Talla Slade

Does anyone else get the problem that when they TP into a region with a scripted HUD worn or cross a border they become stuck to another avatar is one is there where they enter the region? Taking the hud off fixes it but it would be helpful to know what the cause is. It has been happening on any kind of sim and using different viewers and it can happen to any avatar that wears the combat hud. Anyone have an idea?

@Deja You wrote... "Actually, this stuff today has definitely got me thinking. Even if we aren't yet quite comfortable with the security of the open sim, I wonder how it can be used in a non commerce point to further grids that do produce content. Ok, here my brain turning there? What I mean to say is something like this.... I own a goth store. A large base of my clients are into the whole bloodlines and even non bloodlines RP aspect for Vampires and Wolves. What I am thinking if what if I could create a place to advertise from my locations in SL, Inworldz and Avination or wherever else I may open a store and promote the open sim location as a goth RP sim. And back in the RP sim...promote the world stores in all those other closed grids. Especially if one day any of them open up...like Avination and allow items to be available on the open grid. It could all possibly work together to promote each other and build even more customer loyalty up by spending a little bit of money to create an RP sim for customers and potential customers. Who knows if it would be successful but at the cheap rates of an open sim (or even free if Czari was right) it would simply be a sink of time to build it up...which I would potentially do." I think your ideas could work well Deja. It would certainly be supportive and help you build your brand and customer loyalty. I'm sure that is how it has worked for Toy selling sculpties in IW. As far as I am concerned anything that builds more business and the open Metaverse which we all can benefit from the better. If I can help in any way do contact me in OSgrid or SL on this name. I am quite happy to talk more and help anyone out since I do have quite a lot of experience with this thing :matte-motes-bashful:

@Czari What you wrote was very interesting and I am aware that a number of role play communities have set up in OSgrid or the rest of the Metaverse. The Elven realms on Inworldz comes to mind right away and I have a draft copy to post on my blog soon about a Dark gothic Vampire theme that has moved from SL to OSgrid recently and is devloping their 4 region sims presently. I also wrote about Star Fleet Federation, a Trekie RPG group that opened a number of sims on OSgrid to learn the ropes so to speak. That was a few years ago and they have since set up their own grid. It has been very successful because they keep some sims in SL and spread their role play across all of the sim both in SL and the open Metaverse. I am sure role players will benefit from this way or working and if anything should happen to SL then at least people wont have their eggs all in one basket and the Open Metaverse is a growing market for merchants anyway. I should love to meet you perhaps in OSgrid one day. IM me any time. I have the same name there and in SL.

@Luna I am fully aware of the founding principles of the Open Simulator Project and OSgrid was set up as a test grid for the server code. They allowed anyone to connect a region to that grid but made it clear they don't support any economy or token currency. Beyond that the founders have no interest or control over the many individuals that take the server code and use it. They do nto impose a TOS like SL dose because they can't. They don't own all the servers. Now, I wont deny there are individuals that believe in some utopian ideas who have regions attached to OSgrid and those individuals believe in share and share alike. Some call them Techno-communits but it is not the official position of the founders, the developers or the managers of OSgrid. The rest of the open Metaverse is not attached to OSgrid anyway even though they use the open source server code. The Licence on the code permits anyone to use it how they chose and to develop it further and keep their code secret which is what grids like Inworldz and other closed grids have done. They make their own TOS and so do the many other grids that either remain walled gardens or connect with others via Hypergrid. Mentioning the dramas that go in the community is fine but similar stuff happens in all communities and plenty of bad things have happened in the SL so you are actually confirming that there is enough community on the Open Metaverse to actually get into those problems. There is much more good than bad in all communities don't you agree? My blog... Metaverse traveller

Hi again Deja Yes, I wanted you and others to have a balanced view of Opensim and the present state of the open Metaverse. As you read on my blog stuff can be copied on any grid (even Second Life) and I did mention Inworldz as a closed grid which offers the same level of protection that SL offers but in any event one has to decide which grids that will trust. However, that all said, Avination is a good choice to as they are a closed grid as well and, what's more, Melanie who owns that grid is one of the developers of Hypergrid and working on HG2. Mel has said she will enable Hypergrid travel and allow in potential buyers once the HG2 content security is in place and working ( I did say all this). Anyway, Presently closed grids are the safe option but if you are selling any full perm textures or whatever then you can really sell those anywhere with a creative commons licence so that is not really a problem. As for what Luna said No it is not true your inventory can be taken as you travel via Hypergrid. It is perfectly safe because it stays on you home grid and only items you actually rez on the grid you visit can be copied by the grid owner if they don't value their reputation. What you rez has to be called from your home grid because your inventory is not actually traveling with you and even your appearance is being called and as you travel. That's basic HG. In HG2 the perms will finally be respected so one would not travel to a grid not running HG2 and it is as simple as that really so the security will be much better and every grid running HG2 will be a semi-walled garden in effect. Luna also said, "And what about the philosophy Opensim was founded on..that all content should be free? " Well, that is easy to say and I don't know where you got that from so perhaps you can point to the proof? Fact is no such notion exists. Opensim is open source server code and can be used to run a grid by anyone with the knowledge to set it up. This is why I advise caution and getting to know the open Metaverse before jumping in head first. Many people are into making money and setting up grids to do just that. Unlike Second Life the open Metaverse is like IRC where people work from many servers of their own or hosted for them and it is possible to travel between them if they have Hypergrid enabled. You don't have to travel actually. You can sit in one of the grids and be open for business and the customers will come to you from their grids. Not it is up to you to decide if you trust that grid to allow your stuff to travel there. This called doing your home work. My blog tries to help people understand the open Metaverse and I don't try to mislead anyone. I want the open Metaverse to be a great environment for business and none-profit alike. I am there to help if asked and on my blog there are links to vendors and resources sites. Soon I will have a Grid search as well to help people find grids to visit. At the end of the day you can only dip a toe in and explore the possibilities for yourself and your business. If I can help I will otherwise I wish you every success either here or in the open Metaverse. BTW, you have some great stock on Market place Deja. And Luna, yes, I have always blogged in the name of Gaga but I am Talla Slade on Second Life and OSgrid. I run role play sims and make, script and sell my own stuff for what it is worth to know that. My blog: Metaverse Traveller

@ Deja You said... "I'm also expanding into some other grids. Although I'd love to know where the more competive grids are because all the grids I have checked out so far have been pretty dead, which would explain the low tier, but what good is low tier if you can't turn a profit due to no traffic?" As a merchant expanding into the open Metaverse grids the choices are limited if you think only about traffic and not in what the potential is for the long term. However, the busiest walled garden grid is easily Inworldz but they are not likely to open up to hypergrid as they have forked server code that is somewhat different from the mainstream Opensim core code. Most open grids work on the mainstream code which is very stable and will support hypergrid. A new version of Hypergrid, HG2, is expected to be released soon which I mentioned in my last post. Once that is in use more grids will open up to the greater Metaverse so this is what I mean by taking a long term view and getting established. It is not expensive to have an outlet on the open Metaverse so being in both worlds can't be bad. I don't say jump in and abandon SL and I will say you wont make a fortune yet :womansad: but the market is going to grow and already there are over 200 separate grids with around 100 connecting with the rest via HG so the market is somewhat hidden presently until you understand how it is all building. Each of those grids have small communities, some very small and others bigger. There is a growing demand for virtual goods I am sure and online market sites like Total Avatar Shop are building a reputation and have their sights firmly set. The Open Metaverse is a growing market. check my blog for more information and articles on building business in Opensim... This article in particular... Second Life Shrinks as the Hidden Metaverse Expands and this one... Building Role Play Across the Hypergrid

I agree with you, Toy and Darrius in much of what is being said here but I don't think that Second Life is dead or that the sky is falling in. I think more sims will be lost in the coming months and it will increase next January went the education grants run out but then it will level out and next year might in fact see more user traffic as Rod's plans take hold. I don't think there will be a growth in regions though as the new traffic will be video gamers with little or no interest in the existing community. In deed, I can see the existing community being sidelined even more than they are now as LL concentrates on the new people. What I do expect is more of the existing users to actually leave. Those who do leave may go on to explore opportunities in the Opensim grids which is no bad idea if they approach them with an open mind and a willingness to learn new ways to operate and make money. I think role players in particular could benefit especially for I, myself while still renting 2 RPG sims in SL, have built up some regions on OSgrid and now I have a Hypergrid connected standalone world too and it costs me a fraction of what SL costs. However, as I said, I still have my sims in SL and some of my players are happy to play in both SL and the open Metaverse. Opensim is much more stable now and Hypergrid 2, which is expected soon, promises better content security where the creator can decide what goods can leave the grid thus reducing the chance of copying stuff while still making it possible to travel with full appearance and selling stuff on grids you can trust - yes, reputations are being established. Anyway, I do think LL is taking a huge risk and I expect more steps to be taken to silence decent in the SL community. My blog... Second Life Video Gaming?

I find myself agreeing with WADE1 absolutely. Rodvik has a master plan to change the focus of Second Life to one of video gaming which I feel as a long time role player will ultimately degrade my experience. Given I have worked hard for several years to create my RPG without the aid of video gaming tools I kind of resent where Rodvik is taking us. The Jira gave vent to bug issues affecting us all and because we could voice an opinion there we at least felt it might add weight to the urgency to get something fixed. God knows there is still enough wrong with the system and all the so-called improvements have just added to the problems in my view. For role players who, I might add, buy an awful lot of theme content, the system doesn't need to be as complex as Linden Labs want to make it for the sake of where they want to go in pursuit of the video gaming minions. For years we have paid through the nose and got nothing but disruptions, lag and unfixed bugs. What will it be in the end? There could even be hyper inflation in the SL economy as the Gold Farmers move in to set up business high-leveling avatars and farming gold in SL video games. Don't think for a moment it can't happen. It just takes one successful game and that is what Rodvik Humble is hoping for. Do we, the ones paying the bills, really need all this? More said on my blog here: Second Life Video Gaming?

Welcome to Second Life, Rod. May I advise you be very very careful where you tread and who you tread on. The looney Lindens have a terrible habbit of doing just that. There is a very vocal minority that squeeks a lot too - I know, I'm one of them. We have fragil tempers these days since we have been pushed about so much and our pockets sucked dry for the privilige of doing something creative with the platform you gave us. We are tired of Linden crackpot ideas and rolling restarts and more and more controls and having a bunch of kids dumped on us to worry about. However well intentioned we really don't want you to poke your noses in what we do. It's our world remember? You told us that long ago. We made it what it is not you. We don't trust Lindens. We actually don't like you very much either most of the time. We try to have fun and escape the riggers of the real world and then you go spoiling it all with one new control after another. Its tiresome. You kill off our inworld businesses with Web sales. Our malls grow silent. You do everything in your power to piss us off and don't fix the things we want fixed most, the lag (oh the lag!), the search (oh the search!). the script errors, the transaction errors, the lost inventory, the list goes on. Are you sure this is the Job for you, Rod? Anyway, welcome to the sinking ship. I want to be grateful to you but you make it so hard Here are some predictions for 2011 http://metaverse-traveller.blogspot.com/

@Samuel Geiger Oh I agree but none the less, merging the teen grid will add some more traffic to the main gird. Maybe LL will even restore the figures to the login screen! @ Montana Corleone Yes, that's true. They did open an office in the UK back when they really believed SL would hit big time. It didn't happen of course and LL has since sacked a third of it's staff and closed the UK office. They are still charging the VAT though.

Some people have no time for the opinions of others and the best they can do is shoot abuse and make threats. What they don't seem to be able to do is offer a constructive response to the debate or a well-argued rebuttle of what they don't agree with. In fact, generally, they can't string more than few lines together that is not abuse. I meet people like this all the time in SL. I think everyone dose but we tend to treat them as an irritation that needs a scratch rather than something to lose sleep over. If they are particualarly bad we call them griefers and ban them from our sims or even file abuse reports when they become threatening.

Seems like the Teen Grid has been merged ahead of time^

Oh, I absolutely agree, Rene. Opensim can not be stopped now. It's real strength is the open source nature of the project, the low cost and the sheer level of freedom it promises. The tech is catching up fast and, in some areas, has already exceeded SL capability. Blue Mars doesn't allow on the fly building and content creation and it is not cheap either but it is superior to SL and OS at the moment if you have a good graphics card, decent PC and connection. And, of course, it's another grid with an iron curtain round it like SL. If they fold you will loose everything you paid for unless you managed to get some of your content downloaded to your hard drive - impossible to do unless it's full perm. Not so with Opensim, which is, by it's very nature, by and large yours! Like you, Rene. I am not there in Opensim yet but I do visit many grids and keep informed. I have 4 Sims dedicated to role play and sailing in SL and, presently, I am doing fine here despite the gloomy outlook for SL, and my sales have actually gone up in-world but that has probably more to do with selling themed items for the role play than anything LL is doing for me. So there is no advise I can give to vendors accept, "you gotta have a gimmick!" My gimmick, such that it is, is the role play theme I promote but that is a niche market. LL needs to listen to it's customers and entrepreneurs and focus on reviving in-world sales and simply stop going off in the clouds with wasteful projects that do nothing to bring in new members. More importantly, they need to review their pricing policy. If one can get a full sim up and running on Opensim for as little as $10 a month then LL is going to have to compete with that or die.

If anyone is wondering where all the Lindens who got sacked went then some at least have gone to rival Opensim. John Lester - formerly Pathfinder Linden - has launched the Hypergrid Adventurers Club, inspiring many to travel around the hypergrid. Lester has recently been hired to head up community outreach at ReactionGrid, a rapidly growing Opensim-based grid. See this link: http://becunningandfulloftricks.com/hypergrid-adventurers-club/ I also found an article giving growth statistics for Opensim compared to SecondLife. It makes interesting reading. See this link: http://www.hypergridbusiness.com/2010/11/another-record-month-for-opensim/ It doesn't surprise me LL has stopped publishing the user concurrency figures on the viewer login screen. They are dropping seriously! The figures have been pretty static for the last 2 years but in the past six months they have taken a nose-dive struggling to get to 60K and often not getting above 50K and that is peek numbers. Off-peek is abysmal at around 30K and less! We all know LL manipulates their statistics but now they are getting so bad they just don't publish at all. That is, in itself, very telling. Well, we seem to go from one fiasco to another so it can only be expected to get worse. Adding VAT, a European tax, they had no obligation to collect pushed out European land lords to start with then the Open Spaces fiasco pushed small builders and home makes off land and now LL favouring Land barons with discounts is pushing the remaining small land lords out while LL keep general land tier inflated for everyone else. Not just that but now education and none-profits are going to have to pay full price. It really is a scam! Given this state of affairs and the fact Linden Labs is pushing web sales rather than promoting in-world sales it's not surprising that the stores and malls are closing. LL can add mesh to the viewer and other shinny features that geeks might find useful in the short term but Opensim is adding the same stuff and Blue Mars already has it. What LL is doing now is too little, too late. The damage they are doing to the economy is too great to inspire confidence that SecondLife has a long-term future.

@Rene Erlanger Thanks Rene... I don't want to over-egg Opensim because it still faces some difficult challenges before it can truly get into a beta state. Hypergrid 1.5 dose now give some security to content creators however but it's limited and far from a full solution. But it is developing and that is what I base my argument on. People are not leaving SL in droves as might be supposed but many are spending more time away. Nearly everyone I speak to tells me they are interested in OS or are already there. I've been dabbling myself for the past two years since Open Spaces which got me into it originally so I know the pace of development and I have seen the steady growth. And recently the growth has accelerated probably because of apathy in SL and people now really starting to ask themselves why they pay so much for SecondLife hosting and why is it possible for OS hosts to deliver as good at a fraction of the cost. If I am right, and I really think I am, a lot of the decline in SL is due in no small part to the rise of the free metaverse and other proprietary grids as I stated above. I do not take the Lindens for total fools though. They know full well what they are up against and the recent cost-cutting, sackings and killing of projects that don't offer an immediate result show us this is the case. The accelerated development of Mesh, Viewer 2, media on a prim, name spaces, etc all smack of a desperate bid to stay ahead of the growing competition - things LL could have done long ago had they not gone off-track with dreams of an SL_Facebook revolution. Linden Labs needs to cut the cost of their hosting now for it is, in my view, the surest way to bring noobs in and oldbies back. Dare I say it? Yeah, the birdy has come home to roost. Ignore the long-standing users, role players, builders and merchants at your peril. A lot of them have gone elsewhere and elsewhere is starting to look too good to ignore now!

@Lisa Lowe I totally agree. I have always watched the traffic figures and I have noticed the steady decline. Some days the off-peek drops as low as 30,000 while to peek traffic struggles to get above 50,000. Far cry from several years ago when the traffic regularly got above 80K and crashed the whole of SL!

There is a lot of apathy in SecondLife and while I have seen my sales going up despite the gloomy figures given above I am in no doubt that LL is facing growing competition from Opensim and others like Blue Mars. SecondLife is expensive and if one looks back to the Open Spaces fiasco two years ago it was clear a lot of people could not afford to build their dream homes at the current cost of an island sim. Open Space sims allowed many to build, albeit at a restricted level. Homesteads were introduced in response to this demand but the price point was still going to be too high for a lot of people. Many gave up and went to the outside grids based on Open Simulator and, while they could build cheaper, the experience for most was nothing like what they were use to in SL. There was no economy or currency to speak of back then and the content was third rate (not counting copybotted stuff). A lot of things didn't function and scripting was still way behind. But, two years on the story has changed dramatically! Able hosting companies have moved in which has drastically improved performance and the price point to rent a sim is as little as $10 a month. Laggy standalones on home computers are declining too since hosting options return better results cheaply and a huge number of people that used to have a home in SL now find they can do all the building they like with 15K prims and little restriction. Currencies are available too now but the trade in freebees is still flourishing simply because SL content creators are skeptical and worry about copyright theft. Content is not all third rate any more either. But here is a fact... If you can get a $10 a month sim in Opensim to adequately build your home and are happy to spend time there as many do (many in fact create content in OS and import back to SL) then why would you bother with SL? Well, most of them do spend time in SL and OS regardless. That is the trend now. Even some of the role players are building their RPG's in OS and certainly educational institutions see the value now LL is dropping charity discounts. People still buy stuff in SL for use in SL and probably use web shopping more too ( I know I prefer to now), but if many are spending more time in Opensim it stands to reason they will not spend as much here. Why would they need too? I know all the arguments against Opensim but one by one those arguments are being steadily addressed as the platform continues to develop and I would ague that SecondLife is being steadily challenged by that march of progress. However, contrary to apparent support I seem to be giving Opensim in this post, I do really hope LL will put their act back together and working with the free metaverse, finding new ways to do business and attract users, might actually be beneficial to business in SL. Opensim still doesn't have the traffic SL enjoys but most OS users don't care. Most are not trying to make money and are happy to enjoy their cheap homes and have a few friends over from SL, maybe a party or a meeting away from the bustle and griefers of SL, or even a mega region for sailing greater expanses without border crossings. The latest version of Hypergrid in OS allows safe teleporting from one grid to another with appearance and even allows goods to be bought and brought back home. I could give many more reasons but suffice to say, Opensim is coming of age now and this will continue to impact on SecondLife and it's economy to an ever greater degree.