over 5 years now), and now we mostly build together or contribute ideas. That is my SL, and it is surely no different to the SL others enjoy. I am content with what we have now, I can create whatever I wish (although my partner is always bemoaning the fact that he cannot bring into SL what he sees in his mind). SL is not my life, it is a part of my life, just like reading, watching a movie, creative writing and writing for (insert here any number of publications around the world). I buy a book in RL, I read it, I give it away. I buy a blu-ray in RL, I watch it, I give it away. I buy a magazine, I read it, I put it in the recycle bin. I buy a pc, then a graphics card, then another card, then another, then RAM, then another pc, the cycle is endless, I am always upgrading something for my own pleasure and my own satisfaction. What I buy and recycle or give away is likely to be far more than I spend in SL but they are all a part of my RL existence, they are all important to me, and they all give me memories to treasure. I am luckier than most, I can read all day if I wish, or watch movies all day, or log into SL and socialise or build all day. The choice is mine. I am one of those who still remember the old days when I would tp to a place and have to find my shoes which had detached during the tp and got lost in my butt. Or when SL water was nothing more than a flat blue open space. When Fridays I might spend an age "Ruthed". It was all a part of the experience and it was all a part of the learning curve of SL itself. Now we have heard of the announcement of another virtual world being created - I should say "yet another" because there are quite a few we can choose from if we wish. My choice is SL and so I remain in SL and I enjoy and appreciate what SL has to offer. But, unlike many "newer" Residents, I have been fortunate enough to see the development that LL has invested in over time. Sure, there are still bugs, sure we get annoyed when the grid goes down or we can't tp or alpha layers refuse to go or... so many things really but that is also a part of the SL experience, and we all know that LL is working on a code base that is older than SL itself and patching here and patching there just to keep us all happy for a few hours. I say my choice of virtual world is SL. It has nothing to do with friends and associates and customers being in SL, it has to do with an emotion. I enjoy being here. But that does not mean I wouldn't like to savour a new and, as has been suggested, an improved SL experience. To do that, and with new code and new features that have been hinted at, can only be done by creating a new world from scratch. After all, none of us would want SL taken off-line indefinitely whilst the Lab does its work. I take the point that, initially, the new world will be primarily for content creators. That is only correct since LL have always said that SL is built by the Residents (or those who have the time to build). The new platform can then be offered to Residents when it is appropriate, when there is something for them to see and do. And looking at the rumours of time-scales, that could be 18 months or 2 years in the future, and then there will be a few years of building and ironing out bugs. What will this new world be? Who knows for sure? Since the Lab doesn't want "old" stuff imported, perhaps we can say it will be predominantly mesh based - but I expect primitives are still going to be required, after all, it is far easier to texture a prim than it is to texture a sculptie or mesh. But it is all conjecture, we do not know other than a huge investment is taking place. Yes, in the hope that it makes the Lab money but also an investment being made for present, future and perhaps past SL Residents. The time has come for me to learn Blender, or to continue learning it, whichever. Again, that is my choice because I can at least be prepared just in case the new platform is mesh based, and if not, then I will have gained a new skill that I can apply to many SL and new platform builds. Both worlds, we are told, will operate side by side for some time. Residents will have a choice which they log into. Over time, the economics will be closely examined and if the present SL is not making money because people, in their shock and anger and worry have stopped buying and renting, then naturally the present SL will close. Basic business sense will tell all of us that a non-profit making venture is useless, and the Lab is not a charity. Will we lose our inventories? Will we lose our avatars? Will we lose our names? Again, so many rumours and it is far too early to even worry about that. The expectation appears to be that avatars and friends lists and groups will be migrated across. As for inventory, who cares? We have enjoyed what we bought (or picked up free), and we can still use it in the existing SL for a number of years. Some of it, I wouldn't be surprised, will be allowed on the new platform but, at the moment, we do not know what. I have an immense stack of builds that I would hate to lose but there will be nothing stopping me being in both worlds at once and copying from one to the other that way if it proves to be the only way (provided primitives and sculpties are permitted, that is). Failing that, I can start over, build again, improve. And, just like buying a book or a DVD or a magazine, most of which cost more than an average week in SL, should we choose eventually (eventually, mind you) to say goodbye to SL and spend all our time in the new LL world, we can start over and be in at the beginning, creating another world that, according to LL, will be far superior. As it is, we just do not know. Rather than worry about the distant future, enjoy what you have now. Socialise, build, buy new shoes, a new house, a new pair of pants. Enjoy SL. That is the whole point of it. Then, somewhere around 2016 when we are told the new platform can be opened, go visit, take a look, make an informated decision based on the facts at that time. Until then, every debate, every worry, is nothing more than conjecture. Remember though, SL is a business for the Lab and a hobby for us (well, it is also a business venture for many of us). It has to be profitable otherwise it becomes a charity. The only way to keep the present SL profitable is to rent land, buy houses, buy furniture and gardens, buy clothes - and, vitally, log in and have fun. In the years to come we can look at everything again and make informed decisions. A long post, my apologies, but I think we should remember that today is what matters, today is what we need to make us happy, let tomorrow take care of itself. I and my partner will definitely visit the new platform when we are permitted, we will love to see what builders' tools are going to be available, and we will love to take the knowledge we have learned in SL to the new platform when the time comes. Will we be there all the time? I do not have a crystal ball. As we have seen, the new platform will initially be attractive to content creators and then later for Residents. I will see you all in SL, we will concern ourselves with a new world when it is ready. I will still build, I will still buy new items from the Marketplace, I will still pay my tier fees - and I will continue to be grateful to the Lab for creating SL (in spite of endless new ToS and bugs lol but that is part of the charm) and I will continue to enjoy my time until there is a viable choice on the table. So log in, go shopping, rent a nice parcel and put down some roots. Two years is a long time, and just stop and think - that dress or hair or skin you bought 4 years ago, do you even know where it is in your inventory? Will you ever wear it again? Remember, emotions in SL are real, everything else is just a bunch of pretty pixels that disappear when we log out. If we have to create new pixels for a new platform, that will be fun. But we will not have to create new emotions or new friends, they will still be there. Enjoy what we have and don't waste time worrying. There will be time enough for us all to make decisions in the years to come and, for those we absolutely refuse to ever leave the present SL and go to a new platform, all you have to do is keep the present SL profitable.

Interesting and intelligent comments on this subject (for a change). Since LL rarely bother to look at the forums, as we have seen in other threads where residents have emailed them directly and received an email reply, would it be at all possible for you to put your information into a mail and send it to LL and see what kind of response you get? You would then be able to paste the reply back into this thread and we would be able to see what point LL is at and how they are interpretting these matters. I do agree with one thing though, and I had not considered this before, double taxation will result if LL witholds tax and PayPal also witholds tax.

All of my outstanding payments were credited to my account a few hours ago (night time for me, day time for LL). I have been luckier than some, my outstanding money was a few thousand, not the tens of thousands that some Merchants are owed. Since all of mine happened on the same day just over a week ago, it does appear as though LL is going through one day at a time so hopefully everyone else will see their Lindens added over the next few days. Since some are still seeing missed payments, the "fix" clearly hasn't worked for everyone so hopefully that will be given attention asap.

Yes, good post. There is a lot of bad feeling, especially where money is concerned. We do all know mistakes are made, we make them ourselves, although we do try to rectify them instantly. Rather than do this, do that, do this again, no do that, a simple, We are sorry, we know there is a fault, we will get your your money (insert time). That is all it takes

Thanks, Sassy, now you have reminded me I am supposed to write a Jira as well and that is one of those bottomless pits, an abyss of unthinkable darkness, that we just hate entering Sadly, over the weekend it seems quite a few of our number have not been paid for some sold items (even not being paid for some but paid for others on the same basket order) and there is no set reason behind any of it so no finger can be pointed to one fault. Another tax mess to sort out with one page showing sold items and another showing gaps in payments

Just adding my name to this growing list of Merchants who are receiving emails to confirm a sale, their customers have paid for the items but the payments are not being added to the Merchant's wallet. I did submit Support Tickets to list the items where I had not been paid and was given the reply today that the Market Place Team is aware of this issue and are working to resolve the problem and get the Merchants credited.

I might have agreed with you there a few days ago Whirly but following this thread and also discussing it with affected residents, the following has become clear... 1 - they are in different geographical locations in different countries in Europe (ok, there is a link, Europe, unless anyone knows of this affecting other parts of the world) 2 - they have tried different third party viewers plus the official LL viewer, including cleanly re-installing each time (so no link with possible viewer conflict) 3 - they are using different ISPs (probably obvious since they are in different countries), different cable types, different modems/routers 4 - they have different broadband speeds 5 - they have experimented as suggested (several prior to the suggestion) with reducing draw distance and bandwidth settings 6 - none of them are affected when they are on a sim which is not running version 13 on the Magnum server 7 - when the sims of one affected landowner were moved to a version 12, the issue disappeared instantly for him and all other affected residents who visit those sims Given the number of people who are affected, there appears to be a growing number of possible permutations to check, experiment with and, possible, determine a root cause. I do appreciate that because this issue only affects certain residents and not all, then a potential common denominator amongst them might point to a solution to resolve the issue for them. I am sure others will be able to add to my short list above and, unless there are residents in other parts of the world experiencing this issue (please, it could help if you give your country if you do not mind revealing it), I see at the moment only some of the countries in Europe affected. Andrew said above that it was possible one server was at issue here and if there is a server that deals with Europe, perhaps that could be looked at. At present, the only solution that I have heard is when sims were moved from version 13 (European based land owner). Edit to take account of the post directly following this one - it appears that for some residents a connection is being shown with their internet connection or ISP. Although the geographical location of that resident is as yet unknown. If it helps, I do know that the residents I have personally come across with this issue are in UK, Belgium and all others in Germany.

I wanted to test Jessica's suggestion regarding the progressive draw distance, see if it is off as in default and then switch it on to see if that could actually make a difference. However, when I contacted the one avatar I knew was always affected by this, his sims had today been moved, at his request, to a different server running version 12 and not 13. As soon as that happened, he and the other avatars who use those sims and complained about slow rezzing of prims and invisible avatars, immediately had their user experience returned to normal. All prims rezzed, all avatars were visible. Suggestion... let us forget all this rubbish about packet loss, high bandwidth, poor internet connection and the whole range of technical things that has been put forward in this thread, let us see a hand raised in the air to say, Sorry, we got something wrong, version 13 is at fault, we will roll back and start over. This is not a viewer problem, it is not a user problem, it is clearly an LL problem that, it seems, can be resolved very simply, as already witnessed.

On the question of bandwidth settings. Over the 5 years I have been a resident in SL, I have made great changes to my computing equipment, not only with pc and its components but, gradually, with my broadband. When I became a resident, decent speed broadband was enough and 500 bandwidth was an acceptable setting although things would usually rez so slowly (noteably inworld when store owners upload large, high quality images for vendors when much smaller is actually better). That aside, over the years my broadband speed I have had increased in stages and I also increased my bandwidth to 1500. That gave me much faster rezzing times inworld, and not just for merchant vendors but for everything. I experienced no lag, I experienced no problems and I feel I attained greater stability. But that is only my experience and I appear to have been exceptionally lucky - although I still remember my first 6 months when my user experience was quite poor until I began upgrading my equipment. Your mention here of experimenting with a reduction in bandwidth to 500, and taking Jessica's explanation into account also since it was so nicely explained for ordinary people to understand. On Saturday I attempted to assist a resident who was experiencing the issue of avatars and some prims remaining invisible on the affected sims. I know that he has a high end spec computer and high speed broadband. I know he has had no issue with his inworld experience until this last week. We experimented with his reducing his bandwidth to 500, reducing his draw distance, changing from Firestorm to the official LL viewer, doing a clean re-install of Firestorm (which he did correctly). It had absolutely no affect on his user experience. Reducing draw distance, reducing bandwidth, did nothing at all other than degrade the user experience because what little he could previously see clearly was now rezzing too slowly for him to resume any ingame activity. I accept that this is just one avatar, but it is one who is a land owner, has high spec components, fast cable broadband connection. Reducing DD and bandwidth, together and in isolation, simply further degraded the user experience and given that this only began last week, it certainly cannot be implied that the user may be at fault here. If there was nothing wrong at the start of last week but something drastic changed by mid-week, the finger clearly points at an error beyond the individual user. Please also remember that many people who are following this thread and, indeed, read through these forums, might be intelligent human beings sat at a keyboard but I should imagine many of us have little idea of what you (and some others) are talking about. I wonder if it might be possible, therefore, if an explanation in simple terms that mortals can understand could be apended to the more clinical descriptions and suggestions that are given. We all need to comprehend what is being said in order for adequate responses to be made.

Just to add my own comments to this thread. This bug is not affecting me, however, we held a small gathering on our sim last night and 3 of our guests were unable to see rezzed objects and none of the other avatars were visible to them. On discussing it, it appears all three (plus other avatars they know) are experiencing this same issue when they tp to any sim running Second Life RC Magnum 13.01.17.269162. Avatars remain invisible, objects remain invisible. I tp'd to another sim running Second Life RC Magnum 13.01.17.269162 to check and discovered that whilst I could see all avatars present, many of the objects did not rez for me. I can state that one avatar experimented by doing a full clean install of Firestorm, it did not help. He then logged in with the official LL viewer, again it did not help. He owns two full sims and one homestead and two Lindens visited his land but could find nothing at all wrong with the sims. The avatars I know who are reporting this problem are all based in Europe but not in the same regions, so it is not a wholly geographical bug. It also affects their alts, so it is not an avatar-based bug.

I was just wondering if your friend had resolved this issue. I have now find that if I wear alpha layers on any part of the body, or look at another avatar wearing alpha layers, then I too experience the same flickering and almost a jigsaw puzzle where parts of the skin appear to poke through the alpha layer. I am using the latest Phoenix viewer, a good graphics card with up to date drivers, and my settings are on High. I have tried changing to Ultra but that made no difference. Internet speed is 30 mb/s cable, so no problem there either. EDIT After testing many things, including more clean installs, I settled back to use Phoenix v.1050 rather than the new versions which appeared to give me more issues. I was still intrigued though why I could not view alpha layers cleanly and kept trying different things. One thing that has "annoyed" me for a while are the silly little shadows under avatars' feet. By chance, I came across an option to not show them (in Phoenix v. 1050 it is found at ... Advanced / Rendering / Features / Foot Shadows). I selected not to show the foot shadows. I just happened to be wearing an alpha layer to conceal hands at the time and... with no foot shadows selected the alpha layer was clean. For some reason, the foot shadows were having some effect on alpha layers not showing correctly. Hope this "fix" might help anyone else who encounters the same issue.

I have read the posts, I have contributed, I have read the sensible speculations that have been suggested, and all the while I keep thinking of one thing... We have to change the system because it is too complex for new residents when they have an item delivered boxed and have to open the box... at least, that is what appeared initially. Hmmmm on the one hand, simplifying a system that was already so simple we learn it on day one. On the other hand, introducing a complexity that is not present with the magic box system. I don't have three hands or four, so I can't add more here. It now appears that, if something is white and everyone sees it as white and understands it as white, then it must now be changed to black. Hell if I can see how this DD can be an improved system, a better system, a simplified system. And I don't want to hear any whines about delivery failures with the magic boxes, just give the customer another copy and be glad they bought from you in the first place, it's only pixels after all and provided their money appears in your wallet, nothing is lost. Avarice destroys business, good customer relations enhances it... just like listening to customers (are you reading this LL?), listening is the only way forward. You will find imposition and intractibility listed under dictatorship. What inititally appeared to me as a step forward now, from seeing various angles in this thread, is a total disaster that is as unnecessary as was changing XStreet to the Marketplace. I don't want pretty pretty dressed in pink with satin bows, I, like others, want stability. Microsoft introduced pretty pretty with Vista, even they had to swallow their pride. I listen to my customers... are we not the customers of LL? Was there even a need for this thread? Will not the system go ahead exactly as planned irrespective of what we question, want, request or even need? The worldwide economy is still in a precarious condition... the SL economy reflects that. The money for such research and development would have been better spent by another department dedictated to making the inworld experience lag free (if ever such a thing can be achieved). But I ramble knowing that Brooke opened the thread and said she would review the comments a week later. I guess only interested merchants will now read anything that is here and then, some months down the road, watch as yet another new idea fails disastrously with the only impact being upon the wallets of merchants.

I am unable to quickly find the SL Wiki reference regarding a recommended maximum of inventory items, other than remembering their recommendation it should be no more than 10k - 12k items. However, there are various references to inventory throughout, such as this... "Linden Lab strongly recommends you keep your inventory item count relatively low" That is a quotation from a discussion on Outfits in the official Knowledge Base, Jeremy and Bea were the contributors. Reference may be found at http://community.secondlife.com/t5/English-Knowledge-Base/Outfits/ta-p/700127

I think we are moving too far away from the subject of this thread now. This question of alts can be addressed in a Jira or with representation to LL. After all, why should alts have separate inventories, or why cannot one alt access the inventory of another alt? It is the same RL person at the keyboard who has paid for everything. So, maybe the answer to this problem, transferring between alts, is to have just one inventory with a folder for each alt avatar. Now then, what was it Brooke said at the start?

Interesting, but what about items that are modifiable? It is very easy even for an experience resident to make a total mess when modifying something but it does not matter, there is an original copy of it in the inventory. If the item was no copy and it messed up, who is going to replace it? It is not the merchant's job to do that so you either lose it or buy it again.

Thanks Darius, that is one query resolved

Toysoldier is totally correct. For people who only list a small number of single items, a shirt, for example, then delivering folders as opposed to boxed items is little problem. For those of us who use the Marketplace and SL primarily as a business, and who continually add new content, that will push our inventories to ridiculous levels - particularly when SL states on its own Wiki that between 10K and 12K items in inventory should be an absolute maximum. The delivery of boxed items should continue, not folders, it is absolutely no hardship for anyone to rez a box and open it... we were all doing it on day 1 in SL and years later we are still doing it. What is so different about new residents? Are they completely incapable of comprehending a simple instruction on how to rez a box? If so, how on earth can they possibly rez objects from their inventory? After all, the process is near identical. Let's give residents the credit they deserve, treat people as adults and allow them to learn SL rather than holding their hands every step of the way... and watching as more and more stop coming inworld. Already mentioned but an important point. Many of us sell no copy items. Many of us are not in America. We cannot therefore stand by our computers, logged into SL, waiting for notification that a no copy item has been moved and sold, then rush to add another to the outgoing folder. That has to be the most ridiculous idea I have heard! It means if we are not at our computers or inworld, we can only sell one of those items because if another customer tries to buy, the item will not be available for delivery! Time to get real... time to learn the "business" rather than the coding. Continuing on this same no copy point... no copies items are generally in no copy boxes. If the boxes are made copiable but the content of the boxes remains unchanged, will that count as a "copiable" item for DD? Given the very high proportion of residents who use a TPV (still a clear indication that LL got it totally wrong with viewer 2), it is clear that DD cannot be implemented until all TPVs have been given the appropriate information to integrate it into yet another viewer update AND have it tested repeatedly to ensure it will work. Greater clarity is needed on the syncing process for DD between inventory and Marketplace. Finally (and off topic but deliberately so since I have not yet received a reply)... Dakota asked me to place in a thread for Brooke a question they have not been able to answer, even giving me the thread to use and saying Brooke would see it and respond. The question is... if we edit a Marketplace listing and click to update, whether it be a price change, description change, better display pictures, changing related items, does that edited listing retain its position in the search rankings or is it classed as a new listing and shunted back to the bottom? Since this happened to me last month, I feel we need full and clear clarification of the editing process on the Marketplace. BTW... I have no objections to DD, it will actually assist me having BOXES in a special folder in my inventory as opposed to having to load magic boxes over several sims. But the last thing I, and no doubt other merchants, want is the fiasco we have had twice (first with opening the Marketplace, second with the "updates" a few months ago) each resulting in sudden and drastic dips in sales. We are in business, we are not playing a game, that is an important distinction and the reason why so many merchants offer so many suggestions.

Query posted here for Brooke to reply to as per Dakota's request. There appears to be conflicting opinions in the forums on certain aspects of the Marketplace search and rankings. Some state that any edits made to a Marketplace entry, whether it be in price, description, heading, then that item goes to the bottom once more of the search rankings as if it were a new item. Would you please confirm for us here whether making amendments to a listed item, such as changing display pictures, related items, price or even paying for advertising (or taking it off) affects that item's position in the search rankings and places it back to the bottom, or if any edits made do not affect that item's position in the search rankings at all once the Update button is pressed.